The 4 Hour Work Week Vs. Millionaire Fastlane

[Icy]

Robert it sounds like you already have a notion of taking anything involving Tim Ferriss and disregarding it. I can't say whether it's "right or wrong", but it seems silly to ask the question, and just denounce it.

Did others find the 4HWW valuable/helpful?

If you don't find it helpful then you read it "wrong". Perhaps it's not exactly new information for *everyone*, but it is good information to follow. That said, are you going to be working 4 hours weeks after reading it? Of course not. It's about building things (or taking current things) and taking yourself out of the stuff that wastes your time. Yes you are going to be investing a lot of time, but do it in a way that (if you so choose) you can take yourself out of it. Not as a starting today, you will only work 4 hours type of deal.

He doesn't explicitly state, or make note to clear it up (it'd hurt sales), to describe "work". IMO, he works a lot, but if he enjoys it, and it isn't the type of work that makes the day drag on (assembly line), then it doesn't seem to count as work for him.

 

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[Robert Francis]

To you starting a business to cover the cost of a vacation or car might seem stupid...

On the contrary, I think doing that would be an amazing accomplishment.

To me, that means developing the quickest and most easily profitable businesses can be used to fund bigger venues. If only it was that easy though, hmm?

Ultimately, I think this is the crux of why I feel queezy about TF's advice and find MJ's book to be truly insightful.

When you marry the goals (freedom), mindsets (I don't have to be part of the mediocre, poor, masses) and MATH (effectation, scale, magnitude) with the TRUTH that it will also take a ton of work and perseverance... you have something worth pursuing.

Once you no longer feel destined for the sidewalk and are using the correct MATH, you now have a better than ZERO chance of hitting your goals (material or otherwise).

But...

The FINAL key to the puzzle, IMHO, is being willing to trust the MATH enough to continue to apply it until it goes your way.

As MJ says in the book, "In business, you only have to be right ONCE to be hugely successful."

My guess is, that's assuming there may be lots of times you were wrong.

So...

Not that simple. But absolutely doable.

Let us know when you get that car!

 

[Rickson9]

Hi Bob, I'm not sure why you hate Tim so much. Just from my perspective I find that most individuals have something to contribute and I'm willing to listen.

I also don't know how you know what Tim would say to your son unless Tim actually said it. Perhaps there is some reflection of your own preconceptions here, but that is neither here nor there.

With regards to the 'ease of success' my comment was more related to elephants trying to swim with the dolphins. Individuals would experience more success the sooner they realized that they were elephants. With regards to my success, it was given to me by life. It would be extreme hubris for me to believe that I can extract more success than my spiritual bank account can allow. I'm eternally grateful.

There have been no success, struggles or challenges in life for me, now or in the future. There is just life.

All the best.

 

[Robert Francis]

Robert it sounds like you already have a notion of taking anything involving Tim Ferriss and disregarding it. I can't say whether it's "right or wrong", but it seems silly to ask the question, and just denounce it.

There's a bit of truth in that. I'll admit that I am coming to the question with some opinions already.

But, in reality, I was (trying) to be open about the fact that the reasons I don't love the 4HWW is because, for me, it didn't seem to fit my reality and experience and I was curious if it was "just me."

Part and parcel of me advocating ( a bit) for those of us that have to rely on the perseverance part of the equation, is my willingness to admit "I could be wrong."

So, yeah...I DO have my opinions, but I really was curious what others thought.

If you don't find it helpful then you read it "wrong".

See above. I could have read it "wrong." But, I don't think I was wrong to ask questions about it's "real world value."

Perhaps it's not exactly new information for *everyone*, but it is good information to follow.

Agreed. If you limit it's value to the concepts in the book, only.

The problem is, like the example of the FAT guy leading the weight loss class in MJ's book, as a reader/human, it's hard to not evaluate the advice in the book relative to whether the author actually utilized the advice in the book to achieve what he has.

I am not a TF hater.

I am of the opinion that I could learn MUCH about the whole Carpe Diem approach to life from him. Say what you will about him, he appears to be an energetic, multi-talented guy that is passionate about life. Kudos to him.

The problem is, he's offering advice to others (supposedly) based on his own experience and there seems to be some evidence that the realities are far from the PR.

He (from my perspective) appears to be one in a long line of "business advice" authors that, primarily, made his money from selling a book about "how to make money."

There are big questions about his claims for the success of his nutritional line and the reality.

There are even bigger questions about the way he "really" achieved a 30 lb weight loss for his most recent book.

And, both are similar in this way...

If he lost weight in a way that I couldn't (really) replicate, would his fitness book be valuable to me?

If he made his money (really) in ways that are different than outlined in his book, would his business advice be valuable to me?

 

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[Robert Francis]

Hi Bob, I'm not sure why you hate Tim so much.

Ugh. If anyone thinks I hate TF, let me correct you...I don't!

I am sure that there is much I could learn from him.

I (really) was just asking if anyone else had experienced the negative "4HWW" effects that I had (ambiguous guilt that I wasn't only working 4 hours per week).

I also don't know how you know what Tim would say to your son unless Tim actually said it.

That's a fair statement. TF has not actually given my son any wrestling advice. And, I could be wrong about what he would actually say.

But, isn't it fair of me to assume that he'd suggest to my son that he do what TF did?

With regards to the 'ease of success' my comment was more related to elephants trying to swim with the dolphins. Individuals would experience more success the sooner they realized that they were elephants.

Assuming you are putting yourself in the "elephants" category here, "Welcome fellow elephant!"

I wholeheartedly agree, and, in a way, is what I think I'm saying.

By all objective standards, TF is a dolphin (that's a good thing, right?) and, maybe for that reason, "this elephant" isn't finding his advice about jumping through flaming hoops to be super attractive...being an elephant and all.

Is this a bigger reflection on me than TF? Sure. Obviously.

With regards to my success, it was given to me by life. It would be extreme hubris for me to believe that I can extract more success than my spiritual bank account can allow. I eternally grateful.

There have been no success, struggles or challenges in life for me, now or in the future. There is just life.

All the best.

Nice quote...especially the "there is just life" part. I know that one of my personal weaknesses is letting the struggles and challenges rise to higher status than I should.

I appreciate the thought.

 

[kaboom713]

I believe both books are great for motivation to get off your a$$ and do something but they are not anything alike after that. My take is that 4HWW is a great book for after you have become well versed and successful using MJ's methods. I don't believe you can start a business a be working four hours a week in the first couple of years. If you do start a business like that it would be the holy grail. The big difference in the books for me was the Fastlane was chocked full of concepts you can use whereas 4HWW was a self promotion of Tim Ferriss with lots of pages telling we what software, websites and services to use to pare down my workload.

 

[FDJustin]

First thing I'm going to start with here is a quick disclaimer, the notion of "If only it was that easy, hmm?" looks like a jab. I didn't think so when I wrote it, but it does when I read it, and it's not meant to be. It's more a rhetoric, like.. "It's easier for me to say this than do it, of course." Actually, replace it with that line, it's perfect.

I remember the book coming across as very useful, but certainly leaving me wanting on other aspects of business. It isn't hard to recognize that there will be a lot more to figure out and do before you can set up one or more of these "muse" businesses, and it'll be up to you to figure out the process for that.

To be fair, I don't remember if it suggested other resources to get you started with that or not.

Let us know when you get that car!

I might never drive, but I do have my eye on an outlandish jetpack... I'll be sure to upload a video of my first flight. I'll probably look like a cat plummeting towards a full bathtub in it.

 

[cjrocks]

I read about 1 chapter of the 4 hour work week and scanned other chapters. This book is terrable I am in dire straights and reading his bragging made me feel like shit. I just put it down and looked for another book to read.

 

[philip]

Here is one of those debates that will never be settled depending on which side you look at it from. Personally, i do believe the 4 Hour Work Week is very possibly. Many have gotten the whole concept wrong. What the 4HWW is all about is freedom! Freedom to do the things you like, work whenever, wherever.

You don't have to be a multi millionaire to live this kind of lifestyle like many people think. Here is a perfect example: (This is a real opportunity so if you are interested contact me for full details)


I am looking for a super sharp, young C# or VB.NET developer, who wants to move to Bali temporarily and work with us on an exciting company.

We will be covering all transport and living costs, and you will get to work on a highly successful software platform.
It is written in VB.NET, however we realize that C# developers can quickly switch to VB.NET, and therefore we also welcome submissions from C# developers.

You will get to work together with the Project Getaway team, and have a big opportunity to live the 4 Hour Work Week life style, travel the world, and meet successful entrepreneurs.

Put simply what Timothy Ferriss and the rest who advocate this lifestyle are doing is to try and inform others that there is a better, more enjoyable and simpler way to work.

 

[Icy]

I am looking for a super sharp, young C# or VB.NET developer, who wants to move to Bali temporarily and work with us on an exciting company.

We will be covering all transport and living costs, and you will get to work on a highly successful software platform.
It is written in VB.NET, however we realize that C# developers can quickly switch to VB.NET, and therefore we also welcome submissions from C# developers.

Sounds kind of like spam, but I'll bite. What does the software do? Why would I be interested in working on it?

Also, how come you've decided on .NET framework rather than going with something more portable like Java and still has a GC?

 

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[MJ DeMarco]

Finally will add my comments to this thread ...

Here is one of those debates that will never be settled depending on which side you look at it from.

I agree. If one receives personal value out of either (or any book for that matter) does it matter?

I absolutely love both books. They're written by real entrepreneurs. They emphasize the importance of time,

I believe this is the common undercurrent of the two books -- however, both go in radical directions on how to achieve control over your most precious asset ... TIME.

I believe both books are great for motivation to get off your a$$ and do something but they are not anything alike after that.

Correct. The Millionaire Fastlane is market centered and based upon mathematics -- 4HWW is self-centered.

My take is that 4HWW is a great book for after you have become well versed and successful using MJ's methods

Yes, The Commandment of Time might be your last hurdle w/respect to Fastlane as it was mine. My 4HWW came after years of hard work.

I don't believe you can start a business a be working four hours a week in the first couple of years.

I think this is where the 4HWW gets subverted and I've had conversations with wannabe entrepreneurs who think they'll make millions outsourcing everything -- I could only laugh.

I am of the opinion that I could learn MUCH about the whole Carpe Diem approach to life from him. Say what you will about him, he appears to be an energetic, multi-talented guy that is passionate about life. Kudos to him.

No doubt, as I like to say ... I tend to watch what the gurus DO, not what they say and/or preach.

He (from my perspective) appears to be one in a long line of "business advice" authors that, primarily, made his money from selling a book about "how to make money."

Ahh the good old guru hypocrisy -- get rich selling one mathematical equation while leveraging another. Transparency is as easy as defining the equation to which the "teacher" is selling ... is it the same?

My guess is, that's assuming there may be lots of times you were wrong.

Many many times. And I'm still wrong today, and will continue to be wrong on many fronts. Learning never stops as the wisdom that comes from it, doesn't not either.

The FINAL key to the puzzle, IMHO, is being willing to trust the MATH enough to continue to apply it until it goes your way.

Math is the language of the universe. I know if you can impact millions in a monetized structure, you will earn millions.

On a related topic, MJ talks about how it's 180 degrees wrong approach to start with a completely selfish approach/goal.

Nothing wrong will selfishness as long as you throw it in the backseat to your entrepreneurial vision.

And, after being in my own online business, full time, for over seven years now, I found this to be one of the biggest revelations; at least the way he discussed it.

You just discovered that the marketplace doesn't care about your personal motivations,passions, loves, etc. etc. The market is like a needy child -- it wants what it wants.

 

[mvidaurre]

Different levels, perspectives and philosophy

IMHO the two books are for different systems level: MF is more holistic with mathematical support, 4HWW is anecdotical more oriented to the philosophy of doing the minimum that could work.

The tone is also different in MF is clear that MJ has work in try to discovering laws using a more scientific approach, based on facts and mathematical reasoning. That he used in limos.com to build his fastlane road. TF is also articulate and successful businessman but (that is my BIG but) he is machiavellistic in the result justify any means (for example his championship based on weight less one day before the combat and gaining again weight to push outside his opponent).

I learned reading both books. But I'm more in harmony with the MJ vision and philosophy.

Other related book is the Robert Greene 50th Law. This is actionable in other level also, but is a very interesting analysis about the New Principe and the importance of to be Fearless

 

[Fanat]

I found the books to be quite synergistic, and both teach some good stuff.

And I think a lot of people miss many points in 4hww, so that's why it gets some bad rep.

I've never felt TF advocates a four hour work week as the METHOD, rather he puts it as the eventual GOAL, so I don't see how this clashes with Fastlane's Commandment of Time...

 

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[Jason!]

The biggest thing that I took away from the book is that I need to create something millions of people can use and build it into an asset I can sell someday. I've owned many service type companies that aren't scalable as I personally am the 'asset'.

It's funny, I figured out this was my problem about a year ago and really started to look into creating majority-effecting products vs time intensive services that were too niche. After reading MJ's book I was smiling ear to ear, realizing that I definitely am on the right track.

I have a whiteboard hanging in my room and the top thing on it now: Impact Millions.

 

[valuegiver]

If you like Tim Ferrriss, your bullshit detector is very weak.

 

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[domular]

I like both books for different reasons. FLM is the best no BS blueprint I've ever seen. Here's the problem with it, people are brainwashed by society to aspire to (at best) the slowlane. What MJ talks about is so radically different to what they believe that what he preaches is blasphemy to the slowlane religion and is instantly discounted as a scam. While I can see why MJ named the book what he did I believe it creates a hurdle for the average Joe hearing about it.

4HWW on the other hand while not as ultimately useful as FLM, it at least opens peoples eyes to the insanity of spending your entire life working for a couple of weeks a year of traveling or hoping you're well enough to do it when you retire. I agree Tim completely glosses over business creation and makes it sound easy to create a passive income business (muse) that affords you the luxury to travel however you want. I also don't think you can under-estimate the marketing genius of Tim. Using Google ads to test his book title was brilliant. He also knows exactly who his audience is and knows what buttons to push to get them to buy books. Compared with most of the absurd financial advice being spouted by posers I give it a solid B

 

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[PrincessK]

Both r Good

The Four Hour Work Week is great because it teaches you the concept of outsourcing and how to maximize your time.

It also introduces concepts like miniretirements and being able to spend more time enjoying yourself. If you have a certain amount of money and you know where to get things done it makes a lot of sense. even if you are not working 4 hrs a week lets say you are working 10 or 15 its still better than draining your soul to build someone elses dream

The Millionaire Fastlane is great because it teaches process and wise decision making which is priceless because our choices create our results

Love
Conquers All

PrincessK

 

[domular]

It also introduces concepts like miniretirements and being able to spend more time enjoying yourself. If you have a certain amount of money and you know where to get things done it makes a lot of sense. even if you are not working 4 hrs a week lets say you are working 10 or 15 its still better than draining your soul to build someone elses dream

This is a point I didn't hit but you are exactly right. People are completely blown away when I tell them I have a girl in Malaysia I pay $3 an hour for repetitive work and I over-pay, she's thrilled and she always refers to me as Sir Norm which is a cultural thing, but hey I get a kick out of it anyway . Or that I have a lady in Oregon that works from home and is a godsend. She handles all my customer support now and I've never met her, only talked to her a handful of times in the 2 month since she's worked for me and we're both thrilled with the work arrangement. And then there's fiverr.com which is so awesome for simple tasks - it's such a no-brainer.

 

[PrincessK]

Absolutely !! It just makes sense . I am having to stop myself because I love writing naturally but there are a ton of people out there that are great at what they do and I can spend maybe 15 minutes editing vs 2 hrs writing

Love

PrincessK

 

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[Rickson9]

Are you sure his successes are verifiable apart from book launches?

 

[valuegiver]

He has said himself that he definitely "works" more than 4 hours per week because he chooses to. But he has before, and could again. Most people don't have that choice.

Seriously? 4HWW alone has been on the best seller list for over 2 years; it has gone thru 40 printings and has been translated into 35 languages. You really don't think he's made a million dollars from that? Are you high? He was recently listed as #13 on a list of top 100 most influential Venture Capitalists. I'm pretty sure it requires a little money to be a full time angel inverstor.

Okay?? Is there something wrong with this?

Where is your animosity coming from? Did he steal your girlfriend before prom?

 

[moondogy]

So far I think MJ is saying, do something, many things, eventually something special will appear. He is trying to explain all the variables in his book. MJ did not grow up thinking he can change the world wide limo service. He fell upon it as a driver, came up with an idea and ran with it. It happened to have worked for him. It could have gone the other way if one of the elements were missing or out of sequence. But it all fell in place. He re-engineered and documented his thoughts, experiences and processes and he has a book. Now he's out and about promoting his get rich concept. Great idea...

 

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[valuegiver]

He DOES seminars

Tim does not work 4 hours a week, hasn't since the book came out. He did and that worked for him at a point in his life. To Tim's credit he doesn't go around saying this is what I do today and come to my mega seminar where I will teach you what I do. The 2nd edition of the book was just a minor update that updated some of the resources.

 

[domular]

He DOES seminars

There's a difference between being a speaker at a seminar pushing your book and putting on seminars which cover the same things in the book and try to sell additional crap which is exactly what Robert Kiyosaki does. If I'm wrong and you can show me a link to an event he's put on then I stand corrected.

The fact that his new book has nothing to do with the 4hww proves he's moved his attention elsewhere.

 

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[biophase]

There's a difference between being a speaker at a seminar pushing your book and putting on seminars which cover the same things in the book and try to sell additional crap which is exactly what Robert Kiyosaki does. If I'm wrong and you can show me a link to an event he's put on then I stand corrected.

He does have a 3 day seminar that costs $10,000 to attend. He is not going over methods mentioned in his book at this seminar though. It's about something else.

 

[valuegiver]

The "something else" is selling how to be #1 best selling author. So, he is teaching others how to be successful at selling books.

=> Opening the Kimono to 200 People and Baring It All

Ferriss is no different from Frank Kern and invented a persona that would appeal to lazy, gullible people.

He does have a 3 day seminar that costs $10,000 to attend. He is not going over methods mentioned in his book at this seminar though. It's about something else.

 

[911Carrera]

Both books are great, anybody who disagrees is narrow-minded. End of story.

 

[keithshane1981]

I read MJ's first and I'm currently reading 4hww now. Funny thing, I stumbled upon 4hww as an audio book and listened to it on a road trip. I am 10 chapters in and though I feel a lot of the outsourcing he talks about puts YOUR company at risk. MJ talks about never relinquishing control of your business and I believe him 100%. I still find valuable information in 4hww but i'm glad I read fastlane first. It's hard to give a comparison between the two because it seems like MJ's direction with his book was kind of like a ratrace(matrix) disconnect. He wants you to think for yourself and most importantly ACT. 4hww has its points so far and provides a lot of resources to help the Joe's out there get the ball rolling. The biggest point they both drive home is to get out there and get something going!

my thoughts

 

[Kak]

I wouldn't consider outsourcing relinquishing control. You are in control of what they do.

I like MJs book better, definately a better formula.

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SGH-I997 using Tapatalk

 

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[Sky]

I knew a post like this would come to pass. The two books are really different from one another. I could go on and on about it but i think I' ll pass on this one as many of you have made the necessary comparisons already.

 

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