Online vs Offline Business

[ryanbleau]

I've run the numbers on this particular segment so many times it hurts. My father at one time had 14 vans and over 30 employees. he ran a day shift and a night shift and was making ridiculous money. His accountant was shady and never paid taxes and my father took a hit they put him out of business. The guy that bought all his old equipment is still in business and I even worked for him for a time.

 

[EasternMerchant]

Thats the problem, I havent even tried it yet. I have a lot of issues that are holding me back:

• Indecisiveness is a big one.
• Self discipline is another one.
• Fear holds me back from taking action.

In the carpet cleaning example I have allowed people to tell me that it cant be done, before even trying to do anything.

In the online sector, when trying to start Amazon FBA, I also allowed people to tell me that the market was too saturated and that it was more trouble than it was worth.

Im glad im not the only one that goes through this. haha

It's real important to block out the noise and take a chance. Think this "What's the worst that could happen?", on the other hand remember that if you do nothing, then nothing changes. This realization made me suck it up and do it. Look, scrutinize those people's lives and where they are...chances are they are not successful. Chances are they take no risks and live safe, boring lives, everyday the same, acceptance of defeat.

 

[Bryan James]

Plenty of off-line businesses still have some form of online presence; plenty of offline businesses often use the internet as a marketing tool in some form or another.

 

[WJK]

Okay. So you're bright, probably a good problem solver and troubleshooter, you have IT support expertise and great customer service skills.

How about doing something in the IT support sector, for yourself? Whatever company you work for now has obviously found a market that is profitable enough to employ you (and presumably many others) and still make a profit. You have experience in this area so wouldn't be starting from scratch.

This is an idea I've been looking into to do myself, but I'm still stuck in the idea stage and action faking. But I'm getting there. If that interests you, these are the ideas I'd think about:

From your job, what common IT support needs do you pick up? What problems surface time and time again? What are the common complaints? What do people value having fixed? Who out of your support team gets most compliments and thanks, and what are they doing to get that? What does your company do poorly that you would do better? What market is currently under-served? Is there a market for people at home that need IT support, or a business niche? Do people want a home visit, or can it be done remotely?

I like the comments others have put on here about how you can set yourself apart from the crowd just by turning up on time. Here in the UK there is a company called Team KnowHow that does product and tech support, and their policies are aggressively sold when you buy an item from the large electrical store Currys/PC World. If you google reviews for Team KnowHow service, there are literally thousands of 1 star reviews saying how terrible they are. It's a goldmine for an entrepeneur. After reading a few, you pick up the common threads of why people hate them. It shouldn't be hard to be infinitely better than they are - mainly just turn up when you say you will, do jobs promptly and don't have a sh*t phone system that takes 20 mins to get through, only to then have a clueless buffoon not be able to find any record of your job. Simple!

As for scaling and online vs offline, I guess you could go either way with something like this. Either employ a team of people to do the work for you and you manage it then franchise it if it gets big enough, or develop some automated online solutions or some online training to take care of the common problems.

I needed a customized data base system for my Trust Deed business. I couldn't find anyone to build it locally here in Alaska. I ended up hiring an IT guy in Canada. He built me one on a public platform that I'm still using. Yes, he has updated it as I needed his services. You can find a nitch IF you look for one!

 

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[yyes]

I think the answer depends on your personality. If you enjoy the idea of funnels, optimizing ad campaigns, creating e-mail campaigns, etc then go the online route.

If you like face to face business and talking with new people daily then go the carpet cleaner route. Btw the highest grossing Stanley Steemer van in the country averages $900k a year in revenue...one van. With that said, I’ll say this: most carpet cleaners don’t make much money at all, but the ones who do really make a killing.

You have to think of yourself as a marketer who happens to sell carpet cleaning services. Otherwise you’ll always be like everyone in the industry who struggle to hit 6-figures. If you search truckmountforums you’ll find a case study where the owner showed how he started up in a new town and got to $700k/year revenue after year 2.

The secret is to learning how to provide and communicate what I call the Ritz Carlton Experience. That means:

- a text message 30 minutes before arrival including real-time GPS location

-all technicians are properly dressed, clean shaven and wearing booties when entering home

-laying out drop cloths to avoid scratching hardwood floors

-wearing white gloves when carrying furniture

-a follow up call 48 hours later then a handwritten thank you card 1 week later; Chocolates during the holidays for the A+ customers

-a customer retention system

-a rewarding referral system

-most importantly a damn good cleaning

Communicating and providing the Ritz Carlton Experience allows you to charge far more than what everyone else is charging. By charging a lot more, you’ll have better margins to be able to pay your employees well and keep them happy while you scale. Never compete on offering the lowest price.

Good luck.

I've been in those forums and it's crazy how pessimistic people are in there. They all say it's impossible to get rich and that I'm delusional. That in itself is discouraging because these are people that have been in the business for years sometimes decades

But then I remember that many of them are one man crews, have limiting believes, and other stuff that hurts them.

 

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[EasternMerchant]

But how do you decide what to take the dive on?

For example , I personally struggle with what business to endeavor in and flip flop alot. For example, carpet cleaning is an industry that interest me but so is painting and junk removal.

What catches my eye about junk removal is that it's more a necessity whereas carpet cleaning is a luxury.

Junk removal seems the safer option because waste management is not something people like to do,, it's unsexy.

But like I said, I'm constantly flipping flopping and it's something I hate about myself

I don't think you should be that hard on yourself because I think many of us feel that way, I struggle with that which they call "shiny object" syndrome. There are so many things that catch my eye and I know I would be good at, and I get easily distracted from one thing to another - so I am probably not the best person to give you advice but I can say that I have recently forced myself to look at one thing at a time rather than do what I usually do - which is juggle all sorts of ideas at once...I can warn you from my experience, that I have found myself giving diluted effort to each one of those things, ending up overwhelmed because all those things require follow up, and follow through! So if I were you, I would write every idea out and look at all of it critically, benching the ones that could be done following your first idea. Just bench them for later possibility. Now, just focus on the one thing you believe you can execute well and has the least chances of going awry. I think you can combine ideas down the line to and expand, let's say you started with carpet cleaning -- it is CLEANING, just like junk removal is cleaning up, so perhaps you can start a carpet cleaning thing and then expand clean ups of other sorts, allowing for your business to grow in the future. It would all be in how you present it - but it is important to fully focus and build the one thing first.

 

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[Ninjakid]

Even i your business is so-called "offline" it's going to have to be online at some point. Seriously, no one uses Yellow Pages anymore. Google might even smite my comment for mentioning it.

 

[Bryan James]

I always thought it would be funny to have an online company that sells brick and mortar.

 

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[yyes]

@Andy Black helped me with a similar thread to this. Try shifting from the "online vs offline" mindset to the "Value add" mindset. Find something that is painful for you, or family, or a trend you spot and fix that issue. Focus on adding value rather than starting a business. If you decide at the start "I am going to make an online business" you very well may miss excellent opportunities that could be held offline.

Of course this is MUCH easier said than done as I am in this stage as well. All the best!

Yup. Andy is great

But I guess I get discouraged .
Let me give you an example .

I put alot of thought into going into the carpet cleaning business . I came up with a usp that states that I will clean your carpet and if you aren't satisfied I will pay you yuur money back

I thought that this usp adds value as it gives customers peace of mind that they aren't risking their hard earned money

I posted this idea in the carpet cleaning community and got shit on laughed at ridiculed

People said I was stupid that I would be out of business within six months etc

I said that my initial prices would start off at 115 per room and people said that I was crazy and that there are people that clean carpets at 50 dollars per room.

So I was like ok. Here I am trying to add value but I guess maybe I'm not ?

 

[sandrajames]

There's no obvious solution to your inquiry. Gainfulness isn't dictated by whether you are on the web or off. Productivity is controlled by a large group of different components. Principally, that you convey an item or administration your clients need. Looking to the future, numerous disconnected business presently works internet business sites. Online there is a pattern for huge organizations to begin disconnected parts to their tasks. Taking a gander at the prompt future, business visionaries are advancing toward a blocks and snaps plan of action when it is functional. Which is having a nearness both on the web and off.

 

[Tommo]

I'm involved a little bit in real estate. You know what would be great in my area?

A carpet cleaner that answers the phone and shows up when they say they will.

Seriously.

I would worship them like some kind of carpet cleaning messiah, I would refer them to everyone I know, I would pay more per room than any of their competitors. I'd be their biggest fan.

Ever notice something about service companies/professionals?

People refer to them possessively.

"I gotta call MY plumber"

"MY lawyer"

"MY dentist"

"MY electrician"

"MY carpet cleaning guys"

"MY web guy"

There's a study I read once (and can't find on google right now haha) where people were able to recall from memory an average of 7 brand names in consumer goods categories (7 car brands, 7 soda brands, whatever) but on average were only able to recall *1* service brand name per category (1 electrician, 1 lawyer, whatever)

The reason why people could only recall 1 is irrelevant. The point is BE THAT ONE.

How?

1) Strong lead generation efforts

Marketing, networking (realtors and property managers!), referrals, etc.

This is where a USP would come in. It doesn't have to be gimmicky though. Maybe the first room is free. Maybe if it's a property management company, the first HOUSE is free (put in a room limit haha)

All you have to do is let them know you exist (hint: pick up the phone and call!), make them feel comfortable trying you out (reduce their risk), and make the entire process as easy on them as possible (reduce their hassle). Simple. (note I didn't say easy)

2) Strong customer retention efforts

Great customer service. Not good service, which is forgettable, but GREAT service. And at least in my area, the bar is set very low for what constitutes "great"

Great actual service too. You know, actually get the carpet clean?

Long story short....

Is carpet cleaning the right biz? Who knows? Certainly not me.

But who discouraged you? The same ones that don't answer their phone when a potential customer calls? Likely. (so does their opinion matter? does anyone's opinion matter except your customers'?)

Sometimes I think people don't realize just how low the bar is set in some industries, and how many value gaps there actually are, because they focus too much on doing something "no one else has done" (it doesn't have to be that complicated)

Does that make sense?

So true.
I have my accountant and my doctor and wouldn't change them as they are too valuable.
I work in quality control and am a good operator but all the shitty guys make me look like a star. Just do what you say you are going to do and turn up on time and do a good job, provide good service. Try it otherwise don't bother asking and good luck mate.

 

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[ryanbleau]

Even better if you can run 2 vans with night and day crews. Get convenience store and box store hard floor cleaning contracts. Buy a couple $1000 used floor buffers and do the first cleaning free. Nursing homes and retirement homes do weekly cleanings on high traffic areas and will call for emergency cleanups. Hospitals will outsource the hard surface cleanings as well. The market is huge and usually only serviced by a couple guys

 

[yyes]

That's why you have employees based on commission. 4 vans going out every day can do 20 carpets a day each. that's 80 carpets a day 6 days a week. Pay them $20 a carpet. pocket $25 per. You now are making over a half mil a year after investing maybe $200k in Assets. Spend 20k-50k in advertising per year in a high population area and you can see more than a mil a year if you treat the big clientel right and make the little ones feel like they are important. Not to hard to get in front of it.

Why only 50 per room? I was thinking of charging 115 per room..lol

 

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[ryanbleau]

Depends on your market. If $125 is what everyone is charging than charge $125. Most urban markets for carpet cleaning fluctuate between $40 and $75 but higher end markets can be around $150. That also depends if your guys have to move furniture as well. If your market is advertising $125 for a room moving furniture I'd advertise $100 and specify you need the furniture moved in small print. but full price of $125 if you move furniture

 

[yyes]

Hi Ryan, I totally understand what you are saying. I posed the question because I don’t think the OP did any calculations when thinking through potential businesses.

Saying I want to make $200-$400k and I want to get out of the rat race and then saying I’m thinking of a carpet cleaning business doesn’t quite go together.

HI biophase,

Why do you say they don't go quite together?

 

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[yyes]

I own a local service business. I hate to say this. But I haven't really added much value other than providing good quality. I haven't done anything extraordinary, and i'm just focused on staying simple and scaling.

Not saying you shouldn't add value. But some of these businesses are just plan ol' raw business. Nothing special about them, just business.

And do you feel you have differentiated yourself from others because you have provided good quality? Or are you just like the other companies?

 

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[KeithWallace]

That's the problem, I don't know what I'm good at . In a nutshell hopefully this tells you a bit about me

• I have an iq of 115
• I work in the IT industry as a support specialist
• Before graduating with my bachelor's , I was in the plumbing painting and landscaping industry
• I worked for wells Fargo as a banker for five years and developed great customer service skills.
• I'm an introvert but a great listener
• I have a bachelor's in business which frankly feel is worthless .

I feel like the only good thing I'm good at is playing soccer but I don't want to make a job out of the only thing I enjoy

I guess I'm good at blue collar work but I don't want to be a worker I want to manage my business

Okay. So you're bright, probably a good problem solver and troubleshooter, you have IT support expertise and great customer service skills.

How about doing something in the IT support sector, for yourself? Whatever company you work for now has obviously found a market that is profitable enough to employ you (and presumably many others) and still make a profit. You have experience in this area so wouldn't be starting from scratch.

This is an idea I've been looking into to do myself, but I'm still stuck in the idea stage and action faking. But I'm getting there. If that interests you, these are the ideas I'd think about:

From your job, what common IT support needs do you pick up? What problems surface time and time again? What are the common complaints? What do people value having fixed? Who out of your support team gets most compliments and thanks, and what are they doing to get that? What does your company do poorly that you would do better? What market is currently under-served? Is there a market for people at home that need IT support, or a business niche? Do people want a home visit, or can it be done remotely?

I like the comments others have put on here about how you can set yourself apart from the crowd just by turning up on time. Here in the UK there is a company called Team KnowHow that does product and tech support, and their policies are aggressively sold when you buy an item from the large electrical store Currys/PC World. If you google reviews for Team KnowHow service, there are literally thousands of 1 star reviews saying how terrible they are. It's a goldmine for an entrepeneur. After reading a few, you pick up the common threads of why people hate them. It shouldn't be hard to be infinitely better than they are - mainly just turn up when you say you will, do jobs promptly and don't have a sh*t phone system that takes 20 mins to get through, only to then have a clueless buffoon not be able to find any record of your job. Simple!

As for scaling and online vs offline, I guess you could go either way with something like this. Either employ a team of people to do the work for you and you manage it then franchise it if it gets big enough, or develop some automated online solutions or some online training to take care of the common problems.

 

[Robert Williams]

This question probably gets asked alot in this forum and I'm still trying to take the plunge but don't know what to pursue.

Ultimately my ideal goal is to attain financial freedom and get away from the 9-5 rat race. I want to be in control and my ideal income goal falls within the range of 200-400k profit pretty year.

I hear both arguments. Online is saturated, offline doesn't scale, online has too much competition, etc.

But in your guys opinion what business side offers the best road to financial freedom?

The matter is not our opinion, but what actually matters is what you think you are best fit for whether you had a capability of doing 9-5 rat race, or you have the capability to make others do that 9-5 rat race for your benefits.
Understand yourself and then decide whether Online or Offline...

 

[WJK]

I think the answer depends on your personality. If you enjoy the idea of funnels, optimizing ad campaigns, creating e-mail campaigns, etc then go the online route.

If you like face to face business and talking with new people daily then go the carpet cleaner route. Btw the highest grossing Stanley Steemer van in the country averages $900k a year in revenue...one van. With that said, I’ll say this: most carpet cleaners don’t make much money at all, but the ones who do really make a killing.

You have to think of yourself as a marketer who happens to sell carpet cleaning services. Otherwise you’ll always be like everyone in the industry who struggle to hit 6-figures. If you search truckmountforums you’ll find a case study where the owner showed how he started up in a new town and got to $700k/year revenue after year 2.

The secret is to learning how to provide and communicate what I call the Ritz Carlton Experience. That means:

- a text message 30 minutes before arrival including real-time GPS location

-all technicians are properly dressed, clean shaven and wearing booties when entering home

-laying out drop cloths to avoid scratching hardwood floors

-wearing white gloves when carrying furniture

-a follow up call 48 hours later then a handwritten thank you card 1 week later; Chocolates during the holidays for the A+ customers

-a customer retention system

-a rewarding referral system

-most importantly a damn good cleaning

Communicating and providing the Ritz Carlton Experience allows you to charge far more than what everyone else is charging. By charging a lot more, you’ll have better margins to be able to pay your employees well and keep them happy while you scale. Never compete on offering the lowest price.

Good luck.

I have had a similar experience with staying at Ritz. It's wonderful.

 

[GoGetter24]

Junk removal seems the safer option because waste management is not something people like to do,, it's unsexy.

But like I said, I'm constantly flipping flopping and it's something I hate about myself

How much would it actually take to get on with this and test it?

Choose one specific type of junk. Check it by using google keyword planner and seeing monthly searches for things like "how to dispose of [x] in [city y]".

Let's say for the sake of argument it's fallen branches.
So you'd need:

• a pickup truck, chainsaw, and work clothes (inc. goggles etc)
• knowledge where your local landfill is
• a simple paper receipt pad and a pen
• a simple website that says "Yyes's [city] fallen branch disposal" with your phone # / email
• a google ad for it
• liability insurance (in case you poke someone with a branch or whatever)
• if your city is a bullshit "regulate and license everything to death" city, a visit to a lawyer to run it all by him

Everything else is just add-ons, right? And the pickup truck and chainsaw could just be rented to begin with to confirm demand. If there's demand, you can make a logo, give the pickup truck a paint job, get a better website, get a portable credit card thing, set up a formal business structure, more ads, assistants, expanding into other types of waste, etc. But the actual core test is pretty small.

 

[Restless8]

Online business is much interesting rather than offline business. But online bussiness helps you to get lots of customers globally for the business.

 

[EasternMerchant]

I don't think you should be that hard on yourself because I think many of us feel that way, I struggle with that which they call "shiny object" syndrome. There are so many things that catch my eye and I know I would be good at, and I get easily distracted from one thing to another - so I am probably not the best person to give you advice but I can say that I have recently forced myself to look at one thing at a time rather than do what I usually do - which is juggle all sorts of ideas at once...I can warn you from my experience, that I have found myself giving diluted effort to each one of those things, ending up overwhelmed because all those things require follow up, and follow through! So if I were you, I would write every idea out and look at all of it critically, benching the ones that could be done following your first idea. Just bench them for later possibility. Now, just focus on the one thing you believe you can execute well and has the least chances of going awry. I think you can combine ideas down the line to and expand, let's say you started with carpet cleaning -- it is CLEANING, just like junk removal is cleaning up, so perhaps you can start a carpet cleaning thing and then expand clean ups of other sorts, allowing for your business to grow in the future. It would all be in how you present it - but it is important to fully focus and build the one thing first.

So don't hate yourself, you have a valuable asset of generating ideas, just keep them in the memory banks for future use. Because I am not seasoned, I can't give you more info, but can only speak from my experience thus far.