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O/T: Health My Experience Eating Keto/Carnivore

Discussion in 'Health and Fitness' started by Darius, Nov 1, 2018.

  1. Darius
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    Darius Gold Contributor Read Millionaire Fastlane FASTLANE INSIDER Speedway Pass

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    What's up everyone! I haven't posted here in a while but thought I'd give you guys some insight on my experience doing lazy keto (8 months so far) and the Carnivore (~2 months) WOE (way of eating). I'm not a doctor, this post isn't medical advice, and I'm not telling you to do Keto or Carnivore. Do what you want. This post will simply show you my experience and what I think I've learned from my research.

    What is Lazy Keto?:
    Lazy Keto is basically when you eat less than 20g of carbs per day, but you don't track it. You don't try to hit 'strict' macros, restrict calories, or measure blood ketones. Just stay under that carb amount and you’ll enter a metabolic state called ‘ketosis’ (basically when your body starts to utilize stored body fat and convert it into an energy source called ketones)

    What is Carnivore?:
    Carnivore is when you only eat animal products. This excludes all plants. Some people still use plant seasonings and drink coffee/tea, but that’s technically not carnivore. You can incorporate more carbs from animal sources to see how they affect you (think raw honey and milk).

    Why I started eating Keto and Carnivore:
    I’m always trying to be healthier. I heard good things about Keto via Reddit and thought why not. Once I did some research and figured Keto probably wouldn’t kill me to try for a couple months, I went straight to Keto. Carnivore just became a gradual transition that my body steered me towards. I had no diagnosed medical problems and was not overweight (my body fat percentage was probably between 20-23% depending at the time of starting - now around 15%). I definitely had fat to lose.

    Issues I had before Keto/Carnivore:
    • I was always slightly tired regardless of how much sleep I got. Some days better than others, but more tired than not. I now believe this was a sign of insulin resistance. However, all of my blood work was normal. I figured this was just the way it was supposed to be.

    • I would get tired after a carb-heavy meal, think pancakes with syrup. Another sign of insulin resistance. I also figured this was normal for my body, due to it happening when eating a 'healthy' meal of steel-cut oatmeal, egg whites, and 2% milk.

    • CICO (Calories-in-Calories-out) no longer worked for me and despite weight lifting ~6 days per week, I couldn’t lose much stomach fat. I now believe this was an early sign of metabolic syndrome. At the time, I figured I just needed to drop my calories even more (my lowest was 800 per day in order to lose .4-.8 lbs per week at ~152lbs).

    • I could barely breathe out my nose. They said I needed surgery in order to fix it but it shouldn’t cause any major problems to just leave it - that was 5-6 years ago.

    • Eczema & seborrheic dermatitis (I had asthma as a child and dermatologist said they’re related). She gave me steroids that I refuse to take.

    • Acne (figured it was normal)

    • Eyes sensitive to bright lights (had no idea why)

    My Experience (short version):
    • Went from eating 800-1200 calories to 2800-3500 calories per day. (keto + carnivore)

    • Went from 155 lbs to 135 lbs - lost primarily water and fat, strength and muscle mass has increased. (keto & carnivore)

    • 5-year fatigue issues resolved (keto & carnivore)
    • One of my nostrils would always be closed and the other nostril would only be ~50% open. This is no longer a problem. Both nostrils fully open now and no longer a mouth breather (keto & carnivore)

    • Never ‘hangry’ (keto + carnivore)

    • More focus and energy when I don’t eat. (keto & carnivore)

    • Hair grows faster (carnivore)

    • Acne is mainly cleared (keto)

    • Eczema and Seb derm did not clear up from diet. However, it does clear up on days I get a lot of sun.

    • I’m not sure if the eye sensitivity was fixed from diet or since I stopped wearing sunglasses often.

    Typical Things I Eat:
    • 2-4 oz liver with eggs/butter/cheese

    • 0.8-1 lb ribeye with butter

    • 5-8 oz burger patty with cheese and butter (depending on how lean the meat is)

    • Liver, kidney, heart, spleen, and chuck ground mixture for burgers or taco meat

    • Smoked sockeye salmon with eggs/butter/cheese

    • Occasional chicken wings

    • Slow-cooked brisket with cheese

    • Broccoli & green beans (during keto)

    How Often I Eat:
    I started eating 3 meals per day. Now I typically eat 1 or 2 meals per day. I usually eat 2 meals on days where I feel sore from working out or if I'm eating out with friends unexpectedly.

    Month #1 - Keto:
    It was fairly easy for me to keep carbs under 20g just by eating meat, veggies, and cheese. Not the ideal way to keto in my opinion (organs should be included for vitamins), but I ate what I had available. On my 5th day, I got lightheaded for about 1 hour. After a few Google Searches, I learned that electrolyte imbalances are common in the early stages of keto. These imbalances can cause symptoms that people call ‘keto flu’. I kept swallowing a pinch of salt until it tasted too salty. This got rid of the symptoms within 30 mins and I didn't’ have any other keto flu symptoms afterward. I also lost 8 pounds.

    Month #2-#6 - Keto:
    After the first month, body fat kept dropping even though I started eating more calories. I started adding more fat to my diet, specifically butter and avocados - which made my consumed calories rise to around 2300-2500 calories. I was nervous at first due to previously being able to gain fat at anything over 1200 calories. That didn’t happen, so I kept slowly increasing the amount of food I ate until I was full. I did notice some days I’d have digestion issues after eating too much roasted broccoli.

    Month #7 - Keto + Carnivore:
    The first-day doing carnivore felt wrong mentally. Who in their right mind thinks not eating vegetables is a good thing? Regardless, I pushed through the mental thoughts. After the first week, those thoughts went away and I started to feel even better than I did on Keto. All through my time doing Keto I was learning about nutrition trying to put the pieces together as to how it’s causing me to lose fat while eating more and helping the issues that I thought were normal. But, when carnivore started making me feel even better, I really got focused on learning because I didn’t understand how this was even possible.

    I learned a ton about vitamins (both plant & animal versions) and the foods that contain them, plant defense mechanisms, plant diversity, gut microbiota, the quality differences between meat, and a ton more. I probably spent 2-3 hours daily learning/trying to break down different studies and their methods due to it being so interesting.

    This is the month I started to limit my animal consumption to beef, dairy, eggs, and the occasional salmon. I started purchasing grass-fed pasture-raised beef and pasture-raised chicken eggs. I was already purchasing ‘wild caught’ salmon.

    I also began incorporating offal into my diet at this point after researching how nutrient dense they are (and bio-available) from a grass-fed pasture-raised cow. I purchased liver, kidney, spleen, and heart.

    Month #8 - Keto + Carnivore:
    In month #8, I started purchasing a good amount of my beef & chicken from a local farm. I’m actually surprised at the differences in quality. The muscle meat has no marbling and taste beefier (I’m still getting used to it), the beef fat is extremely soft, melts, and taste really good, the beef organs taste normal but I’ve been buying high-quality offal since my first time trying them so I don’t know what others taste like.

    I try to have at least 2 servings of offal (preferably liver) per week as a ‘multivitamin’ due to its vitamin profile (it has every fat-soluble vitamin and water-soluble vitamins depending on how you cook it. Some is lost when cooking). I tried eating liver raw and it’s ok. It’s chewy and can be ‘minerally’ tasting at times, but it’s fine. I prefer pan seared.

    I’m still losing body fat and can now fast for multiple days at a time on accident due to being busy. I rarely get hungry unless I fast for 1-3 days.

    Towards the end of month #8, I started incorporating a couple ‘cheat’ meals during a house move - which are basically keto friendly foods that are more processed - such as a quest pizza. I noticed some bloating from the fiber but other than that there was no immediate weight gain or issues.

    Overall
    It's been a cool experience and this WOE has been fixing some issues that I didn't know could be fixed from diet. I'm slowly learning a lot about nutrition and realizing how much humans don't know about nutrition. Most studies are biased for whoever funds it, even if detrimental to our overall health.

    But, I don't really miss any carbs except for Sweet Potato Pie. I'm planning on eating some in November but going right back to carnivore after.

    Questions:

    How did you use the bathroom without fiber during carnivore?
    On carnivore, I go to the bathroom a lot less (every 3-4 days) but never felt constipated or bloated. If anything, it's easy and quick to use the bathroom when I need to.

    Don’t you feel bad eating animals that have to be killed?
    I know a good amount of forum members are vegans so I figured this question might be asked. Of course. But I also feel bad when a lion hunts and kills an animal for his family. Death, in general, makes me feel bad. I try to limit the number of animals that have to be killed by mainly focusing on beef for organ & meat consumption. One cow can feed 1 person for 12+ months just off of meat and fat. Most people don’t eat organs so I pick those up for cheap so it doesn’t go to waste.

    How is your blood work?
    I haven’t had it done yet since starting keto (I had it done right before). I’ve been waiting until the 1-year mark but might get it done in January. So, it’s possible my blood work could be on the brink of heart disease and diabetes.

    How did you give up carbs/sugar?
    Honestly, I just stopped eating them. The day before starting keto I had over 250g of carbs. I didn’t think about it.

    What about vitamin deficiencies since you stopped eating vegetables?
    The vitamins in vegetables are controversial at the moment. They’re not bio-available (meaning we don’t absorb them well). The rate at which someone can absorb them is on a person by person basis. Some people can get enough from plants and others can't. High-quality liver has most of the vitamins needed to survive (in a bio-available form). I say most due to vitamin loss based on cooking methods, vitamin d (In my opinion, this should come from the sun), and possibly vitamin K2 (which comes from fermented foods like cheese or ‘spoiled’ food - they call this ‘high meat’ I think). I believe the same mechanism that allows our body to make vitamin d from the sun also triggers other mechanisms to run - I read about some of the believed mechanisms but haven’t read any studies on it.
     
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  2. MJ DeMarco
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    MJ DeMarco Raving Lunatic Staff Member Read Millionaire Fastlane I've Read UNSCRIPTED FASTLANE INSIDER Speedway Pass LEGENDARY CONTRIBUTOR Summit Attendee

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    Admin Post
    Some perspective: Vegans don't find issue with the circle of life (as it pertains to lions/zebras or environmental/circumstantial killing for survival, say the Alaskan bush) but with normalization of meat as a primary dietary ration, a centerpiece in the first-world palette, despite macroeconomics, environmental, and/or health effects. In other words, meat for pleasure, not survival. Industrialized meat production (Big-Ag factory farming) is the most disgusting and traumatic thing I ever witnessed in my life. And I refuse to bankroll its inhumanity by burying my head in the sand, all in the name of "it tastes good" or "well, that's the way it's always been done." Most Vegans are from this dualistic perspective, a smaller minority for the health reasons.

    Strong work!

    IMO most dietary changes that yield positive results, whether it be veganism, vegetarianism, Paleo, IM, etc are simply the results of eating less processed garbage like empty carbs and sugar. The closer you get to nature with the least amount of processing, the better results will be. I feel its more about what is now MISSING over what is added.

    Thanks for sharing your experience my friend, appreciate it!
     
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  3. Jakeeck
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    Jakeeck Silver Contributor Read Millionaire Fastlane Speedway Pass

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    Did you have any trouble sleeping in the beginning of starting this diet?

    Whenever I've tried keto in the past, my sleep gets absolutely horrible and I get very constipated. By day 3-4 I cannot fall asleep for the life of me and then if I do I'll wake up 6-8 times during the night.
     
  4. Nelow
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    Wow im not the only one, what you mentioned about breathing through one nose has been me for the past 6 years it came out of nowhere and stayed, I also have daily morning sinus problems. If what you did helped you with the breathing I need to get started asap. Im very active due to my business and I love my meat. What are your suggestions for getting started.
     
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  5. Darius
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    Darius Gold Contributor Read Millionaire Fastlane FASTLANE INSIDER Speedway Pass

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    I had no trouble sleeping. I do remember not using the bathroom often at the beginning (1-1.5 times per week) but I never felt constipated.

    If I did have sleep issues, I probably would have supplemented with magnesium right before bed and made sure I was getting enough salt.
     
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  6. Jakeeck
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    Yeah I tried mass amounts of electros and didn't help =/ Felt like I couldn't hold on to any of them no matter what I did with the lack of carbs.

    The thing I've learned about diet is that it truly is extremely variable by person. We all have genetic weaknesses in different organs. For example, someone with weak adrenal glands already has a very hard time regulating electrolytes, so when they try keto, they can't hold onto any sodium, potassium, magnesium.

    Someone with a weak pancreas can't handle certain foods because their pancreas isn't producing enough digestive enzymes for those foods.

    Etc, etc.

    It's very interesting though when somebody finds the diet that accommodates their genetic weaknesses.
     
  7. Darius
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    Darius Gold Contributor Read Millionaire Fastlane FASTLANE INSIDER Speedway Pass

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    If I could go back in time and give myself suggestions, it would be:

    1. Avoid any keto 'products'. I didn't use any but this would just be a reminder.
    2. Try to eat as much high-quality meat/eggs as you can afford (animal raised on pasture and fed its natural diet). Animals raised like this help regenerate the soil and is said to have a positive effect on carbon emissions (I haven't read studies verifying this).
    3. Don't over-indulge on vegetables. I was eating 1 lb of roasted broccoli in 1 sitting because it tasted good. Bloat quickly followed
    4. Salt your food more
    5. Get rid of supplements and add in organ meats such as liver once or twice per week.
    6. Use more fat in meals.
     
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  8. Darius
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    Darius Gold Contributor Read Millionaire Fastlane FASTLANE INSIDER Speedway Pass

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    Very true. It's all variable based on the person.

    How long did you try Keto for?
     
  9. Kak
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    Great post. Very well done.

    I too have felt some significant benefits from Ketosis. Among other things I have come down from 230 pounds to right at about 205. I burned out on the diet, felt like crap when I ate junk, so I started back up about a week ago. I've been in ketosis for about 4 days... Even through Halloween. Aiming at 185-190.

    I have more energy and mental clarity. My skin is clearer and my hair grows faster and looks thicker and healthier.

    I have gone from my worst at 46r jacket to a 42r or 43 slim. 38 jeans to 34 believe it or not. 36 for most of everything else.

    It has literally been the only diet that shows measurable results steadily enough to keep me this well motivated.
     
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  10. Jakeeck
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    I've tried it many many times over the past 8 years because I really wanted it to work for me. I was always big into lifting (bulking and cutting) so I'd try it when cutting. Usually 5-14 days and then I just can't handle the issues it gives me anymore.

    The diet that makes me feel best is one that's low in fermentable carbs (high water content fruits, non-starchy vegetables, organic soups). I eat a tiny bit of meat.. I have a can of mackerel/sardines every day.

    If I start eating potatoes, rice, bread and cruciferous veggies like broccoli... I'm in a depressive coma in about 3-5 days.
     
    Last edited: Nov 1, 2018
  11. Darius
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    Darius Gold Contributor Read Millionaire Fastlane FASTLANE INSIDER Speedway Pass

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    That's awesome!

    You should have no problem hitting 185-190 long term on keto.

    Have you dabbled in fasting? The mental clarity I've had from a 2+ day fast is unbelievable.
     
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  12. Darius
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    Darius Gold Contributor Read Millionaire Fastlane FASTLANE INSIDER Speedway Pass

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    That's really interesting.

    Sounds like your body is too dependent on glucose and going straight keto doesn't give it much practice for learning how to burn fat, utilize ketones well, and regulate itself.

    Have you tried intermittent fasting?

    That could give your body practice being in ketosis for a short amount of time without the symptoms. Weightlifting would help speed that up.

    But I'm not a doctor tho
     
  13. Kak
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    I have actually. It is way easier to do on Keto. If you eat a good fat heavy diet before you begin and are solidly in ketosis it goes pretty smoothly.
     
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  14. The Abundant Man
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    You gained strength with no carbs?
     
  15. Darius
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    Darius Gold Contributor Read Millionaire Fastlane FASTLANE INSIDER Speedway Pass

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    Yep!

    All of my major lifts have been going up - bench, squat, deadlift, and overhead press
     
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  16. The Abundant Man
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    I guess the body's switch of fuels works to go from Carbs to Fat/Ketones. It's interesting to me since carbohydrates are the body's primary source of fuel. I wonder what happens metabolically when the switch happens.
     
  17. Lionhearted
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    Keto for the last 2+years. Went from 225lbs to (165-168Lbs range) Consume 2500 cals a day or so. Not type two diabetic anymore. Best shape of my life and I am NEVER going back to the Standard American Diet (S.A.D .how appropriate) That was going to eventually KILL me. Testosterone levels are higher as well. Workouts are great too. Mental clarity 100%.
    I love it when people tell me they can't diet. LOL. We are all on a diet, the question being is, how's that working for you? The gym is where you build muscle and get into shape. The kitchen is where you lose or gain weight and where you make or break your health. All the best.
     
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  18. Lionhearted
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    You feel 10 TIMES better.
     
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  19. The Abundant Man
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    I bet. I meant the biochemistry of it. How does Mitochondria process them differently and what causes the difference?

    I agree with you though. The current Food Pyramid is upside down with the chunk of it being grains and at the bottom of the pyramid and fats/oils at the tippy top. It should be switched where fats/oils should be the largest and grains at the tippy top. In fact, South Park did an episode on this.
     
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    He who pays the most get's to the top of the pyramid. Just about EVERYTHING told to you by the media and "health industry" is a LIE. For instance, breakfast is the MOST important meal of the day! Yeah, right. How about, "Trust me, I am from the government!" LOL
     
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    Great stuff, I've also had excellent results with Keto/Paleo. It's crazy how well you're able to lose weight with it, and it seems to be the easiest "diet" I've found.
     
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    thanks again for sharing your journey, I’m serious about fixing my nasal problem and took the first steps to this diet today, NO ACTION FAKING.
    [​IMG]
    [​IMG]
     
    Last edited: Nov 1, 2018
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    Remember FAT is good. Keto is a low carb, moderate protein, high FAT lifestyle. All the best.
     
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