The Entrepreneur Forum | Financial Freedom | Starting a Business | Motivation | Money | Success

Welcome to the only entrepreneur forum dedicated to building life-changing wealth.

Build a Fastlane business. Earn real financial freedom. Join free.

Join over 80,000 entrepreneurs who have rejected the paradigm of mediocrity and said "NO!" to underpaid jobs, ascetic frugality, and suffocating savings rituals— learn how to build a Fastlane business that pays both freedom and lifestyle affluence.

Free registration at the forum removes this block.

The Worldwide C0VlD-19 Coronavirus Pandemic Discussion Thread...

Likwid24

Legendary Contributor
FASTLANE INSIDER
EPIC CONTRIBUTOR
Read Fastlane!
Summit Attendee
Speedway Pass
User Power
Value/Post Ratio
295%
Mar 26, 2011
2,098
6,193
46
Staten Island, NY
Not sure if this was mentioned but the mortality rate since Feb. 1st is .07%. A HUGE difference from the 2-3% most people are talking about. The high percentage was due to the panic of the "new" virus in the beginning, hospitals being overwhelmed in a city of 59 million and not really knowing how to treat it at first. Those numbers have dropped drastically.

An FYI - the flu mortality rate is .06% which is only .01% lower than the Coronavirus at the present time. Not to mention the fact that it is not killing children, which is a huge problem with the flu. A majority of deaths have occurred in people over the age of 80. YES 80.

They say that the Swine Flu was actually 10x worse than this.

Another FYI - I work for the FDNY (the greatest fire department in the world) and we are usually the first to know about stuff like this. As of today, do you know what measures they are saying to take against Corona? Wash your hands. That is all.
 
Dislike ads? Remove them and support the forum: Subscribe to Fastlane Insiders.

biggeemac

Gold Contributor
Speedway Pass
User Power
Value/Post Ratio
150%
Jun 25, 2011
826
1,236
48
Not sure if this was mentioned but the mortality rate since Feb. 1st is .07%. A HUGE difference from the 2-3% most people are talking about. The high percentage was due to the panic of the "new" virus in the beginning, hospitals being overwhelmed in a city of 59 million and not really knowing how to treat it at first. Those numbers have dropped drastically.

An FYI - the flu mortality rate is .06% which is only .01% lower than the Coronavirus at the present time. Not to mention the fact that it is not killing children, which is a huge problem with the flu. A majority of deaths have occurred in people over the age of 80. YES 80.

They say that the Swine Flu was actually 10x worse than this.

Another FYI - I work for the FDNY (the greatest fire department in the world) and we are usually the first to know about stuff like this. As of today, do you know what measures they are saying to take against Corona? Wash your hands. That is all.
Yeah, for me, the more I think about this, the less worried I become. Since there are probably thousands of cases unreported, the death rate is probably far lower than our "trusted" media have lead us to believe. We are probably("PROBABLY") once again running from the boogie man. I personally have only had one or two flu shots my entire life. Yet, somehow, I escaped death. Same with my wife and kids.

My family right now is just adopting the smart hygiene practices that we probably should have been in the past.
 

GIlman

Still Gilman
FASTLANE INSIDER
Read Fastlane!
Read Unscripted!
Summit Attendee
Speedway Pass
User Power
Value/Post Ratio
604%
Oct 16, 2014
801
4,842
Yeah, for me, the more I think about this, the less worried I become. Since there are probably thousands of cases unreported, the death rate is probably far lower than our "trusted" media have lead us to believe. We are probably("PROBABLY") once again running from the boogie man. I personally have only had one or two flu shots my entire life. Yet, somehow, I escaped death. Same with my wife and kids.

My family right now is just adopting the smart hygiene practices that we probably should have been in the past.

I’m not sure how you are calculating a rate of 0.07%. I’ve not seen any data to support that. The best guesstimate really is to watch South Korea. They are doing very comprehensive screening and surveillance. So they are picking up a lot (but not all) mild cases in their numbers.

Of course as I believe @JScott pointed out until people have passed through and recovered we can’t really determine a final number.

Really what we need to be able to do is create cohorts by date Ranges, then follow them for a couple months to figure out some good statistics. Seems like with 60 days after infection there is almost always an outcome.

obviously the statistics are best the larger number of people we have, and ideally if the cohort mimics the population in composition. But this will take time and large numbers to know the truth.

I’m guessing the final total will be about 1-1.5% mortality. About 10-15x the flu. But there is certainly potential for lots of hype so this could be off, probably more likely too high than not high enough.

I also want to point out @biggeemac that a big part of the value from yearly sly shots really is in building both community immunity which helps everyone, and also cumulative immunity for yourself. Each year the composition of the Flu strains change. Over 30-40 years of immunization you have a pretty broad range of things your protected against. And that’s a good thing when your 60’s-90’s and are more prone to death by flu.

I’ve known several people that didn’t believe in getting the flu shot, until they get a horrible flu, and realize how sick you can get. The hard part is that flu vaccine is not 100% and never will be. There are many variants and they only target 3 a year typically. So if a different flu is circulating from your prior immunization history, theN you aren’t protected.
 
Last edited:

Likwid24

Legendary Contributor
FASTLANE INSIDER
EPIC CONTRIBUTOR
Read Fastlane!
Summit Attendee
Speedway Pass
User Power
Value/Post Ratio
295%
Mar 26, 2011
2,098
6,193
46
Staten Island, NY
I’m not sure how you are calculating a rate of 0.07%. I’ve not seen any data to support that. The best guesstimate really is to watch South Korea. They are doing very comprehensive screening and surveillance. So they are picking up a lot (but not all) mild cases in their numbers.

Of course as I believe @JScott pointed out until people have passed through and recovered we can’t really determine a final number.

Really what we need to be able to do is create cohorts by date Ranges, then follow them for a couple months to figure out some good statistics. Seems like with 60 days after infection there is almost always an outcome.

obviously the statistics are best the larger number of people we have, and ideally if the cohort mimics the population in composition. But this will take time and large numbers to know the truth.

I’m guessing the final total will be about 1-1.5% mortality. About 10-15x the flu. But there is certainly potential for lots of hype so this could be off, probably more likely too high than not high enough.

I also want to point out @biggeemac that a big part of the value from yearly sly shots really is in building both community immunity which helps everyone, and also cumulative immunity for yourself. Each year the composition of the Flu strains change. Over 30-40 years of immunization you have a pretty broad range of things your protected against. And that’s a good thing when your 60’s-90’s and are more prone to death by flu.

I’ve known several people that didn’t believe in getting the flu shot, until they get a horrible flu, and realize how sick you can get. The hard part is that flu vaccine is not 100% and never will be. There are many variants and they only target 3 a year typically. So if a different flu is circulating from your prior immunization history, theN you aren’t protected.

lol. Obviously I’m not the one personally doing the calculations. The numbers are coming from updated CDC stats SINCE February 1st.
 
Dislike ads? Remove them and support the forum: Subscribe to Fastlane Insiders.

biggeemac

Gold Contributor
Speedway Pass
User Power
Value/Post Ratio
150%
Jun 25, 2011
826
1,236
48
I’m not sure how you are calculating a rate of 0.07%. I’ve not seen any data to support that. The best guesstimate really is to watch South Korea. They are doing very comprehensive screening and surveillance. So they are picking up a lot (but not all) mild cases in their numbers.

Of course as I believe @JScott pointed out until people have passed through and recovered we can’t really determine a final number.

Really what we need to be able to do is create cohorts by date Ranges, then follow them for a couple months to figure out some good statistics. Seems like with 60 days after infection there is almost always an outcome.

obviously the statistics are best the larger number of people we have, and ideally if the cohort mimics the population in composition. But this will take time and large numbers to know the truth.

I’m guessing the final total will be about 1-1.5% mortality. About 10-15x the flu. But there is certainly potential for lots of hype so this could be off, probably more likely too high than not high enough.

I also want to point out @biggeemac that a big part of the value from yearly sly shots really is in building both community immunity which helps everyone, and also cumulative immunity for yourself. Each year the composition of the Flu strains change. Over 30-40 years of immunization you have a pretty broad range of things your protected against. And that’s a good thing when your 60’s-90’s and are more prone to death by flu.

I’ve known several people that didn’t believe in getting the flu shot, until they get a horrible flu, and realize how sick you can get. The hard part is that flu vaccine is not 100% and never will be. There are many variants and they only target 3 a year typically. So if a different flu is circulating from your prior immunization history, theN you aren’t protected.
First, yes, .07% doesnt seem accurate. I haven't seen a number that low anywhere. .7% may be more accurate, but I digress.

Second, you may be totally correct about the flu shots. Unfortunately, getting flu shots was just something that has never really been drilled into me. After all this current stuff going on, i'm sure many people that have ignored flu shots in the past may rethink that, including myself. My point is that I'm not going to panic. I'm just gonna be reasonable, and act with heightened awareness that my hands and others around me may be carrying something dangerous and respond accordingly.
 

windchaser

Bronze Contributor
Read Fastlane!
Read Unscripted!
Speedway Pass
User Power
Value/Post Ratio
237%
May 24, 2017
148
351
Spain
Yeah, for me, the more I think about this, the less worried I become. Since there are probably thousands of cases unreported, the death rate is probably far lower than our "trusted" media have lead us to believe. We are probably("PROBABLY") once again running from the boogie man. I personally have only had one or two flu shots my entire life. Yet, somehow, I escaped death. Same with my wife and kids.

My family right now is just adopting the smart hygiene practices that we probably should have been in the past.

To me, the most worrying number is not the mortality rate as of now, it is the complication rate of around 20% of infected needing hospitalization and 5% requiring ICU.

Considering these numbers and the RO of the virus, the possibility of hospitals collapsing is not farfetched and that is a very concerning scenario as, not only mortality for those infected would rise, but also affect other patients (such as those suffering from heart attacks or those on cancer treatments to think of a couple), and you need to add the panic effect it could unleash into the population.

I must admit I have never been very concerned about any other recent epidemic (swine flu, SARS, Ebola, etc) but I am concerned about this one to the point I am taking precautions. It is also true that I have my husband in a very vulnerable situation as he in inmunodreppressed due to chemo and I live in Spain, in particular in a city were cases are spiking now.

Also, in my country there are cases of young healthy people in the ICU, and Government is refusing to test people with symtoms or virical pneumonia if they don´t have a history of travel to Italy or China or direct contact with a known infected person, so I do not know what to think anymore.

Maybe I am overreacting with this one because of my situation, but if I can lower the likelyhood of infecting my husband just by taking simple measures as more ususal handwashing, avoiding crowds and travel for a while, I think it is a fair price to pay.
 

Longinus

Platinum Contributor
Read Fastlane!
Read Unscripted!
Summit Attendee
Speedway Pass
User Power
Value/Post Ratio
441%
Aug 28, 2014
1,132
4,995
Poland / Belgium
If COVID19 kills 2% of the 7.5B people in the world (150M), that will be as many people killed by the The Black Death and The Spanish Flu combined. That is apocalyptic.

Except that
  • Black Death: world population was <500M
  • Spanish Flu: world population was <2B
I'm aware that Corona has to be taken serious but you're being a drama queen.
 
Dislike ads? Remove them and support the forum: Subscribe to Fastlane Insiders.

minivanman

Platinum Contributor
Speedway Pass
User Power
Value/Post Ratio
265%
Mar 16, 2017
1,722
4,562
54
DFW
We have a friend that went to the Maastricht (basically an art fair) in the Netherlands. He isn't worried at all. After that he is headed to Italy to try and buy a painting. Hopefully he ends up ok but if not.... he knew what he was getting in to.
 

loop101

Platinum Contributor
Read Fastlane!
Read Unscripted!
Speedway Pass
User Power
Value/Post Ratio
161%
Mar 3, 2013
1,556
2,505
Except that
  • Black Death: world population was <500M
  • Spanish Flu: world population was <2B
I'm aware that Corona has to be taken serious but you're being a drama queen.

After 38,000 views, and 560 posts, there have been no personal insults in this thread until you made one today.
 

Vigilante

Legendary Contributor
Staff member
FASTLANE INSIDER
EPIC CONTRIBUTOR
Read Fastlane!
Read Unscripted!
Summit Attendee
Speedway Pass
User Power
Value/Post Ratio
596%
Oct 31, 2011
11,116
66,265
Gulf Coast
Except that
  • Black Death: world population was <500M
  • Spanish Flu: world population was <2B
I'm aware that Corona has to be taken serious but you're being a drama queen.

We can agree or disagree without denigrating the discussion.
 
Dislike ads? Remove them and support the forum: Subscribe to Fastlane Insiders.

biggeemac

Gold Contributor
Speedway Pass
User Power
Value/Post Ratio
150%
Jun 25, 2011
826
1,236
48
Here is something to put things in perspective. If you exclude China from the equation, which some would agree got most things WRONG in response to this virus in addition to having a very high number of smokers, the number of recorded cases confirmed is 10283 and the number of deaths is is 173. I'm not very good at calculating percentages, but this puts us significantly below 1% (death rate).
 

Longinus

Platinum Contributor
Read Fastlane!
Read Unscripted!
Summit Attendee
Speedway Pass
User Power
Value/Post Ratio
441%
Aug 28, 2014
1,132
4,995
Poland / Belgium
After 38,000 views, and 560 posts, there have been no personal insults in this thread until you made one today.

It wasn't even meant as an insult, but if you insist: boohoo.

My point, and a point that was said earlier, is that all these numbers and stats can be interpreted as you want. Let's say the numbers you showed were like the hysterical teenage girl version of the available stats and the other - more positive ones, for example that the cases in China are decreasing - are ignored. Just like the fact that there are probably more cases without even knowing, making the death rate even lower than 2%.
 

MTEE1985

Platinum Contributor
Read Fastlane!
Read Unscripted!
Speedway Pass
User Power
Value/Post Ratio
425%
Jun 12, 2018
685
2,914
Arizona
10283 and the number of deaths is is 173. I'm not very good at calculating percentages, but this puts us significantly below 1%

173/10283 = 1.7%

I would agree though that China numbers skewed things high. At the WHO briefing this morning they actually pegged the mortality at 3.4%. I believe mainly because initial rates from Wuhan were up around 6%. I think @GIlman is pretty spot on with an estimate between 1-1.5% when all is said and done.

In other news for my fellow Arizonans, another presumptive positive in Maricopa county reported today.
 
Dislike ads? Remove them and support the forum: Subscribe to Fastlane Insiders.

biggeemac

Gold Contributor
Speedway Pass
User Power
Value/Post Ratio
150%
Jun 25, 2011
826
1,236
48
173/10283 = 1.7%

I would agree though that China numbers skewed things high. At the WHO briefing this morning they actually pegged the mortality at 3.4%. I believe mainly because initial rates from Wuhan were up around 6%. I think @GIlman is pretty spot on with an estimate between 1-1.5% when all is said and done.

In other news for my fellow Arizonans, another presumptive positive in Maricopa county reported today.
Yes, I just found an internet calculator that corrected me. You see how internet rumors and fake news get started?!?! DAMMITT !!!
 

Vigilante

Legendary Contributor
Staff member
FASTLANE INSIDER
EPIC CONTRIBUTOR
Read Fastlane!
Read Unscripted!
Summit Attendee
Speedway Pass
User Power
Value/Post Ratio
596%
Oct 31, 2011
11,116
66,265
Gulf Coast

becks22

90% coffee, 10% everything else
FASTLANE INSIDER
Read Rat-Race Escape!
Read Fastlane!
Read Unscripted!
Summit Attendee
Speedway Pass
User Power
Value/Post Ratio
271%
Jul 6, 2016
787
2,129
31
Upstate NY
Two confirmed cases in New York City today. With the abundance of commuters who work in Manhattan but live in Long Island, Westchester, & CT, I'm sure the number of cases will increase over the next few weeks in the greater New England area.
 

BizyDad

Keep going. Keep growing.
FASTLANE INSIDER
EPIC CONTRIBUTOR
Read Fastlane!
Read Unscripted!
Summit Attendee
Speedway Pass
User Power
Value/Post Ratio
416%
Oct 7, 2019
2,885
11,989
Phoenix AZ
Here is something to put things in perspective. If you exclude China from the equation, which some would agree got most things WRONG in response to this virus in addition to having a very high number of smokers, the number of recorded cases confirmed is 10283 and the number of deaths is is 173. I'm not very good at calculating percentages, but this puts us significantly below 1% (death rate).

A friend point out the following to me, and it made me feel a bit better.

These numbers are based on confirmed cases. Many who contract the disease experience cold-like symptoms and don't get tested. Ergo, the actual fatality rate is lower than is being reported.

Here's an article to help some of us calm down a little at least.


Stats from the article:
  1. For Chinese patients whose symptoms started after February 1st, the death rate is just 0.7 percent. (For comparison, the U.S. death rate from 2019-20's annual flu outbreak is between .06 percent to 0.1 percent.
  2. Only one out of every 1,000 people in Hubei Province has contracted the coronavirus
  3. There have been no reported deaths in young children. Moreover, only 2.4% of cases are in individuals under the age of 18. Kids and teenagers have been surprisingly resistant to the virus.
 

Primeperiwinkle

Legendary Contributor
EPIC CONTRIBUTOR
Read Rat-Race Escape!
Read Fastlane!
Read Unscripted!
Summit Attendee
Speedway Pass
User Power
Value/Post Ratio
320%
Nov 30, 2018
1,645
5,261
By July it will be everywhere and when the dust clears, more people will be impacted by the hysteria of this than the actual sickness. Sigh.
 
Dislike ads? Remove them and support the forum: Subscribe to Fastlane Insiders.

biggeemac

Gold Contributor
Speedway Pass
User Power
Value/Post Ratio
150%
Jun 25, 2011
826
1,236
48

Likwid24

Legendary Contributor
FASTLANE INSIDER
EPIC CONTRIBUTOR
Read Fastlane!
Summit Attendee
Speedway Pass
User Power
Value/Post Ratio
295%
Mar 26, 2011
2,098
6,193
46
Staten Island, NY
I’m not sure how you are calculating a rate of 0.07%. I’ve not seen any data to support that. The best guesstimate really is to watch South Korea. They are doing very comprehensive screening and surveillance. So they are picking up a lot (but not all) mild cases in their numbers.

Of course as I believe @JScott pointed out until people have passed through and recovered we can’t really determine a final number.

Really what we need to be able to do is create cohorts by date Ranges, then follow them for a couple months to figure out some good statistics. Seems like with 60 days after infection there is almost always an outcome.

obviously the statistics are best the larger number of people we have, and ideally if the cohort mimics the population in composition. But this will take time and large numbers to know the truth.

I’m guessing the final total will be about 1-1.5% mortality. About 10-15x the flu. But there is certainly potential for lots of hype so this could be off, probably more likely too high than not high enough.

I also want to point out @biggeemac that a big part of the value from yearly sly shots really is in building both community immunity which helps everyone, and also cumulative immunity for yourself. Each year the composition of the Flu strains change. Over 30-40 years of immunization you have a pretty broad range of things your protected against. And that’s a good thing when your 60’s-90’s and are more prone to death by flu.

I’ve known several people that didn’t believe in getting the flu shot, until they get a horrible flu, and realize how sick you can get. The hard part is that flu vaccine is not 100% and never will be. There are many variants and they only target 3 a year typically. So if a different flu is circulating from your prior immunization history, theN you aren’t protected.

I just noticed I put .07. It is .7%. My bad. I'm not good at multitasking. The Flu is typically .6%
 

Vigilante

Legendary Contributor
Staff member
FASTLANE INSIDER
EPIC CONTRIBUTOR
Read Fastlane!
Read Unscripted!
Summit Attendee
Speedway Pass
User Power
Value/Post Ratio
596%
Oct 31, 2011
11,116
66,265
Gulf Coast
Here's a question... why do people need to come out in favor of minimization BEFORE all of the risks are known? What if you are wrong? (And yes, some I am addressing this to on the forum would be considered friends before and after this crisis passes us by).

What do you gain from minimizing an UNKNOWN risk? Isn't it more prudent to err in the side of cautiousness?

If I'm wrong, I have a few cans of pork and beans to consume during hurricane season. What if YOU'RE wrong?
 
Dislike ads? Remove them and support the forum: Subscribe to Fastlane Insiders.

VentureVoyager

Bronze Contributor
FASTLANE INSIDER
Read Fastlane!
Read Unscripted!
Speedway Pass
User Power
Value/Post Ratio
223%
Aug 19, 2017
160
356
33
Merida, Yucatan, Mexico
Here is something to put things in perspective. If you exclude China from the equation, which some would agree got most things WRONG in response to this virus in addition to having a very high number of smokers, the number of recorded cases confirmed is 10283 and the number of deaths is is 173.

That's an interesting thought, and also a comforting one, however, should we then also exclude Italy from the equation, as some would agree that they got most things wrong in response to this virus, and they also smoke a lot?
And then how about Iran?
And where does it stop, or can we just disable the data that we don't like until we get a desired %?
 
Last edited:

BlindSide

Bronze Contributor
FASTLANE INSIDER
Read Fastlane!
Read Unscripted!
Speedway Pass
User Power
Value/Post Ratio
204%
Mar 16, 2017
193
394
30
Los Angeles
Here's a question... why do people need to come out in favor of minimization BEFORE all of the risks are known? What if you are wrong? (And yes, some I am addressing this to on the forum would be considered friends before and after this crisis passes us by).

What do you gain from minimizing an UNKNOWN risk? Isn't it more prudent to err in the side of cautiousness?

If I'm wrong, I have a few cans of pork and beans to consume during hurricane season. What if YOU'RE wrong?
Exactly. “It’s not as bad as the flu!!!”

Hey, what if I don’t want either? Why can’t I do my best to avoid both scenarios? What a novel idea.
 

GIlman

Still Gilman
FASTLANE INSIDER
Read Fastlane!
Read Unscripted!
Summit Attendee
Speedway Pass
User Power
Value/Post Ratio
604%
Oct 16, 2014
801
4,842
Based on the patterns I’ve seen, I have an interesting theory. Flu usually impacts the Old and the Young. This seems to spare the young < 10 years old. And there is huge geographical variability in the severity.

So my theory is that some prior infection is predisposing people to sever illness. People have talked about a cytokine storm. So maybe people who have been previously exposed and developed immunity to some other illness, their immune system is all ramped up. When they get the CV their immune system has a huge out of proportion response, and causes the problem and exacerbated the severity.

very young people would not be expected to have necessarily gotten the sensitizing illness. And of course illness prevalence varies by geography.

just an interesting thought based on observed patterns I’m seeing.
 
Dislike ads? Remove them and support the forum: Subscribe to Fastlane Insiders.

Mattie

Platinum Contributor
FASTLANE INSIDER
Read Rat-Race Escape!
Read Fastlane!
Read Unscripted!
Speedway Pass
User Power
Value/Post Ratio
129%
May 28, 2014
3,485
4,490
53
U.S.

Mattie

Platinum Contributor
FASTLANE INSIDER
Read Rat-Race Escape!
Read Fastlane!
Read Unscripted!
Speedway Pass
User Power
Value/Post Ratio
129%
May 28, 2014
3,485
4,490
53
U.S.

Walter Hay

Legendary Contributor
EPIC CONTRIBUTOR
Speedway Pass
User Power
Value/Post Ratio
401%
Sep 13, 2014
3,318
13,305
World citizen
Does anyone really believe the statistics reported by China and Iran?

Walter
 
Dislike ads? Remove them and support the forum: Subscribe to Fastlane Insiders.

ShamanKing

Silver Contributor
Read Fastlane!
Read Unscripted!
Summit Attendee
Speedway Pass
User Power
Value/Post Ratio
140%
Aug 30, 2018
382
534
California
Here's a question... why do people need to come out in favor of minimization BEFORE all of the risks are known?

Because its easier to deny the fact. It’s easier to say “People are just over reacting”. Most go with the flow.
 

MJ DeMarco

I followed the science; all I found was money.
Staff member
FASTLANE INSIDER
EPIC CONTRIBUTOR
Read Rat-Race Escape!
Read Fastlane!
Read Unscripted!
Summit Attendee
Speedway Pass
User Power
Value/Post Ratio
445%
Jul 23, 2007
38,076
169,471
Utah
Because its easier to deny the fact.

I'm guessing that the normalcy bias really is much worse simply because this is a hidden danger, unlike something visual and/or sensory.
 

Post New Topic

Please SEARCH before posting.
Please select the BEST category.

Post new topic

Guest post submissions offered HERE.

Latest Posts

New Topics

Fastlane Insiders

View the forum AD FREE.
Private, unindexed content
Detailed process/execution threads
Ideas needing execution, more!

Join Fastlane Insiders.

Top