What do you guys think of Jordan Belfort?

[Ninjakid]

Not likely. http://dealbook.nytimes.com/2014/01...h-prosecutors-say/?_php=true&_type=blogs&_r=0

He makes $30,000 per speech. On a 45 city tour that's 1.35 million.

He only made about $1.3 million from the movie, of which only a tiny fraction ($21,000?) was given back and which the government is in the process of suing him for.

Saying 'I'm going to make $100 million dollars this year, is asinine.' and the only purpose is to try and drum up more interest in himself.

Top grossing speakers like Al Gore don't pull anything close to that..

I think his most successful venture right now is his book.

 

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[Maxjohan]

I was expecting to see an article saying he charges like $5000 and your first-born child for a seminar (by the way, Robert Kiyosaki charges $12,000 to $45,000) but 50 to 120 euros isn't too bad.

I don't think you read the article? Either way, here is part of his seminar I think:

 

[Maxjohan]

I think his most successful venture right now is his book.

Maybe. But I would rather see the movie.

 

[MyronGainz]

Had he stolen a significant portion of my assets, I'm pretty sure I'd want him dead.

Other than that, the movie is entertainment (nothing more) and he is a persuasive salesman.

A good person? Not at all. If he pays everyone back in full, then he gets a second chance. If he doesn't, then he's basically just scum.

"Stole" is subjective. I mean if you make an investment decision with someone who cold called you, without doing any research or analysis on either the company, industry or even the brokerage firm...

You should be blaming yourself.

 

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[codo3500]

"Stole" is subjective. I mean if you make an investment decision with someone who cold called you, without doing any research or analysis on either the company, industry or even the brokerage firm...

You should be blaming yourself.

I agree. Manipulating stock prices with pump and dump is different though, that's actually theft.

 

[Villain]

"Buyer beware" doesn't really excuse someone if they lie to sell something. Deception is a form of force. You might as well steal from the victim's house.

 

[AllenCrawley]

SMH

Reading some of these comments you guys are posting is disheartening.

 

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[The-J]

The dude served his time and is paying off his settlements (he owes over $100 million). I wish people here judging his character can realize that.

I think what he's doing is productive and adds value.

 

[Brentnal]

Here's a video of him talking about the mortgage business

I watched it and DAMM!! the way he acts and speaks you can see he is just one of the best salespeople ever

 

[XOthermic]

I personally like his approach overall.

1. NLP and Tonality: How do you sound? You must sound like your siiiiiiick as sars.
2. Always have a script and keep it updated like its the key to success.
3. LOOPS on LOOPS on LOOPS ( my favorite is.... if you do half as well as alll my other clients....ect)

I never stuck with it cuz i'm pathetic but I closed 4 new accounts in one day utilizing his approach ( usually it's 4 accounts a wk around that).

The thing is that it's helped with email and other transactions besides petty (emphasis on petty) small store accounts.

My 2 cents. DM if ya got any questions.

 

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[XOthermic]

My statements have nothhing to do with him as a person. Its really just the same stuff you already know, you just don't do it. Time to start doing it!!

 

[lovecharm]

Ok, since the OP asked what do we think of JB, so here's my opinion:-

He is a brilliant sales guy, no doubt about it. Lots of people can learn and benefit from him. Some times when I need some motivation after getting NO in sales then I watch the clip of that film and it charges me back again. He is one of the few guys along with Anthony robbins who's speech works like a triple expresso for me.

Yes, what he did was wrong (thats what the court decided), but I am trying to see the positives here not the negatives. I am sure all of us have positives and negatives in us as well, like Yin and Yang. I tend to focus on the positives.

As bruce Lee says, "Absorb what is useful, discard what is not, add what is uniquely your own". So we all should absorb what's useful in him (which is his sales techniques) and discard the bad things for which he went to prison.

 

[DeletedUser394]

"Stole" is subjective. I mean if you make an investment decision with someone who cold called you, without doing any research or analysis on either the company, industry or even the brokerage firm...

You should be blaming yourself.

People's naivety is justification for stealing? It would be very easy to scam a lot of people out of a lot of money.. but that fact does not present any valid excuse whatsoever for knowingly offering someone a worthless asset.

When you offer an investment in an asset that you know is worthless by way of deception, that is stealing. There is nothing subjective about it.

Anyway, why do we glorify this guy? Madoff is clearly king if you guys look up to people like this. He could eat this 'wolf' for lunch and shit him out by dinner time.

 

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[Worldisyours]

Belford is entertainment, That one of the biggest industries inthe world.

when it comes to financial success. Ill take the quite guy no ones knows about any day.

 

[Angus]

People's naivety is justification for stealing? It would be very easy to scam a lot of people out of a lot of money.. but that fact does not present any valid excuse whatsoever for knowingly offering someone a worthless asset.

When you offer an investment in an asset that you know is worthless by way of deception, that is stealing. There is nothing subjective about it.

Anyway, why do we glorify this guy? Madoff is clearly king if you guys look up to people like this. He could eat this 'wolf' for lunch and shit him out by dinner time.

if you're that naive you deserve to be deceived
it thickens your skin

 

[DeletedUser394]

if you're that naive you deserve to be deceived
it thickens your skin

Is this serious?

This is like saying if a woman dresses a certain way, she deserved to be raped. Are you kidding me?

So if someone calls up your grandparents, confuses them, and has them send the scammer money, they deserved it? (This happens hundreds of times daily).

Just because the movie came out in 2013, that doesn't mean the business/societal conditions were identical to the time period when the events actually took place.

Remember that this guy perpetrated his crimes in the 90s. In '98, when he was caught, only 26% of American households had access to the internet, and even then, doing your due diligence wasn't as simple as logging on and reading the financial statements of various companies.

Source: http://www.census.gov/prod/2001pubs/p23-207.pdf

This guy TOOK ADVANTAGE OF PEOPLE. Because someone is weaker than you, or not as intelligent as you, or more gullible than you, or what have you, that gives you the right to EXPLOIT them? And not only that, but they deserved it? This isn't the F*cking middle ages.

I think people are confusing what exactly happened here. It's not as if Belfort was selling an under performing asset in which people bought into. That is fine, provided proper documents are provided.. people buy shitty assets every day, and there's nothing immoral or illegal about it..

But Belfort was offering assets in which he deliberately deceived his investors and pump and dumped shares via associates that held his money in trust. That is 100% illegal.

It's not like this guy was stealing insignificant amounts of money.. this guy destroyed people's livelihoods.

The forum is predominately populated by young men with a certain ideology (guilty as charged). But does no one have any shred of human decency? (95% of people that have taken the opposite side on this issue are under 25).

I don't need to step over and exploit people on my way to the top.

Entrepreneurs provide value. They make life better. They don't steal or destroy.

This thread should be locked down. It serves no purpose. (other than exposing the rather nasty/skewed viewpoints of certain members).


As I said originally... this guy is a great salesman, but a horrible human being. That's all there is to it.

You can be a great salesman, and a great person, or you can use your talents for nefarious purposes. It's your life and your choice.

But nobody deserves to be taken advantage of.

 

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[Angus]

This guy TOOK ADVANTAGE OF PEOPLE. Because someone is weaker than you, or not as intelligent as you, or more gullible than you, or what have you, that gives you the right to EXPLOIT them? And not only that, but they deserved it? This isn't the F*cking middle ages.

dude, it's nature

predator and prey

you can't hate birds because they prey lambs

 

[DeletedUser394]

dude, it's nature

predator and prey

you can't hate birds because they prey lambs

I believe you're 16-ish?

I used to think a similar way.

Every year that I get older I realize how stupid I was the year before, not only in my thoughts, but in my actions as well.

I'm already looking back introspectively on some of the things I've thought/said/done in the past few months that I've learned from and that I won't do again.

So I don't fault you. You'll grow out of it. We learn and grow constantly.

The world isn't as black and white as you're painting it my friend.

We can't really equate the biological and predatory nature of meat eaters with human social interactions lol.

I'd like to think we're better than other animals...

 

[Angus]

I believe you're 16-ish?

I used to think a similar way.

Every year that I get older I realize how stupid I was the year before, not only in my thoughts, but in my actions as well.

I'm already looking back introspectively on some of the things I've thought/said/done in the past few months that I've learned from and that I won't do again.

So I don't fault you. You'll grow out of it. We learn and grow constantly.

The world isn't as black and white as you're painting it my friend.

We can't really equate the biological and predatory nature of meat eaters with human social interactions lol.

I'd like to think we're better than other animals...

i don't think i'll "grow out" of my machiavellian views of the world shaped by history, but i'll surely reinforce them
being naive by choice isn't a virtue

 

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[ChickenHawk]

being naive by choice isn't a virtue

The people being swindled might be naive, but when you take advantage of a superior position to lie/cheat/steal, you're not naive, you're a criminal bastard who gives all genuinely wealthy/successful people a bad name.

I'm probably just getting crusty in my old age, but it seems to me that some of the interactions on this forum have gone seriously downhill. I don't know about anyone else, but it makes me hesitate to share information or be helpful to newbies when this is the caliber of behavior I'm seeing.

 

[DeletedUser394]

i don't think i'll "grow out" of my machiavellian views of the world shaped by history, but i'll surely reinforce them
being naive by choice isn't a virtue

I can guarantee you will change.

Change and evolution are natural progressions of life.

This is so far off topic, but to give you an example, when I was your age I was heavily into environmentalism and viewed capitalists as earth destroyers. Funny, I could also recite Il Principe by heart at 16-17. Fyi: Machiavellianism is not something to aspire to and is not a positive character trait.. it's the trait of a sociopath.

Now that I'm older (not significantly mind you) I see clearly that there aren't black and white answers to anything (other than math if you want to get technical.. 1 plus 1 will always be 2, etc).

Also at your age I thought I knew everything. But that couldn't have been further from the truth

 

[Angus]

the best thing to do is to accept the world and human nature as it is and focus on things you can control
can you control people "evilness"? you can't
so just try to minimize their damage

 

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[DaRK9]

This is like saying if a woman dresses a certain way, she deserved to be raped. Are you kidding me?

Sadly, people do believe this.

Back on topic though. It's the past, I don't idolize him, nor do I support what he did. Nevertheless, his sales stuff does work so that's all that matters to me.

Learn from others mistakes. If he had stayed legit, he would have be legally filthy rich. If anything it shows others the truth of what is taught here. Honesty and value go much further than crummy underhandedness and loos morals.

But no one deserved that at all.

 

[MattCour]

Is this serious?

This is like saying if a woman dresses a certain way, she deserved to be raped. Are you kidding me?

So if someone calls up your grandparents, confuses them, and has them send the scammer money, they deserved it? (This happens hundreds of times daily).

Just because the movie came out in 2013, that doesn't mean the business/societal conditions were identical to the time period when the events actually took place.

Remember that this guy perpetrated his crimes in the 90s. In '98, when he was caught, only 26% of American households had access to the internet, and even then, doing your due diligence wasn't as simple as logging on and reading the financial statements of various companies.

Source: http://www.census.gov/prod/2001pubs/p23-207.pdf

This guy TOOK ADVANTAGE OF PEOPLE. Because someone is weaker than you, or not as intelligent as you, or more gullible than you, or what have you, that gives you the right to EXPLOIT them? And not only that, but they deserved it? This isn't the F*cking middle ages.

I think people are confusing what exactly happened here. It's not as if Belfort was selling an under performing asset in which people bought into. That is fine, provided proper documents are provided.. people buy shitty assets every day, and there's nothing immoral or illegal about it..

But Belfort was offering assets in which he deliberately deceived his investors and pump and dumped shares via associates that held his money in trust. That is 100% illegal.

It's not like this guy was stealing insignificant amounts of money.. this guy destroyed people's livelihoods.

The forum is predominately populated by young men with a certain ideology (guilty as charged). But does no one have any shred of human decency? (95% of people that have taken the opposite side on this issue are under 25).

I don't need to step over and exploit people on my way to the top.

Entrepreneurs provide value. They make life better. They don't steal or destroy.

This thread should be locked down. It serves no purpose. (other than exposing the rather nasty/skewed viewpoints of certain members).


As I said originally... this guy is a great salesman, but a horrible human being. That's all there is to it.

You can be a great salesman, and a great person, or you can use your talents for nefarious purposes. It's your life and your choice.

But nobody deserves to be taken advantage of.

Very very well said, agree 100%. This is almost exactly what I wrote in my posts.

I've read a few times that Belfort said 95% of the business he did was legitimate. That's a complete lie. The ratio was prob the other way around.

 

[AllenCrawley]

SMH
Reading some of these comments you guys are posting is disheartening.

I'm probably just getting crusty in my old age, but it seems to me that some of the interactions on this forum have gone seriously downhill. I don't know about anyone else, but it makes me hesitate to share information or be helpful to newbies when this is the caliber of behavior I'm seeing.

It seems to me that most of this is coming from young guys ranging from teens to early and even mid twenties. For some reason this forum has attracted a lot of this mindset in recent months. Could be because of the recommendation from Bold and Determined and a few other factors I'll just keep to myself. The age group seems to be easily swayed by the money and lifestyle and idolize those that have it no matter how they got it.

My views of Belfort is that I don't waste my time listening to convicted felons no matter how remorseful and apologetic they are. I don't even care how successful his 'system' of sales really is.

As bruce Lee says, "Absorb what is useful, discard what is not, add what is uniquely your own". So we all should absorb what's useful in him (which is his sales techniques) and discard the bad things for which he went to prison.

I just love the whole 'take what you can apply and leave the rest' mindset. *sarcasm* You know, if you dig thru the trash long enough or search hard enough you'll find something worthy of eating. I'm just not willing to dig thru all that sh!t to get to it. Someone mentioned earlier in this thread that with so many other legit and ethical businesses and people out there why look up to those like Belfort. There are so many other examples and role models for you guys.

 

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[AlterJoule]

ChickenHawk said: ↑
I'm probably just getting crusty in my old age, but it seems to me that some of the interactions on this forum have gone seriously downhill. I don't know about anyone else, but it makes me hesitate to share information or be helpful to newbies when this is the caliber of behavior I'm seeing.

It seems to me that most of this is coming from young guys ranging from teens to early and even mid twenties. For some reason this forum has attracted a lot of this mindset in recent months. Could be because of the recommendation from Bold and Determined and a few other factors I'll just keep to myself. The age group seems to be easily swayed by the money and lifestyle and idolize those that have it no matter how they got it.

It's unfortunate because there are a few of us here really wanting to learn from you guys. As nice as it is, I can't buy my morning production coffee with my Fastlane Bucks. Maybe eventually that will hit some of the others. I've said it a few times but again, it took me a LONG time to finally come around and finally act upon all the great advice hidden around here on the site.

 

[Iwokeup]

It's unfortunate because there are a few of us here really wanting to learn from you guys. As nice as it is, I can't buy my morning production coffee with my Fastlane Bucks. Maybe eventually that will hit some of the others. I've said it a few times but again, it took me a LONG time to finally come around and finally act upon all the great advice hidden around here on the site.

It's not hidden... It's all around!

 

[Ninjakid]

It seems to me that most of this is coming from young guys ranging from teens to early and even mid twenties. For some reason this forum has attracted a lot of this mindset in recent months. Could be because of the recommendation from Bold and Determined and a few other factors I'll just keep to myself. The age group seems to be easily swayed by the money and lifestyle and idolize those that have it no matter how they got it.

Be right back @AllenCrawley . I'm going to invent a rapid aging machine so I can make myself older and have a moral compass.

 

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[AllenCrawley]

Be right back @AllenCrawley . I'm going to invent a rapid aging machine so I can make myself older and have a moral compass.

Invite a few others along with you.

 

[Ninjakid]

Invite a few others along with you.

No, because that would be sharing