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My Inferiority Complex

Anything related to matters of the mind

simplymoto

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I've not always been the strongest with my inner game. I've had this issue since early adulthood, and it has continued till now still.

This feels like a teenager thread but it's actually in my late 30s. The context might be also somewhat remote given that not everyone is familiar with Malaysia sub cultural context. I now run what I would consider a success business, and many respect me for quitting my job ten years ago to take the hard way. This inferiority complex is like a needle in me, sometimes it's not there, sometimes it pokes me hard. And I am incline to think that it is just a manifestation of insecurity.

Context. I grew up as a Malaysian Chinese in Malaysia. As a third generation Chinese, my grandparents came to Malaysia from China. Growing up I've always watch a lot of movies from Hong Kong, its a culture staple. In the movies speak a Chinese dialect call Cantonese while my family spoke primarily Mandarin Chinese. There are several main dialects but Cantonese was perceived to be the superior dialect, so many ethnic Chinese in Malaysia picked it up and prefers to speak it over other dialects.

Long story short, in college I started feeling inferior around Cantonese-speaking people. It becomes a trigger then I am suppose to meet someone or hear people speaking it.I become nervous, sweaty palms, trembling hands, and socially awkward. I've seen therapist twice, read self help books etc.

I deduce some possibilities:
- My family moved from a one town to another. The new town was primarily speaking and I had a hard time integrating when I was in primary school, and the cool kids spoke Cantonese. And those cool kids remained cool kids into high school. I think that was when my consciousness of Cantonese is cool came.
- Idolising Hong Kong movies as a kid, and having insecurity about my identity. It also happened to speaking in English to some local friends, even though I'd say that I spoke English weekly since a kid to relatives.
- We cannot blame our parents for who we are but parents has always been abit racial chauvenist saying that Chinese language and its people is the greatest.
- Most importantly, I think it's my inner game problem, the overthinking, emotionally afraid person. When I was younger I remember spending some summers abroad in Europe and I've also behaved in very naive way Europeans indirectly.
- Internally I've felt that I have never been good enough, on many things. I had to keep proving myself, it turn out well for business, but it also created other issues like this.

Thank you for reading.
 
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MJ DeMarco

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Fascinating that your "inferiority complex" relates to local geography.

If you lived in the UK, France, Germany, USA, or Brazil, no one would give a shit.

Proving what you already know, it is in your head, and purely a figment of cultural locality.
 
D

Deleted78083

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I get it. As a French-speaking Belgian, we know the Flemish are smarter, taller, and harder-working than we are.

You won't be able to get rid of these beliefs if you don't look for cues proving the opposite. The problem is that sometimes, these beliefs are true. When I go to Flanders, I can't help notice that it is indeed, nicer, richer, more beautiful, and people are taller and harder-working.

The new town was primarily speaking and I had a hard time integrating when I was in primary school, and the cool kids spoke Cantonese. And those cool kids remained cool kids into high school. I think that was when my consciousness of Cantonese is cool came.

I think this is key. The fact that the cool kids were Cantonese does not matter as much as the fact that YOU don't see yourself as cool.

Internally I've felt that I have never been good enough, on many things. I had to keep proving myself, it turn out well for business, but it also created other issues like this.

Yes, this is it. You're not good enough. Probably that's because you don't meet the requirement of the word "enough" in your mind.

You should go back to seeing a therapist that specializes in cognitive behavioral therapy.

Alternatively, you can read "Personality Isn't Permanent" from Ben Hardy, or "The Body Keeps the Score" by Bessel van der Kolk, a world authority on trauma.
 

simplymoto

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I get it. As a French-speaking Belgian, we know the Flemish are smarter, taller, and harder-working than we are.

You won't be able to get rid of these beliefs if you don't look for cues proving the opposite. The problem is that sometimes, these beliefs are true. When I go to Flanders, I can't help notice that it is indeed, nicer, richer, more beautiful, and people are taller and harder-working.

I wanted to give a relatable example for the Western context, and you gave a good one. I have Belgian friends from both sides and things seems complicated.

I think this is key. The fact that the cool kids were Cantonese does not matter as much as the fact that YOU don't see yourself as cool.



Yes, this is it. You're not good enough. Probably that's because you don't meet the requirement of the word "enough" in your mind.

You should go back to seeing a therapist that specializes in cognitive behavioral therapy.

Alternatively, you can read "Personality Isn't Permanent" from Ben Hardy, or "The Body Keeps the Score" by Bessel van der Kolk, a world authority on trauma.

Thank you, I'll read both books.
 
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Beebop27

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I've not always been the strongest with my inner game. I've had this issue since early adulthood, and it has continued till now still.

This feels like a teenager thread but it's actually in my late 30s. The context might be also somewhat remote given that not everyone is familiar with Malaysia sub cultural context. I now run what I would consider a success business, and many respect me for quitting my job ten years ago to take the hard way. This inferiority complex is like a needle in me, sometimes it's not there, sometimes it pokes me hard. And I am incline to think that it is just a manifestation of insecurity.

Context. I grew up as a Malaysian Chinese in Malaysia. As a third generation Chinese, my grandparents came to Malaysia from China. Growing up I've always watch a lot of movies from Hong Kong, its a culture staple. In the movies speak a Chinese dialect call Cantonese while my family spoke primarily Mandarin Chinese. There are several main dialects but Cantonese was perceived to be the superior dialect, so many ethnic Chinese in Malaysia picked it up and prefers to speak it over other dialects.

Long story short, in college I started feeling inferior around Cantonese-speaking people. It becomes a trigger then I am suppose to meet someone or hear people speaking it.I become nervous, sweaty palms, trembling hands, and socially awkward. I've seen therapist twice, read self help books etc.

I deduce some possibilities:
- My family moved from a one town to another. The new town was primarily speaking and I had a hard time integrating when I was in primary school, and the cool kids spoke Cantonese. And those cool kids remained cool kids into high school. I think that was when my consciousness of Cantonese is cool came.
- Idolising Hong Kong movies as a kid, and having insecurity about my identity. It also happened to speaking in English to some local friends, even though I'd say that I spoke English weekly since a kid to relatives.
- We cannot blame our parents for who we are but parents has always been abit racial chauvenist saying that Chinese language and its people is the greatest.
- Most importantly, I think it's my inner game problem, the overthinking, emotionally afraid person. When I was younger I remember spending some summers abroad in Europe and I've also behaved in very naive way Europeans indirectly.
- Internally I've felt that I have never been good enough, on many things. I had to keep proving myself, it turn out well for business, but it also created other issues like this.

Thank you for reading.
Ive met quite a few people from Malaysia and they all seem to have a similar trait, in that they are very competitive and ambitious minded. This one guy I knew used to do anything to get top grades.. and I mean ANYTHING. All for that stupid number. So in part, it could also be cultural.

Low self esteem can be a double edged sword, in that it can be a driving force and trigger for ambition, yet it also can make you put up with low-par behaviour from others and be a source of self hatred and self destructive habits like addictions.

I guess recognising that all of it is inside your head and understand how short we are alive on this planet, could help put these emotions at bay
 

pjm2493

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Something similar happens here in Spain between the people from the north and the people from the south. Some people believe (not everyone) that the people from the north is more educated, hard working and speak a better spanish, while the people from the south is lazy, don't have manners and is ill-educated. They consider the people from the south like the peasants of the country.

And you know what? I'm from the south and I don't give a shit, because I know that these people are completely wrong and I can prove it to them any time. It is simply not true. I'm sure you can track the origins from that kind of thinking if you analyse the history of your country. If you do, you'll find out that this mindset is something from the past, something that have nothing to do with the reality nowadays. It's totally artificial.
 

simplymoto

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@monfii . Went to read a bunch about Belgium. Complicated shit. It became a country seceding from France(?) and the Francophile had more privilege than Dutch speaking in Flanders and were more successful, and it's now Dutch's turns. I read that things are really drawn on language lines, and people in the Dutch side really hate to speak French and they think French takes no effort in learning Dutch.

It's also interesting to talk about size as Dutch are usually taller and is that physical trait being used to tell who's dutch and french in Belgium? There's alot to talk about but could this be part of reason why Belgium football team never won anything on the big stage?
 
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simplymoto

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Something similar happens here in Spain between the people from the north and the people from the south. Some people believe (not everyone) that the people from the north is more educated, hard working and speak a better spanish, while the people from the south is lazy, don't have manners and is ill-educated. They consider the people from the south like the peasants of the country.

And you know what? I'm from the south and I don't give a shit, because I know that these people are completely wrong and I can prove it to them any time. It is simply not true. I'm sure you can track the origins from that kind of thinking if you analyse the history of your country. If you do, you'll find out that this mindset is something from the past, something that have nothing to do with the reality nowadays. It's totally artificial.

Do Spainards thing northern european is more superior to southern european? Some at least.

Also in Spain, do things get complicated by the migrants from latin America? Is there major discrimation based on people's origin, accent, skin color (even if you are latino/latina there's more European-looking ones) and stuff. ?
 

ZF Lee

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I've not always been the strongest with my inner game. I've had this issue since early adulthood, and it has continued till now still.

This feels like a teenager thread but it's actually in my late 30s. The context might be also somewhat remote given that not everyone is familiar with Malaysia sub cultural context. I now run what I would consider a success business, and many respect me for quitting my job ten years ago to take the hard way. This inferiority complex is like a needle in me, sometimes it's not there, sometimes it pokes me hard. And I am incline to think that it is just a manifestation of insecurity.

Context. I grew up as a Malaysian Chinese in Malaysia. As a third generation Chinese, my grandparents came to Malaysia from China. Growing up I've always watch a lot of movies from Hong Kong, its a culture staple. In the movies speak a Chinese dialect call Cantonese while my family spoke primarily Mandarin Chinese. There are several main dialects but Cantonese was perceived to be the superior dialect, so many ethnic Chinese in Malaysia picked it up and prefers to speak it over other dialects.

Long story short, in college I started feeling inferior around Cantonese-speaking people. It becomes a trigger then I am suppose to meet someone or hear people speaking it.I become nervous, sweaty palms, trembling hands, and socially awkward. I've seen therapist twice, read self help books etc.

I deduce some possibilities:
- My family moved from a one town to another. The new town was primarily speaking and I had a hard time integrating when I was in primary school, and the cool kids spoke Cantonese. And those cool kids remained cool kids into high school. I think that was when my consciousness of Cantonese is cool came.
- Idolising Hong Kong movies as a kid, and having insecurity about my identity. It also happened to speaking in English to some local friends, even though I'd say that I spoke English weekly since a kid to relatives.
- We cannot blame our parents for who we are but parents has always been abit racial chauvenist saying that Chinese language and its people is the greatest.
- Most importantly, I think it's my inner game problem, the overthinking, emotionally afraid person. When I was younger I remember spending some summers abroad in Europe and I've also behaved in very naive way Europeans indirectly.
- Internally I've felt that I have never been good enough, on many things. I had to keep proving myself, it turn out well for business, but it also created other issues like this.

Thank you for reading.
From another Malaysian Chinese myself...

Be happy that you CAN understand and learn Mandarin, Cantonese or some other dialect.
Yes, Cantonese may be a dominant dialect in our race, but it's just another language at the end of the day. How you truly use the language is what really matters.

I've had to work with Cantonese-speaking folks for college projects. When I got to know them better...they were just like me. They had similar fears and desires. Cantonese does not make anyone automatically cool.

I actually started out as a 'banana' (Chinese guy who's weak in Mandarin or dialects), and let me tell you...it's as horrible as being an American who can't speak English. I've made Mandarin/Cantonese a regular learning practice now, but it'll take years to reach natural fluency.

But the 'banana' thing has become pretty much a silent epidemic already...I've met Malays and Indians who somehow don't speak much of their mother tongue. Some folks think it's due to globalisation, others think it's Satan's worst weapon to destroy culture...I dunno how this phenomenon will split things up in the future.

That aside...
Every language though needs a lifelong learning process.

Once in a while, I still have to google up a new English phrase.

The best (and most cliche) way to be more comfortable with Cantonese is to listen and speak more of it.
But don't go to Cantonese dramas for that...they are very toxic.

Try documentaries, news or if you want Cantonese friends to learn with, pick the more progressive-minded ones instead of the toxic uncles/aunts.

IMO, I find Mandarin to be more versatile. You need Mandarin for business with China, and dialects are limited in everyday life to casual talk. And it has a writing system...I'm currently paying more attention there.

Ive met quite a few people from Malaysia and they all seem to have a similar trait, in that they are very competitive and ambitious minded. This one guy I knew used to do anything to get top grades.. and I mean ANYTHING. All for that stupid number. So in part, it could also be cultural.
Can't blame them.
Local scholarships are widely available, but the most prominent public ones like MARA have earmarked spots for natives or Malays (Bumiputera races). Which leaves private or global scholarships on the table.

Considering the bad income disparity, guess its up to the kids to perform and nab the scholarships.

Then COVID came and delayed entire exams. We now have a generation of kids who had to learn shakily from an online screen, who will probably have to fight for more crowded placings in colleges.

I hope this will be a lesson for Malaysians to not depend on the academic system alone.
 
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WJK

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I've not always been the strongest with my inner game. I've had this issue since early adulthood, and it has continued till now still.

This feels like a teenager thread but it's actually in my late 30s. The context might be also somewhat remote given that not everyone is familiar with Malaysia sub cultural context. I now run what I would consider a success business, and many respect me for quitting my job ten years ago to take the hard way. This inferiority complex is like a needle in me, sometimes it's not there, sometimes it pokes me hard. And I am incline to think that it is just a manifestation of insecurity.

Context. I grew up as a Malaysian Chinese in Malaysia. As a third generation Chinese, my grandparents came to Malaysia from China. Growing up I've always watch a lot of movies from Hong Kong, its a culture staple. In the movies speak a Chinese dialect call Cantonese while my family spoke primarily Mandarin Chinese. There are several main dialects but Cantonese was perceived to be the superior dialect, so many ethnic Chinese in Malaysia picked it up and prefers to speak it over other dialects.

Long story short, in college I started feeling inferior around Cantonese-speaking people. It becomes a trigger then I am suppose to meet someone or hear people speaking it.I become nervous, sweaty palms, trembling hands, and socially awkward. I've seen therapist twice, read self help books etc.

I deduce some possibilities:
- My family moved from a one town to another. The new town was primarily speaking and I had a hard time integrating when I was in primary school, and the cool kids spoke Cantonese. And those cool kids remained cool kids into high school. I think that was when my consciousness of Cantonese is cool came.
- Idolising Hong Kong movies as a kid, and having insecurity about my identity. It also happened to speaking in English to some local friends, even though I'd say that I spoke English weekly since a kid to relatives.
- We cannot blame our parents for who we are but parents has always been abit racial chauvenist saying that Chinese language and its people is the greatest.
- Most importantly, I think it's my inner game problem, the overthinking, emotionally afraid person. When I was younger I remember spending some summers abroad in Europe and I've also behaved in very naive way Europeans indirectly.
- Internally I've felt that I have never been good enough, on many things. I had to keep proving myself, it turn out well for business, but it also created other issues like this.

Thank you for reading.
So you're not good enough to do what? What do you want to do? Just do it!
I lived through a few years of that kind of situation when I moved to downtown Los Angeles. I was a country girl and I was enrolled in a Fashion College. The other students at that college all had Daddy's money -- their Daddies paid for their apartments and paid their expenses. I was on my own -- just a 19-year-old kid with no backing. So, I was a target for them. I not only survived, but I thrived. I learned to turn their unkind remarks back on them.
I lived through it again when I started my real estate career 45 years ago. Everyone else was middle-aged. I was in my early 20s. There was no training, and again, I was on my own.
When I retired and came to Alaska to care for my mom, it happened again. She died the first winter and here I was -- a single woman who was all alone. I had to build a whole new life here.
I guess I've never been one of the "cool kids". So what! I've always been a square peg in a round hole. That's been my strength, not my failure. I am who I am. If others don't like me, that OK with me. Like an aunt used to remind me, I have a lot of ways -- they should be able to find at least something that they like about me. Or think of it this other way, everyone isn't going to like you. No matter what you do for them, it will never be good enough. If you die for them, you won't kick right. So, don't worry your pretty head about it. Accept that those disagreeable people are out there. Give them their space and carry on with your life. Spend your time pleasing the people who like you!
I also tend to be a "contrarian." I like to ask the questions that everyone else wants to ask, but afraid to speak about. It's the what-if and the why questions. I did that in law school when I was in my early 40s. The other students were afraid to bring attention to themselves during class. I didn't care. I raised my hand and asked my questions anyway. When the profs made fun of me -- and they did -- I made it a big joke. Most of the profs didn't do it again since I turned it around on them. I'd have the whole class laughing. I used the same tact when I was testifying as an expert witness in court. Learning to use humor and a quick wit are very powerful weapons in controlling a situation.
Now I tend to "fly under the radar". People underestimate me all the time. And that is by design. It's one of the most powerful positions you can have. I don't need their approval to be comfortable inside my own skin. I can do all kinds of things without others around me even noticing. They assume that I can't do a whole bunch of stuff -- that I have in the works behind the scene. They don't need to know what I'm doing. Real power can be very quiet and unassuming.
I hope this helps you. Do what you want to do. Don't wait for permission. Don't wait to feel good about it. Get off you &^%* and just go do it! Even if you fail, you will learn something. Even if others make fun of you, at least you had the courage to try -- that's more than they have. And it gives you a chance to ask them what they would have done differently. How would they have approached the problem? What is their solution? You’ll be amazed at their answers and lack of answers.
 
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simplymoto

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From another Malaysian Chinese myself...

Be happy that you CAN understand and learn Mandarin, Cantonese or some other dialect.
Yes, Cantonese may be a dominant dialect in our race, but it's just another language at the end of the day. How you truly use the language is what really matters.

I've had to work with Cantonese-speaking folks for college projects. When I got to know them better...they were just like me. They had similar fears and desires. Cantonese does not make anyone automatically cool.

I actually started out as a 'banana' (Chinese guy who's weak in Mandarin or dialects), and let me tell you...it's as horrible as being an American who can't speak English. I've made Mandarin/Cantonese a regular learning practice now, but it'll take years to reach natural fluency.

But the 'banana' thing has become pretty much a silent epidemic already...I've met Malays and Indians who somehow don't speak much of their mother tongue. Some folks think it's due to globalisation, others think it's Satan's worst weapon to destroy culture...I dunno how this phenomenon will split things up in the future.

That aside...
Every language though needs a lifelong learning process.

Once in a while, I still have to google up a new English phrase.

The best (and most cliche) way to be more comfortable with Cantonese is to listen and speak more of it.
But don't go to Cantonese dramas for that...they are very toxic.

Try documentaries, news or if you want Cantonese friends to learn with, pick the more progressive-minded ones instead of the toxic uncles/aunts.

IMO, I find Mandarin to be more versatile. You need Mandarin for business with China, and dialects are limited in everyday life to casual talk. And it has a writing system...I'm currently paying more attention there.


Can't blame them.
Local scholarships are widely available, but the most prominent public ones like MARA have earmarked spots for natives or Malays (Bumiputera races). Which leaves private or global scholarships on the table.

Considering the bad income disparity, guess its up to the kids to perform and nab the scholarships.

Then COVID came and delayed entire exams. We now have a generation of kids who had to learn shakily from an online screen, who will probably have to fight for more crowded placings in colleges.

I hope this will be a lesson for Malaysians to not depend on the academic system alone.

Thanks, seeing things from my shoes. It's mainly the upbringing and being bullied that created this fear. I agree on the notion that as an adult I have to take charge of my own destiny....

An example is that I always get nervous when I am with a colleague that is Cantonese-speaking, it's like trying to get her acknowledgement that if she speaks to me in Cantonese it means my level of the language has improved, and if she speaks in Mandarin/English then I have failed, such is the obsession....
 

ZF Lee

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Thanks, seeing things from my shoes. It's mainly the upbringing and being bullied that created this fear. I agree on the notion that as an adult I have to take charge of my own destiny....

An example is that I always get nervous when I am with a colleague that is Cantonese-speaking, it's like trying to get her acknowledgement that if she speaks to me in Cantonese it means my level of the language has improved, and if she speaks in Mandarin/English then I have failed, such is the obsession....
Don’t worry about folks having to switch languages to talk to you. I think that should be the beauty of our country…we have multiple languages to use to talk to each other.

There will always be room to improve on language, no matter how good one can get.

Anyone who uses language as a tool of superiority has an attitude problem- not a language problem. And that applies even to the bananas who think English-speakers are more civilized than the Mandarin-speakers.
 

WJK

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Thanks, seeing things from my shoes. It's mainly the upbringing and being bullied that created this fear. I agree on the notion that as an adult I have to take charge of my own destiny....

An example is that I always get nervous when I am with a colleague that is Cantonese-speaking, it's like trying to get her acknowledgement that if she speaks to me in Cantonese it means my level of the language has improved, and if she speaks in Mandarin/English then I have failed, such is the obsession....
Every time I've done something new, as I tried to tell you, I have shared your experience. There are ALWAYS a bunch of cool kids who already have that space. That's normal. It's all part of the human path. You will confront this type of situation again and again IF you try new things. Expect it. Lean into it. Learn how to deal with it gracefully and effectively. It's NOT personal!
 
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Kevin88660

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I've not always been the strongest with my inner game. I've had this issue since early adulthood, and it has continued till now still.

This feels like a teenager thread but it's actually in my late 30s. The context might be also somewhat remote given that not everyone is familiar with Malaysia sub cultural context. I now run what I would consider a success business, and many respect me for quitting my job ten years ago to take the hard way. This inferiority complex is like a needle in me, sometimes it's not there, sometimes it pokes me hard. And I am incline to think that it is just a manifestation of insecurity.

Context. I grew up as a Malaysian Chinese in Malaysia. As a third generation Chinese, my grandparents came to Malaysia from China. Growing up I've always watch a lot of movies from Hong Kong, its a culture staple. In the movies speak a Chinese dialect call Cantonese while my family spoke primarily Mandarin Chinese. There are several main dialects but Cantonese was perceived to be the superior dialect, so many ethnic Chinese in Malaysia picked it up and prefers to speak it over other dialects.

Long story short, in college I started feeling inferior around Cantonese-speaking people. It becomes a trigger then I am suppose to meet someone or hear people speaking it.I become nervous, sweaty palms, trembling hands, and socially awkward. I've seen therapist twice, read self help books etc.

I deduce some possibilities:
- My family moved from a one town to another. The new town was primarily speaking and I had a hard time integrating when I was in primary school, and the cool kids spoke Cantonese. And those cool kids remained cool kids into high school. I think that was when my consciousness of Cantonese is cool came.
- Idolising Hong Kong movies as a kid, and having insecurity about my identity. It also happened to speaking in English to some local friends, even though I'd say that I spoke English weekly since a kid to relatives.
- We cannot blame our parents for who we are but parents has always been abit racial chauvenist saying that Chinese language and its people is the greatest.
- Most importantly, I think it's my inner game problem, the overthinking, emotionally afraid person. When I was younger I remember spending some summers abroad in Europe and I've also behaved in very naive way Europeans indirectly.
- Internally I've felt that I have never been good enough, on many things. I had to keep proving myself, it turn out well for business, but it also created other issues like this.

Thank you for reading.
Not sure that if it makes you feel better anyway Hong Kong is becoming less important as a business/financial center or cultural exporter in the region. Follow the money now and it is Mandarin Chinese.

Language is just a communication tool and its value is a proxy of the total gdp (size and growth) of the native speakers .

Most of the Chinese wealth in South East Asia and Hong Kong included, is really in hotel, real estate, casino, raw material and commodities… the you scratch my back I scratch my back kind of deal with political ruling class. Most of the innovation and higher end manufacturing are really up in the north in Mainland China and Korea.
 

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Malaysia
East Malaysian here. A native from the Kadazan-Dusun tribe. Here, we have more than 10 sub-tribes belonging to the same ethnic group, the Kadazan-Dusun. Which means our languages and dialects are different based on geography.

My father and mother are not from the same sub-ethnic groups. Worse, they never utilize their own respective sub-ethnic languages. We communicate with another language (local dialect Bahasa Melayu). I guess this is similar to the Native American tribes. An Apache will speaks/understands Apachean languages plus English.

During my childhood I created an artificial language switch in my brain to interact with other relatives. Why? I, too went into that period of what you termed as inferiority complex. This is kind a stupid because our ethnic language has mutual intelligibility.

Now, looking back I was actually trying to seek external approval. Being the few ones who speaks native language, when the language itself is on the perception of being extinct is, actually a trophy for me.

The fact that, people of my tribe looks more towards someone as superior than them if the person has the ability to speak English. I've seen university graduates with major English grammatical errors being praised.

If a pseudo-Englishman is superior, a native of Kadazan-Dusun who cannot speak the native language is inferior. A degrading remarks will be made openly, but of course, in a language that's unknown towards the condemned native.

This is a cultural trap that I managed to runaway from.
 

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