Am I REALLY about to do THIS??..

[DakineBMH]

I want to thank MJ for writing TMF and Unscripted (my Favorite) and everyone here for creating such a supportive, open community. MJ's books, this forum and its members' advice and posts were stumbled upon after my 'FTE,' when I was frantically searching for answers/guidance in my life/career when I was literally saying, 'What the F*ck! How did I get here at this age?!!'

Ive never spoken so freely on a public forum. But I believe this forum is 'Good People.' Cue up a beer

Basically I had realized at 36 y/o, late Feb 2018 (FTE occurred): the time I've spent (3 yrs currently) and money ($25k for training) for 'Career No. 2-surgical sales rep turned out to be a major disappointment, and I'll tell you why. This was supposed to 'fix' my life by bringing in great income (replenishing lost savings, I started over financially at 33 y/o-more on that later) and get me on the path to provide a (very) nice lifestyle and income to invest for the future. And guess what? I was chasing money. Plain-and-simple. Money, stability, riches to be handed out freely from a corporation. I would finally be happy. Imagine the disappointment when I found out that the field I thought I was going in to..for money..started ending 15-20 yrs ago due to the ever-evolving economics of healthcare. And then there's corporate America ... I've only been in this 'special sphere' of politics and other weird shit for a little over two years-but I could speak volumes. Never will you find a more wretched hive of scum and villany.

A little background: My family went through very hard financial times starting at 13 for me. In school I worked my a$$ off. Top grades. My first degree was in a medical specialty (non-MD), and I also went to a 'Top 20 Business Undergrad program.' After college and within two years I was promoted to Supervisor.. then to Management.Then in 2009, the economy crashed. The company I worked for filed Chapter 11 proceedings. At that time I was in my mid-to-late twenties, unchallenged, unfullfilled, depressed, and BURNED OUT. So I sold everything and moved to Hawaii in 2010 (have had family there since the late 60s). Palm trees, good vibes and WAVES. Plenty of savings, worked a little bit. Hiked to waterfalls, surfed. Lived my life on my terms. Things were good for awhile. Even then I struggled with 'what I wanted to do with my life (career, life-long stigma of what success APPEARS to be),' and 'what type of JOB will MAKE ME HAPPY.' But complacency kills, as I always say. So, I moved islands and took a fairly lucrative gig as an Army Civilian Contractor in healthcare and there things were 'OK' for awhile. Didn't love the job, routine, confinement, limit on income no matter how hard I worked. Contract was year-to-year, so no long-term stability. Met a girl, fell in love, all of that natural progression-and then we had our son in 2014.

I spent alot. We fought. She left with him for her home state on the west coast. We separated early. Amidst my job contract expiring. Heartbreaking process. And very expensive. That's when I formed the 'exit strategy' of a new career in medical sales back on the mainland where they were. That kind of income would fix everything! New career! Stability! Then she moved back to Hawaii six weeks before I left.

After six years in Hawaii, I scraped enough together for the 'sales rep segway' training, and headed for the east coast in Fall 2015. After eight months of training, I was excitedly flown to the west coast to interview for two separate positions in Hawaii...I interviewed with managers from the mainland. I didn't get an offer from either company. June 2016 brought my first gig as a Sales Consultant trainee for 10 months in my home state-before my employer was bought in a major acquisition in Feb 2017. Hiring freeze for 22 months. So in Feb 2017, I accepted an offer in a major city with a new company, in a state I had never even visited before the interview. Oh..the things we'll do and say for a JOB, BENEFITS, STABILITY, SECURITY=HAPPINESS, right?
So at the age of 35, I moved to a new state. Where I knew no one. Alone. For a job.
Six weeks after I started April 2017, the person who hired me quit, and took all business with him to a competitor. Management doesn't 'know what to do.' Silence/indecision for months. This is the strategy from very well-paid corporate sales executives. Revenue plummets.

My son is growing. He's even old enough to form memories and remember me now. I get to fly out and see him twice a year. May 2018. His 4th birthday in Honolulu. We meet on a playground and he's on the top level of the playground. I see the brightest smile as we make eye contact. He makes his way down to me. I feel little arms wrap around my legs as he looks up and says, 'Hi Dad! I Love You.' F.T.E. After spending time with him and seeing the sadness and disappointment on his face when explaining that Dad has to leave again: F.T.E.

I've read that you have to discover your driving force/passion in combination with situations in life when you just know 'shit isn't right' and search to create new opportunity and it can't just 'be all about the money.' Well? Here's mine!

Please feel free to comment or reach out in PM, as I'm currently working on forming a rental business in Hawaii. So I paused today and asked myself, "Am I REALLY about to do THIS??" I'm sure it violates CENTS, but its a start, and I welcome all experienced advice regarding financing/loans and I'm currently researching how to create a professional website and tie-in SEO at the moment.

Thank You All

 

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[The Abundant Man]

You have your why(Your son). Now go execute. Congrats on finding this forum. This place will take you places.

 

[Danny Sullivan]

First of all, Hello to you. Great story, thanks for sharing and welcome to the right place.

I'm sure it violates CENTS
I'm sure it violates CENTS
I'm sure it violates CENTS
I'm sure it violates CENTS

I fell the urge to link you to this thread: GOLD! - Where I have been this time... and why I'm famous at Wells Fargo

And quote this:

Spoiler

Some of you may know that I am in the process of getting my pilot's license and this may be cheesy to some, but I am noticing a lot of parallels and analogies between the business world, as my limited experience can describe, and flight. The size of an airplane is like the size of our businesses.

Knowledge- There is a tremendous difference in the amount of knowledge and experience required to be built up before you can fly a big jet... Some might say "I don't have the experience or knowledge required to start a business like that", but just like flight, you can learn. All the studying in the world, all the flying of Cessnas, is never going to prepare you to sit behind the controls of a jet. Pilots have to FLY a jet to learn a jet.

No one was born with the ability to fly a jet. Likewise no one was born with the ability to fly a Cessna either... The same goes for business. Folks will bitch about thinking big. "Oh, I'll just "do" ecommerce for now until I build up some capital or experience" It is a bullshit excuse. So you don't have the ability to set out to solve a legitimate problem, but you somehow have the ability to "revoloutionize" the cell phone case market with new color? No. Once again it comes back to becoming the expert. You must DO. You must ACT. There is NO ONE that will hold your hand and teach you how to start a seriously impactful business. Guess what... Thats OK! In fact it is real entrepreneurship. Following a step by step guide isn't. You'll f*cking crash.

Take off- Quite simply put, the larger the plane, the more runway it normally needs to take off. While a tiny lightweight backcountry airplane can take off with almost no rollout, the large jets need thousands of feet to safely take off. This parallels with business because the larger the problem you are solving, the bigger the company it is anticipated to be, the longer it is going to take before it can transfer it's weight from the wheels to the wings.

Barrier to entry? Yes. A jet needs a bigger runway... You can look at that runway as the blood, sweat and tears needed to be put in before your business can take off. Difficult is good for the people who have done it and bad for bozo wannabe competitors. This is the part where you LEARN! This is the part that builds you as a businessperson. This is the part that makes you EXPERIENCED. Have you ever wondered why some people get to the point where they don't feel the need to prove anything? Have you wondered why some people remain calm in the worst of times? They have been down a hell of a runway. The entrepreneur and the business is stronger for this.

This part goes along with my thread about what I would do if I started all over again. In that thread I basically make the case for a well capitalized business in order to ride out the run up first, and then climb faster. Need a bigger runway? OK... Build one.

Climb out- Larger jets, once they are finished rolling out climb like crazy to altitudes you cant touch in a small piston airplane.

This is the day you realize you quite literally could disrupt an entire market. There are growing pains that are bigger than if you were a small business, but so what? Your idea paid off and you are filling the organizational holes with resources on your way up as you leave the small business concerns like getting the cheapest phone system, using your office depot coupons or renting the cheapest sh*t heap office space you can find in your dust. You have cashflow and cash balence to work out most of the pressing problems.

Carrying capacity- I view this like a business' ability to carry resources. While a jet can carry hundreds of passengers, small airplanes have massive weight restrictions and fuel capacity considerations. With a smaller plane you need to make sacrifices in range to carry more weight and vice versa. Sound familiar?

How much inventory can you invest in at once? What kind of resources can your business carry? Can you afford a professional web designer or are you stuck trying your own hand? Can you afford to advertise to the extent you desire? Could your business accept a massive order without cashflow issues? How many ecommerce businesses could hire just one new person today and maintain a comfortable income for the proprietor? Some airplanes simply can't carry more than two or three people at a time, they are just too small and light. Everything in a small business is a trade off. Resources grow businesses.

Rough weather- It is inevitable that you will run into bad weather, the cool part is that jets fly over most of the bullshit. A small airplane can easily be murdered by the same storm a jet can simply fly over. Not only that, but a jet can intentionally fly through most sh*t that a small plane has to concern itself with. Small planes are constantly trying to avoid bad weather and adjust for changing conditions.

What happens when marketplace policies change? What happens when advertising gets more expensive? What happens when taxes go up? What happens when you have a legal problem? The list goes on and on. Things that might simply shake a jet can rip the wings off a cessna.

Ease of operation- I don't think anyone would argue that with modern autopilots and avionics, a jet isn't a more pleasant aircraft to fly. They are, and they're less work. This is self explanatory. Look at a CEO of a company that employs just 20 people vs a onepreneur... The CEO looks at his business from 35 thousand feet and the onepreneur is probably at 5 getting hands dirty and worrying about navigating around the next dark cloud.

What is my point?

All of this is not to say that you can't take a small company and turn it into a large company, but more often than not, the companies that become household names, the companies that employ 50, 1000, or even 100 thousand people are ones that were planned bigger from the start.

I personally only give a damn about jets. Any Cessna stuff is a means to an end for me. You will see that my main businesses, as I progress and discuss them further, fit the criteria of the jet. Not because they grew into it, but because that is where I started them; despite some of the mistakes I've made and will discuss like trying to fly a "jet" off of a "cessna" runway.

Sorry if it's cheesy or elementary for some, but this is the kind of stuff that rolls through my head.

Maybe this can provide some direction on starting your business.

One thing that sticked with me from this thread was "Think with more zeros". If it's scaleable and a 600$ order means the same amount of work as a 60.000$ order - that's it.

Best of luck and welcome again!

 

[DakineBMH]

Thank You! Hawaii is an economically difficult place to live, hence its taken awhile to formulate a plan. Which my plan involves going in to debt with a business just to get back there, but I have an opportunity to live for free and utilize a friends business space for free for awhile, as well. I figured that was a great opportunity to make the push to get back home.

 

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[lowtek]

Welcome aboard.

While I believe moving to be with your son is the absolute right choice, I wonder is there something you can do that doesn't involve going into debt? Perhaps running sales for a small agency of some sort? Selling cars at a dealership, even? You have sales training, so there's no reason to not use it.

Getting into rental properties is an expensive game. If you're going all in with debt, with no prior real estate experience, I would call this a "life risk". You could very easily end up bankrupt and worse off than you are now.

The point of the books was that there is a process to becoming wealthy. Many people focus on the event of MJ becoming rich, but this misses the point. He had a string of shit jobs and disappointment before he made it big. From the sounds of it, you're already halfway there. Don't try to short change the rest of the process by taking a short cut. Short cuts are never short, and they always screw you over in the end. 100% guarantee.

 

[DakineBMH]

Welcome aboard.

While I believe moving to be with your son is the absolute right choice, I wonder is there something you can do that doesn't involve going into debt? Perhaps running sales for a small agency of some sort? Selling cars at a dealership, even? You have sales training, so there's no reason to not use it.

Getting into rental properties is an expensive game. If you're going all in with debt, with no prior real estate experience, I would call this a "life risk". You could very easily end up bankrupt and worse off than you are now.

The point of the books was that there is a process to becoming wealthy. Many people focus on the event of MJ becoming rich, but this misses the point. He had a string of sh*t jobs and disappointment before he made it big. From the sounds of it, you're already halfway there. Don't try to short change the rest of the process by taking a short cut. Short cuts are never short, and they always screw you over in the end. 100% guarantee.

Thanks for the reply, lowtek.

Maybe my post is misleading... it’s not real estate/rental properties. It’s a rental car company. My father had one of the first Budgets in my home state growing up, as well as a couple of car dealerships. Which I worked in growing up. So, I have an opportunity to buy vehicles AT COST which helps tremendously.

I’m not sure I understand what you meant by shortcuts. I’m building something organically and have to finance vehicles.

 

[lowtek]

Thanks for the reply, lowtek.

Maybe my post is misleading... it’s not real estate/rental properties. It’s a rental car company. My father had one of the first Budgets in my home state growing up, as well as a couple of car dealerships. Which I worked in growing up. So, I have an opportunity to buy vehicles AT COST which helps tremendously.

I’m not sure I understand what you meant by shortcuts. I’m building something organically and have to finance vehicles.

I call it a shortcut because you haven't proven your business model and haven't generated any income yet.

IMO, buying cars on credit is even worse than buying rental properties on credit. The rental properties will hold their value far better than the cars, and can be liquidated with only a small loss, if necessary. The cars are going to drop in a value like a rock, and if the business goes sideways you're on the hook for the original loan value.

Doing this without a shortcut would be slaving away to build up the cash you need to buy one car without debt. Rent it out on Turo and see if you can make a profit. If yes, then repeat the process to get a couple more. When you have enough profit to cover the cost of your living expenses and fund the debt required to buy more vehicles, then I would consider using OPM to expand.

Buying cars on credit, with no way of paying for them other than the business, and no prior business experience, is a major risk.

 

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[Dubidu]

I call it a shortcut because you haven't proven your business model and haven't generated any income yet.

IMO, buying cars on credit is even worse than buying rental properties on credit. The rental properties will hold their value far better than the cars, and can be liquidated with only a small loss, if necessary. The cars are going to drop in a value like a rock, and if the business goes sideways you're on the hook for the original loan value.

Doing this without a shortcut would be slaving away to build up the cash you need to buy one car without debt. Rent it out on Turo and see if you can make a profit. If yes, then repeat the process to get a couple more. When you have enough profit to cover the cost of your living expenses and fund the debt required to buy more vehicles, then I would consider using OPM to expand.

Buying cars on credit, with no way of paying for them other than the business, and no prior business experience, is a major risk.

Agree @lowtek .

Can @DakineBMH not follow this line instead? Bit of hustle required but worth a shot given the "why" of the little munchkin providing long term motivation

GOLD! - No network? No money? No idea? No education? NO PROBLEM!

 

[DakineBMH]

Fast-forward.. Well I did it. I haven't posted in almost two years. I built a custom campervan for my business which generated 50,000 views in 4 wks (but thats not a real metric for income, but popularity maybe I thought it was a great feeling-). Then I built the rest of the fleet with additional units and started the rental business in Hawaii. Once the site was up, it was all-over. I had a sold-out business (nearly every night of the month for each vehicle). Revenue for 4 units was generating a nice five-figures per month, for general purposes. Very healthy profit margin.

I had just added two more units before COVID hit. Which I cancelled the order or turned around.

Also, last year within 4 months of moving back here the ex moved back to CA with our son.

So, F*ck. On an island alone (NO FAMILY, no support network of higher thinkers/ambition-its mainly beach bums out here) with little savings. Here I am draining cash (savings, not much left), using the PPP and EIDL waiting to see if tourism will come back but its not looking good. Depending on the season 1.) 35-50% of customers were european/canadian travellers... thats gone for awhile and questions about
-2.) peoples' comfort level of flying in general
-3.) leftist Hawaii 14-day quarantines
-4.) people's financial ability to spend on a Hawaii vacation

At some point there has to be an end..but how long to wait? I've been idle for 4 months and no- i dont want to become an instagram influencer, or sell courses, or build sites...etc etc etc.

I guess in these dark hours, it is just nice to talk to complete strangers on the internet.

 

[DakineBMH]

Fast-forward.. Well I did it. I haven't posted in almost two years. I built a custom campervan for my business which generated 50,000 views in 4 wks (but thats not a real metric for income, but popularity maybe I thought it was a great feeling-). Then I built the rest of the fleet with additional units and started the rental business in Hawaii. Once the site was up, it was all-over. I had a sold-out business (nearly every night of the month for each vehicle). Revenue for 4 units was generating a nice five-figures per month, for general purposes. Very healthy profit margin.

I had just added two more units before COVID hit. Which I cancelled the order or turned around.

Also, last year within 4 months of moving back here the ex moved back to CA with our son.

So, F*ck. On an island alone (NO FAMILY, no support network of higher thinkers/ambition-its mainly beach bums out here) with little savings. Here I am draining cash (savings, not much left), using the PPP and EIDL waiting to see if tourism will come back but its not looking good. Depending on the season 1.) 35-50% of customers were european/canadian travellers... thats gone for awhile and questions about
-2.) peoples' comfort level of flying in general
-3.) leftist Hawaii 14-day quarantines
-4.) people's financial ability to spend on a Hawaii vacation

At some point there has to be an end..but how long to wait? I've been idle for 4 months and no- i dont want to become an instagram influencer, or sell courses, or build sites...etc etc etc.

I guess in these dark hours, it is just nice to talk to complete strangers on the internet.

 

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[DakineBMH]

4 year update: well here's the timeline.
2019 started the business
2020 Covid closed island for 9 months
2022 Maui county places restrictions on my industry
2023 Lahaina wildfire scares away tourism

I'm now 42 staring down the barrel of starting over again.

 

[Kevin88660]

I want to thank MJ for writing TMF and Unscripted (my Favorite) and everyone here for creating such a supportive, open community. MJ's books, this forum and its members' advice and posts were stumbled upon after my 'FTE,' when I was frantically searching for answers/guidance in my life/career when I was literally saying, 'What the F*ck! How did I get here at this age?!!'

Ive never spoken so freely on a public forum. But I believe this forum is 'Good People.' Cue up a beer

Basically I had realized at 36 y/o, late Feb 2018 (FTE occurred): the time I've spent (3 yrs currently) and money ($25k for training) for 'Career No. 2-surgical sales rep turned out to be a major disappointment, and I'll tell you why. This was supposed to 'fix' my life by bringing in great income (replenishing lost savings, I started over financially at 33 y/o-more on that later) and get me on the path to provide a (very) nice lifestyle and income to invest for the future. And guess what? I was chasing money. Plain-and-simple. Money, stability, riches to be handed out freely from a corporation. I would finally be happy. Imagine the disappointment when I found out that the field I thought I was going in to..for money..started ending 15-20 yrs ago due to the ever-evolving economics of healthcare. And then there's corporate America ... I've only been in this 'special sphere' of politics and other weird shit for a little over two years-but I could speak volumes. Never will you find a more wretched hive of scum and villany.

A little background: My family went through very hard financial times starting at 13 for me. In school I worked my a$$ off. Top grades. My first degree was in a medical specialty (non-MD), and I also went to a 'Top 20 Business Undergrad program.' After college and within two years I was promoted to Supervisor.. then to Management.Then in 2009, the economy crashed. The company I worked for filed Chapter 11 proceedings. At that time I was in my mid-to-late twenties, unchallenged, unfullfilled, depressed, and BURNED OUT. So I sold everything and moved to Hawaii in 2010 (have had family there since the late 60s). Palm trees, good vibes and WAVES. Plenty of savings, worked a little bit. Hiked to waterfalls, surfed. Lived my life on my terms. Things were good for awhile. Even then I struggled with 'what I wanted to do with my life (career, life-long stigma of what success APPEARS to be),' and 'what type of JOB will MAKE ME HAPPY.' But complacency kills, as I always say. So, I moved islands and took a fairly lucrative gig as an Army Civilian Contractor in healthcare and there things were 'OK' for awhile. Didn't love the job, routine, confinement, limit on income no matter how hard I worked. Contract was year-to-year, so no long-term stability. Met a girl, fell in love, all of that natural progression-and then we had our son in 2014.

I spent alot. We fought. She left with him for her home state on the west coast. We separated early. Amidst my job contract expiring. Heartbreaking process. And very expensive. That's when I formed the 'exit strategy' of a new career in medical sales back on the mainland where they were. That kind of income would fix everything! New career! Stability! Then she moved back to Hawaii six weeks before I left.

After six years in Hawaii, I scraped enough together for the 'sales rep segway' training, and headed for the east coast in Fall 2015. After eight months of training, I was excitedly flown to the west coast to interview for two separate positions in Hawaii...I interviewed with managers from the mainland. I didn't get an offer from either company. June 2016 brought my first gig as a Sales Consultant trainee for 10 months in my home state-before my employer was bought in a major acquisition in Feb 2017. Hiring freeze for 22 months. So in Feb 2017, I accepted an offer in a major city with a new company, in a state I had never even visited before the interview. Oh..the things we'll do and say for a JOB, BENEFITS, STABILITY, SECURITY=HAPPINESS, right?
So at the age of 35, I moved to a new state. Where I knew no one. Alone. For a job.
Six weeks after I started April 2017, the person who hired me quit, and took all business with him to a competitor. Management doesn't 'know what to do.' Silence/indecision for months. This is the strategy from very well-paid corporate sales executives. Revenue plummets.

My son is growing. He's even old enough to form memories and remember me now. I get to fly out and see him twice a year. May 2018. His 4th birthday in Honolulu. We meet on a playground and he's on the top level of the playground. I see the brightest smile as we make eye contact. He makes his way down to me. I feel little arms wrap around my legs as he looks up and says, 'Hi Dad! I Love You.' F.T.E. After spending time with him and seeing the sadness and disappointment on his face when explaining that Dad has to leave again: F.T.E.

I've read that you have to discover your driving force/passion in combination with situations in life when you just know 'shit isn't right' and search to create new opportunity and it can't just 'be all about the money.' Well? Here's mine!

Please feel free to comment or reach out in PM, as I'm currently working on forming a rental business in Hawaii. So I paused today and asked myself, "Am I REALLY about to do THIS??" I'm sure it violates CENTS, but its a start, and I welcome all experienced advice regarding financing/loans and I'm currently researching how to create a professional website and tie-in SEO at the moment.

Thank You All

Welcome.

Look to hear more about your rental business soon.

 

[AmazingLarry]

4 year update: well here's the timeline.
2019 started the business
2020 Covid closed island for 9 months
2022 Maui county places restrictions on my industry
2023 Lahaina wildfire scares away tourism

I'm now 42 staring down the barrel of starting over again.

Did your business rent out camper vans? I started a van conversion business last year (but it's been on hold since Feb for some unforseen circumstances).

I visited Hawaii in June, and I remember reading about how difficult it is to find places to park/sleep in a van there.

Do you have any idea what your path forward might be? It sucks having to start again, but I'm sure you've learned a ton from this venture.

 

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[DakineBMH]

Did your business rent out camper vans? I started a van conversion business last year (but it's been on hold since Feb for some unforseen circumstances).

I visited Hawaii in June, and I remember reading about how difficult it is to find places to park/sleep in a van there.

Do you have any idea what your path forward might be? It sucks having to start again, but I'm sure you've learned a ton from this venture.

Yes, I've built out 3 Ram Promaster Highroofs myself. My business is being run by my part time employee while I'm in FL flipping a house.

 

[AmazingLarry]

Yes, I've built out 3 Ram Promaster Highroofs myself. My business is being run by my part time employee while I'm in FL flipping a house.

This is awesome. Would love to hear more about it if you're willing to share in a PM.