iPhone App outsourcing.

[kawasakirider]

Hey guys, I know that outsourcing is generally frowned upon, so I'm just asking a question...

If I came up with a good idea for an App and did up all the artwork and the way that I wanted the app to work and act, basically everything involved in the app apart from creating it, would it be possible to meet with an app developer, get them to sign and NDA and then offer them a percentage of the profits?

Obviously it's possible, but is it feasible? How much of the profits would you allow someone to have? It's obviously a big, involved task doing this, so it would have to be a reasonable chunk.

Thoughts?

 

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[healthstatus]

Outsourcing is NOT frowned upon. You won't find many quality programmers that will work for iPhone app equity. You can get a coder to do it for about $1k-$3k and not give them any equity. If you can't afford that, it will be easier to find a "money" partner to fund your idea and still outsource the programming.

 

[sk24iam]

How to Build an App Empire: Can You Create The Next Instagram?

 

[kawasakirider]

Outsourcing is NOT frowned upon. You won't find many quality programmers that will work for iPhone app equity. You can get a coder to do it for about $1k-$3k and not give them any equity. If you can't afford that, it will be easier to find a "money" partner to fund your idea and still outsource the programming.

OK sweet, well I am out of state due to a death in the family at the moment, but when I return home i intend to start a gardening/rubbish removal service as I have a trailer and the stuff I need to do it. I know guys with good reputations can make $100 an hour here doing it, if I charge less than that I should get work and 3K should be easy to save.

I haven't come up with many good ideas for apps other than games, which I believe would be a huge gamble as they aren't necessarily going to be in the top 25 continuously. However, I think my ideas would work.

For a game as well polished as "Rat On The Run", how much would one expect to pay?

Thanks for the advice!

 

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[kawasakirider]

How to Build an App Empire: Can You Create The Next Instagram?

Thank you!

 

[andviv]

For a game as well polished as "Rat On The Run", how much would one expect to pay?

I don't know about game apps in particular. I have only built "business-type" apps. The smaller ones go for about $50K-$60K. A more elaborated one will go for around $250K.

Like everything.... It all depends on the features and quality you are looking for.

My developers have rates between $75-$125/hour, depending on length and complexity of the app built.

Of course, you can find the solo guy working at his basement, and see what rates they are charging.

When I contact developers in India, I am seeing $25-$50/hour rates. These are developers with proven experience.

And again, these are for business apps, not games. I could see going rates for game development being higher, but I do not know for sure.

I hope this information helps.

 

[andviv]

Ah, disclaimer... Windows Phone apps are a little cheaper as the development platform is "easier" and more developers know about it, but the adoption of the new win phones is still an unknown.

 

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[PopEmersen]

I am actually in the process of outsourcing an app via the web as we speak. I have my project on elance, odesk, and freelancer.

 

[DavLung]

hey, I've been doing app development for months now. My approach has been doing the coding and artwork myself (b/c I don't have the budget). It's been a slow process but I finally got to the point where I can outsource the graphics work, so that should make things go faster. I agree with healthstatus and sk24iam. It's best to get to a point where making the app itself is outsourced and your focus is just on the business/marketing. That is more important if you want to get on the fastlane.

 

[kawasakirider]

I don't know about game apps in particular. I have only built "business-type" apps. The smaller ones go for about $50K-$60K. A more elaborated one will go for around $250K.

Like everything.... It all depends on the features and quality you are looking for.

My developers have rates between $75-$125/hour, depending on length and complexity of the app built.

Of course, you can find the solo guy working at his basement, and see what rates they are charging.

When I contact developers in India, I am seeing $25-$50/hour rates. These are developers with proven experience.

And again, these are for business apps, not games. I could see going rates for game development being higher, but I do not know for sure.

I hope this information helps.

250k to get a developer to make an app? Or 250k is the sale price for a proven app?

 

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[Bond]

I have only built "business-type" apps. The smaller ones go for about $50K-$60K. A more elaborated one will go for around $250K.

Care to PM some of those apps?
I'm curious to see the level of complexity required to charge those amounts.
Thanks

 

[andviv]

250k to get a developer to make an app? Or 250k is the sale price for a proven app?

No, I am not talking about 1 developer building an app. I am talking commercial here, where the (usually big) client pays for development.

I am talking about having a company with designers, Q/A-Testing, documentation (trust me, that is needed when you need to make revisions and there is a new developer involved), plus developers.

And again, the price range varies a lot, I am seeing most things fall in the $50K, but have seen a few in the $250K range.

 

[Mike39]

No, I am not talking about 1 developer building an app. I am talking commercial here, where the (usually big) client pays for development.

I am talking about having a company with designers, Q/A-Testing, documentation (trust me, that is needed when you need to make revisions and there is a new developer involved), plus developers.

And again, the price range varies a lot, I am seeing most things fall in the $50K, but have seen a few in the $250K range.

Hey if you wouldn't mind sending me a PM with the names off the apps you have designed, I would love to take a look at them!! Also, it sounds like you have had some experience in the app world and would love to hear about any lessons you have learned and any success or failures you have had in this industry!

Hope to hear from you, Thanks,
-Mike

 

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[kawasakirider]

Hey if you wouldn't mind sending me a PM with the names off the apps you have designed, I would love to take a look at them!! Also, it sounds like you have had some experience in the app world and would love to hear about any lessons you have learned and any success or failures you have had in this industry!

Hope to hear from you, Thanks,
-Mike

+1


I know these questions are basically a "how long is a piece of string" sort of thing, but how much do you think it would cost to develop an app that is similar to the FB app?

I don't want anything that is exactly like FB, but the level of depth that the FB app has would be what I'm after, plus a bit more refinement on the search function side of things.

I have pitched the idea to someone and they are prepared to fund the outsourcing for a share of the profits, I'm happy to allow that to happen...

If I wanted an app that will eventually be as large as FB, what do I have to research in regards to databases that are large enough to accommodate something of that scale?

I assume that it would be possible to launch an app like this, and once it grew, options like databases to handle the amount of info and traffic could then be employed?

Sorry for all the questions, it's just that the ball is rolling on this at the moment. If I knew where to start reading, it would be a great help.

 

[andviv]

About the facebook-like app, I would guess the cost is around $400K. But, this is just my wild guess without looking into all the features.

Also, remember, you are usually talking about building apps for multiple platforms.

Apple is more strict about what apps they accept into their store. Android? You can put a virus up there in no time, and they won't care.

I am not sure how will Windows handle their store, I am not done with the first app we are putting out there soon.

I am not sure what your idea is, but you need to keep in mind the value probably won't be in the mobile app.

The value is the back-end.

You will need servers that provide the data. You will need some sort of API or Web Service to enable the data to go back and forth between the device and the servers.

About DB technology, Facebook and other big services like that use distributed databases like Mongo DB, Cassandra, Hadoop.

I guess you won't need anything like that at the beginning, so without knowing what you have in mind, I'd venture that MySQL or MS SQL Server will suffice. When the need arises then you will have to switch to a more scalable database.

*******************************

About cost for big apps, look at this:

Microsoft is said to be paying developers anywhere between $60,000 and $600,000 to create apps, presumably for well-known or rising brands, to shore up its app catalog.

http://mashable.com/2012/04/06/windows-phone-apps-microsoft-incentives/

I can tell you, these are not silly, simple, small apps.

 

[kawasakirider]

About the facebook-like app, I would guess the cost is around $400K. But, this is just my wild guess without looking into all the features.

Also, remember, you are usually talking about building apps for multiple platforms.

Apple is more strict about what apps they accept into their store. Android? You can put a virus up there in no time, and they won't care.

I am not sure how will Windows handle their store, I am not done with the first app we are putting out there soon.

I am not sure what your idea is, but you need to keep in mind the value probably won't be in the mobile app.

The value is the back-end.

You will need servers that provide the data. You will need some sort of API or Web Service to enable the data to go back and forth between the device and the servers.

About DB technology, Facebook and other big services like that use distributed databases like Mongo DB, Cassandra, Hadoop.

I guess you won't need anything like that at the beginning, so without knowing what you have in mind, I'd venture that MySQL or MS SQL Server will suffice. When the need arises then you will have to switch to a more scalable database.

*******************************

About cost for big apps, look at this:


http://mashable.com/2012/04/06/windows-phone-apps-microsoft-incentives/

I can tell you, these are not silly, simple, small apps.

Jee, that's a lot of start up cash. So there's no way an app that allows social networking would be doable for a cheaper price? At the moment I only want it available on iDevices, for cost factors. It wouldn't be as large as FB, but it would have to have the ability to connect everyone that had an iDevice with the app installed with each other.

400k is way out of my price range.

 

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[andviv]

So there's no way an app that allows social networking would be doable for a cheaper price?

Sure there are ways.

But again, you need to define what features you need to get started.

A good idea is to create a mock up/wire frame of your concept, so you get a clear perspective of what you will actually do, and will be able to get an accurate estimate for your work. Take a look at these:

Wireframing tool for professionals - WireframeSketcher

iui - Web UI Framework for mobile devices - iOS, Android, Palm, and others - Google Project Hosting

WebApp.Net

 

[andviv]

About cost for big apps, look at this:

Microsoft is said to be paying developers anywhere between $60,000 and $600,000 to create apps, presumably for well-known or rising brands, to shore up its app catalog.
http://mashable.com/2012/04/06/windo...ft-incentives/

This is the source for that information about cost:

http://www.nytimes.com/2012/04/06/t...lds-its-checkbook.html?_r=2&hp&pagewanted=all

When Microsoft offered to underwrite a Windows Phone version of Foursquare, the mobile social network, Holger Luedorf, Foursquare’s head of business development, did not hesitate to say yes.

“We have very limited resources, and we have to put them toward the platforms with the biggest bang for our buck,” he said. “But we are a social network and it is incredibly important for us to be available on every platform.”

Foursquare has in-house engineers working on iPhone, Android and BlackBerry versions of its service. But had Microsoft not offered to pay an outside company to do the work, Mr. Luedorf said Foursquare would “probably not” have developed an app for Windows Phone.

In the same article:

It is even going so far as to finance the development of Windows Phone versions of well-known apps — something that app makers estimate would otherwise cost them anywhere from $60,000 to $600,000, depending on the complexity of the app.

 

[healthstatus]

I wish they would pay me $60,000 to port my app. If you pay $100/hour that is 600 hours of development time, I pay about $12/hour, so I would get almost 3 man years of development time for those $$$ and that is the low end.

 

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[andviv]

I pay about $12/hour

That is a great rate. Is this the rate you pay for mobile applications?

How is it working for you?

Care to share some of their apps? (not necessarily yours, just others they have built, to get an idea of what can be done).

I'd love to lower my expenses when building these apps. These days good mobile app developers are in high demand.

 

[healthstatus]

HealthStatus iPhone application

works for me

 

[andviv]

Pretty cool app. Thanks for sharing. And Rep++ for having the app out there.

 

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[kawasakirider]

HealthStatus iPhone application

works for me

That's a fantastic app, it covers so much stuff in a concise manner, you should really be proud of it. Do you mind me asking how successful you've been with it?