trading fast or slow?? need help!

[Peter2]

I am going to be taking a $250 trading account and building it first to $2500 then to $25000 in about 6 months time.

Then you woke up and realised that you had wet your bed. :smxB:

You will have a much easier time trying to pick the winning lottery numbers.

 

[NerdSmasher]

Well... it's always good to learn, and do such things like that, but as you said, that is your IDEAL plan. But, goals like that are much harder to achieve than the books and gurus may lead you to believe.

Starting with $250 really... just probably won't cut it. I started, originally, with $500, and could've done quite well if I was an experienced trader, with the returns I got, but since I wasn't, I lost over $2,000 that I made with that $500, and now that account is worth less than $5 lol.

Now, it is a good idea to start with a small amount, and learn the game, because it is never what you think it will be. You may see the most perfect chart pattern, and buy in at what you think is the bottom, only to see the perfect pattern fail, at which point you have to decide to get out, or stay in and hope it goes your way.

Realistically, especially in Forex (which, I do believe is the slowest changing, and thusly has the lowest returns, unless highly leveraged. But I could be wrong.) returns of 100%+ just don't seem likely, unless you're very highly leveraged. And even then, there would be so much risk, it just doesn't seem worth it. But, that's my opinion, yours may be different.

The returns you're speaking of sound more like great options picks, or penny stocks. And they are achievable! It's just difficult, especially if you haven't ever traded before. And, quite frankly, $25,000 a month is probably a bit far out there. It's possible, but starting with $250, you would have to make a LOT of perfect plays, and that's just unlikely... possible, but unlikely.

To be perfectly honest, if you think it's a good idea, and achievable, then you shouldn't need to ask the board what they think. Realistically, Bill Gates shouldn't have had the success he had, I imagine many people told him it's not going to work, you can't do that, etc. etc. But look at him. It doesn't matter what others think is possible and what isn't, it matters what you think is. And, that you actually DO it.

You may fail, and you may not reach your original goals, but as long as you continue to learn and refine what you do, you will get there eventually, and that's everyone's true goal. No one can say what a truly realistic number is, because it's different for everyone, and some of it can depend on luck.

Just do what you believe is right, and be sure that you can live with your decisions, whichever way the outcome goes. Otherwise, you're just setting yourself up for eventual failure.

 

[CarrieW]

the 250 to 25000 is a different trading style and riskier because i will be in my growth stage. its incremental and with every step up the rules change... its like compound intrest on overdrive....

once i get to 25k my equity managment will change. as will the kinds of trades im making. also untill i get to the 25k level i wont be withdrawing anything from my account. after that i will be this will affect the rate at which i can increase my account size... therefore making the second half of the plan take longer then the first...

i certianly hope to be able to make 250 million trading forex one day... i have to see what happens. I dont want to be trading all day everyday. there is more to life then being tied to a computer screen all day. the money is going to be invested in other things as well as making my familys life better. what good is being able to make 25k a month and not touch it for anything???

for the record I know the difference between mlm and affilate marketing. ive done alot of research into many different things.

its providing the content. I dont feel like doing that at this time... its as simple as that.

ive researched high and low on forex trading information and ive only found one thing worth while thats availble for me to endorce. if i had the time or the energy to do it i would but right now im concentrating on this.

maybe after im successful at it ill feel more comfortable doing it for the public to see but for now im doing this for me.

 

[kurtyordy]

I have always said that true learning starts once you get some skin in the game. Too many people just sit back and read books for ever and NEVER TAKE ACTION! Just like poker, you can read all the books you want, but until you get into a real money game, you do not know anything. Throw the $250 out there, it will be the best and cheapest FOREX MBA that you can get.

 

[piranha526]

ive been studying and researching for this for about 18 months or so... im not setting my goals on what some intro to forex guru is saying. ive done my homework.

Studied what? Fairy tales?

If you have studied at least one reputable trader, you would know that $250 will get you NOWHERE (and fast - especailly with leverage)! Try starting with something closer to $10,000 or $25,000 and then you may a real chance. Maybe!

Listen, I don’t want to be an a** but why do you only have $250? I find it extremely hard to believe anyone in the world can trade successfully with such an awfully low amount. Why can’t you put together a stake larger than $250?

Traders only have a chance when starting with $10,000. They have a statistical edge with $100,000 as long as they know how to trade by implementing a plan that incorporates position sizing and expectancy.

I don't want to argue - just debate reality.

 

[Russ H]

Carrie,

There is a big difference between someone telling you that you can't do something, and a successful investor cautioning you that your goals may be too aggressive.

You are hearing one thing, but many on this thread are saying the other.

We're not trying to beat you up.

We're asking you to look at your goals, and if they are realistic.

If you set unrealistic goals and fail, how do you feel?

If you set small goals and achieve them, how do you feel?

Most of us have gotten to where we are b/c we've started by taking baby steps. It may not be glamorous, but it's a solid way to begin.

You have my best wishes for success.

-Russ H.

 

[CarrieW]

one of the biggest parts of trading forex Ive learned is to know what the people and the markets are likely to do... mostly with currency your trading with literaly the entire world. your trading against huge banks and actual central banks of countires. of course all controlled by people! only about 2-5% of the forex market is retail forex trading...

the reason the leverages can run so high is because in forex it deals in fractions of pennies. and when multiplyed by thousands of dollars the actual risk to your money is relitivly small compared to what the leverage leads one to think...

heres a wiki link. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Foreign_exchange_market

its astonishing whats possible in this unique market.

the more I learn the more facinating it becomes.

 

[Sid23]

So Carrie, have you begun trading yet?

People are not being negative, it's just that you have nothing to show for anything, other than your study (which I applaud by the way).

But there are a lot of people out there who know a LOT about things (i.e. professors) who don't have a pot to piss in.

Stop debating with everyone here whether FOREX works or not.

GO OUT AND PROVE THAT IT DOES!

Fastlaners are concerned with results, not talk.

Focus on making that first $25k in 6 months, then come back and post that check, then we'll all help you figure out how high to shoot from there.

The proof is in the pudding...

 

[CarrieW]

so this is my ideal plan. i am trying to figure out if its doable in the time frame im thinking. I have been studying alot and belive i can do this. I may have to readjust some things depending on how fast I can actually get in profit...(is readjusting goals still fast lane?)

I am going to be taking a $250 trading account and building it first to $2500 then to $25000 in about 6 months time...after this i get stuck...

I am having a hard time figuring out what monitary goals to shoot for here with this.

after hitting 25k mark(hubby quits we live off 4k a month)and I build it to 100k.

in about 1-2 yrs time i want to be able to produce 25k a month in income at minimum from trading with that size account. Hopefully more. then we either leave it in the trading account to produce higher returns(me still activly trading) and use the excess to invest into income producing rei, id also love to start trading stocks. (when i grow up i want a fun portfolio like kimber!)

the first goal in passive income is 5k a month. then 10k then 25k ect to infinity...

My husband says after we are able for him to stop working he wants me to teach him how to forex trade... Im thinking thats not the best idea. wouldnt it be better for him to learn how to do something different to make money? to have multiple streams going?

is active trading(and i mean being a kick a$$ trader) a fast lane idea or slow lane???

to me its fast lane, well at least what i expect to gain from it is(too much money to know what to do with!) just wondering what everyone elses thoughts are on this...

 

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[CarrieW]

UM no.

I didnt realize that the lottery was a skill involved past time. ive actually been studying the skills i need to do that.

so instead of trying to become a sucessful forex trader youd rather me go and spend my 250 bucks on the lottery???

 

[Peter2]

If you can multipy your money at the speed you suggest, you would be richer than Bill Gates in just a little over 2 years.

You have to set realistic goals.

 

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[CarrieW]

then help me set some. that was part of the purpose for this thread...

i honestly dont know if i can acheive what i set forth in my first post in the time frame i alloted. it seems with 200:1 or 400:1 leverage its totally possible.(if you know what your doing) not that i will be trading at that...

all i know is im gonna try like hell!

 

[CarrieW]

ive been studying and researching for this for about 18 months or so... im not setting my goals on what some intro to forex guru is saying. ive done my homework.

what i could really use is the formula to figure out what i can expect for the roi i am expecting to gain. then and only then can i come up with a realistic goal...

this is the ideal. once i plug the numbers i will know better the time frame in which i can acheive it.

the 25k a month is only after i become very seasoned and have a large enough trading account like 100k size or larger.

the reason i have decided on forex is the ability to make money with a little. i can not work to gain money to invest and this is really the best way ive found to try to accomplish what i want to do.

some of the rules i have in place is to only work in my demo account with the money i have to spend in real life. sure i could probably do really well with a 100k trading demo account but without having that to really trade with its not going to do me any good. i need to learn how to manage and trade exactly how i will be when im trading live. then i have to be in profit and building my account size for 2 months before i switch to real cash.

as i said i have done alot of homework and research on stratigies and money managment. and before i start to trade I will have a business plan for trading. and clear goals and time frames.

i just wanted to know if it was considered fast track or not. 90% of people who try to trade forex fail. most people who havent tried it dont understand it. and most people who have tried and failed wont have a great opinion about it.

im not going to give up on this. even if some feel id be better off buying lottery tickets...

 

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[CRBFL]

i can not work to gain money to invest and this is really the best way ive found to try to accomplish what i want to do.

I find this hard to believe, given that you have internet access. You can definitely do some capital raising for free via the internet.

 

[CarrieW]

i could make some money off the internet if i tried eventually. ive researched into that also. maybe one day i will.

forex is what my passion is for. i didnt jump into it and blow money i took my time and did the research and i really believe i have a shot at it. there is no reason i cant do it.

i have bad credit. i cant work. so i only have income from social security. i need cash to invest with and my dreams are big...

i have nothing but time on my hands to do this. it only requires a tiny bit of money and i can gain enourmous amounts with the leverage thats available to me. with good money managment there is no reason for me to fail.

i honestly expected way more from this board then the reactions i get from my mother... i have to say i am very dissappointed...

 

[CRBFL]

i honestly expected way more from this board then the reactions i get from my mother... i have to say i am very dissappointed...

Sorry if we disappointed. No one is saying it can't be done, just trying to put things in perspective.

I think you can do extremely well with your plan, it's just that if you were going off of your plan:

Month One- $250
Month Six- $25000
Month Twelve- $2500000

By all means, shoot for the stars. I wish for nothing more than for you to come in here Nov 18, 2008 with a bank statement that says, "F*ck you doubters!"

If you have 18 months of forex knowledge under your belt, I would say start a blog/website built around that knowledge. Once you have some readership move on to push some affiliate marketing offers for forex. I've found plenty that pay out in the range of $20-$3X per sale that you get. That would build your capital nicely.

Even if you just space it out a two or 3 year time frame your plan would still be Fastlane in my mind. Hell, $250 to $2.5 mil in 3 years- I'd buy your book.

 

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[CarrieW]

Sorry if we disappointed. No one is saying it can't be done, just trying to put things in perspective.

I think you can do extremely well with your plan, it's just that if you were going off of your plan:

Month One- $250
Month Six- $25000
Month Twelve- $2500000

By all means, shoot for the stars. I wish for nothing more than for you to come in here Nov 18, 2008 with a bank statement that says, "F*ck you doubters!"

If you have 18 months of forex knowledge under your belt, I would say start a blog/website built around that knowledge. Once you have some readership move on to push some affiliate marketing offers for forex. I've found plenty that pay out in the range of $20-$3X per sale that you get. That would build your capital nicely.

Even if you just space it out a two or 3 year time frame your plan would still be Fastlane in my mind. Hell, $250 to $2.5 mil in 3 years- I'd buy your book.

first i never said id have that much money in 1 year. i think you need to reread my post. it may take me several months of demo trading to get into a comfortable place and consistantly making money before I can trade with real money...

second i have 18 months of research not trading, i have nothing to prove i know what i think i know yet... it was suggested to me that i pimp my information while back. i dont feel comfortable doing that. most people who trade forex fail. most people dont have 18+ months of time to think about, research, and read about it to learn what to do before they start.

most of those things that affilate programs offer are a bunch of crap...

third
whats wrong with me wanting to build my capital, knowledge and experience at the same time???

 

[CRBFL]

first i never said id have that much money in 1 year. i think you need to reread my post. it may take me several months of demo trading to get into a comfortable place and consistantly making money before I can trade with real money...

second i have 18 months of research not trading, i have nothing to prove i know what i think i know yet... it was suggested to me that i pimp my information while back. i dont feel comfortable doing that. most people who trade forex fail. most people dont have 18+ months of time to think about, research, and read about it to learn what to do before they start.

most of those things that affilate programs offer are a bunch of crap...

third
whats wrong with me wanting to build my capital, knowledge and experience at the same time???

RE to first: " I am going to be taking a $250 trading account and building it first to $2500 then to $25000 in about 6 months time."

If you could do this in 6 months, why wouldn't you just scale and replicate? That's what I based my figure off.

RE to second: "ive been studying and researching for this for about 18 months or so... im not setting my goals on what some intro to forex guru is saying. ive done my homework."

I didn't say trading when I spoke of this, I said knowledge. Whether it's first or second hand. It's knowledge non the less. You don't have to pimp your knowledge. You can just document your experiences, lessons learned, wins, losses, whatever... Get good content and you will get readers. Consistent readers will drive traffic, traffic gives you options to monetize. Some of the contextual ads relating to stocks/forex on my blog give me $1-$2 per click. Just think in terms of scaling up and exponential growth.

As far as the whole affiliate thing goes. Maybe you're thinking of MLM instead of affiliate marketing. While the informational products in the affiliate marketing world aren't always the greatest, that's not your issue. People need to be responsible for their own finances and purchases, if you could make $20 a pop without endorsing, just advertising- why not.

If you're talking about affiliate marketing not being a viable source of income, well that's a whole different threat entirely.

RE to third: " whats wrong with me wanting to build my capital, knowledge and experience at the same time???"

Nothing, that's what I'm encouraging and giving you suggestions and options for.

 

[AroundTheWorld]

i just wanted to know if it was considered fast track or not. ...

Does it matter? If you have studied this for 18+ months you clearly have a focus on it and you have decided to do it. Who cares if it is or not? It is a step in the direction you have set out for yourself.

You have made a plan to improve your financial life by trading Forex. Don't get bogged down by whether or not it is fast lane. For that matter - don't get bogged down with the distant future. Take your $250 and do it. Maybe you will make some money. Maybe you will lose all your money - but atleast you made a plan and took action on it.

BTW - give the forum a chance. Read, read, read. We are all changing and learning and growing and sometimes it comes in the form of tough love.

 

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[Rawr]

so this is my ideal plan. i am trying to figure out if its doable in the time frame im thinking. I have been studying alot and belive i can do this. I may have to readjust some things depending on how fast I can actually get in profit...(is readjusting goals still fast lane?)

Have you traded before?

I am going to be taking a $250 trading account and building it first to $2500 then to $25000 in about 6 months time...after this i get stuck...

Once again, have you actually traded before? It is very easy to record say 10% in April and say - "hey, I am going to quit my job and just make 10% every month for the rest of the year.. it's going to be easy!" Well if it was, everyone would be making predictions like you here and rolling in Bugattis.

The only problem is - the market goes up and it goes down. A lot. Your profits can and will be eaten and may be erased depending on how big of a mistake you make and how greedy you are - and it seems you are very very greedy. (this is not an insult so do not take it as one)

I am having a hard time figuring out what monitary goals to shoot for here with this.

after hitting 25k mark(hubby quits we live off 4k a month)and I build it to 100k.

in about 1-2 yrs time i want to be able to produce 25k a month in income at minimum from trading with that size account. Hopefully more. then we either leave it in the trading account to produce higher returns(me still activly trading) and use the excess to invest into income producing rei, id also love to start trading stocks. (when i grow up i want a fun portfolio like kimber!)

And I want my stock - that just dropped 30% in a week to shoot up 1500% so I can buy myself a mansion and sip fruity drinks. Wanting and being level headed are two different things.

One thing is for sure - you will not take any money out of your account. I mean why would you - if you can continuously record profits, why not put all your money in the market and make more money? That's what any reasonable person would do. (and that's how you can lose your a$$ too if you are wrong)

the first goal in passive income is 5k a month. then 10k then 25k ect to infinity...

Let us know when you get to infinity dollars. I want to see what that looks like on a bank statement.

My husband says after we are able for him to stop working he wants me to teach him how to forex trade... Im thinking thats not the best idea. wouldnt it be better for him to learn how to do something different to make money? to have multiple streams going?

I also think this is not a good idea until one of you actually knows how to trade and has vast experience to teach the other. Do not quit your jobs.

is active trading(and i mean being a kick a$$ trader) a fast lane idea or slow lane???

??? what is the point? If we tell you it is slow will you not do it? Who cares what is slow and what is fast if you are making INFINITY dollars within few years?

to me its fast lane, well at least what i expect to gain from it is(too much money to know what to do with!) just wondering what everyone elses thoughts are on this...

I wish you good luck. Forex to me is even trickier than Stocks, if you are the next Soros, please remember us

 

[CRBFL]

the 250 to 25000 is a different trading style and riskier because i will be in my growth stage. its incremental and with every step up the rules change... its like compound intrest on overdrive....

once i get to 25k my equity managment will change. as will the kinds of trades im making. also untill i get to the 25k level i wont be withdrawing anything from my account. after that i will be this will affect the rate at which i can increase my account size... therefore making the second half of the plan take longer then the first...

i certianly hope to be able to make 250 million trading forex one day... i have to see what happens. I dont want to be trading all day everyday. there is more to life then being tied to a computer screen all day. the money is going to be invested in other things as well as making my familys life better. what good is being able to make 25k a month and not touch it for anything???

for the record I know the difference between mlm and affilate marketing. ive done alot of research into many different things.

its providing the content. I dont feel like doing that at this time... its as simple as that.

ive researched high and low on forex trading information and ive only found one thing worth while thats availble for me to endorce. if i had the time or the energy to do it i would but right now im concentrating on this.

maybe after im successful at it ill feel more comfortable doing it for the public to see but for now im doing this for me.

Good responses, that's what it's about. Learn, plan, execute, analyze, new plan, execute again. You might have been disappointed in the forum for your entrance, but I think you'll learn to tolerate us

Rep + for being so motivated. Don't loose that. Like I said, I wish nothing more than for you to make a new thread in a year about how to invest something with 5 or 6 zeros.

 

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[Jonleehacker]

I salute you for having a big dream, but starting with a 250 account is going to put the probability of success very low.

Consider just the transaction costs. It costs me 10 a trade, which means you're going to have a guaranteed penalty of 8% just to execute a buy and sell!

Then consider that you won't be buying full lots (if you trade stocks, not sure what it's like in forex, but I'm sure there a minimum contract sizes) which also costs a premium.

Some of the best trading systems ever developed, can encounter 10 or more losses in a row before hitting a winner, if you are under capitalized and cannot ride out a losing streak, then you would likely go broke before even getting a chance to uncover that home run which could take you from 250 to 2500 or more.

If you pull it off, you'll likely be richer than Bill Gates just on the book sales

 

[CarrieW]

its non commission trading no transaction costs like in stocks. the only way the brokers make money is thru the spread. which if you dont think your going to beat the spread and then some you dont trade...

mini forex accounts trade in 10k lot sizes where in a real account its 100k lot sizes. you can trade any size lot you like even partial lots. you can trade any amount of money you chose at any one trade...there is no penalty to trade mini or partial lots. you get whatever % you should get in porportion to the trade size.

in the first growth phase of my plan i will be risking up to 5% of my capital per trade. after the growth phase is complete i will only be risking 2% per trade at most. it would take ALOT of losing trades at 2% equity to wipe me out...

if you have good equity managment skills you can ride out quite a few bad trades before it seriously affects your trading account.

if your using a system where you fail 10 times in a row you should reevaulate your system or stop trading... part of the process is getting into profit. once i know what im doing i seriously doubt ill have 10 losing trades in a row. maybe 2 or 3. but 10? i would need to go over the stratgey to find out where im going wrong and go back to demo trading till i figured out and corrected my mistakes...

the whole point is to win more then you lose.(hopefully way more!) with proper money managment and following the rules theres no reason i cant be sucessful.

i really am liking this idea of being richer then bill gates!

eta: micro mini lots are about 1k lot sizes depending on the currency.

 

[CarrieW]

I know starting out with 250bucks is quite low. i dont have the available cash to fund a real account of say 25k or mroe to play in. the only way i can do this is to build what i have up to a decent enough level that im makeing halfway decent money per trade.

if i cant build up 250 to 2500 and 25000 then i wouldnt do any better with more money... its all about learning the game and trying to make a sucess out of it with a little to start with... the knowledge alone i will learn even if i lost every dime to me will be well worth it!

im not planning on losing the money. as i said before with proper money managment and diciplined trading i shouldnt have to...

 

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[DustinS]

The 250$ would be better spent on books in my opinion.

 

[kurtyordy]

Why would $250 be better spent on books? Clearly she has already researched this. Maybe her goals are a little lofty, but that is not unusual for a beginner. If the trading platform will allow her to start with $250, then I say go for it. Why not risk it? It is only $250. Most of us waste more than that a month.

 

[CarrieW]

thanks kurt!

yes ive already spent 250 or more on books and stratigies. I am at the point now of just reading a few things for perspective and not to learn anymore... the next phase in my learning is to start trading and putting into practice all ive absorbed up till now.

 

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[DustinS]

Do you actually trade? I've read quite a few books on options and stocks and it has helped me tremendously in the market (up 35% at this moment). Jumping in and waisting your capital which I'm assuming you don't have much to start with if you can only manage 250$ is going to get you no where.

There is a difference between being supportive and being at least semi realistic. I'd love for this lady get a 10000% return, but the odds of that happening are as Peter stated as good as winning the lottery.

 

[CarrieW]

theres a big difference between being semi realistic and rude...(not saying you were)

If I was about to waste my capital i would have opened an account 18months ago and blew it. I wouldnt be in the final stages of months and months of research and planning before I start.

as i stated in a pp the part of the plan to go from a small amount to a decent sized account is different then how i will be trading normally. Its a risky agressive part of the plan. (also the decent real brokers are only available to you when you have 7-25 thousand bucks)

If i can sucessfully do that Imagine what i will be able to accomplish! I havent even ventured to guess what my ultimate return will end up being. I dont want to limit myself!

God willing I am very good at it and manage to get decent returns on a regular basis...filter it out of forex and into building some businesses and other passive investments while I continue to trade and create more money!

Honestly I expected so much more support here.

 

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[1320Trader]

If it were me I would focus on capital preservation for the first 6-12 months. First you have to learn how to not lose money....then profit and scale up as your win% and confidence increase. To me trading isn't about knowing what stock/currency/etc. is gonna go up or down. The game is about discipline, control, money and trade management. So I think you should focus on yourself as a trader and not the money you make.