Learn to Program vs Outsourcing

[rotem]

NDA'S won't protect you. They sign your NDA, quit after a couple of weeks (or days) and tell your idea to someone. And then he makes use of your idea without you even knowing it. It's impossible to protect ideas.

 

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[ions]

zen*******

last week we launched a website that is doing over 1K per day in NET profit. I think we paid 750 to a graphic designer and 1500 to a coder to get it all together.

Can you post the URL to the site that you describe above? I am curious to see what can be purchased for $2250 these days.

Thanks

 

[DeletedUser2]

nope
but thanks for asking

 

[ions]

I hope I didn't offend you zen*******. Is it bad manner to ask for URL's on this forum? Are business URL's generally kept private?

 

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[TommyBoy]

To hire a great developer take the steps to write out the project description, timeline, terms, payment, and agreement.

1. Objective title with type of application and language.

2. Include your goals and be open to suggestions. The experienced developers will have feedback because they probably made something similar before. Newbies won't.

3. Be specific and describe expected communication such as progress updates, turnaround time, phone calls, and payments for each completed milestone.

4. Show design samples and intended usage such as the flow of the application.

5. Get candidate to follow follow your application guideline by asking for specific text to filter out un-targeted mass proposals. Example would be "write I'm really interested in project abc" in the subject line. This means they've read your request from top to bottom.

TIPS
Do not include any fluff or ridiculous words such as "Rockstar coder"! Developers are left-brained and think in logic.
Measure response time.
-If they respond within 24 hours and you're ready to hire that is good.
-If it takes a few days, then they probably won't be ready for your project right away.
-Short responses can indicate poor communication or poor English.
-Get them to tell you their work environment (Windows or MAC or LINUX). Developers using MAC or LINUX are usually better.

 

[DeletedUser2]

I hope I didn't offend you zen*******. Is it bad manner to ask for URL's on this forum? Are business URL's generally kept private?

nope you can ask.
normally i would

This is a special page, we dont want out on a forum like this is all.

 

[somniloquist]

The website I would like to build would just rely on a few question and answer pages that would use the user provided answers to direct the user to pre-generated pages containing what I will offer based on the answered questions

That ought to be easy for you to build then, given that you're willing and capable and have the time. If you go to a vendor and aren't able to talk shop with them and do serious diligence/evaluate their proposal (probe hard!), there is a good chance that you will be taken for a ride.

 

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[somniloquist]

To hire a great developer take the steps to write out the project description, timeline, terms, payment, and agreement.

This whole post is good advice if you have experience building a project. To keep on-message for OP's question though, this might be too experienced/advanced of an approach.

Point #4:

4. Show design samples and intended usage such as the flow of the application.

is your best newbie advice. I suggest checking out Keynotopia -- almost everyone knows MS powerpoint, and this tool is a PPT add-on that lets you mock up applications with minimal fuss, drag-and-drop style. I and a lot of my programmer and designer friends use it.

 

[Skys]

This thread is great. I was starting to learn how to code, but because of this thread I realise its about learning how to make money.
With programs like Wordpress and Joomla, I wonder how much coding there really is needed.
I also hate this thread. I had a clear vision what I needed to learn until I realised it's not clear at all!
I might not need coding at all. Since I am not even sure what my business is going to be, it might even become a complete waste of time

Thanks zen******* and others. Another mistake avoided!

 

[BeingChewsie]

is your best newbie advice. I suggest checking out Keynotopia -- almost everyone knows MS powerpoint, and this tool is a PPT add-on that lets you mock up applications with minimal fuss, drag-and-drop style. I and a lot of my programmer and designer friends use it.

I love this. I still hand draw the way I want stuff to look in our apps and on our website...silly now that I see this and I couldn't purchase it fast enough. Thank you!!

Sue

 

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[Hairy Maclary]

What language do the guys on 99desings use?

It seems pretty cheap for $400 all up and if you have 20 people submit a site, that's closer to $8000 in investment. Perhaps if you take a few programing lessons on youtube, hire a coder, reverse engineering what ever he gives you, bobs your uncle...?

 

[MCaruso]

Outsource....Concentrate on your strengths, In the end youll look back and see it was more efficient

I just got done hiring a developer/programmer from overseas on elance, and the work has been excellent!

BUT, like the posts above you do need to know at least the basic to intermediate jargon/lingo of programming to let them know EXACTLY what you want. It is very hard for someone to read your mind....

 

[agustin]

this is what you need to learn: marketing & innovation

everything else can be outsourced

 

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[stranger]

This is the best answer in this topic as for me.

health status has it in 1.

when MJ did his project, it was much harder to find or afford coders.
now its very easy.

and cheap

I use expertrating.com

you find a coder, send them there, pay the few dollars for them to take a test.

and FYI. a 75% rating in php, means that they could build a CMS like wordpress from the ground up.
*(not just a wp theme, but an acutal Content Management System from the ground up)


oh and next time you need a car mechanic, better start studying...


PS. a quick list of skills you need to be successful

1. delegation
2. prioritizing
3. learning to say no
4. basic risk assessment
5. sales, and advanced sales
6. conflict resolution
7. basic management of people
8. management of self.

these skills will take you 100x farther than learning coding

 

[Goosey]

Try this site: Learn to code | Codecademy

 

[escher11]

youtube some php - html tutorials... they are quick/easy to learn/do and gives you a basic understanding...

i started building my own website on google - not finished yet but i think it will look good when it's done - but you don't need programming experience when building on google it's pretty user friendly

 

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[ColtonJD91]

I personally feel learning to program is key. I didn't even consider outsourcing and taught myself html/css in about a 2 week period. Php was a bit more time consuming, but overall a 3 month time investment has given me full control over my website and web apps and infinite savings on expenses. Start with HTML/CSS "Build your own website the right way" by Ian Lloyd. It was my first book on markup and it did a great job of getting me rolling. I actually enjoyed a lot of SitePoint's books. PM me if you want some reading material advice.

 

[JaySoriano]

"Give a man a fish and you feed him for a day. Teach a man to fish and you feed him for a lifetime."

IMO, learn the basics of programming so you can efficiently talk with your outsourced programmer.

This. Most will tell you horror stories of outsourcing a web/mobile app. But from my experience, just learning programming for a month really improved communication with my developer. That and using a mockup tool like Balsamiq.

 

[healthstatus]

I personally feel learning to program is key. I didn't even consider outsourcing and taught myself html/css in about a 2 week period. Php was a bit more time consuming, but overall a 3 month time investment has given me full control over my website and web apps and infinite savings on expenses. Start with HTML/CSS "Build your own website the right way" by Ian Lloyd. It was my first book on markup and it did a great job of getting me rolling. I actually enjoyed a lot of SitePoint's books. PM me if you want some reading material advice.

Have you got any traffic?

 

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[RogueInnovation]

The barrier of entry for code is like 3 years
Food and expenses over those years is going to exceed tens of thousands of dollars. Let alone all the hours of unpaid work you put into it.
The barrier to entry when buying a website is something you can afford in like ten hours work doing anything else.

Years unpaid + living expenses + huge emotional investment
vs
Getting a bit of money + laying out the work needed and specs

I think that learning to code is an insane barrier of entry comparitively.
Perfectionism can really hinder you in this decision making process I think.

 

[RogueInnovation]

-double post-

 

[Norman987]

I think I am pro learning to code because that way you get actual experience and you can find a job quite easily and even start your own project. Otherwise you have to deal with a complete stranger and his ways of working. Don't get me wrong, there are a few sites like seoclerks where you can easily outsource the task and get the gob done for pennies.

I personally know a lot of people who have learned coding and are making quite the living out of it right now, regardless if they're working for a firm or for themselves.

 

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[Xanothraxos]

This all hinges on how good you want to be and how professional you want to be with programming. I've been using HTML/CSS and PHP for close to a decade now, and there are still some things I outsource simply because of the time it would take me to build them, or my lack of experience in a specific area.

I would say that it is a greater use of your time and your money to pay someone to do the coding and site development for you, but it might be worth it to spend a few weeks learning the basics so you can communicate better with your developer.

Just don't be the guy that makes his own tweaks and sends back. Those clients are always awful.

 

[458]

I can build a $5,000 website for $300 using ANY quality contractor in many different countries. I started off learning code when I was young but now I rarely code anything, it makes little sense. Be a problem solver first and everything else later, this goes for any skill including accounting, sales, marketing and everything else you can think of.