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OFF-TOPIC Why isn't money taught in schools?

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thecoach

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Aug 29, 2007
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Everyone talks about it, how people get taught to get jobs, and never get taught any of the simple concepts about money. Anyone know why? Any reason that it's never been incorporated into the school system? I was thinking of a way of educating young people about money and started wondering why it's never been taught in schools...everyone knows it's a problem, but has anyone tried to provide a solution for it?
 

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ErikV10

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Aug 2, 2007
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I think the concepts of money aren't taught in school because they just don't know how it works. If they did, there wouldn't be any teachers or they wouldn't be making less than $50K/year.

The solution for it really depends on the child or the parents. There are just some kids who are very interested in business, and since they are interested, they find a way to learn through books and through people who have "been there, done that".

I educate myself mostly by reading books and forums.
 

djs13

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Well money is actually taught in school, but on an elective basis. I take a full year business ownership class (I'm a high school junior) and I don't mind it. The teacher worked in corporate america for twenty years or so, which isn't business ownership but she is far more educated about entrepreneurship than probably any other teacher in my school. We do focus alot on marketing and retail. We haven't at all touched e-commerce or interenet businesses or even real estate which I enjoy. Most of the info I take in is about starting a "mom and pop" type brick and mortar store selling sport goods and such.

There are other classes like personal money management but most of those classes the teachers are history teachers or math teachers just teaching another elective and you basically just screw around each period with movies.

I do agree that if any teacher who actually was teaching us true business strategies would most likely quit being a teacher and become a full-time businessman. Furthermore, any accomplished investor or entrepreneur probably wouldn't want to become a teacher - even if it did educate my generation.

I've been saying this for a while, but the books I've read in the past year have influenced my life more than the past 11 years of schooling and certainly more than this year's business class that I am in. Rich Dad Poor Dad, Think and grow rich, The power of thinking big, Real Estate Riches, Guerilla Marketing and others have all been great tools for me to learn from.

I think students who want to become investors and entrepreneurs are better off doing what I do and read in their spare time and learn about business. Then get through their everyday classes and if possible take a business class or two. That's as much money oriented my school gets - I hope college is different.
 

thecoach

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Aug 29, 2007
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Regina, SK, Canada
Has anyone ever approached the school board about offering a coarse once a semester or something that educates kids on some of the simple concepts of money? Paying youself first? budgeting? How credit works? What is a mutual fund? How to create a financial plan? Just teach kids enough so they are educated enough to know to start early and how to start. It doesn't have to teach them fastlane, just the basics so they don't become homeless when they retire. Make a beginers class and an advanced class that would teach the kids more fastlane ideas.
 

thecoach

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Aug 29, 2007
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Regina, SK, Canada
Why would any accomplished business person want to teach? Why do people coach sports? Some people just like teaching people things.

Are these business classes in junior high offered in all schools in the states? I'm in Canada and I don't recall ever hearing them offered anywhere here.
 

NerdSmasher

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My school has made it mandatory for every student at the high school to take the class Money Management before they are allowed to graduate. Honestly, having taken the class, it's not hard to see why they don't bother teaching it in school... It's the same as all the other classes... actually, worse...

The students sit there and listen as the teacher talks about interest on loans, and credit cards, how to get a mortgage for a house, unions, etc. etc. And they don't pay attention. Every time I talk to someone about the class, they always say "I'm never going to use this." and I just stop talking to them... they are so naive! He even taught us a way to buy a house with zero money, and how he invests in real estate (he owns 4-plex in a large city near a college campus) and people just slept through it... I was the only one paying attention, and even added to what he was teaching, but no one cared.

Kids these days want everything handed to them on a silver platter. They don't work, they don't care... which is why I'm probably moving out of this country when I can. The future work force is terrible, and I'm coming from one of the top rated schools in my state!

Bottom line: Kids = stupid. Society = screwed.:bgh:
 

ErikV10

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Aug 2, 2007
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And then in the future, they will just rely on the government for money. I HATE people like that.. with a 'passion'.

Kids nowadays don't take their time to learn. All they care about is having FUN. FUN = drugs + alcohol :tdown:
 

CVentures1B12

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Oct 18, 2007
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That's as much money oriented my school gets - I hope college is different.

You are in for quite a treat! Go to college, if it is for you. I went, and I would not trade my 4 years there for anything in this world! I grew as a person more than I ever would have in any other environment. I treasure my time there; however, they did not teach me a thing about business. Granted I did not take many Economics classes, but even among my friends that did major in Econ, they are very uneducated (and might I add, skeptical) of the world of business. They have a great background to work with but it was taught in a way to use that to get a JOB and not use that to create systems in order to build businesses. They learn to be Financial Advisors, etc...but as I said NOT a bad thing. Just a different way of presenting the material. College presents many opportunities and was actually the best Networking tool that I ever gained! So it is definitely a great thing, but not necessary to be very successful.

I can't take credit for this quote, but a mentor of mine once said; "In college, they teach you more and more about less and less, until you eventually know everything about nothing."

Keep your mind open, wherever you go after High School. Keep your financial education growing. It is better to be a jack of all trades than a master of one!

The person who I quoted above went to a very prestigious school, an even more prestigious medical school and is a very successful doctor (rather was); he made the move to the FastTrack 10 years ago and has not been back on the slow side since. He is a very successful RE Investor and also a Serial Entrepreneur. He has been there, done that, and he went to college. It is possible both ways. You are ultimately the master of what you decide to do with your life.

Best of luck in your Endeavors!
:fastlane:
 

Runum

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I teach in a school district with over 40% of the students' families economically disadvantaged. I have tried talking about what I do with my coworkers, their eyes glaze over. I have even mentioned that I only have 2-3 more years of teaching left, they yawn. :bgh: Then there are the kids. I have talked with many of my students about their futures. They have no idea of where they are going, they only think about the here and now. I presume they get that from the examples in their lives. When we plan for a class party and request money to buy the kids drinks and snacks many families just don't have the money. However, the parents will have their alcohol and smokes. Also, the kids always have the latest video games and the best shoes. :bgh: There is one other adult in the school that speaks the same financial language I do. We both agree that most of these kids are just a level above the basic survival mode. The kids nor their parents can understand investing as we know it. What a waste.:smxE:
 

CarrieW

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I think the concepts of money aren't taught in school because they just don't know how it works. If they did, there wouldn't be any teachers or they wouldn't be making less than $50K/year.


i completely agree!!!
 

Rawr

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People I admire are the ones willing to take time out of their lives to teach others - I had two teachers in my Entrepreneurship class who got paid $900 each to teach a semester for our class.

Their parking fines for that semester were close to $1,000.

God bless those guys.

I have some input as a current finance and international finance student - I am more and more getting pushed towards the JOB of "financial adviser" Honestly, that job has about as much appeal as watching grass grow, a smart man once told me "Try to be the person who does things, not the person who manages money for the person who does things"
It seems that I chose those degrees to have a basic understanding of how money works and what's going on in the world of finances. But now I am stuck since I don't particularly imagine any exciting jobs out there. (Investment banker is NOT exciting from what I gathered :( )
 

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camski

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Jul 24, 2007
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The students sit there and listen as the teacher talks about interest on loans, and credit cards, how to get a mortgage for a house, unions, etc. etc. And they don't pay attention. Every time I talk to someone about the class, they always say "I'm never going to use this."

Quite possibly one of the saddest things I have read here.
 
T

TheGreatBear

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My school has made it mandatory for every student at the high school to take the class Money Management before they are allowed to graduate. Honestly, having taken the class, it's not hard to see why they don't bother teaching it in school... It's the same as all the other classes... actually, worse...

The students sit there and listen as the teacher talks about interest on loans, and credit cards, how to get a mortgage for a house, unions, etc. etc. And they don't pay attention. Every time I talk to someone about the class, they always say "I'm never going to use this." and I just stop talking to them... they are so naive! He even taught us a way to buy a house with zero money, and how he invests in real estate (he owns 4-plex in a large city near a college campus) and people just slept through it... I was the only one paying attention, and even added to what he was teaching, but no one cared.

Kids these days want everything handed to them on a silver platter. They don't work, they don't care... which is why I'm probably moving out of this country when I can. The future work force is terrible, and I'm coming from one of the top rated schools in my state!

Bottom line: Kids = stupid. Society = screwed.:bgh:

I dunno, I bet you'd get the same result if you taught it in China or Japan or Singapore or Switzerland...
Besides, if everyone was buying 4-plexes, who'd be living in them :D.
 

Diane Kennedy

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Aug 31, 2007
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I think the concepts of money aren't taught in school because they just don't know how it works. If they did, there wouldn't be any teachers or they wouldn't be making less than $50K/year.

Amen!

Although there are a few exception, by and large the teachers I have met teach that you must go to college and get a secure job. They don't teach business and money skills (or even give credit to them) because they don't possess them personally.
 

J P D

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Nov 6, 2007
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Chicago, Il
School is not intended to teach someone how to manage their lives independently but rather to be dependant and conform to a future corporate life that awaits them. I was reading an article a few years back that was talking about the purpose of having kids switch class rooms for every subject at the sound of a bell. It would make more sense for the teacher to switch rooms but it is set up to train kids to follow orders and prepare for life in corporate America at a young age.
If schools actually taught kids the skills they would need to get ahead then who would go work a 9-5 office job for little pay when they would have the skills needed to start and manage their own company? I have friends my age that know nothing about investing what little money they make, they don't even know how to balance a check book or file taxes. I know those things because I sought the information on my own, I didn't wait for some teacher to decide it was time for me to learn it.
People like us on this forum are the minority that goes out after what we want on our own. Most people seem to think it is the schools job to teach them and the governments job to take care of them.
camski also made a good point on this subject, there is more than meets the eye, and the education leaders have many other objectives and political obligations than most realize and most of the time the kids best interest is not priority.

I do however feel different about seeking higher education in a particular field like medical or engineering where you recieve specialized information that you are going to use to save my life or build my home. But as far as general high school and college education goes, its just getting you ready to go be another loan officer with a 45 minute lunch break at noon. have fun, not for me.
 

kimberland

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Jul 25, 2007
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Amen!

Although there are a few exception, by and large the teachers I have met teach that you must go to college and get a secure job. They don't teach business and money skills (or even give credit to them) because they don't possess them personally.

Yep, have you ever talked to teachers about financial planning?

First, in Canada, most of them have a defined benefit pension.
If I hear from another teacher that retirement savings aren't necessary...

Second, most of them have job security and very strong unions.

And third, they're average people with average financial knowledge.

I prefer mentoring (after school classes) rather than mandatory classroom stuff.
If you have limited skilled teachers,
teach the kids that want to be taught first.
 

thecoach

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Aug 29, 2007
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Regina, SK, Canada
In my business, I've talked to teachers and you are right, they really don't have a clue, they think they have a safe and secure job, but most of them don't realize that employees of 7-11 actually have a better benefits package than they do (teachers benefits aren't terrible, but 7-11 benefits are pretty good if you look at them, in my province anyway).

What about creating a course that would be like a lunch and learn type course. The students spend every second day or even once a week during lunch at this class and at the end of the year they earn a credit for it. Have someone from the business or financial industry come in help create the course and teach it. Not nessesarily a high level business course, but just the basics. Maybe 1 in 10 of the kids are going to have enough balls or have the aptitude to go into business on their own, so why not just teach the simple stuff that would apply to business and/or personal life, like budgeting, properly using credit and OPM, ways to reduce your monthly expenses (IE bank service charges, etc). Make it more of a practical hands on thing with some little check point exams for some of the material. Kind of a combination of the mentoring and the 'manditory classroom stuff'.
 

andviv

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This is one of those topics I don't like to discuss that much, especially in the General Business section of the forum. I am seriously considering moving this thread to the Off-topic Discussion as usually nothing positive comes from these discussions.

From a business perspective I agree, there is a HUGE opportunity to fill the void. Go out there and create your financial planing for kids and make millions. I remember reading that Robert Kiyosaki's ideas were being implemented in some schools in Maricopa county, AZ, so obviously some have already identified that niche and are going after it. If that is the intention with this thread then fine, it should remain here in the Business Section. Otherwise I think it should moved to the Off-Topic area.

What do you guys think?
 

AroundTheWorld

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Ya, I would probably agree we should move it to off topic - as people like to go off on wild detours ... just like I am about to do.

I've read a lot about the history of American education. It's been a few years and all the details are not fresh in my head, but here is the *basically* what I remember. Please read with a grain of salt.

The public education system was origionally set up ... it was actually origionally the mission of the public education.... to produce factory workers. It was really a dumbing-us-down system. What was "best" for America was to produce an American work force - not to produce business owners and investors.

The public education system - because of the animal it is is very slow (and difficult) to change. When you combine the beginning with the difficulty to change, teaching money in schools is going to be very slow in coming.
 

thecoach

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Aug 29, 2007
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Regina, SK, Canada
I wasn't really sure if it would fall under here or off topics, so I just picked this one. If you want to move it, I'm fine with that. I was more just curious if this opportunity is worth looking into in my area to get something set up or if it's been failed before for a reason I might not be able to do anything about (IE: kids just don't give a shit and won't understand the value becuase they aren't experiencing it right away)...
 

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Diane Kennedy

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I think "off topic". It's an important one topic, but doesn't really have anything to do with starting/running a business unless someone is identifying a niche and has an idea on how to fill it.
 

Diane Kennedy

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Aug 31, 2007
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I wasn't really sure if it would fall under here or off topics, so I just picked this one. If you want to move it, I'm fine with that. I was more just curious if this opportunity is worth looking into in my area to get something set up or if it's been failed before for a reason I might not be able to do anything about (IE: kids just don't give a shit and won't understand the value becuase they aren't experiencing it right away)...

I posted right at the same time that this was posted. Now, if thecoach is working on creating a program, that would be awesome.

BTW, Sharon Lechter (co-founder/co-author of Rich Dad series) is VERY active in the school sector. Not to name drop (but I will), I had a long lunch with her this past weekend and she has some really cool programs for kids in the works. But, she's not doing it through curriculum as much as going after the other organizations and parents for support. That helps the kids whose parents are paying attention, which is significant. It still leaves a growing segment of kids whose parents aren't involved much in their lives.
 

thecoach

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Aug 29, 2007
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Regina, SK, Canada
I coached baseball for a long time and people always told me I would be good teacher, but I never really wanted to teach something useless that kids wouldn't use after school and the only practical things I could teach kids were things I had no real interest in (cooking, mechanics, etc). I do seminars now, but they are somewhat biased becuase of the work I do (they more or less lead to plugging products that I sell and don't get into fastlane things). I've worked in the financial industry and am starting to learn more and more about business, so at somepoint when I'm uber rich and spend 4 out of 5 days golfing, I might take up teaching money as a hobby or something...

BTW, Aroundtheworld, I did a google search about the origins of education....there's some pretty interesting articles that talk about what you mentioned. Never knew that before...
 

AroundTheWorld

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Ok, because this is a fun topic for me, I went back to some of my old bookmarks and copied these quotes. These particular quotes came from: http://www.mises.org/web/2689#United.

These top two quotes were from two leaders in the movement toward compulsory education in the mid 1800’s. Third is a quote from that same article. I have placed BOLD on the words I find particulary interesting.

Keep in mind – I am bias. After much research about both public education, education of children in general, and my own experience I decided to homeschool my kids.

“all children will be taught in them ... in these schools the precepts of morality and religion should be inculcated, and habits of subordination and obedience be formed .... The state, in the warmth of her solicitude for their welfare, must take charge of those children, and place them in school where their minds can be enlightened and their hearts can be trained to virtue”

huh? Subordination and obedience? Why did children need that? To be "good employees?"

“It is national, rational, republican education; free for all at the expense of all; conducted under the guardianship of the State, and for the honor, the happiness, the virtue, the salvation of the state.”

huh? Education is not for the honor, happiness, virtue and salvation of the CHILDREN!!!????

“Another educationist declaration on behalf of State authority was made by the influential Josiah Quincy, Mayor of Boston and president of Harvard, who declared in 1848 that every child should be educated to obey authority.”

Again, why is this? To make good little employees for the good of the state.
 

AroundTheWorld

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It's been moved.

Oh... and just for the fun of it, here is one more quote. This was the first mission statement of John D. Rockefeller's General Education Board.


"In our dreams, people yield themselves with perfect docility to our molding hands. The present education conventions of intellectual and character education fade from their minds and unhampered by tradition we work our own good will upon a grateful and responsive folk. We shall not try to make these people or any of their children into men of learning or philosophers, or men of science. We have not to raise up from them authors, educators, poets or men of letters, great artists, painters, musicians, nor lawyers, doctors, statesmen, politicians, creatures of whom we have ample supply. The task is simple. We will organize children and teach them in an perfect way the things their fathers and mothers are doing in an imperfect way".

Ok. I'll climb off my soapbox before I really get going!!!
 

dino23

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Sep 19, 2007
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i personnally believe schools didnt teach money because schools were creating and grooming future employers. all i ever heard in school was you can be a... instead of you can start your own business. dreaming wasn't encouraged. getting that job was more realistic.

you have the old phrase "A" students teach and "B" students work for "C" students. back in the day, the A students would get the good ole jobs and the C students would start in some type of skilled trades. eventually the C students wised up and started to work on their own businesses.

as their businesses started to expand, guess who they hired to do their accounting, marketing and so on. the smart students (A and B) groomed for the work force.

the industrial age encouraged us to go the school and get that good ole job. it promoted job security and not freedom that's associated with ownership.

as the times changes, business ownership was encouraged, thus the boom in startups and entrepreneur education begun.
 

thecoach

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Aug 29, 2007
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Regina, SK, Canada
you have the old phrase "A" students teach and "B" students work for "C" students. back in the day, the A students would get the good ole jobs and the C students would start in some type of skilled trades. eventually the C students wised up and started to work on their own businesses.

Thanks for the motivation! I was a "C" student in high school...hahaha
 

NerdSmasher

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Yes, yes... I do find it fascinating that my school's slogan is "Come to learn. Leave to serve."

It's a good thing I don't much care for what they're teaching... and I'm one of those almost perfect students. Straight A's, in all the advanced classes, blah blah blah, as if it matters. People tell me I'll have no trouble getting a job :)
I tell them I don't plan on going to college (other than what the state pays for while I'm in High School). They laugh, as if it's a joke.
I just smile and nod :)
 

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