Have We Lost Our Hunger?

[Runum]

I have been doing some thinking and reasoning here. (Caution, this may be dangerous). At this point I have come to the conclusion that overall American has lost its fire, its hunger and we are all looking for someone to blame.

I teach science, mainly, and some social studies to 10-12 year olds. Same lessons every year. We are currently going through the industrial revolution. It got me to thinking that what made this country great was that we did not have it all. We wanted more. We wanted our independence from taxation of the King of England, we wanted our own land, we wanted a better life.

We, as a country, achieved our goals. We have our comfort, we have leisure time and all the toys anyone could want. Yeah, I know, as individuals we always want more but we do not ache for it, we just want it. That comfort has made us fat and lazy. Our citizens are busy blaming anyone and everyone for our education, taxation, and budget problems. We are not paying attention to the fact that other countries are hungry and, with technology, they have the tools to take over our position in the world. We sit around complaining and yearning for the good old days.

Collectively, we do not see that getting up and being productive is the biggest factor that can help this country and ourselves. We can't see the biggest problem we have is the person in the mirror.

Maybe I'm slow, I dunno. I'm trying to put a lot of pieces of this puzzle together and make sense of what I see and where we are going. I am also looking at opportunities, not just complaining.

Not sure if anyone wants to comment, just expressing some recent observations.

PS, for all the newbies. Notice no mention was made of politics or religion. That is because those topics are not allowed on this forum. Please be courteous and observe forum rules.

 

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[Likwid24]

I agree 100%. We, as a whole, don't have the desire we once had. There are way too many people who want but don't want to do anything for it. Not enough doers, which was what our country was founded on and made it what it is today (or should I say made it what it was). Everywhere you go people put their hand out looking for freebies and blaming others for their financial problems. We need to get back to our roots which I feel will never happen now. The country has gotten too greedy and lazy. I know I'm going to be doing my part to change that but I feel that the majority will not change their ways. I hope I'm wrong on this. I would love to get back to the days my parents and grandparents told me about and I'll do everything I can to help change things but how do we get the rest of the country to follow? They say that every great empire falls. That's going to happen sooner than later if we don't change our ways.

 

[petethepeddler]

And that is why I'm fascinated with history. The industrial revolution was our country's time to shine. Because of that drive we succeeded. Other countries are going to take the information age (or whatever is next) and succeed in becoming a great power like America once was.

History repeats itself, not always with the same people.

 

[MJ DeMarco]

Have we lost our hunger?

Collectively as a country? Yes. This is why I believe the best investments are outside of the USA and any USA company that I own (invest in) has to have a global presence.

Great take Greg, not just because of the topic, but because you steered clear of politics.

 

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[kurtyordy]

I think the greatest issue is not a loss of hunger but of national identity. Earlier generations were Americans first. The systems (i.e. racism and other forms of discrimination) were not perfect, but even in those we all still considered ourselves Americans. The country as a whole functioned closer to how we acted in the few weeks post 9/11. Yes, there were rabble rowsers (what am I, 90?) but there was a sense of national pride that ran deep.

Now we are so segmented as a country. My hunger might step on your hungers toes, so we fight and so on a so forth and the idea of working together as Americans seems dead. It is all about getting ourselves or our little segment ahead whatever that segment may be.

 

[CEBenz]

100% Agree.

We once had a little thing called the Tea Party as a protest against taxes, now where are we on taxes?

People used to come to this country for opportunity, NOT because they wanted a "safe secure job". But the sheeple have largely become complacent and now think they're entitled to everything their ancestors WORKED for.
I found this article on Simon Black's blog interesting personally.

The ‘New America’ is catching up to the ‘Old America’ | Sovereign Man: Finance, lifestyle design, Offshore Business and Expat news

 

[bflbob]

I have to agree. Things have changed for the better, and that's made it worse.

In prior generations many wondered if they would have something to eat. Now we wonder where we should eat.

They used to wonder if they'd ever get a day off. Now we have trouble deciding where to go for our vacation.

They used to be lucky to have one good suit or dress. Now we give away clothes better than they ever hoped of owning.

The most important thing in their life was a job. Now, the most important thing in our job is a life.

With all the comforts we have in life, today is a good time to live. But it is at the expense of tomorrow.

As bad as our worst day is today, it is still better than the best day of 80% of the earth's population.

But it can always get better ;-)

 

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[Gonzosan]

Collectively as a country? Yes. This is why I believe the best investments are outside of the USA and any USA company that I own (invest in) has to have a global presence.

Great take Greg, not just because of the topic, but because you steered clear of politics.

I believe these days any good company has to have a global presence. As time passes I think eventually the best companies will be known in some small country across the world. We'll be so tightly knit that companies will no longer be known by their country of origin. Personally I think that everyone should start thinking globally. If you want to succeed you need to realize that sticking to the US alone is putting all your eggs in one basket, then again I always try to think globally when I'm thinking about future businesses I want to pursue so I'm biased.

 

[Kung Fu Steve]

We have bred ourselves into a culture without a mission. No real point to get out of bed each morning. As silly as a reference as it is; there's a speech by Brad Pitt in Fight Club that sums it up. There is no great war, there is no great depression, we are history's middle children. Stuck without a real cause.

It was brought up by Kurt. After 9/11 there was a purpose. We didn't know exactly what it was, but somebody had to die. Justice had to be served. There was a mission.

Now what's the mission? There are no real powerful evil do-ers to stop. There is no crisis to pull ourselves out of. No matter how bad the economy is becoming, it isn't painful enough for people to finally take action.

The pain & pleasure principal on a global scale (I say global because I think there and many countries in a similar position as us).

Where's the opportunity you ask? I think it is in rallying people behind something worth doing. Giving people a mission, something to pursue, conquer, achieve, something that is for the good of man kind. Create the reason for people to get out of bed each morning, and not just that, but create a reason for someone to literally put their blood, sweat, and tears into.

 

[CEBenz]

I believe these days any good company has to have a global presence. As time passes I think eventually the best companies will be known in some small country across the world. We'll be so tightly knit that companies will no longer be known by their country of origin. Personally I think that everyone should start thinking globally. If you want to succeed you need to realize that sticking to the US alone is putting all your eggs in one basket, then again I always try to think globally when I'm thinking about future businesses I want to pursue so I'm biased.

I think you have an excellent point here. I think we're going to watch billionaires created at a much faster pace over the next 20-40 years as the entrepreneurship reaches into hungry markets. MJ might have to get back to work lol.

We have bred ourselves into a culture without a mission. No real point to get out of bed each morning. As silly as a reference as it is; there's a speech by Brad Pitt in Fight Club that sums it up. There is no great war, there is no great depression, we are history's middle children. Stuck without a real cause.

It was brought up by Kurt. After 9/11 there was a purpose. We didn't know exactly what it was, but somebody had to die. Justice had to be served. There was a mission.

Now what's the mission? There are no real powerful evil do-ers to stop. There is no crisis to pull ourselves out of. No matter how bad the economy is becoming, it isn't painful enough for people to finally take action.

The pain & pleasure principal on a global scale (I say global because I think there and many countries in a similar position as us).

Where's the opportunity you ask? I think it is in rallying people behind something worth doing. Giving people a mission, something to pursue, conquer, achieve, something that is for the good of man kind. Create the reason for people to get out of bed each morning, and not just that, but create a reason for someone to literally put their blood, sweat, and tears into.

This is another interesting point and one I hadn't given much thought. If we could convince people to turn their attention towards liberty, education, and feeding the homeless here and abroad, we might be on our way to a brighter tomorrow. It would give people some direction.

 

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[Graves]

I have to agree. Things have changed for the better, and that's made it worse.

In prior generations many wondered if they would have something to eat. Now we wonder where we should eat.

They used to wonder if they'd ever get a day off. Now we have trouble deciding where to go for our vacation.

They used to be lucky to have one good suit or dress. Now we give away clothes better than they ever hoped of owning.

The most important thing in their life was a job. Now, the most important thing in our job is a life.

Looks like I'm playing devil's advocate here, but I think this is good.

 

[JEdwards]

From an employer stand point. Guys in their 20's now are the laziest group of people as a whole I have ever seen.

In the 90's they wanted to get ahead, they wanted to be something.

Now they want a faster mustang and to play video games, while sitting around telling people how smart they are.

Have we lost our hunger.. Yes.

BTW: Good for the 20 year old that actually wants to do something. There are a lot of people to hire.

 

[Icy]

Where's the opportunity you ask? I think it is in rallying people behind something worth doing. Giving people a mission, something to pursue, conquer, achieve, something that is for the good of man kind. Create the reason for people to get out of bed each morning, and not just that, but create a reason for someone to literally put their blood, sweat, and tears into.

This is very much mine line of thinking on this.

A big killer (imo) is how we have schools set up. First, and foremost, I'm not insinuating about teachers here, but school as a whole. I know for a fact that I had a teacher who went against the standard, in a more 'doer' type teaching view.

In my experience, school was set up just like an assembly line. If you can follow the procedures you get a 'promotion'. It was never about taking what you do and figuring out a way to apply this information to something else, just about following along with rules. Yes, it is a bit 'vague', but essentially if you could follow some rules, or memorize spelling\date\whatever you'd advance on.

There was one teacher though, who as far as I remember, mostly had us learn through creating things of our own. Now, being 13ish a lot of it was rehashing other projects we've done\seen, but it was open as to what we create pertaining to the topic at hand. It was about an understanding, and applying that, not simply regurgitating what we were told back onto a test paper.

Being immature 13 year olds I remember the first project just starting metric measurements resulting in a parody of 'She thinks my tractors sexy' resulting in 'She think's my meter stick is sexy'. As you can imagine, he asked as to do something else (projects were presented in front of class. haha) They became more about creating things, rather than parodying songs after the first few projects though.

He's now after a few years of making educational games for the iphone, taking the step of trying to create a business out of it. So, perhaps that line of how he thinks, was his way to teach.

So, I guess my point is, with the exception of certain teachers, school is set up to not make you feel as though you can expand upon existing methods\ideas. It's simply about following the rules rather than applying to other areas.

 

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[Graves]

I think if a man from the early 1900s time traveled to today, schools are the only places he would find familiar

 

[mrhahn]

So, I guess my point is, with the exception of certain teachers, school is set up to not make you feel as though you can expand upon existing methods\ideas. It's simply about following the rules rather than applying to other areas.

I think the school system definitely adds to the state our country's in right now. The format worked well during the Industrial Revolution, but it hasn't kept up as America and the world has changed. Its main focus is still to produce a large working class; there is less emphasis on creation. We score low in math and science compared to other countries.

If we want to stay competitive with the global market, a revolutionary change in schooling is definitely needed. As children to young adults we spend most of the time there, so it would have a great effect on our mindset.

 

[dkt91]

I think it's not merely an American problem, but a problem that most - if not all - first world countries share. Really, it's the same in my country.

In my country the general population, too, has become lazy, averse towards taking risks, and totally dependend on other people to build them their reality. If something is not working out they are blaming the government, the EU, the rich, the 3rd world countries who are "stealing" us low-wage jobs and everyone else except for themselves.

The generation of our grandfathers and parents has rebuilt this country after the war and since then many great companies have been either rebuilt or newly founded. Among those are names like Mercedes, BMW, Porsche, Siemens, SAP or Bayer and Würth.

What is happening now is that people finish school, get a secure job with a lot of vacation time and that's it. Only very few people are actually striving for improvement and innovation.

That's the one way to see it. I, however, feel very ambivalent about this topic, since despite this development it feels like there are more entrepreneurs than ever (among them many people in their 20's or younger), to a large degree thanks to the internet and the technology revolution it has caused. I do not have any statistics ready but I highly doubt that the number of millionaires in their early 20's has ever been has high as it is today (of course taking inflation into account).

I cannot think of a proper conclusion now because it is late already but all in all I'd say that things don't look too bad for the individual thinking and acting on a global scale.

 

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[Runum]

I appreciate all the comments but some of them are exactly what I experience. I am a teacher. I have tried to teach motivation, goal setting, problem solving, and real world applications to all grades from 5-12. The result is about the same as you see here. A few(read 2-3) are ready to learn and take some action. Most of the students talk a good game but make excuses as to why they can't do.

Then I try to teach real world, hands on science. I get excuses from parents as to why their kid is not capable of problem solving. The students are unbelievably capable as long as mommy isn't around. But it is much more comfy and safe not to upset their kids by pushing them to learn something new.

As far as my fellow teachers, I love them but there is no more incentive to work hard than there is to work mediocre. Most teachers I know got into the profession to change the world. Now they are burned out, tired of excuses and exceptions to everything. So the system does have flaws.

My point is the problems will not get solved because we do not have the stomach, resolve, motivation, hunger, or whatever to solve them. We will not face facts. We want someone else to be uncomfortable and solve our problems for us as we eat cheetos, drink our cola, and watch Biggest Loser.

We can point fingers all we want, it will not fix a thing. We have to start with ourselves and our own.

 

[ethicalmarketin]

A great post! I think anyone with their eyes open can see that this is true, but it's almost like people are afraid to admit it. It's easier to delude yourself into thinking things are going just fine, when they're obviously not. You could get into the political and economic reasons why this has happened (I won't) but I think it's mostly because of culture. America have embraced a culture of ignorance and intellectual laziness. Last time I checked, Brittney Spears had a number one album so it's obvious that "the new dumb" have completely taken over. We've lost our souls, and lost our spines with it.

While the current situation is grim, there are certainly enough people trying to change this trend. Most and more Americans are realizing that job security is a myth, and taking the reins themselves. I see a future where more and more individuals will work for themselves. People just don't trust large companies anymore, and for good reason.

 

[Runum]

I think it's not merely an American problem, but a problem that most - if not all - first world countries share. Really, it's the same in my country.

In my country the general population, too, has become lazy, averse towards taking risks, and totally dependend on other people to build them their reality. If something is not working out they are blaming the government, the EU, the rich, the 3rd world countries who are "stealing" us low-wage jobs and everyone else except for themselves.

The generation of our grandfathers and parents has rebuilt this country after the war and since then many great companies have been either rebuilt or newly founded. Among those are names like Mercedes, BMW, Porsche, Siemens, SAP or Bayer and Würth.

What is happening now is that people finish school, get a secure job with a lot of vacation time and that's it. Only very few people are actually striving for improvement and innovation.

That's the one way to see it. I, however, feel very ambivalent about this topic, since despite this development it feels like there are more entrepreneurs than ever (among them many people in their 20's or younger), to a large degree thanks to the internet and the technology revolution it has caused. I do not have any statistics ready but I highly doubt that the number of millionaires in their early 20's has ever been has high as it is today (of course taking inflation into account).

I cannot think of a proper conclusion now because it is late already but all in all I'd say that things don't look too bad for the individual thinking and acting on a global scale.

Thanks for an international perspective dkt91.

 

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[Fermovian]

I think that instead of a continuum of ambition most of society is going to the two extremes of low ambition/achievement and high ambition/achievement. As has been said above, there are probably more young millionaires than ever and there are more slackers (it would seem) than ever. The thing is our culture kind of encourages it by exalting people who have not really achieved anything (reality T.V. etc.) and by constantly denigrating the aquisition of money and people who have wealth.

Some people use religion as a motivator in their lives, but society has turned its back on that (probably a result of 9/11).

I suppose charity and volunteering are left, but a lot of people don't take the first step in those areas because they don't see the point or believe it will benefit them, so that is no help.

Then there is the ease of obtaining a variety of cheap entertainment, which means you do not need to make a lot of money or work very hard to live a life full of "fun".

Overall it is an environment that does not foster motivation.

 

[ClintonSkakun]

Yeah, most people have become loosers. It's sad. Not too many people have the determination to succeed. At the end of the day most people will say, "what's it going to matter, I've got everything I need." Those people are best left to their own devices.

 

[Josh Igoe]

We should be happy about it for us! The media and the mega corporations have helped dumb down the average person into mindless consumers. Thats a whole nation of 350million people who are basically programmed to just buy stuff and not think. Thats perfect for the type of businesses that Fastlane is advocating. Without the consumers we haven't got businesses.

 

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[Adrian88]

Interesting discussion. When our culture seems obsessed with the Kardashians, Paris Hilton, and the Jersey Shore, famous for being famous, one starts to worry.

All I can say is: "Be the change you want to see in the world".

 

[ethicalmarketin]

As has been said above, there are probably more young millionaires than ever and there are more slackers (it would seem) than ever.

Then there are also the "slacker millionaires" who realized that working smart is better than working hard. Through most of my school years I was a notorious slacker, and in hindsight it actually made me smarter. I never really cared about getting good grades or learning most of the crap they tried to brainwash me with in school. But I was always hungry for information, and retained my natural sense of curiosity. There's a lot to be said for taking your education into your own hands. What I'm getting at is pretty much the same point that's made in the movie "Good Will Hunting" when Matt Damon talks about getting the same quality education from a library that someone could get going to Harvard.

In some ways, MJ acted like a slacker in his younger days; living in his mom's basement and refusing to get a job so he could pursue his dreams. I'm pretty much there right now, and I believe I'm happier than most people who have "real jobs." Of course, most people are hostile towards this sort of thinking.

Has anyone else here had a similar experience?

 

[ethicalmarketin]

We should be happy about it for us! The media and the mega corporations have helped dumb down the average person into mindless consumers. Thats a whole nation of 350million people who are basically programmed to just buy stuff and not think. Thats perfect for the type of businesses that Fastlane is advocating. Without the consumers we haven't got businesses.

I agree for the most part. "a sucker is born every minute" was said roughly one hundred years ago, but now it's more like "a sucker is born every half second." However, there's also something to be said for targeting consumers who aren't typical brainwashed idiots. Sure, you can sell a lot of crap to a lot of morons, but for the most part these people won't be repeat customers. For more long term success, I believe it's better to be honest and talk to people like they're intelligent.

TV advertisers have long since figured out how stupid the average American consumer is. Most TV commercials are designed to appeal to adults who have the intellectual maturity of 12 year olds. It's really sad that things have gotten this way, but I'm cautiously optimistic that more and more people are resisting the dumbing down.

 

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[Likwid24]

Thanks for starting this great thread runum! I like seeing everyones opinion on this subject and I like that most of us fastlaners see eye to eye. I am very patriotic, I even have a tattoo of an american flag on my back from when I was younger, so Im very concerned about the direction this country is headed in. What do you think are ways we can get back to the way things use to be? Or do you think we're too far gone now and there's no hope for future generations?

By the way Runum, speed ++ for starting this thread

 

[Runum]

What do you think are ways we can get back to the way things use to be? Or do you think we're too far gone now and there's no hope for future generations?

Fixing it will require many plans and action from many different entities. It will also require hard work and giving up entitlements. The limitation we have here is that some solutions will require political discussions and those are not allowed on this forum.

Rather than focus on solutions for our country I am more focused on how me and my family can thrive. I do want the country to thrive but I have to take care of my own first.

 

[MJ DeMarco]

Have we lost our hunger?

I don't think so ... this man looks pretty well fed.

Michelle Malkin » Adult Baby Syndrome
(Warning: Links to a political blog)

 

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[dnice]

I have been interviewing applicants for a new paralegal position for the past couple weeks. Most applicants are just graduating college. We have been unimpressed with the quality of the candidates. Not so much as far as their education and employment background but in how they come across at the interview. It seems that there is no real drive or hunger in these new college graduates. If these kids were entrepreneurs I wouldn't buy what they were selling.

 

[Likwid24]

Rather than focus on solutions for our country I am more focused on how me and my family can thrive. I do want the country to thrive but I have to take care of my own first.

That's exactly what I'm focusing on right now

I don't think so ... this man looks pretty well fed.

Michelle Malkin » Adult Baby Syndrome
(Warning: Links to a political blog)

That pretty much sums up what we're dealing with right now. A bunch of big helpless babies waiting to be fed!