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Need help with cold outreach

CryptoGuru

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Hello everyone,

I built a good website for a construction company and they said that they got good leads from the website. So, I guess I did a good job.

I spent the last 2 weeks searching for leads and I got some email addresses and LinkedIn accounts.

I'm sending them messages but most of the ignore me or tell me they're not interested. Here's how I'm doing this:

Hello X.

I recently completed a project for a company very similar to yours that helped them increase their clientele quite a bit.

Here's the link: www.websitethatsells.com

My client, Mr John Smith, reported that they're getting an average of 5 good leads from this website every week, which translates to some good projects.

If you want, I can share my knowledge with you so that you can experience the same success as they did.

Ask me any questions and I'll happily answer them.

- CryptoGuru

What do you guys think of this? I'm sending each email manually because I make sure I'm researching the client first and tailor my message to each one.

I sent this to 15 people already but didn't get a single one to talk to me.

Should I just continue or do I need to change my strategy?
 
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I email or DM saying I've made a personalised video for you about email marketing that will help increase your sales by 20% or more. What's the best email address to send this to?

I only make the videos for those who say send it to this email.

I sent out 15 messages yesterday and got 2 replies for a video.
 
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Kung Fu Steve

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I email or DM saying I've made a personalised video for you about email marketing that will help increase your sales by 20% or more. What's the best email address to send this to?

I only make the videos for those who say send it to this email.

I sent out 15 messages yesterday and got 2 replies for a video.

@CryptoGuru this response is getting buried quickly.

I think you passed over it because you couldn't see it for what it was -- brilliant.

You can go knock on 100 doors today and say "gee, mister, you wouldn't wanna buy anything from me would you?" -- you might get one just out of pity but that's no way to build a business.

Your income is in direct proportion to the amount and QUALITY of offers you make.

Shift your focus:

  • Those are not nameless, faceless, faceless numbers you're reaching out to -- it's people. Real people. Imagine walking into a room full of strangers, shaking hands, and before anything is even said you go "I can build a website" ... how freaking creepy is that?

  • I'll mirror momo's advice.

    "Hey future client, I just dove into your website and saw a couple of things that might get you more customers. I can send them over in an email if you'd like? And if you're ever in need of a fantastic web designer, I'd love to interview for the gig. Which email is best?"

  • If you can do that in a video USING their name and website? You're going to start getting the response you're looking for but it's F*cking work, dude. You gotta work.

When people say "provide value" -- this is what they're talking about. Your pitch needs to provide value. "I have a 8-point checklist I run through for all of my clients. It looks like if you did this, this, and this you could potentially get more business and leads from your website!" <-- a basic example but I hope you get the point.

Every pitch I make comes with value.

I started pitching my new ad agency business and here's my pitch "I'll work with you to build a plan to double or triple your business in a single year... and one of 3 things is going to happen. You love the plan and do it on your own. You love the plan and decide to become a client of mine. And in the unprecedented event you think I've wasted your time, I'll pay you $200."

(I'm not suggesting you do that, I'm just giving you an example of what I'm doing)
 

Paul David

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ok guys today someone replied to my InMail and we setup a phone call.

This was one of the funniest interactions I've had so far.

---
Basically, this guy has a really ugly website and in his reply, he said he wanted something better looking (like the one I showed him) so that he can attract better prospects.

Right from the start, he told me that setting up a simple website like that will take about 1 day and that I just need to show him some themes from Themeforest and then he will pick the one he likes.

Then I will setup Wordpress or something.

I asked him if he tried looking on Fiverr for this task and he said yes but he wanted me to do it because the website I built looked good. And that when he hired on Fiverr before, the results weren't that good.

So I asked him what kind of results he's expecting with that website and he said nothing. It's just for online presence and he's not expecting any ROI on it.

So I told him I'm not the right person for this because my pricing starts from $2000.

Shocked, he told me that installing a theme from Themeforest shouldn't require that much money.

I told him that I like to provide value by building websites that brings results like better leads.

He told me that themes from Themeforest are already optimized for conversions and that I don't need to do much after installing it.

He said he can pay $50 max.

I asked him how much he paid for his current website.

He said he built it himself.

I told him we're not a good fit and that he's free to look elsewhere.

He asked me if I'm saying that because I don't know how to build websites (even though I showed him a great website already).

I repeated that we're not a good fit and that working together won't be possible.

He hung up on my face.
---

I told this to one of my friends and he said I should just have taken the money because setting up a theme is pretty easy anyway.

What do you guys think?

I think you should stop listening to that friend.

Move on and find customers who value your time and your ability to build them a website that works for them, at a price that works for you.
 

Andy Black

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Hindsight is 20/20 but maybe it would be worth to take this job just for testimonial.
Maybe with a clause in contract that he can't disclose for how much you did it.
I wouldn’t touch him with a barge pole.

Two lines from Blaise Brosnan:

“Sales is a screening process.”

“Your job is to find out as soon as possible if the person in front of you sees the value in what you do, or the cost. Walk away if it’s just the cost.”
 

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Check this out :
View: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ocwSGZ-sVuc


He literally shows it all, the exact script, first liners and lead gen.

Be sure to stop everything, watch the video till the end and take notes, instead of watching 2 min and making a tea or ending up on some YouTube rabbit hole.

Also no matter how dumb it may sound, or that may think that this approach doesn't work.

Still do it!

Make sure to make 600 Outreaches, 20 per day, before tweaking anything.

I've literally seen such dumb people get rich doing boring things over and over!

You can do it too.

Also not affiliated with Jordan Platten or anything, just love his YouTube SMMA content.
 
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Miketing

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Yes I'm doing it all manually. I try to personalise the start of each message so that takes the longest time.
So for this part, you should only be spending a few minutes per prospect. 5 mins max. Batch it all at once.

Here's how it might look:
View: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jr9-1Oj-GQ0


As this is quite a common problem though, people have already created services and products to solve that problem for you:
  1. Outsource - you can hire someone on Upwork for a few $ an hour or $1 per first line. There are people on there who literally have their title set to "First Line Writer".
  2. Automate - ...what? This can be automated...? Yep, with AI. Check out Warmer or Lyne. Quality won't be quite the same of course, it depends what you value most.
Otherwise, you could test not using a personalised intro. If your offer is strong enough and the message is highly targeted to the segment/niche, then you may not even need one. Test reply rates with/without.
 
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Miketing

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Why are you trying so hard to sell people on cold calling vs. cold email or messaging?

You've made three claims here which are completely untrue:
Firstly, your prospects are bombarded by HUNDREDS of emails and DMs DAILY, compared to about 20-40 calls per day depending on your industry.

Secondly, your prospects are free to ignore ANY email/DM you send them. In 99% of cases, they won't even bother to reply.

What's more, most email software these days automatically puts any email from unknown senders directly in the spam folder... where your prospects will NEVER see them.
Aside from the fact you say "your prospects" without actually knowing who our prospects are, none of this is backed up by proven data. You're just spreading misinformation.

I would imagine you've personally not been very successful with your cold email or messaging outreach. Have you perhaps considered that it may be your approach, or are you just assuming that it's "utterly ineffective" for everyone?
 
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WillHurtDontCare

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Isn't it too early for a call? They don't know me so I figure that I'd just try to get them to rely instead.

If Irina Shayk called me out of the blue asking to come over because she didn't want to be alone during the thunderstorm, I guarantee you that I wouldn't give a shit about if she called too early or how she got my number.

The point that I'm making is that if you're offering people something that they really want, they'll quickly get over the fact that you're a stranger. Now, you'll obviously have to demonstrate your credibility, but trust me, you can call soon.

And here's something that will help you a lot: you need to seriously believe that what you're doing will help these people. If you knew that every time you redid someone's website that they wound up with an additional $50,000 in sales the next month, guaranteed, would you hesitate for even a second to pick up that phone? Honestly, you'd be an a**hole if you didn't pester them about redoing their website if you were that good.

There is nothing more powerful in life than belief. Zilch. Zero. Nada. You need to internalize the fact that you can help these people and it will dramatically improve your ability to close deals.
 

Miketing

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Yes but I want them to reply so that I can get into the specifics.

They might not be interested though because I don't see how seeing my portfolio would provide any useful information. Case studies are more useful but right now I only have 1.

It doesn't matter that you only have 1, you need to make it sound attractive to your prospects.

You need to be specific in how your website got those leads, what exactly they translated into for your client, and use strong vocabulary that is relevant to your niche.

Otherwise, these prospects aren't going to believe you and they aren't going to give a F. They're not going to reply at all if that's the case. Or when they do, they're going to give you some fake objection like "send me a portfolio".
 

Andy Black

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Check out the Quickmail.io podcast btw. I think the book was good too, although I whizzed through it without applying anything as I’m not an outbound guy.
 

Paul David

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@CryptoGuru this response is getting buried quickly.

I think you passed over it because you couldn't see it for what it was -- brilliant.

You can go knock on 100 doors today and say "gee, mister, you wouldn't wanna buy anything from me would you?" -- you might get one just out of pity but that's no way to build a business.

Your income is in direct proportion to the amount and QUALITY of offers you make.

Shift your focus:

  • Those are not nameless, faceless, faceless numbers you're reaching out to -- it's people. Real people. Imagine walking into a room full of strangers, shaking hands, and before anything is even said you go "I can build a website" ... how freaking creepy is that?

  • I'll mirror momo's advice.

    "Hey future client, I just dove into your website and saw a couple of things that might get you more customers. I can send them over in an email if you'd like? And if you're ever in need of a fantastic web designer, I'd love to interview for the gig. Which email is best?"

  • If you can do that in a video USING their name and website? You're going to start getting the response you're looking for but it's f*cking work, dude. You gotta work.

When people say "provide value" -- this is what they're talking about. Your pitch needs to provide value. "I have a 8-point checklist I run through for all of my clients. It looks like if you did this, this, and this you could potentially get more business and leads from your website!" <-- a basic example but I hope you get the point.

Every pitch I make comes with value.

I started pitching my new ad agency business and here's my pitch "I'll work with you to build a plan to double or triple your business in a single year... and one of 3 things is going to happen. You love the plan and do it on your own. You love the plan and decide to become a client of mine. And in the unprecedented event you think I've wasted your time, I'll pay you $200."

(I'm not suggesting you do that, I'm just giving you an example of what I'm doing)

This is just absolute gold.
 

Miketing

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Is it me or does cold outreach feel like an awful time suck. You have to build the list, message the list, create videos for those who reply, then follow up with everyone again.

Is there a better way?
Well a lot of this can be automated rather than doing it all manually. Or outsourced.

But yes, its not easy. You're learning more about your audience while you do it though. And every lead you get is worth a lot if it could turn into a client. Hence why people pay good money for B2B leads.

Are you doing every step manually? Which part takes up the most time for you?

ok guys today someone replied to my InMail and we setup a phone call.

This was one of the funniest interactions I've had so far.

---
Basically, this guy has a really ugly website and in his reply, he said he wanted something better looking (like the one I showed him) so that he can attract better prospects.

Right from the start, he told me that setting up a simple website like that will take about 1 day and that I just need to show him some themes from Themeforest and then he will pick the one he likes.

Then I will setup Wordpress or something.

I asked him if he tried looking on Fiverr for this task and he said yes but he wanted me to do it because the website I built looked good. And that when he hired on Fiverr before, the results weren't that good.

So I asked him what kind of results he's expecting with that website and he said nothing. It's just for online presence and he's not expecting any ROI on it.

So I told him I'm not the right person for this because my pricing starts from $2000.

Shocked, he told me that installing a theme from Themeforest shouldn't require that much money.

I told him that I like to provide value by building websites that brings results like better leads.

He told me that themes from Themeforest are already optimized for conversions and that I don't need to do much after installing it.

He said he can pay $50 max.

I asked him how much he paid for his current website.

He said he built it himself.

I told him we're not a good fit and that he's free to look elsewhere.

He asked me if I'm saying that because I don't know how to build websites (even though I showed him a great website already).

I repeated that we're not a good fit and that working together won't be possible.

He hung up on my face.
---

I told this to one of my friends and he said I should just have taken the money because setting up a theme is pretty easy anyway.

What do you guys think?
Interesting interaction. This is good though. "An indication you're making progress is that you're confronted with new problems." - @Andy Black

The problem here is that he wasn't qualified. So is there a way you can filter out people like this in future? How can you find people who are qualified?

I'd start by looking at his business to judge if he actually has money - can you find out what his revenue is or at least how many employees he has?

Also, is there a way you can set people's expectations higher up front? What's your branding like - how do you present yourself on LinkedIn/your site?

And is there a way you be the one in control of the call from the start instead of them?
 

WillHurtDontCare

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I sent this to 15 people already but didn't get a single one to talk to me.

15 people is absolutely nothing - reach out to 1,000 people and get back to us. You can easily reach 100 people a day, minimum

Sign up for LinkedIn Sales Navigator and start using that to find decision makers for companies who you think you can help.

Check out @Fox 's threads, like the one below.

 

WillHurtDontCare

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Ok sounds good. Just wanted to make sure I'm not sending the wrong kind of message or something.

I don't have money for coaching right now, I bought Sales Navigator and I'm almost broke. Hopefully I'll get something this month.

You don't have to sign up for the coaching - just dig through his other threads for lots of free value on how to run a profitable web design company.
 

Miketing

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15 people is absolutely nothing - reach out to 1,000 people and get back to us. You can easily reach 100 people a day, minimum

Sign up for LinkedIn Sales Navigator and start using that to find decision makers for companies who you think you can help.

Check out @Fox 's threads, like the one below.


While yes, you should be doing this at scale, I would not recommend sending 100 cold emails per day. That kind of volume, especially straight out of the gate, is likely to harm your domain reputation and start getting you marked as spam.

If you split it up over other channels though, then that would be fine. Yeah.

E.g. Something like 30 cold emails, 20 LinkedIn connections (limit is 100 per week), 30 cold calls, and 20 facebook messages (DM the business page) would be a good strategy.

You'll then get a better idea of which channel works best for your niche and service offering.
 

WillHurtDontCare

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While yes, you should be doing this at scale, I would not recommend sending 100 cold emails per day. That kind of volume, especially straight out of the gate, is likely to harm your domain reputation and start getting you marked as spam.

If you split it up over other channels though, then that would be fine. Yeah.

Good correction - that's what I meant, and that is what I should have said.

Cold call as much as you like, but try to limit business and LinkedIn connections to 25 a day or so.
 
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Miketing

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Isn't it too early for a call? They don't know me so I figure that I'd just try to get them to rely instead.

I'm not putting trackers in my email right now because I'm scared to get in spam. I just send plain text emails instead.

I customize the email based on what I discovered about the prospect. For example, if they need a redesign instead of a new website.

I'm doing this manually right now. Do you suggest I automate instead? I wanted to focus on quality instead of quantity but it's taking a long time to research every prospect before I contact them.

Yea, I'm sending on their personal emails. I also use InMail on LinkedIn. They open my message and I see the "seen" status but no reply.

The point of a cold call is so that they can get to know you. You wouldn't usually be looking to close straight away, just booking another call for a later date. Definitely look into it, you can start by watching some youtube videos to give you an idea of what to say.

Trackers on your email are fine. You can use GMass for free which allows for tracking, scheduling multiple sends, and personalisation.

It is good to start somewhat manually until you figure out what works. However, you have a template already which you can just add personalised merge tags to.

You could then have multiple options saved which you can just slot in based on what you have found out about them. E.g. one templated bullet point based on those who need a redesign, or a different option for those you think need a new site.

If you then want to personalise further, you can also add a "personalized first line" a la Alex Berman:
View: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Bn1BgvIhEOU


It shouldn't take you hours to research and personalise each prospect though. Just come up with a template that you test a few dozen times, then spend a few minutes personalising each email to the individual prospect.

Edit: One thing you should also do is customise your template to the niche/segment. Since you're sending to construction companies, it should be written in a way which appeals to them specifically. Right now, your template could be sent to ANY type of business. It should be tailored to only fit your niche: construction companies.

What exactly do construction companies want? What problems might they have specifically? What kind of terminology do they use to describe that?
 
Last edited:

Itizn

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Big red flag with your cold outreach for me is

The first word in the body is "I". Whether it's cold or warm, you don't want to open with something "you-centric". Rearrange your phrasing to hardly use I, my, or me.

Start to cold call prospects. Follow the general outline of your cold email message (which isn't that bad, just needs some work) but over voice.

You can reach people who don't ever look at unknown emails and also improve your verbal skills at the same time, which you will absolutely need when you get prospects on the phone for meetings and pitches.
 
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CryptoGuru

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It doesn't matter that you only have 1, you need to make it sound attractive to your prospects.

You need to be specific in how your website got those leads, what exactly they translated into for your client, and use strong vocabulary that is relevant to your niche.

Otherwise, these prospects aren't going to believe you and they aren't going to give a F. They're not going to reply at all if that's the case. Or when they do, they're going to give you some fake objection like "send me a portfolio".
Ok I'll rewrite my message to include some more specific details.
 

CryptoGuru

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Check out the Quickmail.io podcast btw. I think the book was good too, although I whizzed through it without applying anything as I’m not an outbound guy.
It's an interesting resource, thanks.
 
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Miketing

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What are you supposed to say then?

This happened to me before and I replied with something like:

"I can't reliably quote a price before I know more about what you're trying to achieve. Are you available for a quick call next week?"

Then I got ghosted. That's why I reply with my minimum price now.

Do you suggest I do something else?

They're obviously somewhat interested in what you're offering, because they've replied asking for a price. Before giving a quote though, you need to help them understand the kind of value that they would be getting if they were to invest in your service.

That means you need to first of all sell the call before you can sell your service.

So what's in it for them? At the moment, you're just offering to give them a quote in return for half an hour(?) of their time.

For them to want to get on a call with you, you need to first show that you're someone worth talking to. That means you're:
1. CAPABLE of helping them, and
2. WILLING to help them/provide value

The video idea mentioned in this thread is a great way of doing this.

Conveying these points via text-only emails is possible, but not quite as easy when you're starting out.
 

David Fitz

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Is it me or does cold outreach feel like an awful time suck. You have to build the list, message the list, create videos for those who reply, then follow up with everyone again.

Is there a better way?
 
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Paul David

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Is it me or does cold outreach feel like an awful time suck. You have to build the list, message the list, create videos for those who reply, then follow up with everyone again.

Is there a better way?

Hire a VA for $3 an hour!
 

CryptoGuru

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ok guys today someone replied to my InMail and we setup a phone call.

This was one of the funniest interactions I've had so far.

---
Basically, this guy has a really ugly website and in his reply, he said he wanted something better looking (like the one I showed him) so that he can attract better prospects.

Right from the start, he told me that setting up a simple website like that will take about 1 day and that I just need to show him some themes from Themeforest and then he will pick the one he likes.

Then I will setup Wordpress or something.

I asked him if he tried looking on Fiverr for this task and he said yes but he wanted me to do it because the website I built looked good. And that when he hired on Fiverr before, the results weren't that good.

So I asked him what kind of results he's expecting with that website and he said nothing. It's just for online presence and he's not expecting any ROI on it.

So I told him I'm not the right person for this because my pricing starts from $2000.

Shocked, he told me that installing a theme from Themeforest shouldn't require that much money.

I told him that I like to provide value by building websites that brings results like better leads.

He told me that themes from Themeforest are already optimized for conversions and that I don't need to do much after installing it.

He said he can pay $50 max.

I asked him how much he paid for his current website.

He said he built it himself.

I told him we're not a good fit and that he's free to look elsewhere.

He asked me if I'm saying that because I don't know how to build websites (even though I showed him a great website already).

I repeated that we're not a good fit and that working together won't be possible.

He hung up on my face.
---

I told this to one of my friends and he said I should just have taken the money because setting up a theme is pretty easy anyway.

What do you guys think?
 
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David Fitz

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I prefer inbound to outbound. I’m not knocking outbound, it works and I may do it later. I prefer the dynamic when people come to you asking for help. It feels like we’re peers.

Is this what you mean by getting in to groups and helping people in the groups?
 
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Miketing

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Yea it's a good idea. Next time I'll research the business a little and see if they can actually afford.
You should have some kind of criteria in mind for the businesses that are the best fit for you. So what would their revenue range be? $500k-5M? $10M-100M? Or 10-200 employees?

Not sure where you're finding the businesses, but you can usually look up this info manually easily. Otherwise, get for LinkedIn Sales Nav or access to a database if you have the budget.

How would I go about being in control of the conversation instead?
It seems like that last prospect might have been a lost cause, but in future:
  • Set the frame and expectations before the call - how do you position it to them in the messaging now? In the original, you said "Ask me any questions and I'll happily answer them." whereas you should be the one asking questions to qualify them.
  • Do you have any kind of script for the sales calls? At least when starting out, you should have a structure.
  • Improve your sales skills - have you done much training or reading for sales skills?

That's what I was thinking. I don't see what kind of value I can provide for $50.

Even if I setup the website, it won't be generating any revenue or helping the business much. The testimonial would have to be faked.
Yeah if you're going to work for $50, you might as well work for free for someone who's actually going to appreciate the help.
 

frenki

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What are you supposed to say then?

This happened to me before and I replied with something like:

"I can't reliably quote a price before I know more about what you're trying to achieve. Are you available for a quick call next week?"

Then I got ghosted. That's why I reply with my minimum price now.

Do you suggest I do something else?
If you got ghosted means he was going to be a "pain in the a$$" client.

Think of it this way, does the doctor give you medicine without asking you questions about your problem?

No!

That's what you as a Web/Marketing Consultant do and the other reason why you shouldn't say a price is because the prospect isn't aware of their problems and how bad they are and they also aren't aware of your solution and how it helps them solve their problem only then a 2000 Dollar retainer to help them get 10000 dollars worth of sales using Facebook Ads makes sense.
 

frenki

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Just got off another phone call. It was another construction company but smaller in size.

The guy has zero online presence and does all marketing via word of mouth. He's been doing this for 10+ years.

I enjoyed this call but still didn't make the sale.

---

So right from the start I told him I tried researching his business but couldn't find anything online.

I told him about his competitors that were appearing on Google.

Since I didn't know much about his business, I asked him to talk a little. He talked for 5 minutes about what he does and told me about a new type of service he going to offer soon and that he wanted to market that. He seemed very passionate.

For some reason, he knew about stuff like SEO even though he's got no online presence. He said he wanted a decent mobile responsive website with good seo.

I lost control of the sale a little here because he was talking too much. He was saying things like how he can't deal with too many leads because he's a small business with only 1 secretary.

He also doesn't have time to manage his website so I think I would have to do that for him. The problem is I don't think he has the budget for a maintenance plan. Otherwise, I would have to train his secretary.

I wanted to ask more questions but I kinda lost control here and we started to talk about pricing instead. So, I told him it would be $2000 for his website and some essential SEO with the goal of getting leads from the website.

He said Ok, send him a proposal and he will look into it. He said he wasn't going to start the website right now but maybe in 2-3 months.

I agreed and told him that since he doesn't have staff to handle new leads and his word of mouth marketing is working fine for him, it makes sense to take some time to think before investing.

We agreed and ended the call.

---

This call was OK but I think he wasn't qualified.

Either he doesn't have the budget or he just doesn't see the value of a website right now. He mentioned that he doesn't want many leads so I don't think a website is what he wants right now.

He also doesn't care much about his competitors. I think he's comfortable where he is and doesn't want to grow more.

I will try to target larger companies next time and I need more sales practice. What do you guys think of this one?
Go on Amazon and get this book (It's Free) :

https://www.amazon.com/dp/B08XZP5PPG/?tag=tff-amazonparser-20

It's only 100 pages so a quick 2 hour read.

Read it all by today and then proceed to make calls again.

It will show you how to let business owners convince themselves they need a lead generating website.

One of my mentors used to say you can't iterate your offer or change niche if you haven't had atleast 30 calls (strategy sessions) in that niche.

So keep making calls until you hit 30 and then let us know how it goes.
 
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CryptoGuru

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Someone replied to my InMail and I believe he was a little angry.

Basically, his website is really ugly and lacking in information. I researched his competitors a little and sent him this:

"Hello X.,

You know how website visitors judge the quality of your business based on how your website looks? Your competitors google.com, yahoo.com, and bing.com could be stealing customers from you.

I can share a few things you can do right now for your website that will greatly improve your credibility.

If you're interested, just reply and I'll send them to you."

So, he replied and told me that he's a pretty credible business and doesn't need anymore of that, and that he doesn't need advice from a business smaller than his.

Should I have worded my message differently?
 

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