Should I learn programming or pay someone?

[Anon3587x]

Using the search bar for excessive periods of time can sure give one a headache.

 

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[snowbank]

My number of shorter, blunt comments to long posts ratio goes up in relation to the number of books MJ sells, and will probably continue to go up until I'm driven to insanity and don't allow myself to post anymore.

 

[Kak]

Should I learn programming or pay someone?

Is your time worth more or less than a programmer's at this point in your venture? Also take into account that it will take you longer than a programmer, yet you will get exactly what you want and can change it at will.

I learned basic web site creation for this reason well after I dished out money on a developer.

 

[900]

here is the start of the basic website so far..i don't know how to add the actual forum or video submission stuff or shopping cart etc so this guy in iran will do it for about 100 bucks no matter how intricate. I bet if I asked for a facebook he'd do it too. lol. 100 bucks.

I'm thinking of getting the forum and the main things on the site going to generate traffic so I can start asking people on the site what they want cuz askdatabase.com has been crappy so far. =(

Take a look at something like this:

Marketplace script by CloneForest - template marketplace script, Video marketplace script, Audio marketplace script, Graphic marketplace script

 

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[DeletedUser394]

My number of shorter, blunt comments to long posts ratio goes up in relation to the number of books MJ sells, and will probably continue to go up until I'm driven to insanity and don't allow myself to post anymore.

I feel the same way. If nothing else, posting less gives me more time to work.

I also love how the junior/younger members ask questions and receive great responses from successful people (such as yourself) but are so ignorant/arrogant that they are set in their ways and take none of the advice given and refute it. Makes you wonder why the hell they bothered asking the question in the first place.

 

[Steven Williams]

If your talents are in programming learn it but if you're going to be focusing on marketing your business you'll need to find someone to do it for you.

I've used individuals and companies from Elance.com I've had good success with that, but with my latest project The Real Debt Solution Online Software System I started with a company from Elance.com but I later contracted an individual from Florida to by my on-call tech for my software.

It cost but when it comes to getting things done right and on-time nothing beats it. You can probably find someone at a great price. I'm paying $500 per week and this is for everything from designing my sites, pages, tech support for any software issues from my clients, etc.

If you don't have a lot of money to invest try elance.com and just make sure you are specific about what you need done and also the cheapest isn't always the best on elance.com or anywhere else.

Best of luck!!!

 

[911Carrera]

I advocate that you learn yourself; here is why.

There is no shortcut to the event. If you don't pay homage to process, you will, in one way or another, suffer a less than rewarding event.

If you learn to program yourself, you will be able to adapt to change and requests from your clients quicker. If you pay someone else to build your widget, you are handing them the keys to your success and "hope" they don't drive the damn bus off the road.

Will it take time to learn programming? Yes. Yes it will. I started learning programming concepts and techniques over 7 years ago and I am still learning. It is a commitment to lifestyle of continual learning. You will always be learning, adapting and changing.

Maybe it's because I like control .... but never, never give someone else control over your wealth vehicle.

If you build your widget, you know everything there is to know about it inside and out, and that will pay dividends to you during the process in ways you can't see or understand now.

Take any successful product or web startup .... how many of them are ran by people who paid someone else to build it?

Bill Gates? No. (Microsoft)
Steve Jobs? No. (Apple)
Mark Zuckerberg? No. (facebook)
Biz Stone? No. (Twitter)
Drew Houston? No. (DropBox)

If a programmer can see the potential in an idea, he/she isn't going to build it for you (especially for $500.00 dollars), he/she will build it for themselves. Also, I don't care what economy you are in or hire in, $500.00 is not going to get you a pot to piss in (in terms of software). If you found someone that says they'll build your idea for $500.00 I'd run my a$$ the other direction with a quickness.

You're looking for get rich easy, and that my friend is a false prophet - it does not exist. To get massive wealth you need to perform massive action, not have someone else perform massive action for $500.00 (because it isn't going to happen).

My intent isn't to be mean or condescending; rather to violently shake you to your senses, before you waste $500.00 that could undoubtedly be appropriated in more efficient ways.

Take that $500.00 and go buy some books on web programming technologies and get to work!

Thanks,

Ryan

I see your point to a certain extent and I used to feel the same way about learning to program but your examples are wrong. Did you know that Steve Jobs was not technical at all. He didn't know how to build computers or program. He was just the marketing guy, the idea guy.

Bill Gates, although he was very technical and could program, didn't program the first MS OS or any one for that matter. He actually had Paul Allen buy it from some programmer and he and his team tweaked and sold it to IBM and started their fortune right then and there.

Mark is actually the only good example because he actually stole the idea from guys who hired him to build the early version. There was a big lawsuit over that and facebook settled for like $20 million to the twins who had their idea allegedly stolen. The facebook that took off was not built by Mark alone, he hired talented guys to help him build it.

Now if you lack capital to pay other people to do the programming and your time spent on programming doesn't affect your business then by all means learn it and it will be a great asset. If anything you should learn enough about programming to know what you want from your programmers in technical terms.

 

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[fierce86]

do you guys know how having animation skills will help me make a website? I could make 3d buttons and 3d backgrounds and maybe a 3d animation of a 3d tutor showing you how to use the site..but anything more substantial than that? I guess advertisement would be a big one..


just wrote my mission statement

Our mission is to provide people in the animation industry the quickest, cheapest, most efficient way to further their animation careers in a way that best showcases their talents, services, or desires.

 

[DeletedUser2]

Fire Yourself.

Don't Learn to program.

Focus on making money.

the tricks are.
have you found a market (where people want stuff and pay for it)

have you found a way to get traffic (really, do you think you could battle SEO for credit card companies? )
pay for it first to test.

Next can you provide the stuff people buy, for less than they are willing to pay? (yea profit)

GET YOUR FIST SALE> even ugly sites can sell stuff.

now its all about incremental improvement. 90%+ of companies are not Microsoft or Facebook. they are not innovators in their space.

they Resell stuff, or sell various versions of stuff. it still works, and it still makes money.

FOCUS ON MAKING MONEY. programing is becoming a commodity. you can hire 10 yr programers for very little money. learn to think strategic, and leverage everything. I agree with snobank. focus on the basics.
PS. your better bang for the buck, is learning copy-writing, or understanding marketing messages.

good luck

 

[900]

Fire Yourself.

Don't Learn to program.

Focus on making money.

To add my 2 cents (literally, that's what my opinion is worth! :smx4.

Do what you're good at. If you were meant to be a programmer, you probably would have been already. That's not to say you can't be one, but keep rolling with your strengths.

My own venture, I was lucky to find two great partners who are programmers, and one's that have impressive resumes. We've all done our specialties really well for a while at big companies, so now we're out on our own.

I can't program, though I have a deep understanding of web technologies and business models, and I work on the front-end, business model, meetings with potential customers, meetings with potential partners, meetings with potential investors. That in itself is a daunting amount of work, and something the tech guys aren't doing because they're doing what they're good at, and I'm doing what I have strengths in.

 

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[rthconsultants]

I see your point to a certain extent and I used to feel the same way about learning to program but your examples are wrong. Did you know that Steve Jobs was not technical at all. He didn't know how to build computers or program. He was just the marketing guy, the idea guy.

Bill Gates, although he was very technical and could program, didn't program the first MS OS or any one for that matter. He actually had Paul Allen buy it from some programmer and he and his team tweaked and sold it to IBM and started their fortune right then and there.

Mark is actually the only good example because he actually stole the idea from guys who hired him to build the early version. There was a big lawsuit over that and facebook settled for like $20 million to the twins who had their idea allegedly stolen. The facebook that took off was not built by Mark alone, he hired talented guys to help him build it.

Now if you lack capital to pay other people to do the programming and your time spent on programming doesn't affect your business then by all means learn it and it will be a great asset. If anything you should learn enough about programming to know what you want from your programmers in technical terms.

You're missing the point.

Not one of the people I mentioned in the original post actually built 100%, what their company is selling today. The point is - that they all had major roles in the development process, they knew enough to police the police.

Not one of those individuals would be where they are (were, RIP SJ), if they had tried to build it all themselves.

The best investment you can make is an investment in yourself.

So back to the matter at hand, I advocate learning to build it yourself; with frameworks and loosely typed languages, it won't take as long as one would think to become proficient.

However, if you are going to have someone build it for you, you have to know enough about programming to police the police. Would you invest in municipal bonds without knowing what they are?

 

[911Carrera]

You're missing the point.

Not one of the people I mentioned in the original post actually built 100%, what their company is selling today. The point is - that they all had major roles in the development process, they knew enough to police the police.

Not one of those individuals would be where they are (were, RIP SJ), if they had tried to build it all themselves.

The best investment you can make is an investment in yourself.

So back to the matter at hand, I advocate learning to build it yourself; with frameworks and loosely typed languages, it won't take as long as one would think to become proficient.

However, if you are going to have someone build it for you, you have to know enough about programming to police the police. Would you invest in municipal bonds without knowing what they are?

Nobody is missing the point. What I said is that Neither Steve Jobs nor Bill Gates built their software to begin with. I never said anyone had to build it all themselves. Steve Jobs never knew how to program computers, but he had the human ideas he had his engineers make a reality. That's all you really need, good ideas and execution. You don't need to know technical shit really but it's a plus.

 

[Guest6814]

Learn to Do it Right First

I agree with the gentleman who said that you should learn programming yourself. You can easily do it using a book. Once you've established a viable business, you can expand it by hiring others to do some of the lower-level tasks for you.

 

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[DeletedUser2]

I agree with the gentleman who said that you should learn programming yourself. You can easily do it using a book. Once you've established a viable business, you can expand it by hiring others to do some of the lower-level tasks for you.

that's like learning how to lay brick, learning plumbing, laying a foundation and all aspects of construction before becoming a landlord.

Focus on the making money part.
selling a product to your market.
FAST

 

[TheAstonMartian]

It depends though. Some people are impatient or have ADHD. I can learn to do basic web design work using Kompozer but hell, give me a complicated coding work to do and I simply won't be interested in learning. Creativity can come from business ideas and marketing. If you can do that, then its worth it to hire a coder to worry about the design. Sure, you might not make as much money but then again money is always limited to a number. Your focus should be on providing needs and then profiting enough to change your lifestyle.

The way I look at it, my job is to provide for my customers needs. It's not to learn and be efficient. It's to market and deliver. If I can do that, that's what counts.

As for Gates and Jobs, I don't think they are businessmen. They are innovators, and specialists in their fields. It's just that the demand rose so exponentially that they had to form a business out of it and since they came first, they got rich.

 

[DeletedUser397]

Take any successful product or web startup .... how many of them are ran by people who paid someone else to build it?

Bill Gates? No. (Microsoft)
Steve Jobs? No. (Apple)
Mark Zuckerberg? No. (facebook)
Biz Stone? No. (Twitter)
Drew Houston? No. (DropBox)

Actually, DropBox was founded and developed by a team, not just one guy who did all the programming. Steve Jobs didn't exactly do a ton of programming, he was more of a visionary. Zuckerberg and Biz Stone are probably the only 2 on that list that really relied mainly on their own programming skills as the foundation for their business success.

There's also many others that have successfully built internet companies with little or no programming experience. For example, one of my inspirations, Gurbaksh Chahal sold his company Blue Lithium to Yahoo for $300 million, and he didn't do any of the programming himself.

I think as others have said, it definitely depends on what you're doing, and whether learning that new programming skill will help down the line with that project or other projects. I agree with Ryan in some aspects, but overall I've come to the conclusion that you can't know it all, and it's just good to have some knowledge. The more you know the better, as long as you jump start yourself in the right direction, and not get ripped off by whoever you decide to hire later on - that should be enough.

But the problem is... "do it yourself" is good up to an extent... anyone can learn to program, but not everyone can program efficiently. Yeah, you can learn to program and write something in 300 lines, whereas a pro can come along and write the same function in 12 lines.

It's like anything else. Would I rather fix my car myself or get a mechanic to do it? Sure it's nice to know the basics and understand how the car works, so as to not get ripped off, but the mechanic will likely do a much better job than me, in most cases. I could change the oil myself, the filters, change lights, etc. but I'm not going to attempt to change the transmission myself. That's just not my expertise. There's people who have been doing it for a living, have the right tools, resources, troubleshooting experience, and they'll do a much better job. My goal is not to become a mechanic.

I think the analogy can be applied to any service you pay others for, where you hire a specialist because you're not trying to become that specialist yourself... you'd rather pay the money than spend the time trying to specialize in everything.

That's just my 2 cents.

 

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[Milenko]

Do what you're good at. If you were meant to be a programmer, you probably would have been already. That's not to say you can't be one, but keep rolling with your strengths.

I think that this is a key point. People who don't know much about programming assume that it's easy to get good at. That creating complex applications like those mentioned in this thread is just a matter of sitting down, learning some language syntax, and knocking it out.

Chances are if you've never been attracted to programming before that it's going to be a hard road learning it well enough to do anything major. Not that it's especially difficult, just that it requires some serious dedication to get good at and unless you're naturally drawn to it it's going to be challenging putting in the time necessary to get good enough where doing it yourself makes more sense than outsourcing.

 

[Mr.Marnier]

Doesn't this all come down to one thing really...

WHAT are you trying to achieve?

I see where this question comes from, I really do, I mean I asked it myself after finishing the book, I think it's a question that follows naturally in the mind once you've read about how MJ coded up his site himself (i'm not excusing neglecting the search function however!) in combination with his message of process etc...

BUT, I think it takes some perspective, do you want to be a programmer? do you want to be the next Zuckerberg or whoever is making the newest and most complex social media monster / Amazon 2 etc ?

If the answer is yes to any of those, then cool, put in your 10000 hours+ and see what happens I guess, but I suspect those are not the exact aspirations of the majority of people posing this question, it wasn't for me in any case.

If the goal is more to do with leveraging the internet, software etc... in order to create something of value for both you and your customers then surely the smart money is on investing time into learning those typical essential entrepreneurial skills, Sales, marketing, market research, networking, putting a team together and all that jazz? I mean damn, if being an accomplished programmer is a prerequisite to financial freedom these days I for one better be printing up my "Slowlane Rules!" Hat and Tee right now because I would be royally screwed!

 

[cpaballin]

Learn enough so you can build a dirty prototype.

Python can easily be learnt in a few months.

 

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[Crissco]

This is my opinion - As a web developer. - It can go both ways:

Learn to code yourself, you enjoy the learning process and the learning curve, and you also save a lot of money in the short and long run. If your idea takes off you might not have to worry about money, but lets say you have 10 ideas and you spend thousands and thousands on paying someone who knows how to code, ,and i mean QUALITY, not just throw shit together and hope it works, you might be okay. Also have to take into context various updates thought the months and years to improve the site or app. A lot of variables go into it that people sometimes don't get.

Also if you want a "good paying job" as a backup plan just in case, you can get it with programming and the right company.

For anyone wondering what languages are for what:

Font end web development: HTML/CSS Javascript

Fullstack (Create a community website) HTML/CSS /Javascript/ PHP / SQL

Game development: C++

Android : Java

iPhone : Objective C / Swift

 

[Greg R]

Learn enough so you can build a dirty prototype.

I like the idea of the "dirty prototype."

I don't know how to code, but I know enough to get around Wordpress.

It makes sense to build the dirty prototype through Wordpress and a slew of plugins to help automate the system.

This give me a chance to get intimate with the core of the business and cheaply validate it before I dump truck loads of money into getting the site developed (seemed to be a mutual consensous from all of the Should I learn How to Code) threads.

Whatever I cannot find a plugin for, I will just have to do the work manually (mostly back end tasks).

Hopefully the income generated from the site can sponsor paying a developer and the new site can sponsor the app.

We all have an idea of how we want the finished product to look, but getting there is the challenge.

I think of Walt Disney and his concept of Disney world.

Even though many years have passed, I am not sure Disney has ever reached the Utopian amusement park that he originally had in mind.

But he got damn near close.

 

[Torger]

What functions does the plugin require?

 

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[Jon L]

I think the OP should hire my company to write his software ... if he is still interested ... though, given the fact that the thread was started in 2011, he might have moved on. I would also charge considerably more than $500, so ... nevermind.

 

[DWORD]

I am not going to go through all the replies to your initial post OP so maybe this has been already said.

At the moment, in the year 2016 it is really different from what it used to be 10 years ago. You can get almost everything you want for free or for small fee. There are many websites where developers and designers have submitted their work which are being sold for less than $100.

If you want a really custom software then you should pay. However in such situation I would think that I might have some homework to do.

It's really unlikely that you have a unique problem to solve which hasn't already been done so. Specially if you just want a website.

EDIT: Didn't notice the thread creation date. Perhaps OP can tell us how his choices worked out in the end.

 

[Raoul Duke]

EDIT: Didn't notice the thread creation date. Perhaps OP can tell us how his choices worked out in the end.

Good luck with a reply.

 

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[Leon Williams]

I am in a similar boat with an idea but no programing skills. I guess the real question is how would I know if my partner or outsourced coder was any good? I am not opposed to learning code I just do not want to waste time.

I'm the same, I have and idea for a smartphone application that would change how some companies advertise but I have no idea how to approach it.

 

[TonyStark]

Last seen: Apr 2012.

 

[smarty]

Good luck with a reply.

View attachment 12997

He's probably dead by now, ran over by a bus or something

I'm the same, I have and idea for a smartphone application that would change how some companies advertise but I have no idea how to approach it.

Find potential customers and talk to them. Don't waste time building something unless you've potential customers (real people) who are really interested.

 

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[MainlyMotivation]

I would ALWAYS outsource when possible

 

[Mitch carson]

If you find someone with 50 buck then no reason to wait. I do not think it is possible in that price! I would like suggest spend time to learn coding and it will take at least 6 month to gain better knowledge. hope you got it.