I have on offer you can't refuse,..or Else

[Sparlin]

I just heared about this on the radio. What legal authority does the state have to do this?

California to withhold a bigger chunk of paychecks -- latimes.com

 

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[Russ H]

No big surprise here.

Even when our economy was BOOMING, the CA legislature and the governor could not get a budget passed until it was WAAAAAY past deadline.

And no one was ever happy.

That was part of the reason Schwarzenegger got in via a recall election-- we had the same party as a majority in the state house, senate, AND governor's office, and they still couldn't agree on a budget.

Let me be clear: This is not a Democrat/Republican thing.

Neither party is responsible for this mess.

The voters are the ones that are responsible.

Because year after year, they vote down taxes and support structure.

And year after year, they refuse to give up state funded programs.

So year after year (after year) we have the exact same problem:

No budget.

Not enough money to pay the bills.

Again, my post is not intended to be political. Only to explain why these monies are being taken out of paychecks.

It's a mess.

But NO ONE has come up with a solution that everyone can agree on.

And as long as we don't have consensus, we'll continue to have these problems.

-Russ H.

 

[MBinMT]

With the current fractured opinions from all the different interests that have input at the state and federal gov't levels, do you ever think we will really see a "common good" consensus anytime soon?

 

[Sparlin]

Thanks for the comments Russ. It just seems like extreme measures are being implemented without clear constitutional authority. Even if the state government is in need of the funds, it would seem to me like they have their priorties backwards. As you said, it's the people that put legislators in positions of power. Hopefully, the consequences won't be too bad for the residents out there.

 

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[Russ H]

With the current fractured opinions from all the different interests that have input at the state and federal gov't levels, do you ever think we will really see a "common good" consensus anytime soon?

We've been working on getting consensus for centuries in the US.

It ain't easy.

And it's not fun.

Consensus doesn't mean that everyone is happy-- what it means is that most folks agree on a solution that best accommodates all.

I think we've lost the fine art of consensus.

Can we re-learn how to achieve consensus?

I think yes.

But a lot of folks have gotta wanna.

And right now, they don't.

-Russ H.

 

[Russ H]

Thanks for the comments Russ. It just seems like extreme measures are being implemented without clear constitutional authority. Even if the state government is in need of the funds, it would seem to me like they have their priorties backwards. As you said, it's the people that put legislators in positions of power. Hopefully, the consequences won't be too bad for the residents out there.

Bottom line, the choices are slim.

We need to start shutting down the state at this point-- we've already implements state employees taking one day off each week (w/no pay).

We could shut down the schools completely, and still not have enough.

Or close all of the police and fire departments. Still not enough.

Shut down all of the "wasteful" programs identified by, say, one group (like unemployment or disability insurance). Still not enough.

I won't pretend to have a solution.

It's a big problem, and lots of really smart people have not come up with a solution, either.

-Russ H.

 

[MBinMT]

We've been working on getting consensus for centuries in the US.

It ain't easy.

And it's not fun.

Consensus doesn't mean that everyone is happy-- what it means is that most folks agree on a solution that best accommodates all.

I think we've lost the fine art of consensus.

Can we re-learn how to achieve consensus?

I think yes.

But a lot of folks have gotta wanna.

And right now, they don't.

-Russ H.

This is the point I think is very relevant right now. Obviously, people are feeling pressure and seem more willing to go to the middle ground. But, so far, that attitude has not moved into the body politic.

Locally, we have a mayoral election coming up, and I am very interested to see at this level if our town has a more willing bent toward a "we" are more important than "me" community.

At state and fed levels the lag time from now to election time is longer, and I have never been sure that letter writing campaigns had much impact. And I really wonder how serious things have to get before the U.S. as a whole tastes the bitter medicine we have coming, and we all agree to do it. (I think the last time was WW II, and, no, 9/11 does not count)

Basically, with all the tough decision items in front of us (Social Security solvency, Medicare, fed & state deficits) it may take a large global crisis to pull us all back on track together.

 

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[MBinMT]

Oops, sorry.

I think I crossed over the politics line.

 

[GlobalWealth]

I think the problem goes deeper than politics. We have a fundamental problem with entitlement in the US. I think this fire has been both fueled and flamed by politicians though. The mindset of the people is to do less and get more. The government fuels this problem by creating programs that provide us with things we may or may not need but will certainly pay for in tax increases. This becomes a power grab and no one is willing to relinquish any power so it creates a snowball effect where the power grab grows incrementally every year until you have a avalanche, which it seems is where we are right now. Now the government is unable to sustain itself and therefore increases the burden on citizens. But because of the enormous amount of power the government has accumulated over the past 100 or so years, they are essentially unstoppable at this point. What is now and will continue to happen is the productive members of society will leave the country or stop producing which will create a major world power shift. The people created a monster in this government and now we must find a way to kill the monster.

 

[HCBailly]

You say that the rich will go somewhere else eventually. Out of curiosity, are there ANY governments anywhere that run a balanced budget, preferably not with a fiat currency? I don’t think there are any left, so where would the productive members of society go?

 

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[GlobalWealth]

You say that the rich will go somewhere else eventually. Out of curiosity, are there ANY governments anywhere that run a balanced budget, preferably not with a fiat currency? I don’t think there are any left, so where would the productive members of society go?

As a US citizen, you can legally live abroad 330 days per year and are tax exempt from your first $91,500 plus $15,000 housing allowance. If you are married, you can avoid taxation on your first ~ $200k in income.

Right now, you can "buy" citizenship in a couple of countries (invest in local real estate) that have no taxation for non domestic income.

There are a few governments that run budget surpluses though. Ironically, the US is, and has been, the worst country in the world for many, many years (from a balanced budget perspective only).

 

[Russ H]

. . . Ironically, the US is, and has been, the worst country in the world for many, many years (from a balanced budget perspective only).

That's intentional.

Leveraged debt is part of our long term monetary policy.

No, I'm not saying it's good or bad.

Just that it "is".

-Russ H.

 

[GlobalWealth]

That's intentional.

Leveraged debt is part of our long term monetary policy.

No, I'm not saying it's good or bad.

Just that it "is".

-Russ H.

I agree. this is why the government is manipulating the money supply and creating inflation. It allows the government to pay back debts at a much lower cost.

 

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[Russ H]

I agree. this is why the government is manipulating the money supply and creating inflation. It allows the government to pay back debts at a much lower cost.

Yup.

That's been the plan as long as I can remember.

-Russ H.