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Daytrading Crypto: My Journey

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Matteo Zhou

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Nov 5, 2018
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I created this thread to show my progress by daytrading Crypto.
The tools i'm gonna use to make profitable trades are:
.Elliott wave to count the waves
.RSI to look for momentum changes
.FIbonacci to know when to enter a trade

Before entering a trade i have to be sure to have a good R:R(risk:reward) and a stoploss in case i made a wrong prediction.

Wish me Luck :)
 

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Matteo Zhou

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Nov 5, 2018
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This shows my ignorance, but what are the different currencies that you are looking at?
I trade on bitfinex, only coins with 10m+ daily volume so BTC, ETH, XRP and EOS, these days i'm trading mostly btc and eth.
 

Mikkel

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I'm not sure how you can make any trade on a crypto at this current stage where there will be a "good R:R." Crypto's are most likely in a bubble and looks like it is currently popping. I realize day trading is all about moves up and down that happen quite quickly, I just can see you losing a lot of money when you begin day trading and don't realize when something like bitcoin breaks down again like it did earlier this week.

Wish you the best, but this is definitely not a market I would like to be in.
 

TinyTim

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I'm not sure how you can make any trade on a crypto at this current stage where there will be a "good R:R." Crypto's are most likely in a bubble and looks like it is currently popping. I realize day trading is all about moves up and down that happen quite quickly, I just can see you losing a lot of money when you begin day trading and don't realize when something like bitcoin breaks down again like it did earlier this week.

Wish you the best, but this is definitely not a market I would like to be in.
You can "short" the market.
 

TinyTim

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I know many people who make money by trading crypto. However, they all have a long history of trading.
 

garyfritz

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I know many people who make money by trading crypto. However, they all have a long history of trading.
Bingo. You can throw all kinds of trading concepts at crypto but nothing is guaranteed to work. @Matteo Zhou, have you successfully applied those analysis tools to other markets?

I know a few people who use Elliot Wave, or claim they do. Personally I think they've just developed a subconscious skill for reading the market, and their brain uses the EW structure as a conceptual framework. EW itself has little or no predictive ability in my opinion. You can look at a chart and see oh yes, here's the 1-2-3 and the a-b-c and it worked just perfectly -- but it's not that clear when you're trying to find those waves in realtime.

RSI just tells you "the market just moved." It can help to filter out noise and give you a simpler/cleaner signal to look at, but it has absolutely no predictive power. It tells you what the market just DID, not what it's GOING to do.

IMHO Fib levels are the strongest of the three tools you listed. I've never understood why they work, but they tend to. But you need more than that.

Many of these trading analysis tools can give you a little bit of an edge. Combining them together, so that you only act when they agree, can strengthen the signal. But unless you've already developed that system and used it with success in other markets, I would strongly suggest you do a lot of paper trading before you put real money at risk. The crypto markets are a lot more inefficient than e.g. the stock market or forex, so it's probably easier to pull out a profit. But prove to yourself that you CAN before you jump in.
 

Mikkel

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I know many people who make money by trading crypto. However, they all have a long history of trading.
He said he was day trading though. Shorting crypto's seems like a much better idea, though I think doing so earlier would have been a better time. It seems like a lot of people already know Bitcoin is going to fall flat on its face... the Bitcoin mania was the time to short.

Either way, there are always ways to make money... when someone loses money, someone else gains... typically.
 

Jaden Jones

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I do some day trading on the stock market, and have for a while. That is difficult enough, I cant imagine trying to do it with crypto. There is still a lot of manipulation and volatility. Not to mention crooked exchanges. I lost money in crypto, and as mentioned above, I think you might have better luck in a casino. Anyone who made money in crypto who doesnt think it was luck is foolish.
 

Megan Kay

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I'd be curious to see how it pans out now that everything is rock bottom. I lost some money in crypto too, but I am just holding where I'm at to see what shakes out in the end. A couple coins I think had great utility and will eventually--hopefully--go somewhere.

As for day trading, how does that look at tax time now that crypto is considered the same as stocks? I was worried about how it would look taxwise and have shied away since.
 

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FinTech

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Nov 14, 2018
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Retail is not going to make money trading crytpo the spreads are ridiculous. Institutional and prop traders love this guy. It's like saying hey I'm going to go try to play in the MLB today wish me luck. I'm amazed people keep fooling themselves they can beat the market. The only reason they sometimes last for a little while trading FX is the the spread is so tight. I promise you are better off sportsbetting or blackjack. Or seriously buy lotto tickets at least you will have better odds.
 

Jaden Jones

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Retail is not going to make money trading crytpo the spreads are ridiculous. Institutional and prop traders love this guy. It's like saying hey I'm going to go try to play in the MLB today wish me luck. I'm amazed people keep fooling themselves they can beat the market. The only reason they sometimes last for a little while trading FX is the the spread is so tight. I promise you are better off sportsbetting or blackjack. Or seriously buy lotto tickets at least you will have better odds.

I dont think anyone can beat the crypto market, but there are tonnes of examples of people who beat the stock market. If anyone is serious, they would go that direction. I understand its cool and edgy to say you trade crypto, but your right, he is gonna get taken.
 

FinTech

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Nov 14, 2018
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I dont think anyone can beat the crypto market, but there are tonnes of examples of people who beat the stock market. If anyone is serious, they would go that direction. I understand its cool and edgy to say you trade crypto, but your right, he is gonna get taken.
"tonnes of examples of people who beat the stock market"

A million monkeys with a million typewriters.......
 

TinyTim

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I don't recommened it, but why is everyone saying it's impossible to beat the crypto market? Compared with the FX market and stocks, the competition is far weaker . It can be more volatile and random, but seasoned traders can handle that no problem.
 

FinTech

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Nov 14, 2018
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I don't recommened it, but why is everyone saying it's impossible to beat the crypto market? Compared with the FX market and stocks, the competition is far weaker . It can be more volatile and random, but seasoned traders can handle that no problem.
I'm not saying seasoned traders can't beat the market. I'm saying retail traders can't beat the market. Look even seasoned traders can't beat the FX market. Lots more low hanging fruit in Crypto.

And not to sound mean but honestly, Elliot Wave, Fibonacci, etc is all hocus pocus to sell people a system. Like if you "take out this one tiny ad"....

It sells books but 85% of the trading books out there are written to sell not to make you money, so they have to have a good Story. Very similar to what MJ bitches about the reviews for his book those people are all looking for elliot wave of entrepreneurship. Something they can believe in and if it doesn't work it wasn't them.

Is some basic math formula going to beat professionals who scored in top 1% on standarized tests, went to elite schools and do this for a living? Can you read a couple poker books and sit down with Phil Ivey and win. Maybe in the short run.....

Not trying to rain on the parade but I hate people lighting money on fire.
 

Mikkel

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I'd be curious to see how it pans out now that everything is rock bottom. I lost some money in crypto too, but I am just holding where I'm at to see what shakes out in the end. A couple coins I think had great utility and will eventually--hopefully--go somewhere.

As for day trading, how does that look at tax time now that crypto is considered the same as stocks? I was worried about how it would look taxwise and have shied away since.
You think $3,000 - $4,000 is rock bottom for something that is incapable of holding value? Sure, something that is unable to hold value can be valued at any price... which means that if it can reach $20,000 it can also reach $1. Just wondering why you think it is at rock bottom now? I see no evidence of rock bottom tbh.
 

FinTech

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Nov 14, 2018
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You think $3,000 - $4,000 is rock bottom for something that is incapable of holding value? Sure, something that is unable to hold value can be valued at any price... which means that if it can reach $20,000 it can also reach $1. Just wondering why you think it is at rock bottom now? I see no evidence of rock bottom tbh.
This is why .... Anchoring - Wikipedia
 

Mikkel

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The same could be said of those who own Bitcoin... for legit the entire time it went up. Which leaves us in determining what is actually going on within Bitcoin rather than disproving my point with psychology that won't actually determine if Bitcoin will go up or down.
Except Bitcoin is a bubble and has been for a long time... the only reason Bitcoin went up was because people believed it was something valuable, so basically based on emotions. People wanted to get rich quick. The only way Bitcoin can reach $20,000 again is if it can find a new group of people willing to gamble their money. I doubt you will find them, seeing that Bitcoin basically capture an incredibly large audience late 2017/early 2018 and a VERY large amount of people lost money with Bitcoin and will most likely have a negative perception of Bitcoin now.
 

Maxboost

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And not to sound mean but honestly, Elliot Wave, Fibonacci, etc is all hocus pocus to sell people a system. Like if you "take out this one tiny ad"....
lol my screen image lol
 

Megan Kay

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You think $3,000 - $4,000 is rock bottom for something that is incapable of holding value? Sure, something that is unable to hold value can be valued at any price... which means that if it can reach $20,000 it can also reach $1. Just wondering why you think it is at rock bottom now? I see no evidence of rock bottom tbh.
I've never considered BTC to be a coin worth investing in and wasn't even considering it when I posted - where the masses are is where the losses are. It's the alt coins that have potential, and many of those have hit rock bottom. TBH I have stepped back from the whole crypto game over the past few months, so my perception might not be completely relevant, but some high volume coins are now down to nearly nothing.

Take TRX, for example. It was massively overhyped and people rode the wave...all the way down to almost $.0. It's probably seen its best times already, but the volume and supply are huge - people are still crazy about this weird coin. I'd pretty much call that one rock bottom.

I could pull up more examples of the crashing alt coins, but that's what I was thinking of when I said "rock bottom."
 

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TinyTim

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I'm not saying seasoned traders can't beat the market. I'm saying retail traders can't beat the market. Look even seasoned traders can't beat the FX market. Lots more low hanging fruit in Crypto.

And not to sound mean but honestly, Elliot Wave, Fibonacci, etc is all hocus pocus to sell people a system. Like if you "take out this one tiny ad"....

It sells books but 85% of the trading books out there are written to sell not to make you money, so they have to have a good Story. Very similar to what MJ bitches about the reviews for his book those people are all looking for elliot wave of entrepreneurship. Something they can believe in and if it doesn't work it wasn't them.

Is some basic math formula going to beat professionals who scored in top 1% on standarized tests, went to elite schools and do this for a living? Can you read a couple poker books and sit down with Phil Ivey and win. Maybe in the short run.....

Not trying to rain on the parade but I hate people lighting money on fire.
Sounds like we agree.
 

Jaden Jones

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I've never considered BTC to be a coin worth investing in and wasn't even considering it when I posted - where the masses are is where the losses are. It's the alt coins that have potential, and many of those have hit rock bottom. TBH I have stepped back from the whole crypto game over the past few months, so my perception might not be completely relevant, but some high volume coins are now down to nearly nothing.

Take TRX, for example. It was massively overhyped and people rode the wave...all the way down to almost $.0. It's probably seen its best times already, but the volume and supply are huge - people are still crazy about this weird coin. I'd pretty much call that one rock bottom.

I could pull up more examples of the crashing alt coins, but that's what I was thinking of when I said "rock bottom."
There is still nothing to show this has value, why do you feel this could go back up, its exactly the same as BTC, it will only have value if a new wave of people decides it does.
 

Megan Kay

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There is still nothing to show this has value, why do you feel this could go back up, its exactly the same as BTC, it will only have value if a new wave of people decides it does.
What "this" are you talking about? If you mean TRX, I don't think it has value and didn't say anything to indicate I did.

I do believe there are coins with utility that can prove useful. One of those is BAT, created by one of the founders of Mozilla to go along with a privacy-focused browser and an alternative payment/advertising model that would eliminate the middleman (think YouTube). It's a pretty cool concept that brings its own value.

As for people deciding the value, isn't that the same as anything? Value is perception.
 
OP
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Matteo Zhou

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Nov 5, 2018
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I have a bussiness to run so trading is something on the side.
I didn't do any trading yet because of work, anyway my current bankroll is at 3261.99$.
 

Jaden Jones

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As for people deciding the value, isn't that the same as anything? Value is perception.

Maybe with something like Beanie Babies, but stocks have real value tied to the income of a company. By Buying TRX or BAT, your simply hoping someone will pay more for it than you did, when there is really no reason to.
 

Maxboost

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Maybe with something like Beanie Babies, but stocks have real value tied to the income of a company. By Buying TRX or BAT, your simply hoping someone will pay more for it than you did, when there is really no reason to.
It's the greater fool fallacy and the reason why cryptocurrency is a religion at this point. Many scammy people are too financially and emotionally invested into it. If there is no greater fool, there is no money...period.

Even if you were to short, you still need to find a sucker on the other end....
 

JordanS

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As someone who also day trades, I wish you luck.

Not sure why people are arguing over bitcoin itself, that does not matter. It could fall to $100 or rise to $100000. Either way there is money to be made day trading.

We aren't buying and just hoping it goes up in a month. Get in and out for a few % and be happy.
 

Jaden Jones

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As someone who also day trades, I wish you luck.

Not sure why people are arguing over bitcoin itself, that does not matter. It could fall to $100 or rise to $100000. Either way there is money to be made day trading.

We aren't buying and just hoping it goes up in a month. Get in and out for a few % and be happy.
I day trade as well, the point being made is that stocks are more predictable, and better regulated. I played around with day trading BTC, ETH, and a few others, and it wasnt even remotely the same. Plus most exchange are crooked, especially on margin. They will find reasons to screw you, because there is no regulations. And the amount of trading bots for crypto is ridiculous.
 

kiqu

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Nov 30, 2018
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May I ask why you chose Crypto currencies as opposed to more established (and probably more liquid) financial instruments?
 

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