Occupy Wallstreet Thoughts

[RealOG]

WTH - feels like this thread has become a bunch of trolls...

After three pages are arguing, agree to disagree and focus on your fastlane strat.

 

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[77startup]

actually I disagree with you on this one.

everyone that exists deserves something. they were brought into this world and should recieve certian things in order to grow and thrive. I dont believe that this responsibility rests soley on the people who brings life but by everyone who enjoys it. at least in civilized society. they have said for a long time it takes a village to raise a child. no man is an island entire of himself.

what you want to give/allow people to recieve is the basic human needs provided for because if god forbid it was for you or someone you loved you would expect nothing less.

I cant believe how cold some of you guys are.

So you're suggesting population control? Regulation of life itself? I honestly don't think you are realistically thinking this through. What you're suggesting is communism or socialism but look around how thats turned outin Russia or China. I think you should take a serious look at what you're suggesting.

Personally I don't expect anything from anyone. Expecting help from others without offering them something in return for their assistance is the quickest way to not survive in this world.

 

[CarrieW]

So you're suggesting population control? Regulation of life itself

where did I say that lol?

 

[77startup]

where did I say that lol?

"I dont believe that this responsibility rests soley on the people who brings life but by everyone who enjoys it."

If the above statement is true then that means it's up to society to regulate life it self and insure all life istaken care of. Which also means that society will have to have a means of eliminated unwanted aka life that does not fit into the system as well like they do in China.

It's impossible to provide for all life without destroying society unless you also control the amount of life at any given time.

 

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[Anon3587x]

Somebody who doesn't make a significant amount of money through their own efforts, has no right to tell (or even suggest) to other people who do make significant amounts how they should be spending THEIR money.

 

[CarrieW]

"I dont believe that this responsibility rests soley on the people who brings life but by everyone who enjoys it."

If the above statement is true then that means it's up to society to regulate life it self and insure all life istaken care of. Which also means that society will have to have a means of eliminated unwanted aka life that does not fit into the system as well like they do in China.

It's impossible to provide for all life without destroying society unless you also control the amount of life at any given time.

one thing doesnt equal the other. and I totally disagree. we will see how well that process of elimination goes in china in the near future now that their population is decreasing and theres far less girls around then boys and someone suggests offing the elders to ease the suffering of the working.

just because I believe that society is expected to take care of those who are unable to care for themselves doesnt mean what you said is correct in any way shape or form.

beati I was not referring to individual people. I am refering to the government, big corperations ect... you know the kinds of entities who create the money and the laws we have to abide by and the ones who get bail outs cause they are too big to fail...

 

[Anon3587x]

beati I was not referring to individual people. I am refering to the government, big corperations ect...

But corporations are people

 

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[CarrieW]

they were people/businesses who when they needed help got it.

what goes around comes around.

if some of these companies/government actually agreed to do something to appease these people they would likely earn far more in the long run then they what they spent in appeasments just in increased revenue from publicity about it, or from increased spending as people could begin to breathe again and that would in turn boost the economy.

this has become tiring to me. I have tried and tried again to explain myself but it seems that no matter what I say someone is going to intrepret it wrong or quote it and turn it into something else. obviously I am not going to change anyones opinions on anything so I am done wasting my time.

 

[Anon3587x]

they were people/businesses who when they needed help got it.

what goes around comes around.

if some of these companies/government actually agreed to do something to appease these people they would likely earn far more in the long run then they what they spent in appeasments just in increased revenue from publicity about it, or from increased spending as people could begin to breathe again and that would in turn boost the economy.

Only a handful of corporations were bailed out.

How many millions of people are receiving food stamps and special benefits?

 

[Russ H]

Thanks for that healthy dose of objectification! Always great to join a new forum and know that it's not inclusive to women.

To paraphrase Olympia Dukakis in Moonstruck:

"What you don't know about these forums . . . is a lot."

FYI, accusatory troll-like posts w/no follow-up replies or explanations are not appreciated around here, DB.

Please be courteous and explain your comments. You may be surprised at how many listen, and try to learn.

Or, if you'd rather we ban you, so you can go away and never come here again, just say the word.

Your choice.


-Russ H.

 

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[Kak]

I was confused about that one myself.

 

[GlobalWealth]

if you are making 50billion/million dollars a year, giving 1% or evn 10% to a good cause or to help someone/society in some way then you should do it and I dont think its unreasonable to expect it.

You comment 'should' is pretty subjective here. Keep in mind if you are making $50m per year, then you must be doing something very right and you aren't doing it alone.

You have hired workers, investing in real estate, bought assets, outsourced business processes, etc. All of these activities create jobs, which increases economic productivity. By the act of becoming wealthy, you have already given to that good cause by improving the lives of others.

Had you given $5m per year to a charity, at least 30% of the money (in most cases, sometime much higher) is wasted on administrative costs, high salaries for non-profit CEO's, etc. By and large, charity on a large scale is a destroyer of wealth and economic activity.

Personal charity on the other hand can be very good. If you know a family who is down on their luck, go out and buy their kids christmas presents this year. Buy them a turkey for thanksgiving. If you really want to be charitable, offer them some work - even if it is menial work like washing windows or cleaning the car and let them work for the money.

But the best thing the businessperson earning $50m per year can do it reinvest in his business and other assets which will ultimately lead to more jobs.

there needs to be programs like welfare and social security and disability and things like that(not run the way they are run now tho lol) not becauase its expected of us to provide it for them but because its the right thing to do.

I don't agree 100% that we need these programs. Your statement 'its the right thing to do' suggests you have the capacity to dictate your morality on other people. The US didn't have a welfare or SS system until about 80 years ago. The rest of the world followed the US lead after that by instituting similar systems. Even today not all countries offer such program, ie. China.

However, as you stated, if we are going to have these programs, they need to be run much differently - here I agree. For example, New Zealand and Chile have privatized their SS system many years ago and have had much success. It has lowered the tax rates there and the private pension system has generated returns vastly superior to the US SSA.

 

[CarrieW]

I really am done with this thread guys. you can quote me and ask me questions and make statements about what I have said all you like.

I am done here. I said what I said, I defended what I said. I've explained and reexplained what I meant and I am done.

thanks for the debate. but really Im all damn done now.

 

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[Anon3587x]

I really am done with this thread guys. you can quote me and ask me questions and make statements about what I have said all you like.

______

 

[GlobalWealth]

thanks for the debate. but really Im all damn done now.

You won't last long in business if you cannot accept that everyone doesn't always share your viewpoint. Getting upset because someone disagrees with you is a sure sign of weakness.

 

[DirectInc_Becky]

Oops! I thought I replied directly to his post but I was objecting to the following quote attached to a video:

I like this one with all the chicks doing Yoga in the background.

Check out :54

I thought it was very unprofessional and insulting to the women on the forum.

 

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[CarrieW]

spinning my wheels talking to myself and arguing my point with people who dont care to understand and turn things and twist things isnt very productive.

knowing when to cut your losses and walk away is a very admirable business trait.

and I am not upset I am just all damn done wasting my time here.

there you got me to post again. you win. but If you care to know how I think or why reread my other posts in this thread. cause theres nothing more I can say and no other way to explain it to you. nor do I care too. life is too short and I got better things to do.

and just for the record I am not a business person lol. my passion is for daytrading forex. not running a business.

 

[CarrieW]

Oops! I thought I replied directly to his post but I was objecting to the following quote attached to a video:


I like this one with all the chicks doing Yoga in the background.

Check out :54
I thought it was very unprofessional and insulting to the women on the forum.

thank you got clairifying your post. at least now we know what you are talking about!

dont put too much thought into that. as a woman you should already know most guys r pigs. sometimes it slips out here and there on the forum but for the most part its not like that around here. just cut the guys some slack, and try to not take it personally. really this is a great group of people around here. sometimes we disagree and sometimes they let the pigs out but in the end its worth it to overlook it and make the best of it! and if you happen to make a post objectifying men w/e lol what goes around comes around and I doubt any of them would get offended by it!

good luck and welcome to the forum!

 

[458]

Anyway.... How bout them dolphins?

 

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[Rickson9]

Trump provides his opinion on the Occupy movement and other items on the economy.

Donald Trump on Daily Ticker

 

[77startup]

Oops! I thought I replied directly to his post but I was objecting to the following quote attached to a video:



I thought it was very unprofessional and insulting to the women on the forum.

If that offended you, you're going to want to avoid all male populated forums in general.

 

[Anon3587x]

!!!


Men are pigs? How offensive and insulting!

 

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[CarrieW]

!!!


Men are pigs? How offensive and insulting!

haha lol!

 

[GlobalWealth]

Men are pigs? How offensive and insulting!

Maybe.....but she's right and you know it.:smxB:

 

[CarrieW]

what do you guys think of this?


'Occupy' protesters find allies among the wealthy - US news - Life - msnbc.com

I can tell you it actually brought tears to my eyes.

 

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[kwerner]

what do you guys think of this?


'Occupy' protesters find allies among the wealthy - US news - Life - msnbc.com

I can tell you it actually brought tears to my eyes.

If you're paying attention to anything that msnbc has to say, then that explains a lot about why you have the viewpoints that you do IMO.

 

[GlobalWealth]

what do you guys think of this?

It seems you found a group even more idiotic than the 99'rs.

 

[CarrieW]

actually I dont usually read news. the title of the article caught my eye so I read it.

not following the news is why I refrained from posting specifics about the movement and spoke more about what I thought and how I felt about the things that were being posted.

I go to msn to check the weather and the top news stories and usually only read the science or world events or the lifestyle stuff. mostly just the fluff. I dont watch tv news either. I am not really into poilitics or anything like that.

I trade forex by technical anaylsis only so I get to do what I do w/o it.

the only times I pay attention to actual news is like the earthquake in japan or specific things that catch my attention or if theres a hurricane coming.(live on southern east coast)

this world depresses me and I prefer to live in my own little bubble lol.

 

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[CarrieW]

It seems you found a group even more idiotic than the 99'rs.

lol even tho we disagree on this. that was funny!

 

[GlobalWealth]

lol even tho we disagree on this. that was funny!

I made the comment because after reading the article, the first 2 guys have no concept of basic economics. A progressive tax policy penalizes productivity and creates disincentives for economic growth.

For example, the common idea many of these 99'rs have is to increase the estate tax. The reality is that the estate tax has never accounted for more than 2% of all tax revenue. In 2010 the figure was 1.2% (see Congressional Budget Office - Home Page).

Over the past several decades the estate tax has fluctuated dramatically but has always been between 1-2% of total tax revenue. The reason is that the wealthy are savvy enough and have the money to avoid this draconian tax. If you really dig in to the numbers, you will find that the estate tax actually creates almost zero net revenue because of the cost of enforcement.

Another example can be found in the states. Just ask OR, IL, CA, MD, or NY what happens when you increase the tax on the upper income levels. You guessed it - when the progressive rates were increased, the gross tax revenue fell (search the tax department websites for each respective state).

I also find it a bit ironic that the first guy inherited his wealth and then founded a charity. Which basically means he wasn't the creator of the wealth but he was smart enough to know how to shelter income through a charity which pays no taxes.

And the second guys also inherited his wealth and works for a non-profit.

Always remember, don't just listen to the words, but understand the source.