The Entrepreneur Forum | Financial Freedom | Starting a Business | Motivation | Money | Success
  • SPONSORED: GiganticWebsites.com: We Build Sites with THOUSANDS of Unique and Genuinely Useful Articles

    30% to 50% Fastlane-exclusive discounts on WordPress-powered websites with everything included: WordPress setup, design, keyword research, article creation and article publishing. Click HERE to claim.

Welcome to the only entrepreneur forum dedicated to building life-changing wealth.

Build a Fastlane business. Earn real financial freedom. Join free.

Join over 90,000 entrepreneurs who have rejected the paradigm of mediocrity and said "NO!" to underpaid jobs, ascetic frugality, and suffocating savings rituals— learn how to build a Fastlane business that pays both freedom and lifestyle affluence.

Free registration at the forum removes this block.

[PROGRESS THREAD]: Six-figure Fiction

Thriftypreneur

Silver Contributor
Speedway Pass
User Power
Value/Post Ratio
156%
Jun 8, 2013
477
743
I've decided to go ahead and put myself out there a bit (yikes) and start a progress thread for my self-publishing fiction ebooks plan.

What qualifies me to be a fiction writer?

Absolutely nothing. In fact, I would have to say I'm probably the least qualified that a person could be.

  • English/Writing was always my worst subject in school, by far.
  • Up to now, I can only recall reading one fiction book solely for enjoyment, and have probably read less than 5 in my lifetime.
  • Due to always being a poor performer in my English classes, I've never been particularly interested in writing, at all. I've only done writing for various small websites I've created over the years (none of which ever really got going).
But, it's not all bad news. After reading countless self-publishing success stories (here and elsewhere), I decided to give it a try. After all, how would I know if I enjoyed writing, or if I was any good at it, unless I tried it. Right?

To my surprise, as I've been working on book one of my novella fiction series, I've found that I actually enjoy the process (which I usually don't). I find the creation of fiction, painting a picture and story with words, to be very therapeutic. It may be a form of escapism, but, writing under the anonymity of a pen name and creating your own world, you can really express yourself however you please in your stories.

Additionally, in fiction writing, there aren't really any rules (aside from writing fundamentals, of course). While there are best practices and preferences, from both readers and writers, there's really no right or wrong way to create/tell your story, and that aspect appeals to me greatly. :)

My Six-Figure Fiction Action Plan:

Based on the research I've done, this is the plan I've come up with:

Produce Novellas - I think these types of books have the highest ROI in terms of time investment and earning potential, especially for new writers. I'd like my books to range between 20,000-40,000 words each.

Everything should be a part of a series - In relation to the point above, I really think series are the way to go. Not only do they, by their very nature, help bolster sales of your catalog and past works, they are a way for writers (inexperienced writers in particular) to maximize earnings.

Where established writers can produce a 300-400 page book and sell it with no problems at $8.99, new writers will have a much harder time doing the same thing. By writing novella series and selling in smaller bites, it's an easier way for less experienced writers to be able to earn that $9 per completed story, like the big boys. For this reason, every book I plan to write will be a part of a series (not all the same series, just part of one).

Genre Selection - For me, I have to write what I enjoy writing. If I don't enjoy it, it's simply not going to get done. With the websites I've ran in the past and the writing I've done for them, I've learned that I have to be interested in what I'm doing, otherwise I completely lose motivation and interest. While I won't say what my genres and sub-genres are, I will say that they are very mainstream, have deep pools of buyers, and have a lot of home-run potential.

Production Goal - Since I'm still very inexperienced in the process, I'm trying keeping this goal achievable, so that as I improve, I can begin to exceed it and get ahead of schedule. I'd like to be able to produce, on average, 2000-4000 word per day or around 30,000 words per two weeks - with a few days to spare for formatting, cover creation, and publishing. The main goal being to improve to a point where I'm publishing a little over 3 books per month.

Initially I'll be doing the cover creation myself, and outsourcing it down the road. I'll likely set up social media profiles and what-not for my pen names, and a mailing list, in order to assist in building pen name followings. However, I don't really plan on doing any outside promotion. Write, Publish, Write, Publish, Write, Publish is my game plan. Anything else seems like mental masturbation to me.

While the Amazon marketplace is my primary focus, I'll be trying to publish to each of the major self-publishing platforms.

Monetary Goal ($8400 in one month) - While this is really hard to quantify, due to the massive amount of variables involved, I still want to have a monetary goal. If each book in the catalog earns, on average, $400/month (naturally, some may earn more and some may earn less - or they may never make this much), it will take me about 20+ titles and around 7 months to reach $8400 in sales per month ($100,000/year). If I achieve or exceed this amount in a one month period, I'll consider the goal achieved.

Even with this goal, however, my primary focus is solely on writing. While I'll be looking to record and track sales to see what's working and what isn't, if it isn't "write, publish, write, publish," I'm not going to let it consume a ton of my time (like compulsive stat checking/social media interaction/figuring out how to game Amazon's search algorithm, etc).

Where I'm at now:

Currently finishing up book one of my first novella fiction series. This book will be the first in a 3 part series, each being priced at $2.99. With only two or three chapters to go, I'm hoping it's completed, edited, formatted and published within a few days of this post.

I'm using OpenOffice for my writing suite, and, I really don't have any experience in proper ebook formatting. So, unfortunately, I'll likely have to spend a few days learning the ins and outs so I can ensure that a quality, correct piece is put up. Hopefully, this won't back me up too long.

What I've learned so far:

Planning is super, super important: I tried to be smart and map out my fiction series in advance. But, it's absolutely amazing to me how easy it is to underestimate the production of a story. Starting with a beginning and an end and planning to fill in the blanks just doesn't work. I went further than this and still ran into problems.

If one thing has slowed me down, it has been a lack of planning. In the future I hope to plan out every scene, with as much detail as possible, before writing a single word. I find that once I map my scenes out in their entirety and define what needs to happen to progress the story, when I finally start writing, the words fly onto the page with ease.

Become a compulsive saver: Nothing worse than going on a run and forgetting to save your work, only to reopen your story and find a chapter or two missing. Save frequently, save often, then save again!

Time happens a lot faster in books: This one really surprised me. I'm sure it'll get much better with experience, but I was astonished at how fast time flies in a book. While I may have been stewing over a scene for a few days, and then finally get it on paper, what seemed like a long, gradual buildup in my head, turned out to be an hour event in my book. Learning how to make your readers feel the passage of time and buildup is an interesting skill to develop.

Don't stop writing!: In relation to the planning point above, I found that it's very easy to get stuck on a scene and have it halt production. What's helped me with this so far, is, when possible, just skip it and keep producing the story. Don't stop writing. For example, I'm about to write the last chapter of my book, while there is a chapter in the middle still missing. Everything can be fixed/adjusted later, so just keep writing - get it done!


That's all I got for now. I'll probably end up posting in this thread too much :D, but I encourage any kind of discussion/questions/comments in relation to my posts, here. Good luck all!
 
Dislike ads? Remove them and support the forum: Subscribe to Fastlane Insiders.

ChickenHawk

Legendary Contributor
EPIC CONTRIBUTOR
Read Fastlane!
Read Unscripted!
Speedway Pass
User Power
Value/Post Ratio
468%
Aug 16, 2012
1,281
5,992
Butt in Chair
Post away, I say! For those of us who are hungry for information on how this process goes, I don't think there's such as thing as too many updates (well, unless you were giving minute-by-minute accountsI guess...)

I'll be interested to see how your progress goes as you move forward. I like how you picked a genre with a deep pool of buyers. That's something I'm not sure I did, so comparing notes with someone who did will be particularly interesting.
 

Breaking Free

Bronze Contributor
Speedway Pass
User Power
Value/Post Ratio
102%
Aug 4, 2013
274
280
Phoenix, AZ
Speed to you as well. How about the first one of us that makes a million on ebooks buys the rest of us indie authors dinner? :)
 

Boyd

Bronze Contributor
Read Fastlane!
Speedway Pass
User Power
Value/Post Ratio
223%
Apr 2, 2011
81
181
Florida
Speed + for a great post and excellent gameplan.

Write, Publish, Write, Publish, Write, Publish is my game plan.

This seems to be the "secret" to success from what I've been seeing.

I'm using OpenOffice for my writing suite, and, I really don't have any experience in proper ebook formatting. So, unfortunately, I'll likely have to spend a few days learning the ins and outs so I can ensure that a quality, correct piece is put up. Hopefully, this won't back me up too long.

I'm currently using Scrivener for my writing. So far, I like it. It's an excellent program for not only writing, but also for planning and organizing. Plus, it automatically saves your work like a millisecond after you stop typing and has a "compile" feature that automatically formats your ebook for you. The best part? It's dirt cheap.

Post away, I say!

Absolutely! Just don't use this thread as an excuse not to write.

How about the first one of us that makes a million on ebooks buys the rest of us indie authors dinner?

I'm game. Where should I take you? :tiphat:
 
Dislike ads? Remove them and support the forum: Subscribe to Fastlane Insiders.

Thriftypreneur

Silver Contributor
Speedway Pass
User Power
Value/Post Ratio
156%
Jun 8, 2013
477
743
I'm currently using Scrivener for my writing. So far, I like it. It's an excellent program for not only writing, but also for planning and organizing. Plus, it automatically saves your work like a millisecond after you stop typing and has a "compile" feature that automatically formats your ebook for you. The best part? It's dirt cheap.

Software looks incredible. Definitely going to have to buy that before I start my second book. :)
 

COSenior

Gold Contributor
Speedway Pass
User Power
Value/Post Ratio
171%
Jun 22, 2013
950
1,628
Colorado
Thanks for posting the link, and for the fascinating first post. I have a couple of questions.

First, what method did you use to determine there is a deep pool of buyers in your genre? Next, how did you arrive at your calculations to get to your monetary goal? I'm an analytical freak, so every formula that could be of use is interesting to me.

Anything else seems like mental masturbation to me.

I can attest to the fact that establishing a social media presence is a huge time-sink. If I didn't enjoy the interaction so much, I would have to seriously regret getting into it. That said, it is a way to establish a small following with very few titles out. Hopefully, small followings become bigger ones.

Great thread!
 

RogueInnovation

Gold Contributor
Speedway Pass
User Power
Value/Post Ratio
170%
Jul 28, 2013
1,278
2,178
What marketting and distribution are you thinking?
Other than that its a very neat plan.
 
Dislike ads? Remove them and support the forum: Subscribe to Fastlane Insiders.

Thriftypreneur

Silver Contributor
Speedway Pass
User Power
Value/Post Ratio
156%
Jun 8, 2013
477
743
First, what method did you use to determine there is a deep pool of buyers in your genre? Next, how did you arrive at your calculations to get to your monetary goal? I'm an analytical freak, so every formula that could be of use is interesting to me.

As most of us know, determining things like this isn't an exact science.

Since I already had in mind a couple, main genres I was interested in writing for, I began to go through the sub-genres of each. And, using this list: Theresa Ragan: Sales Ranking Chart, I started comparing rankings for all books on the "best sellers" and "new and popular" lists - giving extra attention to titles that appeared to be self-published.

Looking at the various category rankings of a book, you can see where people are really trying to target their sub-genres by listing their books in those categories and avoiding the larger, broader ones. Finding works like those and looking over their rankings, you can start to see which sub-genres have the highest demand.

Some of the works I saw, that were only targeting/listed in the sub-genres, even though there were ranking #1 for their sub-genre, their overall rank would be higher than #1000. This tells me, that that is the ceiling for those particular sub-genres.

Additionally, you can see where sub-genre popularity allowed titles to cross-over and start ranking in the main genre category (for example, a book ranking well in Mystery, Thrillers & Suspense > Crime Drama > Kidnapping also ranking well in Mystery, Thrillers & Suspense > Crime Drama).

Basically, I was looking for books that were listed in sub-genres that were also achieving overall rankings below 1000. Obviously this may be a silly, inexact way to go about it, and I've probably placed myself in a sub-genre that is way more competitive than I should have, but, it's a genre that I enjoy writing for, so far. And, I figure, you'll never get the opportunity to hit a home run unless you step up to the plate.

Next, how did you arrive at your calculations to get to your monetary goal?

This is also an inexact calculation. I based it off of all the research I did from the success stories of others (here and elsewhere), where the authors were sharing a few numbers. Even though the genres may differ between the successes I studied, the results I compared seemed to have somewhat similar numbers. Based on this research, I figured that 20'ish titles x $400/mo average was a pretty reasonable goal, provided my writing doesn't completely suck. If nothing else, based on the production I want to achieve, it gives me something to shoot for, even if it's way off the mark.

On a side note: While my sub-genres certainly seem to have preferences for certain types of stories, I'm also trying to fill what I think is an under-repped subject in the genre. Like, if you're in erotica and everyone is writing about billionaires, and has been for a while, I think something a little more fresh/different could take advantage of the lack of diversity in the genre.

Doing this, instead of replicating what's already selling, may really blow up in my face, but, time will tell.

Even though I probably didn't nail anything down for you with my inexact methods/thoughts (hey! I'm a newbie!), I hope that helped in some way. :)

What marketting and distribution are you thinking?
Other than that its a very neat plan.

I'm publishing ebooks, so distribution isn't really an issue. As for marketing, I'm going to let my future titles do the work for me and write, write, write (As suggested by Held for Ransom and many, many other authors who are finding success). This seems to be the one thing that all the successes I've seen have in common.

Of all the places/forums I've done research, the authors who have a very small catalog of 1-3 books and are spending all their time trying to "market" them, are the same ones who are making "I can't get any sales" threads. The people with large catalogs (read: more real estate on the amazon bookshelves) seem to be the ones making the cash.

Since I'm writing nothing but series, I may try to use KDP select to put the first books of my series on free promos to generate sales/buzz - this is undecided. Main goal for now is write, publish, write, publish.
 

DennisD

Mini Media Mogul
Read Fastlane!
Speedway Pass
User Power
Value/Post Ratio
216%
Jun 16, 2012
1,488
3,208
36
Bali, Indonesia
Speed+

I'll be following this closely. Please spare no expense, go into as much detail as possible. Your struggles, your finances, your writers block, everything.

I very much would like to also jump into writing fiction.
For the past 4 years I've been building a fantasy world on paper.
I have different races outlined, villages, backstories, town histories, and some prominent families outlined.
I have the science behind how magic works, and where they are technologically. It's something I eventually would want to branch into comic books, video games, and books.

Your selection of "Novellas" as optimum time investment for a fiction writer is really interesting. I think when I start I will also follow this format of shorter books following a singular arc.

I also think it's smart to take a step in a fresh direction. I've seen a few successful comics/novels succeed (with subpar writing) because they were writing for a niche (Plus sized women erotic fiction, biblical comic books, Technological Humor, etc).
 

RogueInnovation

Gold Contributor
Speedway Pass
User Power
Value/Post Ratio
170%
Jul 28, 2013
1,278
2,178
I definately agree on writing more than 3 books, and having a nice catalog. You are exactly right on that point.
However, I would suggest SOMETHING to get it moving.
For example, are you selling it from your website? Through some friends? Through a forum? From youtube (with a short self made add, referrer, or vlog)? Through a blog? Through kindle?
If so, what are you going to do for ratings and comments, and materials to help potential buyers feel comfortable that your book is what they are looking for?

Also, have you considered how the internal design itself can advertise the book? Internal hook points, ways of displaying what is there so that it is easier to access or more fun to read (because walls of texts, get like omg...)(you are doing novella which is one part of that design planning, but are there other things to consider?)

Um, other than that, I'm just saying, what is the plan to get it ROLLING. 3 books with ZERO audience, is like :|. You won't feel good about it. I say that cuz, I wrote a funny book, just for laughs, and shared it amongst friends, and they thought it was a nice little gift. I put it on kindle to experiment, and see if anything happened at all, with ZERO marketting or push behind it. And as far as I know, nothing happened to it. I don't really care about that book, but I am just saying that my experiment displays an enjoyable book, still needs at least some push and press behind it otherwise its just a curiousity sitting in your living room.

Book stores really like independant authors to sell books in their shop, the reason being, that just that little bit of stir can sell more of their otherwise untouched selections. Bring magic on the marketting front, and people will look beyond the cover. And if they look beyond the cover and find something they can easily get behind (nice theme etc, nice atmosphere), then it starts to be recommended as they look out for the best interests of their friends and family (wom).

Also, as an author, what is your attitude towards your audience? Warm? Authoritative? Strictly professional? Artistic? And who are your clients? What is the story behind them purchasing, and so on. Why did they like it? Was it easy for them to get into? Did it fit with their style and what they like to read?
Who do you want to write for? Can you get them up on their TOES, and biting their nails?

;)
Stimulation...

As writers, sometimes we get lost in writing for ourselves and we forget that its all about the people we lift up.
Design, getting it out there, stimulating the readers, having an attitude for a specific audience.
All part of the planning process ime.
 
Dislike ads? Remove them and support the forum: Subscribe to Fastlane Insiders.

Thriftypreneur

Silver Contributor
Speedway Pass
User Power
Value/Post Ratio
156%
Jun 8, 2013
477
743
Um, other than that, I'm just saying, what is the plan to get it ROLLING.

Primarily just Amazon, and the way they like to ensure that their audience has a chance to view new releases. Continuously putting out new titles will (I hope) ensure that I always have some kind of visibility on the "newly published" lists of amazon and the websites out there that scrape those lists. (I think people really underestimate the traffic that Amazon has. If you put something out there, you're getting eyes on it).

As for sales, my sales page is my book blurb and "first look" which I've already factored into my writing. I intend to use the back matter of my books to refer readers to where & how to find my other works.

You have to remember, this isn't a Clickbank Ebook, and the promotion processes aren't the same. I've researched plenty of writers who really do absolutely zero promotion and are doing just fine at Amazon because they simply keep pumping out titles. Maybe I'm an idiot and might change my mind down the road, but I have absolutely zero desire to get bogged down trying to cultivate a social media presence, build/maintain an author blog, do keyword research, get search engine rankings, and all that other crap that comes with normal web-based businesses. If I wanted to keep doing all that, I'd just keep trying to build websites.

The most I see myself doing is making a site for my pen names in order to refer readers to my mailing list and host my catalog, that's it. If it's not write, publish, write, publish - I'm not really interested in it right now. If I have 20+ titles and no sales, then I'll start to worry about it.

Also, as an author, what is your attitude towards your audience? Warm? Authoritative? Strictly professional? Artistic? And who are your clients?

I don't have an audience yet. However, I do know/see/have researched what readers of my genre want and expect to read, so that's what I'm trying to write. Also, I'm writing fiction, not non-fiction, so it's not necessary for me to portray myself as an expert or professional or whatever. All that I think is necessary is to create compelling stories, with interesting, well-developed characters, and give these people enjoyment for their money - whatever my voice is will come through naturally in my writing, I don't need to try and create one. I really don't think they care who/what I am or pretend to be - they just want to be entertained.
 

RogueInnovation

Gold Contributor
Speedway Pass
User Power
Value/Post Ratio
170%
Jul 28, 2013
1,278
2,178
You've got the enthusiasm. :thumbsup:
I'm sure that if there is anything to be adapted, you'll figure it out :)
Its not that hard, after you've written a few good books to think about that stuff anyways.
I was just curious as to your stances.

I like the idea of having a landing page so that people can understand more about the books and the author though, so if you think you can do that, I'd recommend it because it will help the audience feel better informed before reading. And ime people look at books thinking, "am I really going to read this?" thinking about how they must sit down to it a few times, or over a few hours, thinking about when they might need it for a trip, or wait in line. And they buy it because they end up thinking "screw it, what the hell, why not". A landing page can really facilitate that process, because the author seems cool, and they like the concepts and how he is talking about them initially.

Anyways, you got the enthusiasm, and a pretty tight plan, so...
Have fun man :)
 

britnidanielle

Bronze Contributor
Speedway Pass
User Power
Value/Post Ratio
126%
Aug 24, 2013
215
270
Los Angeles
Congrats! Can't wait to read about the updates!
 
Dislike ads? Remove them and support the forum: Subscribe to Fastlane Insiders.

COSenior

Gold Contributor
Speedway Pass
User Power
Value/Post Ratio
171%
Jun 22, 2013
950
1,628
Colorado
Of all the places/forums I've done research, the authors who have a very small catalog of 1-3 books and are spending all their time trying to "market" them, are the same ones who are making "I can't get any sales" threads. The people with large catalogs (read: more real estate on the amazon bookshelves) seem to be the ones making the cash.

I've researched plenty of writers who really do absolutely zero promotion and are doing just fine at Amazon because they simply keep pumping out titles. Maybe I'm an idiot and might change my mind down the road, but I have absolutely zero desire to get bogged down trying to cultivate a social media presence, build/maintain an author blog, do keyword research, get search engine rankings, and all that other crap that comes with normal web-based businesses. If I wanted to keep doing all that, I'd just keep trying to build websites.

Timely reminder for me. Since I created a Facebook and a Goodreads presence for my pen name, I'm spending valuable time interacting with people who seem to mostly want to read my books for free. I'm not opposed to that if I can get reviews or constructive feedback from beta readers out of it. Trouble is, I'm not satisfied with my own writing, and I crave that feedback; what they like, what they don't, how to improve. So I have to weigh it carefully, spend an hour in social media, or spend it writing 1000-2000 words.


if you're in erotica and everyone is writing about billionaires, and has been for a while, I think something a little more fresh/different could take advantage of the lack of diversity in the genre.

I am so sick of billionaires! Maybe I'll write my next short about a sexy hobo that pleasures housewives as he passes through town, lol.

OK, I'm going to try your research method, which may or may not pertain to my genre, I'll just have to follow the steps and see. Otherwise, keep plugging away. I have five titles published in the short story to novella length, one novelette in beta read and am 3/4 of the way through a full-length novel. Maybe it's time for me to post a progress thread.
 

Thriftypreneur

Silver Contributor
Speedway Pass
User Power
Value/Post Ratio
156%
Jun 8, 2013
477
743
I am so sick of billionaires! Maybe I'll write my next short about a sexy hobo that pleasures housewives as he passes through town, lol.

Lol.

OK, I'm going to try your research method, which may or may not pertain to my genre, I'll just have to follow the steps and see. Otherwise, keep plugging away. I have five titles published in the short story to novella length, one novelette in beta read and am 3/4 of the way through a full-length novel. Maybe it's time for me to post a progress thread.

Would love to watch your progress too. As for research, it's definitely not as intricate as what some others do, but just from browsing around sub-genres, comparing rankings, comparing category listings, comparing publishing dates, and things like that - it's not really difficult to see what the most popular sub-genres are.

For example: Teen & Young Adult > Romance > Contemporary (Amazon.com: Contemporary - Romance: Kindle Store)

Just browsing around in there for a minute and checking out different rankings, reviews and category listings, and it's easy to see that is a hot, hungry, competitive market full of rabid, repeat buyers.
 

Thriftypreneur

Silver Contributor
Speedway Pass
User Power
Value/Post Ratio
156%
Jun 8, 2013
477
743
Trouble is, I'm not satisfied with my own writing, and I crave that feedback; what they like, what they don't, how to improve.

I can certainly relate. Being so new to all this, myself, I feel the same way and I'm eager for validation. I figure I'll get that with each book published though, instead of having side-seat writers trying to sculpt a story for me - nothing speaks louder than people voting with their wallets.

Take H.M. Ward and her The Arrangement series, her reviews are absolutely dominated by people bitching about how she releases her series. Based on that and all the negative feedback littering her listings, you would think everything is horrible - but, she's having zero problems selling the crap out of that series, left and right. Money speaks louder than words in this case.
 
Dislike ads? Remove them and support the forum: Subscribe to Fastlane Insiders.

COSenior

Gold Contributor
Speedway Pass
User Power
Value/Post Ratio
171%
Jun 22, 2013
950
1,628
Colorado
Take H.M. Ward and her The Arrangement series, her reviews are absolutely dominated by people bitching about how she releases her series. Based on that and all the negative feedback littering her listings, you would think everything is horrible - but, she's having zero problems selling the crap out of that series, left and right. Money speaks louder than words in this case.

Holy crap! I must purchase one of these overpriced volumes and see why everyone's buying them. Now off to raise the price on my last one, lol.
 

Thriftypreneur

Silver Contributor
Speedway Pass
User Power
Value/Post Ratio
156%
Jun 8, 2013
477
743
Cover Images/Artwork - Rants and Thoughts:

Cover Images/Artwork - Rants and Thoughts:

With my book nearing completion (just need to edit), I've begun the search for cover art.

I'd like to share a few thoughts/observations and open them up for discussion.

Same images everywhere - If you've ever looked for stock images before, you know that 90% of the big sites all carry the same images. However, I'm still finding there is a good 10%+ that is unique to each site, so it's still worth checking them out, I think.

Duplicate Covers - The more I search, the more I see that with the explosive popularity of self-publishing, it's pretty much impossible (unless you're doing your own photoshoots) to get a 100% unique set of cover images/models. Lots of cover artists are drawn to similar pictures for similar genres. So, if there's one really great image of a buff vampire guy posing in a cloak, and it fits your book perfectly, chances are, someone has used that exact same image for probably the exact same type of book. Which leads me to my next thought:

Does the reader really care or even notice? - Naturally, with completely unedited stock photos, you're going to run into pretty much identical covers, but even with some minor manipulation, the difference between covers is usually fairly obvious, even if the covers are using an identical image. As I keep researching, I'm starting to think that it doesn't really matter that much, as the problem is unavoidable - even if you're using a designer. I'm beginning to think that, as long as there is some effort put in to make the cover your own, it really doesn't matter if it looks somewhat similar to another book or not (unless, of course, your cover looks near identical to a home-run best seller).

This is certainly one area, down the road, that I won't have any problem paying top dollar to top-notch designers so they can work their magic on creating very unique covers using not-so-unique stock art.

On a side note: deviantART: where ART meets application! is a pretty amazing site to get some unique stuff from their amazing community of artists. I don't think it's really a stock image site (more just an art community), but I'm sure you can work out something with the artists there.

7ca8cc57888f97b89cc430591431d5a2-d63xxpz.jpg


golden_fishes_by_elenadudina-d6kld71.jpg
 

DennisD

Mini Media Mogul
Read Fastlane!
Speedway Pass
User Power
Value/Post Ratio
216%
Jun 16, 2012
1,488
3,208
36
Bali, Indonesia
Cover Images/Artwork - Rants and Thoughts:

With my book nearing completion (just need to edit), I've begun the search for cover art.
I'd like to share a few thoughts/observations and open them up for discussion.

Same images everywhere - If you've ever looked for stock images before, you know that 90% of the big sites all carry the same images. However, I'm still finding there is a good 10%+ that is unique to each site, so it's still worth checking them out, I think.

Duplicate Covers - The more I search, the more I see that with the explosive popularity of self-publishing, it's pretty much impossible (unless you're doing your own photoshoots) to get a 100% unique set of cover images/models. Lots of cover artists are drawn to similar pictures for similar genres. So, if there's one really great image of a buff vampire guy posing in a cloak, and it fits your book perfectly, chances are, someone has used that exact same image for probably the exact same type of book. Which leads me to my next thought:

Does the reader really care or even notice? - Naturally, with completely unedited stock photos, you're going to run into pretty much identical covers, but even with some minor manipulation, the difference between covers is usually fairly obvious, even if the covers are using an identical image. As I keep researching, I'm starting to think that it doesn't really matter that much, as the problem is unavoidable - even if you're using a designer. I'm beginning to think that, as long as there is some effort put in to make the cover your own, it really doesn't matter if it looks somewhat similar to another book or not (unless, of course, your cover looks near identical to a home-run best seller).

This is certainly one area, down the road, that I won't have any problem paying top dollar to top-notch designers so they can work their magic on creating very unique covers using not-so-unique stock art.

On a side note: deviantART: where ART meets application! is a pretty amazing site to get some unique stuff from their amazing community of artists. I don't think it's really a stock image site (more just an art community), but I'm sure you can work out something with the artists there. Edit: never mind, you can purchase art through the site, very cool.

My friend Ani had a book out titled "Highfall."
This was her first cover:
18191724.jpg
And this is her new cover:
18335491.jpg
Her new cover DESTROYED the old cover. Huge raise in downloads during her promotional days. I don't know if she used stock photography or what... but cover design is massively important.

Something I've been doing is purchasing stock VIDEO, and using single frames of that as photography for my website. Might be something worth looking into?

My girlfriend makes a fulltime living doing freelance art for people on sites like DA.
The artists there are wide open for work, but for something of significant quality CUSTOM made will cost you 1K+.
However, licensing an image for your book from artists there is a REALLY good idea. You can get it for cheap, they'll be flattered, and you have a unique book cover. Make sure you tell them you're crediting them in the book, and approach them with a hard offer.

"I'm an author just getting started, and I LOVE your art! So much so that I'd love for it to represent my new short story. I'll offer you $200 to use your image on the cover of my digital book".

To them, it's basically free money. They don't have to do any additional work, they weren't expecting to make money off of it, and most of them are pretty poor so an extra 200 bucks would go a long way for them.
 
Dislike ads? Remove them and support the forum: Subscribe to Fastlane Insiders.

Thriftypreneur

Silver Contributor
Speedway Pass
User Power
Value/Post Ratio
156%
Jun 8, 2013
477
743
Her new cover DESTROYED the old cover. Huge raise in downloads during her promotional days. I don't know if she used stock photography or what... but cover design is massively important.

Oh, yes, absolutely. Don't get me wrong, I wasn't saying that cover design isn't important, but suggesting that as long as you make it reasonably unique to your book, readers probably aren't going to care or notice that you're using a stock image that many other books are using. It's writers and cover designers that notice.

For example (taken from this kboards thread):

Collection.jpg


The top two rows are a little too similar for my tastes, but you get the idea. The bottom two rows show good use of making the same images pretty unique to their respective titles.
 

DennisD

Mini Media Mogul
Read Fastlane!
Speedway Pass
User Power
Value/Post Ratio
216%
Jun 16, 2012
1,488
3,208
36
Bali, Indonesia
Oh, yes, absolutely. Don't get me wrong, I wasn't saying that cover design isn't important, but suggesting that as long as you make it reasonably unique to your book, readers probably aren't going to care or notice that you're using a stock image that many other books are using. It's writers and cover designers that notice.

For example (taken from this kboards thread):

Collection.jpg


The top two rows are a little too similar for my tastes, but you get the idea. The bottom two rows show good use of making the same images pretty unique to their respective titles.

I see,

Yeah, colorgrading is something the bottom images do very well that the top images don't. If you feel up to making the images yourself, and you know how to use photoshop, you can buy some cheap color-grading photoshop actions on graphicriver.com to make it easy for you.
 

Thriftypreneur

Silver Contributor
Speedway Pass
User Power
Value/Post Ratio
156%
Jun 8, 2013
477
743
So, I've been waiting until my first book goes live before making a milestone update. However, I've seem to run into an odd problem.

The categories in the Kindle Author Submission area don't mimic those found in the store, as a result, for some categories, you have to email them and have them manually add your book to those listings. So, I submitted my work and emailed them. Here is the response:
I'm currently working on assigning your title to the categories you've requested.

This procedure seems more complex than initially expected. We'll contact you with more information by the end of the day on Tuesday, 10th September 2013.

Thanks for your patience.

So, instead of a 12 hour publishing time, it looks like it will be a full 7 days!? Anyone else experienced anything like this?
 
Dislike ads? Remove them and support the forum: Subscribe to Fastlane Insiders.

ChickenHawk

Legendary Contributor
EPIC CONTRIBUTOR
Read Fastlane!
Read Unscripted!
Speedway Pass
User Power
Value/Post Ratio
468%
Aug 16, 2012
1,281
5,992
Butt in Chair
The whole category picking is a real issue. The kindle categories don't seem to actually map up to what's offered in the kdp interface. I wonder, though, if it will delay the full publishing process or just where it's listed. My experience might be different than normal but things seemed to happen quicker than their official estimates. And the process seemed to go quicker (on amazon's end too) each time I used it. Please keep us posted!

One nugget that might be useful. You can change categories after your book is live. So even if you get it not quite right during the initial submission process, you can tweak it later.
 

Thriftypreneur

Silver Contributor
Speedway Pass
User Power
Value/Post Ratio
156%
Jun 8, 2013
477
743
I wonder, though, if it will delay the full publishing process or just where it's listed.

Kind of sucks because I was really looking forward to making my milestone update today and seeing my book go live, but, it is what it is.

It's been well over 12 hours since submission, and I followed the guidelines (to a T) they listed for submitting to my specific categories, so hopefully it won't take too long. I'm wondering if they ran into some weird problem with my submission or something, based on the wording of the response.
 

COSenior

Gold Contributor
Speedway Pass
User Power
Value/Post Ratio
171%
Jun 22, 2013
950
1,628
Colorado
Kind of sucks because I was really looking forward to making my milestone update today and seeing my book go live, but, it is what it is.

It's been well over 12 hours since submission, and I followed the guidelines (to a T) they listed for submitting to my specific categories, so hopefully it won't take too long. I'm wondering if they ran into some weird problem with my submission or something, based on the wording of the response.

My last submission took a good 16 hours to go live, and category is not an issue for me, since listing Erotica automatically eliminates all other categories. I think maybe they are just getting bombarded with new titles; it seems to take longer and longer each time I upload a title. In any case, wishing you the best in seeing it live before another day passes, and in getting the category right where you want it.
 
Dislike ads? Remove them and support the forum: Subscribe to Fastlane Insiders.

Thriftypreneur

Silver Contributor
Speedway Pass
User Power
Value/Post Ratio
156%
Jun 8, 2013
477
743
My last submission took a good 16 hours to go live, and category is not an issue for me, since listing Erotica automatically eliminates all other categories. I think maybe they are just getting bombarded with new titles; it seems to take longer and longer each time I upload a title. In any case, wishing you the best in seeing it live before another day passes, and in getting the category right where you want it.

I hounded them with a couple more emails yesterday, as the 7 day quote time just seemed too far off the mark. Seems they are changing things in the category area.

I wanted to let you know that my colleague is still researching the category issue.

As we've recently had a change in the system for category assignment there is also a slight change with regards to the policies of category assignment of ******** sub category; I'm very sorry about the delay.

My colleague will be in touch with you again with more information as soon as possible.

Thanks for your continued patience.

This scares me. Because my book is targeting that category specifically. If it's denied, I really don't know if it will do as well being placed in another category.

But, whatever, done worrying about it. Just going to get back to writing. :)
 

DennisD

Mini Media Mogul
Read Fastlane!
Speedway Pass
User Power
Value/Post Ratio
216%
Jun 16, 2012
1,488
3,208
36
Bali, Indonesia
I hounded them with a couple more emails yesterday, as the 7 day quote time just seemed too far off the mark. Seems they are changing things in the category area.



This scares me. Because my book is targeting that category specifically. If it's denied, I really don't know if it will do as well being placed in another category.

But, whatever, done worrying about it. Just going to get back to writing. :)

Ah, that's the only thing that really seems to make sense.
They can't put your book into a category if they're unsure if that category will even exist after an update.

The issue that's in front of you is my BIGGEST fastlane obstacle:
Being productive while you're waiting for something.

It's part of being event minded and not process minded.
I can't help but be stuck in an event mentality.
Submitting, being accepted, it going live, is all part of one EVENT, and until that event is complete my mind can't focus on the next task.
This has put me behind on a number of tasks significantly.... I need to learn to never stop being productive. Ever.
 

Thriftypreneur

Silver Contributor
Speedway Pass
User Power
Value/Post Ratio
156%
Jun 8, 2013
477
743
It's part of being event minded and not process minded.
I can't help but be stuck in an event mentality.
Submitting, being accepted, it going live, is all part of one EVENT, and until that event is complete my mind can't focus on the next task.
This has put me behind on a number of tasks significantly.... I need to learn to never stop being productive. Ever.

Yeah, I can certainly agree, it's something I'm still working on. I mean, really, we are all aiming for the events. They're the culmination of process, so I think it's natural to look forward to them. I'm still working on refining my process, but, you're right - it's tough. I didn't get much done yesterday, dealing with Amazon, researching for similar issues and their outcomes, and some other stuff. Just going to forget about it for now, though.

As for my writing - I'm pre-planning the rest of my series today (and getting started on it). I've said it before, but it's probably worth mentioning again. The absolute, number one thing that is slowing me down is lack of pre-planning for my series. After getting my first work done, I can see a 1000% increase in my ability to properly map out stories/scenes for production, it's just coming up with everything that is a challenge. Being able to properly map out every scene, and the progression of your story within each scene, I think that's when your daily writing production really skyrockets.

Edit: Here's something from JK Rowling's Amazon author page which relates to this: "She started writing the Harry Potter series during a Manchester to London King's Cross train journey, and during the next five years, outlined the plots for each book and began writing the first novel"

It doesn't say, specifically, how long she spent building the outline, but it seems apparent that a considerable amount of time went into it before she even wrote her first word.
 
Dislike ads? Remove them and support the forum: Subscribe to Fastlane Insiders.

Thriftypreneur

Silver Contributor
Speedway Pass
User Power
Value/Post Ratio
156%
Jun 8, 2013
477
743
Milestone Update

Book one is now live in the store! Yay!

I have no idea what the category issue was, as they didn't send me any further information regarding the issue. After browsing the "Last 30 Days" list for my desired categories, and seeing my book, it appears I got it where I wanted it.

Cover Design

(I'd love to share it, but I'm still debating on outing my pen name.)

I ended up doing the cover myself, using stock images and gimp, and I'm very, very pleased with how it turned out. I'm not really a graphics guy, but anything you want to do in Gimp, there's almost certainly a YouTube tutorial that will show you how. I went more in the direction of a movie poster advertisement rather than a traditional, artsy cover (although, I kept it fairly simple to get the most "pop" from the thumbnail listing).

I really like having creative control over the covers of this series and designing them myself (after all, it's my most important marketing piece). I feel it's a great way to design something that really captures what the series is all about, and it gives me valuable experience for when I decide to outsource.

The cover I designed is going to be used for all books in this novella series. Each cover will have obvious variations, but the overall look will be the same. So, since I have 3 books planned, each cover only cost me $2.66, and, in my opinion, they certainly outshine quite a few of the other covers in my genre. At this point, if I sell 2 copies, I'm in the black. :)

The reason I'm going with visually similar covers for this series is two-fold.

1. I want to start gathering data to compare a novellas series that uses visually similar covers against another one of my future series, in which I'll use unique covers for each title.

2. I like the idea of readers immediately recognizing other books in the series when viewing my "Also bought" lists. If they're glancing over one of my sale pages, they may not instantly recognize that the also bought list contains other books from the series if the covers are all different (similar to banner blindness). If the covers are similar to what they're already viewing, I think it will tend to catch the eye more (I know it does for me).

But, we'll have to wait and see. It will be a while before I have any data to analyze.


About the Book

Book ended up being just over 24000 words, which came out to about 76 pages in the store, and took me about 2 weeks to complete. I honestly thought it would be closer to 100 pages, but oh well. This shows that book page estimates are based on roughly 315 words per page. Book is currently listed at $2.99.

Other Web Real Estate

Since I don't have any other works to mention, I created a Facebook Author Page and linked to that from the "More by Author" page in my book.

Since I'm not planning to do much social media interaction, aside from alerting people to new releases, I may skip the twitter account. Twitter doesn't lend itself well to newsletter type updates, as it moves too fast.

Author/Catalog Website will come in the future, probably after I complete this series.

Writing

Other than the planning thing I've already mentioned in this thread, not much else to add. The better the plan/outline, the easier the production.

One thing I've been doing to help me write is that, since I started the book, I shut off all distractions and put on classical music (pandora - classical for studying channel). This really helps me out. Before this, I've never really listened to classical, but, once it comes on, now, my brain instantly recognizes it's time to write and goes into "writing mode." It certainly seems to help me.

Promotion

As I've said earlier in the thread, don't really have any promotion set up. So, I'm going to let it sit on the Amazon shelf and just see what happens from a regular listing (can never have enough data :)). Then, I may enroll it in KDP Select for some free promotional days and compare sales before and after.

I feel like this post is missing something, but I just woke up, so I don't know. That's all I got, for now. Happy writing everyone. :)
 

ChickenHawk

Legendary Contributor
EPIC CONTRIBUTOR
Read Fastlane!
Read Unscripted!
Speedway Pass
User Power
Value/Post Ratio
468%
Aug 16, 2012
1,281
5,992
Butt in Chair
Wow, congrats!!! Please keep us posted on what kind of results you get, and how your progress goes from here. I like your approach to the covers. It definitely seems a smart move to keep a consistent look and feel for all the books in your series.

BTW, that's helpful insight on the 315 words per page. Thanks for sharing!
 

Post New Topic

Please SEARCH before posting.
Please select the BEST category.

Post new topic

Guest post submissions offered HERE.

Latest Posts

New Topics

Fastlane Insiders

View the forum AD FREE.
Private, unindexed content
Detailed process/execution threads
Ideas needing execution, more!

Join Fastlane Insiders.

Top