Website POS/ Account Management Question

[dreaminBIG]

So I have finally filed for the LLC and registered the domain to my website. My next move is getting my EIN from the IRS and start outsourcing the programming of the site. I've been thinking a lot about how my site will work, which has led to a problem I know nothing about. I have no idea how I will go about asking the site programmer to add a "shopping cart" and automated account management system. I want to sound at least semi-intelligent when talking to the programmers so hopefully someone here can help me sort out what I need to ask for in scripting/programming terms, and maybe give better or more efficient ideas.

Here is how I imagine the site working. Restaurant owners register for an account then post their menus for to-go and delivery. Customers go to the site, click on the items they want then checkout. The order is then sent via email to the store for the food to be made. Through the restaurant's account, they will be able to: 1) see a history of all prior orders.
2) track how much money they have made from the site
3) track customer reviews
4) see pending orders
5) get paid for the orders processed through my site
6) post menus with a company logo.

The customers will be able to:
1) check out using a credit card
2) track their previous orders
3) click on items to add to their cart
4) write reviews

What do I need to ask for (or do myself) to make sure my site is secure, and process orders? I will make money off taking a small percent off each order going through my site, so that is why the account management system will be so important. How will the restaurants get paid, and how will I assure that I get paid as well?

Thanks for reading!! I know it's long but hopefully someone will learn from this thread later on down the road.

 

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[jbuckingham]

I think what you've put here is a great starting point for your discussion. You fairly clearly describe the functionality for which you are seeking. The technical stuff is the developer's responsibility. I do think it's valuable to discuss this with people on this site who have some expertise in development as they will give you tips on how to discuss this with a developer and can probably give you and idea of cost, complexity etc.

 

[dreaminBIG]

Thanks, I'm hoping it will become helpful!

 

[Pat]

For the payout problems you might want to look into how affiliate networks are doing it? There might exist a difference for food though, but I know they sell things like acai berries so I think it should be the same.

Cheers
Pat

 

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[dreaminBIG]

Thanks pat! I will look into that tonight.

 

[FastNAwesome]

There are many online services providing secure payment processing, here's one of the better known:

Online Merchant Services & Credit Card Payment Processing

They also have an API (application programming interface) and other integration tools, so this means that
your programmer will have all the tools at his disposal to integrate their secure payment system into your website
the way you'd like it.

. I have no idea how I will go about asking the site programmer to add a "shopping cart" and automated account management system. I want to sound at least semi-intelligent when talking to the programmers so hopefully someone here can help me sort out what I need to ask for in scripting/programming terms

My advice: until you're very familiar with this terms, stay away from them! You won't express yourself well, and they'll have a perfect excuse for not doing the right thing ("well boss, YOU said you wanted ____________")

Why semi when you can sound absolutely inteligent? Explain them in plain words what you want - just like you did here. When you go to the doctor, you don't start speaking Latin do you?

Just plain English, and the main thing is - as much details as possible. Document all the functionality you want and need. Because if you oversee something, then it likely won't be done. Plain English is perfectly acceptable for talking with programmers - and if you get the feeling they are getting too techy or bluffing you, PM me and I can try to translate whatever jargon they threw at ya

 

[dreaminBIG]

FastNAwesome,

You're really living up to the "Awesome" part of your username.:hl: I appreciate all of the advice and I look forward to repaying the favor one day. I will use your advice and post my job on free-lance sites this weekend.

Thanks again,

Lee

 

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[mcjon77]

dreaminBIG,

Reading your post is kind of funny, because I was thinking about doing a similar project a few weeks ago. More as a programming exercise or standalone software system to sell than a subscription service. Anyway, I thought I would pass along some thoughts about your set up.


1) Restaurant notification of customer order. The email idea was my original thought as well. However there is one big challenge to simply sending an email, from a user (the restaurant) perspective. Assuming that anyone placing the order is picking it up within the hour (as opposed to an order for the next day, which seems unlikely), the restaurant has to be constantly checking their email for any notices. This can create two issues. First, it may slow down productivity if there is one person dedicated to hitting the refresh button on the email, as opposed to preparing food. Second, without the dedicated person, if someone forgets to check the email (lets say that the restaurant is busy and no one is checking email for half an hour or more) you could have a situation where someone shows up expecting there food when it was either started late, or not started yet at all.

The possible solutions I came up with (in order of simplicity) were:
a) Require the restaurant to use an email client that constantly sends audio alerts whenever it receives a new email.
b) Require the user to keep your webpage open in a browser that uses AJAX (or perhaps a Java Applet if you want to go old school) to make continuous updates in checking whether there are new orders to be fulfilled.
c) Have your server side application continuously check to see if any orders have been in the queue without acknowledgement of receipt for more than 10 minutes. If it finds one, it sends a text message or makes a call (perhaps using the Skype API) to the restaurant notifying them that they have open orders that have not been checked.
4) Build a separate desktop app that continuously calls the server (say, once every 2-5 minutes) to check for open orders.

2) Credit card processing and how you get paid. The first question I have is whether you are going to take your commission immediately when the customer places an order, or are you going to bill the restaurant every week/month. The reason why I ask this question is because it leads to another question. Merchant accounts are somewhat costly. Are you going to require that each restaurant have their own merchant account and simply port your system to their merchant account, or are you going to have a single account that you process all of the orders through.

In the first scenario, the client gets paid and then he pays you. In the second scenario, you get paid, and then you pay the client. Each method has it's pluses and minuses for both you and the restaurant. Most restaurants have their own merchant accounts, but I don't know if ALL of the providers have APIs that permit web order placement.

There are some other issues to deal with, but nothing insurmountable. A system like this would cost a decent amount of money to develop (not enormous, but you won't be able to pay some guy in India just $200 to complete it, either). It is still a good idea though.

One question I have for you is have you found a market for it yet. Did you take any informal market surveys to see what the reception for this type of service would be?

Hope this helps,

Jon

 

[900]

dreaminBIG,

The possible solutions I came up with (in order of simplicity) were:
a) Require the restaurant to use an email client that constantly sends audio alerts whenever it receives a new email.
b) Require the user to keep your webpage open in a browser that uses AJAX (or perhaps a Java Applet if you want to go old school) to make continuous updates in checking whether there are new orders to be fulfilled.
c) Have your server side application continuously check to see if any orders have been in the queue without acknowledgement of receipt for more than 10 minutes. If it finds one, it sends a text message or makes a call (perhaps using the Skype API) to the restaurant notifying them that they have open orders that have not been checked.
4) Build a separate desktop app that continuously calls the server (say, once every 2-5 minutes) to check for open orders.

Why not an old school solution like fax? I get the sense that restaurants typically aren't focused on things like accessing the Internet when things are busy, but rather getting food out the door, so anything Internet focused may not get used. Fax machines are still pretty common, and get attention when paper shoots out.

 

[mcjon77]

Why not an old school solution like fax? I get the sense that restaurants typically aren't focused on things like accessing the Internet when things are busy, but rather getting food out the door, so anything Internet focused may not get used. Fax machines are still pretty common, and get attention when paper shoots out.

Fax? What's that? Hehehe. Just kidding. The Fax Machine option is actually quite a good idea, especially since there are already services that will send faxes from online. One could simply use that services API to send the fax. Also, many restaurants already have fax machines in the back office.

 

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[dreaminBIG]

Mcjon77, thanks for the info! Are you a web developer by chance?
I know there is a market... Most chain restaurants around here already have their own online ordering, and the smaller places are left out. Not many mom and pop places can afford a 6k website.

By taking a percentage off each order I think I can make this site a profitable reality. I'm going to go with your option 2 so that I get paid first.

In order to make sure the restaurant receives the order, I was thinking of an IVR api. Automated calls would be the best option as all restaurants have a phone. Faxes would work too but not all places have fax. I haven't looked into the skype idea yet, but that sounds very appealing.

My budget for this at the moment is around 6k to get this set up. I will research more and post what I find later. Any more ideas are welcomed!

 

[FastNAwesome]

Cool, there's a developer too, maybe you guys can do some JV

Just some suggestions:

1) Notification system:

I would say not email nor fax are really functional, for someone to check them in a steamy kitchen.

How it's done nowadays is SMS, you can integrate this into your software, to send SMS's with order to restaurants.


2) Payment:

As you're in full control of notification system, you'll know how many orders were made and in what amount, so you can bill restaurants monthly with a simple invoice. Maybe it's different for you, but in my country usually food is paid on delivery, so credit cards are not even used that much if at all.

This releases you from all worries about payment processing, and opens just an issue what about false orders?

DreaminBIG I know that website I sent you link to has the following mechanism to deal with those:

1) You have to register to the website, with name, address and phone # which cannot be a cellphone.

2) They call you to verify


PS. just in case, here's a link to another known cc processor: https://epoch.com/en/index.html

 

[dreaminBIG]

The payment info and notification problems are all starting to make sense. I have found ways to do the automated calls in a VERY cost effective way that I will share with you guys later. FastNawesome, I think you are right again with the payment structure you helped with. That seems like the easiest and most cost-effective way of doing it.

 

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[trnkyit]

...interesting. Here are some rambling thoughts.

I host email for clients across the country. Email, is NOT secure, yes even SSL encrypted messages... ( For those rising eyebrows, think SPAM filters like Barracuda and how they let ' Administrators ' see everything... ) There is also no guaranty the email will even arrive...

Faxing? Faxing doesn't work well over VOIP lines. VOIP seems to be the future.

SMS? I think its okay as a backup to a dedicated client/server model. Twitter could also be a similar alternative.

Personally I would create a client server application using something like Real Software: Programming language, Web Development, Software Development Tool. With a client server application you can ensure encryption and control the clients experience.
Realsoftware is a 'Visual Basic ' like development environment that creates programs that are cross platform. Therefore your clients can install your application on Linux, Macintosh or Windows machines. They can even run the program via a Browser should you wish.

Also think about creating an application(s) for Android, Windows 7 and iPhone that supplement the client/server back end. These apps would be used by the restaurant patrons...
These platforms are amazing. The two way communication between devices would make you stand out as a service. Here are some ideas.

1. Beautiful menus with ' featured ' items.
2. Fast ordering. Fast updates and notifications.
3. Real time coupons
4. Integrated payment system. Possible future near field payments?
5. Facebook, twitter integration that posts what and where an item was ordered.
etc...


Just rambling...
Corey

 

[mcjon77]

Mcjon77, thanks for the info! Are you a web developer by chance?

Yes. I've been working in IT for a while now in corporate and government and have decided to go into freelancing, with an eye on developing a fastlane business in the immediate future. I'm focusing on web and mobile app development. Even in this recession, it is still kind of a fun time to go out on your own. Do you have any web development/programming experience?

By taking a percentage off each order I think I can make this site a profitable reality. I'm going to go with your option 2 so that I get paid first.

The other companies offering the same (or similar) service are either taking a percentage or (in most cases) taking a flat monthly subscription fee. Also, the companies that are in the marketplace now, for the most part, look like small shops, like yourself.

My budget for this at the moment is around 6k to get this set up. I will research more and post what I find later. Any more ideas are welcomed!

Definately keep researching the market and what it wants/needs. For a basic system with the core functionality that you need your budget is certainly manageable. The key is setting up a solid system that does the essentials of your business well, and leaves room for growth. In addition, there are other ways that you and your developer can keep your project within budget.

For this (or really any) type of web/software application project here are a few tips that I would suggest you keep in mind. Every single project that I have ever seen fail violated one or more of these rules.

1) COMMUNICATION. IMHO, this is the single most important aspect of a project. The better you and your developer can communicate your wants/needs/vision between each other, the greater your chance of success. If you are having problems communicating with your developer in the beginning, and you question whether he truly understands your goals, it will only get worse as the project moves on.

2) Avoid feature creep. Figure out the core functions you want your system to preform in the beginning, and built that. There will always be additional features that you would like to add, but continually adding features before the initial release just delays the project, increases costs. Obviously, for someone on a tight budget this is an issue, but I have been on multi-million dollar projects that went nowhere because they kept adding new features before the first version was even released.

3) Build a quality system that is designed from the beginning with expanding features in mind. This is probably the hardest for a non-programmer to watch out for. Far to many systems are cobbled together with code that is extremely difficult to maintain and modify (if you have heard of the term "spaghetti code", that is what I am talking about)..

Think of it like this. Imagine if someone built a car that had the wheels permanently welded to the axel.Imagine trying to change a flat tire on that type of car. It is POSSIBLE to change the tire like that, but the additional work in doing so would be enormous compared to how wheels are attached to cars now. That is what bad code is like. I have seen companies dump existing systems that they spent hundreds of thousands (sometimes millions) on, simply because it was easier to start from scratch rather than clean up the existing code enough so that they can add the new features they wanted.

Hope this helps.

 

[dreaminBIG]

Thanks for the advice involving the project Mcjon77!

 

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