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The Worldwide C0VlD-19 Coronavirus Pandemic Discussion Thread...

G

GuestUser4aMPs1

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Today's food for thought.

We've been under lockdown for over 3 weeks. In the meantime I've been moderating a group of ~400 people in our locale about this crisis, and the fear is palpable. The penalties for violating the Executive Orders are up to a $5k fine and/or 6 months jailtime.

Among one of the ridiculous provisions in the EO is people can't even walk their dogs or exersize in solitude, while maintaining a safe and responsible 6 foot distance. There are some people suing the Puerto Rican government calling some of the provisions unconstitutional.

Something isn't quite right.

I believe in individual responsibility and precaution, both to do what's necessary for individuals to prevent spreading the disease, and for individuals to make their own choice to protect themselves. I also believe in some (but not all) of the government-mandated provisions happening around the world (mainly to keep idiots from being idiots). I think the real answer lies somewhere in between.

But legislating ourselves into total lockdown has made me realize that for most people, their liberty isn't worth more than a $5k fine and 6 months jailtime, and is worth less than a $1200 stimulus check.

That, is the scary part.
 
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Kak

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Among one of the ridiculous provisions in the EO is people can't even walk their dogs or exersize in solitude, while maintaining a safe and responsible 6 foot distance. There are some people suing the Puerto Rican government calling some of the provisions unconstitutional.

There were also reports of roping off “non-essential” areas of essential businesses here. That is unapologetic tyranny for tyranny’s sake.
 

EVMaso

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Well, I went and watched the movie Contagion, just because it's the movie everyone's talking about right now. Lots of parallels to our current real-life situation, though spiced up a bit for entertainment. I'm just glad that C0VlD-19 dosn't have the mortality rate of Ebola.

As grim as this sounds, after this experience, I think the world will be better prepared for when a disease that can spread as easily as C0VlD-19 but with a higher mortality rate appears.

View: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4sYSyuuLk5g
 

SteveO

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There were also reports of roping off “non-essential” areas of essential businesses here. That is unapologetic tyranny for tyranny’s sake.
You mean like this? We have all kinds of rules. One person per cart, no sitting in the clubhouse, no scoring as a group, etc. But we are open for play.20200405_133748.jpg20200405_133803.jpg20200405_133735.jpg
 
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James Klymus

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I would rather take the risk of dying than being locked up in my house for god knows how long.''

Most people are so damn scared of getting sick or dying that they literally are just laying in bed at home for weeks.

Found an interesting update, We may already be at the peak:


I, like many others including family members, had a particularly bad illness around Christmas time which resulted in an absolutely awful cough (multiple spastic attacks where I almost threw up) that persisted nearly 2 months, until nearly March.

I wish the government could create a task force of researchers to figure this out, instead of listening to a few "experts" who grossly overestimated the potential death toll of this virus at 2 million Americans.

The longer we're "locked down" here in America, the more people will become pissed off, because it seems to me that some people are falling off of the "flatten the curve" virtue signaling band wagon.

Probably because after a month and a half plus of no income, and their savings (if any) being drained, they are starting to question the sustainability of this crap.

Also, walmart and target are starting to meter the number of people allowed in the store at one time. Seeing people lined up outside of a walmart waiting to go in (when it's not black friday), worryingly resembles a breadline.
 

Kak

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Most people are so damn scared of getting sick or dying that they literally are just laying in bed at home for weeks.

Found an interesting update, We may already be at the peak:


I, like many others including family members, had a particularly bad illness around Christmas time which resulted in an absolutely awful cough (multiple spastic attacks where I almost threw up) that persisted nearly 2 months, until nearly March.

I wish the government could create a task force of researchers to figure this out, instead of listening to a few "experts" who grossly overestimated the potential death toll of this virus at 2 million Americans.

The longer we're "locked down" here in America, the more people will become pissed off, because it seems to me that some people are falling off of the "flatten the curve" virtue signaling band wagon.

Probably because after a month and a half plus of no income, and their savings (if any) being drained, they are starting to question the sustainability of this crap.

Also, walmart and target are starting to meter the number of people allowed in the store at one time. Seeing people lined up outside of a walmart waiting to go in (when it's not black friday), worryingly resembles a breadline.

The problem with these lockdowns is the sustainability. More people are going to perish of violence and civil unrest if this goes on until no-one on earth has the virus.

I would be 100% for a lockdown, if it actually gave the virus a total knockout, but it just simply won't. It would honestly seem less tyrannical if it was as effective at destroying the virus as it is the business world.
 

James Klymus

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The problem with these lockdowns is the sustainability. More people are going to perish of violence and civil unrest if this goes on until no-one on earth has the virus.

Go check out the article I posted if you havent already. This woman, and mother of 4, cant even get her regular monitoring for a possible malignant tumor on her liver, because her condition is considered "elective"
 
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James Klymus

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Also, New York city, one of the hardest hit areas in the US, is not currently seeing an exponential growth in cases and deaths. According to the latest data, the number of cases, hospitalizations, and deaths is on a downward trend.

https://www1.nyc.gov/site/doh/covid/C0VlD-19-data.page
 

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MTF

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Classy move on the US part. Desperate times call for desperate measures but still, robbing a small country of their PAID FOR and DONATED ventilators?

I know that this is a very local thing and a minor piece of news, but I consider it appalling.

Correction:


Glad to hear that they haven't reached such desperation.
 
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Rivoli

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Classy move on the US part. Desperate times call for desperate measures but still, robbing a small country of their PAID FOR and DONATED ventilators?

I know that this is a very local thing and a minor piece of news, but I consider it appalling.
Heh, nothing personal buddy.
 

Rivoli

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***BREAKING***

Navarro is standing up for the American people on hydrochlroquine - even to the point of YELLING at the goal-post-moving head of the NIH DR FAUCI

Navarro - the most important person in the gov for businesses right now - is fighting to start producing it and securing the drug NOW while it’s efficacy is proven.

source:

Hopefully “Shut it down” Fauci will be removed from position soon.
 
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Rivoli

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msufan

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Rivoli

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This post feels like you are spreading disinformation and hate on purpose.

Its on video. There’s no disinformation. She did that specifically to limit Americans access to masks. She recorded herself.

political correctness has limits dude
 
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NovaAria

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And there was that Jewish guy who got busted for hoarding a million masks and reselling them at cut-throat prices. Are you down for some good old concentration camping, maybe?
She's a piece of shit and and everyone knows it, no need to get the pitch and fork.

On an unrelated note, more and more economists in my country are speaking against the lockdowns, right now. TV shows, radio interviews, the whole package.
Leave it to doctors, and we will be staying at home till the end of the year. Leave it to the economists, and we will be back at work tomorrow. Politicians are supposed to be the mediators in times like these, but this crisis proved that politicians are the most reactive people on the planet.
 

Rivoli

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And there was that Jewish guy who got busted for hoarding a million masks and reselling them at cut-throat prices. Are you down for some good old concentration camping, maybe?
She's a piece of shit and and everyone knows it, no need to get the pitch and fork.

On an unrelated note, more and more economists in my country are speaking against the lockdowns, right now. TV shows, radio interviews, the whole package.
Leave it to doctors, and we will be staying at home till the end of the year. Leave it to the economists, and we will be back at work tomorrow. Politicians are supposed to be the mediators in times like these, but this crisis proved that politicians are the most reactive people on the planet.
Funny you reference the Jews when 1 million Uyghurs are in chains in China.

I don’t care what one person does. But the Chinese government is doing this everywhere. Having it’s citizens buy up supplies.


 

GIlman

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Most people are so damn scared of getting sick or dying that they literally are just laying in bed at home for weeks.

Found an interesting update, We may already be at the peak:


I, like many others including family members, had a particularly bad illness around Christmas time which resulted in an absolutely awful cough (multiple spastic attacks where I almost threw up) that persisted nearly 2 months, until nearly March.

I wish the government could create a task force of researchers to figure this out, instead of listening to a few "experts" who grossly overestimated the potential death toll of this virus at 2 million Americans.

The longer we're "locked down" here in America, the more people will become pissed off, because it seems to me that some people are falling off of the "flatten the curve" virtue signaling band wagon.

Probably because after a month and a half plus of no income, and their savings (if any) being drained, they are starting to question the sustainability of this crap.

Also, walmart and target are starting to meter the number of people allowed in the store at one time. Seeing people lined up outside of a walmart waiting to go in (when it's not black friday), worryingly resembles a breadline.

I’ve been tempted to try and get the antibody test kits. It seems lots of people believe they have been exposed And recovered early in the year. I’m not sure what the kits cost but probably 20-150 a pop. Probably have to buy 10-50 I’m guessing. If any Scottsdale/AZ people might be interested in knowing their immune status Let me know. It probably would have to be local people only because it needs reagent that probably only comes one to each batch.

I’ll inquire and see if it’s possible to get these. With so many people focused in diagnosing people with active infections it might actually be possible to get these kits which arecan only tell if you have already been infected.
 
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WillHurtDontCare

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"In sociology, there is a famous book about Chicago’s heat wave in 1995. Sociologists found that social isolation during the heat wave made people, especially the elderly, more vulnerable to dying."

A second order effect that I hadn't considered.
 

farmer79

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And there was that Jewish guy who got busted for hoarding a million masks and reselling them at cut-throat prices. Are you down for some good old concentration camping, maybe?
She's a piece of shit and and everyone knows it, no need to get the pitch and fork.

On an unrelated note, more and more economists in my country are speaking against the lockdowns, right now. TV shows, radio interviews, the whole package.
Leave it to doctors, and we will be staying at home till the end of the year. Leave it to the economists, and we will be back at work tomorrow. Politicians are supposed to be the mediators in times like these, but this crisis proved that politicians are the most reactive people on the planet.

I am Canadian and kind of indifferent towards Trump but this is why I have high hopes for him leading the world out of this mess.

Most leaders around the world are career politicians who are more than happy to hide behind the “experts”. They can’t be blamed if they followed the experts advice. For whatever you think of Trump he has done hundreds and I assume 1000’s of deals. And with any deal you have the lawyers, accountants, engineers, architects, etc. all weighing in with their expertise but at some point he had to move forward despite their objections (you’ll never totally appease your lawyer and accountant) and risk millions of dollars by essentially weighting their advice properly. 90% of politicians are simply going to do whatever the medical experts say and that will leave you locked up in your house until next January. I am hopeful that Trump will sort through this difficult situation without being a slave to the usual trappings of politics.
 
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loop101

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Scott Adams mentioned this theory about CV19 possibly being a blood infection rather than a lung infection. If I understand it, the theory is that the virus attacks the hemoglobin in the blood, preventing it from absorbing oxygen, with the lung damage being a secondary effect. He is skeptical because it probably would have been discovered earlier, if it was true. I mention it because it seems like anything is still possible at this point.

View: https://twitter.com/cameronks/status/1244672393160863752
 

MHP368

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Leave it to the economists, and we will be back at work tomorrow.

or

not

at all

a bunch of dead and panicked people and the collapse of the medical system (a foundation of modern society) doesn't exactly spell "business as usual" , think it through for like literally 2 minutes. Or google up some economists and see what their actual opinions are.

Give it a few weeks maybe when the hospitals actually have supplies and we've implemented surge policies and flattened things a bit at least? , like you can start talking reopening strategies when the entire buildings not on fire but lets walk through this a bit...

You have the most overworked disgruntled healthcare workers in the countries history, literally don't have the protective equipment they need to keep themselves or the patients they took an oath not to harm safe. You open the floodgates and they'll walk , mid pandemic or not.

Would you work construction if you knew no medical facility was available if you got injured?

would you drive? , and if you had to drive you'd still avoid it right?

and since no massive testing was done and you knew as a halfway intelligent american that it wasn't safe to be out , even if they opend up businesses and said "go ahead" , would you? would you dine out or go to a movie? would you send your kids to school?

concert? business meeting?

If you try to reopen the economy prematurely its not going to work because you'll have no consumer confidence, maybe people will drag themselves to work until they get sick but they'll hoard the money they make so demand will not recover.

and economists know all of this, which is why they agree with the current protocols. A sick panicked population doesn't make for a healthy economy. The small portion of people who don't care if they get sick and don't care if they're spreading the disease (symptoms or not) aren't going to drive enough money into the economy to keep it functioning anyway.

Given how much we've already thrown at the problem in grants and emergency spending (which will trickle down to allow the parasites to suckle off huge amounts) we could have literally just shut the entire country down for two months and paid all business owners and employees the difference (instead we came out with hole filled half measures)

were 4 trillion deep and the entire 2019 gdp was what like 20 trillion? , so thats more than two months of covering all productive activity in the country. They could have averages it out and cut checks , instead? all this nonsense that just lets the grifters get a piece.
 

Thoelt53

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or

not

at all

a bunch of dead and panicked people and the collapse of the medical system (a foundation of modern society) doesn't exactly spell "business as usual" , think it through for like literally 2 minutes. Or google up some economists and see what their actual opinions are.

Give it a few weeks maybe when the hospitals actually have supplies and we've implemented surge policies and flattened things a bit at least? , like you can start talking reopening strategies when the entire buildings not on fire but lets walk through this a bit...

You have the most overworked disgruntled healthcare workers in the countries history, literally don't have the protective equipment they need to keep themselves or the patients they took an oath not to harm safe. You open the floodgates and they'll walk , mid pandemic or not.

Would you work construction if you knew no medical facility was available if you got injured?

would you drive? , and if you had to drive you'd still avoid it right?

and since no massive testing was done and you knew as a halfway intelligent american that it wasn't safe to be out , even if they opend up businesses and said "go ahead" , would you? would you dine out or go to a movie? would you send your kids to school?

concert? business meeting?

If you try to reopen the economy prematurely its not going to work because you'll have no consumer confidence, maybe people will drag themselves to work until they get sick but they'll hoard the money they make so demand will not recover.

and economists know all of this, which is why they agree with the current protocols. A sick panicked population doesn't make for a healthy economy. The small portion of people who don't care if they get sick and don't care if they're spreading the disease (symptoms or not) aren't going to drive enough money into the economy to keep it functioning anyway.

Given how much we've already thrown at the problem in grants and emergency spending (which will trickle down to allow the parasites to suckle off huge amounts) we could have literally just shut the entire country down for two months and paid all business owners and employees the difference (instead we came out with hole filled half measures)

were 4 trillion deep and the entire 2019 gdp was what like 20 trillion? , so thats more than two months of covering all productive activity in the country. They could have averages it out and cut checks , instead? all this nonsense that just lets the grifters get a piece.
Do you work in a hospital? If so, what is your experience with the surge? Have you seen any C0VlD-19 patients yourself?
 
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Thoelt53

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Scott Adams mentioned this theory about CV19 possibly being a blood infection rather than a lung infection. If I understand it, the theory is that the virus attacks the hemoglobin in the blood, preventing it from absorbing oxygen, with the lung damage being a secondary effect. He is skeptical because it probably would have been discovered earlier, if it was true. I mention it because it seems like anything is still possible at this point.

View: https://twitter.com/cameronks/status/1244672393160863752
Super interesting. Just early tonight I saw a video of him discussing this topic. Makes one wonder..
 

Rwill

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Regardless of what you think the future holds, here's a worthwhile thought from Seneca:

"Remember that all we have is 'on loan' from Fortune, which can reclaim it without our permission—indeed, without even advance notice. Thus, we should love all our dear ones, but always with the thought that we have no promise that we may keep them forever—nay, no promise even that we may keep them for long."

Stoicism teaches us how to deal with these situations mentally. Imagine the worst case, and realize then take comfort, that your not there.
Marcus Aurelius is a good read right now as well
 

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