Trouble sleeping. Advice please

[Blair]

Hi Guys,

just wondering if anyone else has experienced trouble sleeping where you wake up in the middle of the night and have so much on your mind that you are unable to sleep. Ideas floating, tasks needing to be done etc etc. Mainly always related to business/work. It is starting to disrupt my sleep to the point where I am running short of energy come the afternoon. Any insight into the would be appreciated.

 

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[SteveO]

I used to have a lot of trouble sleeping. The first step I took was over the counter sleeping pills. When these quit working, I moved on to prescription meds. After a while, I was taking both at the same time. The problem was that over time, I was still not sleeping well.

This cycle went on for years. My doctor would change the pills on occasion just to try and make something work. I would have withdrawals with each change.

One day I just gave it all up. Dropped all the pills at once and decided to embrace the lack of sleep. Anytime that I could not sleep, I would simply get up and do something. Read, clean, meditate, do some work, etc... The thing is that once I came to terms with the problem, I quit feeling bad the next day. Sometimes I would be tired but chose not to let it affect me.

I started getting up early as well. Nothing like starting the day at 5:am.

I started sleeping through the night after a couple of months. I have slept well for years now. Every now and then something comes up that gets me excited or worked up. I just get out of bed if I can't sleep. This happens less than once a month on average.

 

[MJ DeMarco]

just wondering if anyone else has experienced trouble sleeping where you wake up in the middle of the night

Are you laying in bed watching TV? Playing on the iPAD? These things will contribute.

 

[Blair]

Are you laying in bed watching TV? Playing on the iPAD? These things will contribute.

I usually do 30min of internet browsing / social media before bed then go to sleep quite fast. Problem occurs halfway through the night. Eg asleep at 11 then wide awake at 2-3am.

 

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[SarahSH]

If my mind is racing and I have that feeling like there is too much I am trying to keep track of, I sit down and do a brain dump onto paper. Take a sheet or 3 of notebook paper and, using 1 line per thought, just write everything that is bothering you, everything that you are excited about, and all other random and mundane thoughts onto the paper. Tell yourself that you no longer need to keep this stuff in your head because you are now putting it into writing. I always feel better after this but sometimes you need to do this for several says in a row in order to really unload. You will find that a lot of what you write down is BS that really doesn't require any action by you. You may also find that you are mulling about stuff that is a legitimate worry and once it is down on paper, you can see it in black and white and will then be able to figure out your next actionable steps instead of stressing yourself out by ruminating on these things. Once, I wrote a brain dump list of around 240 things ranging from the dog possibly having cancer to writing that I was bothered by my kid's nose picking habit. Write every thought down. I hope it helps you wind down and get some sleep. SteveO's idea of just getting up and doing something useful is great. Putting that time to good use instead of worrying or looking at the clock is a great way to get in a better mindset about the lost sleep. It gets better!

 

[redshep]

Reminded me of this quote:

As a young man I used to have a dream where I was stuck in the corner of a room, a big boulder was rolling toward me, and there was nowhere to go. I'd wake up and think, Maybe that boulder represents the world, and it's getting bigger, and there are all kinds of opportunity coming my way. Then I'd think, maybe that boulder is the world, and it's going to smash me to death. I stopped having the dream by working so hard during the day that I couldn't dream at night — or at least couldn't remember the dream when I woke up. - Greg Norman

I struggled for a long time. Here's how I've solved it:

Food (probably the biggest reason for my immediate improvement):
I added quality fats during the day, I cut sugar way back, replaced diet coke with teas, smaller portions at dinner, a lot more water(a lot), added a magnesium supplement and take either a tbl of almond butter or honey before bed.

Bedroom:
I put a blackout curtain over the window and memory foam topper on the bed. Topper works 2 ways: I fall asleep faster and stay in place, and I don't notice my lovely wife tossing and turning. Well, not as much.

Tech:
I wore a sleep monitor for 30 days straight, measured my sleep cycles and found that I'd been forcing myself to wake up in the middle of a deep sleep, almost every day. There was a "valley" of light sleep between 4-5, so I started getting up at 4:30. It's been working pretty well.

This also solved my late night gaming and snacking, reddit surfing, groggy amazon purchases, mid morning a$$-dragging, etc.

 

[Goobii]

Get some morning Sun! It works wonders and for myself the second day I was up before my alarm went off.
Exercise! - If you don't want to exercise or go to the gym, just do some squats to failure or pushups till failure.
Green Tea helped me as well.

Good Luck

 

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[themaxx]

Hi Guys,

just wondering if anyone else has experienced trouble sleeping where you wake up in the middle of the night and have so much on your mind that you are unable to sleep. Ideas floating, tasks needing to be done etc etc. Mainly always related to business/work. It is starting to disrupt my sleep to the point where I am running short of energy come the afternoon. Any insight into the would be appreciated.

James has the answer:
I tell myself: I know this is the “3am Dance”. I make an appointment with myself for 3 in the afternoon. I say, “I’m going to figure out all these worries at that appointment but now I’m going to get to sleep.” Then I sleep. Then at 3 in the afternoon I, of course, realize none of those worries were valid. They were illusions that melted away with dawn.

http://jamesaltucher.quora.com/Four-Step-Technique-To-Not-Kill-Yourself-Or-How-To-Choose-Yourself

 

[Blair]

Thanks guys for your advice and experience, looking through my sleep app it looks like between 4-4.30am I wake up 80% of nights. I think next time this happens im just going to get up and go to work and see how my body reacts to less sleep / might be able to sleep through the 4am barrier the next night.

 

[Tengen]

Doing 30 Days of Discipline, waking up at 5AM seems to make it much easier to just drop off to sleep around 9-10PM.

 

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[MakeItCount]

I find that what most often delays my falling asleep is when I start unconsciously analysing ideas/problems/life issues just when I settle down in bed. Over the past few months I've tried several methods to stop these mental meanderings and, through experimentation, I have found a solution that works great for me.

Solution:
When you get into bed, allow yourself around 30 seconds to calm down and get comfortable.

Then, simply begin counting each breath, incrementing after each exhale.

Focus only on your counting. If you want, you can picture each number in your head as you exhale.
This way, you can prevent other intrusive thoughts/images from diverting your attention.

At first, your breathing will be fast. You should naturally begin to breath slower and slower over a few minutes.

Eventually, if you are still awake, your breathing will become much slower, and finally subconscious.

At this stage, you are taking in less oxygen, each breath is less defined, and you will have long forgotten about counting. Sleep is inevitable.

 

[Kristina]

This reminded me of an article I read not so long ago. It's only recently that humans started trying to sleep for a solid eight hour block of time. We used to sleep for about four hours, wake up for one to two hours, and then go back to sleep for about four hours. This sleep system has fallen into vogue in the last two hundred years or so. This break at night is a part of our natural sleep cycle. It was changed because of want of more time (time is money!). This could be what you're experiencing.

Some references for you:
http://www.bbc.com/news/magazine-16964783
http://slumberwise.com/science/your-ancestors-didnt-sleep-like-you/

I would also follow the advice of the people on here. My personal favorites were:
SteveO- Acquire a new mindset.
MJ DeMarco- No tech. in the middle of the night.
SarahSH- Mind Dump. (I would do this before you go to sleep and if you are woken up by a racing mind. You could just keep a pen and notepad on your nightstand.)
Redshep- Analyze your Diet and Environment. Figure out your sleep schedule. Try to time your sleep schedule so that you wake up during a lighter stage of sleep.
Goobii- Morning sun and Exercise.

If you are a scheduling type person, it might help to schedule out your days. Having a set bedtime and wake-up time could force your body onto a schedule, and it might give you some peace of mind.

I have also read somewhere (sorry no reference) that turning off all stimuli (TV, computer, phone, etc.) an hour before bed has been proven to help you relax. It could also help you get all those mid-night worries out and on paper before you go to bed.

Good luck on your sleeping ventures!

 

[MJ DeMarco]

I usually do 30min of internet browsing / social media before bed then go to sleep quite fast.

That could be contributing. I read and usually within 10 minutes I'm out.

looking through my sleep app it looks like between 4-4.30am I wake up 80% of nights.

What a great time to get up and go to the gym. Get your Miracle Morning groove going.

 

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[Mineralogic]

Hi Guys,

just wondering if anyone else has experienced trouble sleeping where you wake up in the middle of the night and have so much on your mind that you are unable to sleep. Ideas floating, tasks needing to be done etc etc. Mainly always related to business/work. It is starting to disrupt my sleep to the point where I am running short of energy come the afternoon. Any insight into the would be appreciated.

Yes have some experience in this

#1- always consider Environmental issues/stresses such as LED LIGHTS, IPAD use, TV, the Food/Drink you are putting in late at nite, etc
#2- How is your nutrition? There are SEVERAL things that can improve sleep in supplements and diet to relax the body nutritionally and hormone related
#3- Other guys nailed it about brain dumping your thoughts into physical form even your iPhone sound recorder- etc so you don't go to bed with lingering things
#4 - There is a chance because of all the above you are in a chronic insomnia issue where all 3 come together and manifest into this cycle to various degrees.

 

[Blair]

Thanks for all the advice guys, thinking ill start getting up when I wake up and see how it goes. Gym opens at 5am and that will free up my afternoons too as I usually go to the gym 4-6pm at the moment.

 

[Phones]

Tech:
I wore a sleep monitor for 30 days straight, measured my sleep cycles and found that I'd been forcing myself to wake up in the middle of a deep sleep, almost every day. There was a "valley" of light sleep between 4-5, so I started getting up at 4:30. It's been working pretty well.

What sleep monitor did you use @redshep ? I desperatly want one!

Zeo seems to have died off and NeuroOn only starts shipping next year :<

 

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[redshep]

What sleep monitor did you use?

Nothing fancy. I use the Jawbone Up wristband, and an app called Sleep Cycle. The app is more in depth, and can wake you up during your lightest sleep phase but I didn't like sleeping on my phone, so I got the Up. The Up app does just fine and syncs with other apps like myfitnesspal and ifttt too.

 

[Juhill]

I read somewhere that a spoonful of honey before bed helps. I think I heard it from Tim Ferris. Something about keeping your blood sugar level up while you are asleep so your body doesn't want to wake up to eat. Sounds weird and I haven't tried it, but worth a look if the other suggestions already mentioned don't work.

 

[Rawr]

Meditation helps getting tired and ready for sleep. Youtube some how to videos and just do it until you feel a bit more rested and ready to lay down.

For sleeping through the night, advil PM but mornings will suck.

 

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[InLikeFlint]

I had a very severe concussion about two years ago and I developed insomnia because of it. I started with Melatonin (over the counter) but eventually switched to Ambien (prescription) and that worked like a charm. However, Ambien can be physically addictive, and both can be mentally addictive because you are so used to taking something and breaking that cycle is tough. After a while I weened off and eventually toughed it out for a little while until I was back to normal.

Now I have the issue of not being able to fall asleep because of too much on my mind, knowing I need to do things, or remember things I forgot to do and also in part because I work out late and have a lot of adrenaline in my body after a heavy lift. A couple things that have worked for me is buying an accupressure mat (cost $15 on amazon) that you lay on to relax your muscles before bed - I pair this with a playlist I made with some nice soothing and relaxing songs that engage my brain enough to hold my attention, without being disruptive. This works like a charm for me and I don't even need it every night now - just on occasion. Additionally, reading fiction before bed works really well. Anything business or learning related is awful, but a good story that can take your mind away should put you right to sleep.

Having tried both 'remedies' and meds I would strongly recommend going without meds, in the long run it is much better for you.

Best of luck, let me know if you have further questions!

Cheers,Sam

 

[splok]

Lots of great suggestions above! A couple of other things that supposedly help:
Unless you spend a lot of time outdoors, you may not be getting enough vitamin D. You could try taking some in the morning.
Try to minimize blue light a couple of hours before bed. Flux is a free program that does this for your computer automatically if you can't break yourself of the pre-bed screen habit (it does take a bit of getting used to though). If you want to go all out on the blue light elimination, you can even get color-programmable led lightbulbs for your house (although just turning out the lights would probably be even better).

 

[SteveO]

A couple of other extreme things that I left out. Drop the caffeine and alcohol if you partake... They will both affect your sleep.

 

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[Worldisyours]

Ok,

seems like you have too much stress. be careful, its a sign

drink herbs tea like camomile. Smoke cannabis, find your place of peace.

OWN what you do. Be happy with your life.

 

[Yeezy]

Screens should be all off at least 1 hour before going to sleep, if you really can't handle this then get Flux, it works.
Make your bed for sleeping only, don't do work on your laptop in bed or use it as a couch etc.. this way whenever you go to bed your body knows it's time to sleep.
When you are trying to go to sleep the aim should be to stop all thoughts, think to yourself 'I can worry about stuff tomorrow, all that matters now is sleep.'

Also some people can live off less sleep than others, maybe you're one of them.

Good luck!

EDIT: GO TO THE GYM/EXERCISE MORE. Common sense, make your body more tired and you will sleep better.

 

[Blair]

Been getting up early and seems to be helping, im kind of ignoring what time it is and listening to my body more. I also have massive amounts of caffeine through the day and go to the gym 6 times we week at least. Pushing myself fairly hard which I guess takes its toll in one way or another but interesting so see the different opinions.

 

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[lovecharm]

Ok, here's what I take about 30-40 min before I go to bed.

10mg of Melatonin.
100mg of 5-htp.

Those are food supplements, so you can buy them in any most health food store.

Knocks me out completely.

Try it and let me know. If you sleep through your morning alarm then don't send me any hate emails

 

[Gsuz]

+1 for Melatonin.

I'd start with a way lower dosis, for me 1/4th of 1 mg is enough.

Also, there is some interesting research here for those interested: http://www.gwern.net/Melatonin

 

[lovecharm]

+1 for Melatonin.

I'd start with a way lower dosis, for me 1/4th of 1 mg is enough.

Also, there is some interesting research here for those interested: http://www.gwern.net/Melatonin

Oh yes, one other thing I should have mentioned, you can try with smaller dose and see how it feels 1mg, 3mg, 5mg, 10mg etc.

As for me, I workout 5 days a week, I am about 220lb and very muscular since I used to play rugby (still do when I get time), plus doing several ventures in various countries so fairly stressed lifestyle (I know, not exactly fast lane is it lol). So I need 10mg to get the full benefit.

LC

 

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[Blair]

Lots of great suggestions above! A couple of other things that supposedly help:
Unless you spend a lot of time outdoors, you may not be getting enough vitamin D. You could try taking some in the morning.
Try to minimize blue light a couple of hours before bed. Flux is a free program that does this for your computer automatically if you can't break yourself of the pre-bed screen habit (it does take a bit of getting used to though). If you want to go all out on the blue light elimination, you can even get color-programmable led lightbulbs for your house (although just turning out the lights would probably be even better).

Just tried flux for the first time last night and what a difference! Felt tired when I shut my laptop and slept right through till my alarm went off at 5am.

 

[Vagabond 007]

I've had sleeping problems since I was a young teenager. I'm 32 now. So it's been awhile.

Here are some tips (some have been mentioned)...

Limit your caffeine - After 8 hours, there is half of the caffeine you consumed still in your system. If you are going to consume it, have a cut off time.

Get some sun and then avoid blue light later in the day - The sun provides vitamin d. Something we need. Our bodies have what is called a circadian rhythm. The most basic explanation is when the sun comes up our bodies wake up and when the sun goes down our bodies naturally start to wind down. Our brains release melatonin. Melatonin lowers our body temp and causes drowsiness.

You can take melatonin pills to help you feel tired. I tried them for a short time and then stopped taking them. They are hormones so I didn't feel comfortable taking them. Some will say it is safe to take. And it may be. But I choose not to take any.

Again, avoid blue light later in the day - Use f.lux on your computer so it removes the blue light from the screen. Blue light will make your brain think it's still daytime. f.lux has an ipad app as well, although your ipad needs to be jailbroken.

I bought a pair of orange safety glasses that blocks out blue light. They are awesome! You will look totally ridiculous wearing them but they are great for relieving stress on your eyes from the bright screens we all stare at. I paid about $10 for them on Amazon. They are usually back ordered though.

Do something relaxing before bed - Don't be involved in anything that requires brain power. You need to start winding down.

Drink some water before bed and as soon as you wake up - Your body is dehydrated when you wake up. Drink a glass of water right away. Drink water throughout the day as well. I used to drink a half gallon of iced tea everyday. 3 weeks ago I started drinking water instead. I bought a 72 oz. jug and drink it throughout the day. I was sluggish for the first week (body was probably used to the sugar and caffeine), but now I feel fine.


I think a lot of this is mindset as well. I am a HUGE believer that the mind controls 90%+ of everything in our lives. Tell yourself you will be tired tomorrow because you won't get enough sleep and guess what, you'll probably be right. The opposite is true as well. Within reason...getting 2 hours a night is going to make you tired, I don't care how positive your thoughts are.


With all of that being said, I still struggle to have a "normal" sleeping pattern. I'm convinced I have delayed sleep phase syndrome. Sometimes I just don't get tired at night, even if I'm going on a few hours of sleep. I am a night owl and actually like being up late. I get energy at night, oddly enough.