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Mobile App/Game Marketing - Your Thoughts || Experiences?

Marketing, social media, advertising

eTox

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Curious.

I know there are a few folks on here who are in the App/Game development sphere. How do you, if you do, go about marketing your app/game through paid traffic sources such as Admob and the likes.

And for those who aren't into this, what are your thoughts on it?

My main points of interest are:
  • Is driving paid traffic to your app/game on "low" scale worthwhile the investment? (I know it should be at least on the large scale because that's how big dollar companies are getting players)
  • What are your experiences like, your thoughts, comments, concerns?

I would really love to hear from people with regards to mobile app/game marketing strategies.

Thank you.

Perhaps @Andy Black may have some thoughts with Adwords. What about @Sanj Modha with Facebook Ads?
 
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devine

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Low budget = Niche advertising.

But, show your game, if it's good, it may be 100x more effective to advertise it via Instagram.
 

luniac

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My weakest link as an app developer.

I F*cking suck at marketing compared to my other skills.

A friend of mine is learning marketing in college and at a sales job, im hoping to use his skills when he's ready.

Low budget = Niche advertising.

But, show your game, if it's good, it may be 100x more effective to advertise it via Instagram.

I have 1 or 2 very casual fun type app games, i haven't tried instagram, don't know anything about it. Maybe i should give it a shot!
 

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I've used Admob to launch free apps and make money off the backend i.e. Adsense.

That being said. Have you considered looking at the FB apps platform? I don't know much about it but millions play games on FB.

The marketing is always the same. Product + passionate audience = $$$$
 
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eTox

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I've used Admob to launch free apps and make money off the backend i.e. Adsense.

That being said. Have you considered looking at the FB apps platform? I don't know much about it but millions play games on FB.

The marketing is always the same. Product + passionate audience = $$$$

Thank you for the advice :)

I am more interested in pondering about IOS/Android freemium type games.

It's interesting to me to think whether a dollar invested in the game is worth more in the future, because up until now I've allowed "fate" (organic traffic) to take control of the games.

It would be really interesting to know whether sending paid traffic to the game will result in a surge of revenue... :smoking: however, the current prediction states otherwise.

I wonder how it could be in real life...
 

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Low budget = Niche advertising.

But, show your game, if it's good, it may be 100x more effective to advertise it via Instagram.
Thank you for the advice :)

I am more interested in pondering about IOS/Android freemium type games.

It's interesting to me to think whether a dollar invested in the game is worth more in the future, because up until now I've allowed "fate" (organic traffic) to take control of the games.

It would be really interesting to know whether sending paid traffic to the game will result in a surge of revenue... :smoking: however, the current prediction states otherwise.

I wonder how it could be in real life...

From what i've seen and read, without some kind of marketing you're basically invisible and playing the lottery. Way way better chance of winning compared to an actual lottery, but still a lottery.

It feels too out of our hands compared to other fastlane ventures, but i think im just naive about how to take control of an app's exposure.

entertainment apps that is, a need based app is way simpler cause its so much easier to validate.
 

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Curious.

I know there are a few folks on here who are in the App/Game development sphere. How do you, if you do, go about marketing your app/game through paid traffic sources such as Admob and the likes.

And for those who aren't into this, what are your thoughts on it?

My main points of interest are:
  • Is driving paid traffic to your app/game on "low" scale worthwhile the investment? (I know it should be at least on the large scale because that's how big dollar companies are getting players)
  • What are your experiences like, your thoughts, comments, concerns?

I would really love to hear from people with regards to mobile app/game marketing strategies.

Thank you.

Perhaps @Andy Black may have some thoughts with Adwords. What about @Sanj Modha with Facebook Ads?
Sorry... I can't help you. It's not my lane at all. I generate phone calls and email enquiries for local bricks and mortars businesses. Good luck though.
 
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splok

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Is driving paid traffic to your app/game on "low" scale worthwhile the investment?

The basic requirement of all paid traffic is that you eventually make more money from a user than you pay for its acquisition.
The problem with most indie games is that they're terrible at retention and monetization.

Most indies think they have a marketing problem when they're really just not making games that make people pull out their wallets. This is both a design and a quality issue. You can make a great game that has terrible monetization, but there are far more games that just aren't good enough to get users to stick around.

Go recruit a few users somehow (post in communities, buy ads, whatever) and see how long they stay and much money you make from them.
  • If too many are hitting your game page but never installing, then your page sucks and needs to be fixed (description, screenshots, etc).
  • If people make it into game but never come back after their first session, then your game sucks and needs to be fixed. (or possibly your targeting, but still probably your game)
  • Once you get your retention to something reasonable, see how much money you're making per user. If that number is lower than you can reasonably expect to pay for users through a well-optimized paid traffic campaign, then your monetization sucks and needs to be fixed.
 

eTox

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The basic requirement of all paid traffic is that you eventually make more money from a user than you pay for its acquisition.
The problem with most indie games is that they're terrible at retention and monetization.

Most indies think they have a marketing problem when they're really just not making games that make people pull out their wallets. This is both a design and a quality issue. You can make a great game that has terrible monetization, but there are far more games that just aren't good enough to get users to stick around.

Go recruit a few users somehow (post in communities, buy ads, whatever) and see how long they stay and much money you make from them.
  • If too many are hitting your game page but never installing, then your page sucks and needs to be fixed (description, screenshots, etc).
  • If people make it into game but never come back after their first session, then your game sucks and needs to be fixed. (or possibly your targeting, but still probably your game)
  • Once you get your retention to something reasonable, see how much money you're making per user. If that number is lower than you can reasonably expect to pay for users through a well-optimized paid traffic campaign, then your monetization sucks and needs to be fixed.

I've thought through the exact same process and I've come to the realization that, perhaps, I am not paying for traffic in order to monetize it. Rather, I would be paying for visibility and further organic growth.

Typical situation that I have seen is, assuming the game is reasonably interesting and worthwhile (indie, non-professional game) what would happen is this without marketing: The game get's published, get's visibility in the top free section in it's own subcategory (Google Play) where some people discover it. If it's good enough people download it while it's still floating above other shit, but once a month goes by, it gets covered with other crap and gets buried. Now assuming a game is good enough, it will get couple dozen installs a day throughout some time, until it eventually gathers enough installs and reviews, and gets queried in the search with the "right" keywords so that more people see it. Then it starts to grow organically: snowball effect.

What I would like to, is to bypass the waiting game and throw some benjamins at it to get installs and reviews so that the snowball starts rolling NOW, not some time later.

I am thinking of paid traffic as a means to kickstart organic growth through which LATER monetization will follow from organic installs.

I hope I am making sense. Please prove me wrong :S
 

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The basic requirement of all paid traffic is that you eventually make more money from a user than you pay for its acquisition.
The problem with most indie games is that they're terrible at retention and monetization.

Most indies think they have a marketing problem when they're really just not making games that make people pull out their wallets. This is both a design and a quality issue. You can make a great game that has terrible monetization, but there are far more games that just aren't good enough to get users to stick around.

Go recruit a few users somehow (post in communities, buy ads, whatever) and see how long they stay and much money you make from them.
  • If too many are hitting your game page but never installing, then your page sucks and needs to be fixed (description, screenshots, etc).
  • If people make it into game but never come back after their first session, then your game sucks and needs to be fixed. (or possibly your targeting, but still probably your game)
  • Once you get your retention to something reasonable, see how much money you're making per user. If that number is lower than you can reasonably expect to pay for users through a well-optimized paid traffic campaign, then your monetization sucks and needs to be fixed.

yea that's why I hoped for any casual games of mine to just go viral and make a killing real fast all at once.
 
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devine

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I've thought through the exact same process and I've come to the realization that, perhaps, I am not paying for traffic in order to monetize it. Rather, I would be paying for visibility and further organic growth.

Typical situation that I have seen is, assuming the game is reasonably interesting and worthwhile (indie, non-professional game) what would happen is this without marketing: The game get's published, get's visibility in the top free section in it's own subcategory (Google Play) where some people discover it. If it's good enough people download it while it's still floating above other shit, but once a month goes by, it gets covered with other crap and gets buried. Now assuming a game is good enough, it will get couple dozen installs a day throughout some time, until it eventually gathers enough installs and reviews, and gets queried in the search with the "right" keywords so that more people see it. Then it starts to grow organically: snowball effect.

What I would like to, is to bypass the waiting game and throw some benjamins at it to get installs and reviews so that the snowball starts rolling NOW, not some time later.

I am thinking of paid traffic as a means to kickstart organic growth through which LATER monetization will follow from organic installs.

I hope I am making sense. Please prove me wrong :S
There are two games:
Both have great design, both are heavily advertised on social networks.
Both, as their authors say, have great gameplay.

One of them makes money, the other one doesn't.
Do you know why?
Me neither, because it's all hypothetical.

The difference is in details. In color palette, in ad featured image, in targeting, etc.
Until there is no game on the table, discussion is meaningless.

Make sure it clicks. I would tag half of TFLF to read this post, but somebody has to live in a hypothetical world, run hypothetical businesses and brainstorm hypothetical situations.
 

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I know a fair bit about this space as worked marketing large mobile games globally for an ad network. On a large scale you're right, the big guys use all the mobile ad network channels so paid media and the occasional featured spot on the Apple app store as a result of the paid media, so it's Chicken and the egg.

That being said if you're just starting out on a "low scale" I would really focus on Facebook ads and mastering this as an ad platform. You could always approach a large app "publisher" who work with indie developers and they cross promote it in their games and you receive a cut of the revenue

Also, in terms of monetising your game, a lot of games are monetised through featuring video and banner ads and not in-app purchases which only a small percentage of free to play users do.

I've read some great posts on this forum, so hope that helps give some direction and good to be able to give something back too.
 

splok

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Rather, I would be paying for visibility and further organic growth.

Sure, you can buy your way up the charts if you have deep enough pockets. I have no idea what your budget is, but I see most people coming at games/apps thinking that they're going to make some magic happen by spending what's effectively pocket-change on ads. That's hard because that's really the spot where your ads need to be paying for themselves if you want to make any progress. The idea of buying your way up the charts is the FAR more pricy option. It always comes down to return on ad spend, even if you're hoping that a viral/organic effect multiplies the number of users that a dollar buys. Any multiplier effect just lowers the cost of acquisition, which your average lifetime customer value still has to beat.

However, even if that's what you're doing, the points still apply. If you have a game with shitty retention and shitty monetization, all the downloads you get just by being at the top of the charts will be wasted. Better to buy a few users, test, optimize, and repeat until your metrics are reasonable first. That way when you dump your wad into chart climbing, it won't be a wasted effort.

One thing that larger studios will do is soft-launch in a much smaller, but similar-ish, market (sometimes Canada or New Zeland). The users aren't necessarily cheaper to acquire (though they can be), but it's easier to move the needle on the local chart ranking while doing the optimization necessary to actually get a game earning money.
 
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So I'm just getting into this with my first 'freemium' app - it's a 'lifestyle' app to train your brain for positive thinking. Three days after release and I'm getting negligible downloads and negligible ad revenue. I don't know how far you've taken the organic marketing eTox - but at least in my case, I still have a lot to learn as far as aso and keywords. I already learned a bunch since my first batch of keywords and have some updates that I hope will get me better results, I have other aso steps I need to take as well, such as localizing my screenshots etc.. My thought is I should take aso and keywords as far as I can go with it - then if I'm comfortable that I'm doing as much as I can as far as organic marketing, try things such as FB ads.
 

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So I'm just getting into this with my first 'freemium' app - it's a 'lifestyle' app to train your brain for positive thinking. Three days after release and I'm getting negligible downloads and negligible ad revenue. I don't know how far you've taken the organic marketing eTox - but at least in my case, I still have a lot to learn as far as aso and keywords. I already learned a bunch since my first batch of keywords and have some updates that I hope will get me better results, I have other aso steps I need to take as well, such as localizing my screenshots etc.. My thought is I should take aso and keywords as far as I can go with it - then if I'm comfortable that I'm doing as much as I can as far as organic marketing, try things such as FB ads.

well you picked a hyper saturated niche, how do you expect do go viral unless u have a new "hook"?
 

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I guess I have low expectations for my first few apps. First things first - I'm just starting off and right now I just want to make some money and learn ASO.

The next set of apps I'm really going to spend some time doing market research and niche it down before I even begin developing. Hopefully this will all come together soon.
 
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I guess I have low expectations for my first few apps. First things first - I'm just starting off and right now I just want to make some money and learn ASO.

The next set of apps I'm really going to spend some time doing market research and niche it down before I even begin developing. Hopefully this will all come together soon.

pretty much same as me.
In the last 3 years i released 2 casual games and a bunch of stupid joke andoird apps.

After finishing a clicker game for a youtube channel that i like, im gonna make my first 100% NON GAME app involving instagram. My friend who's a graphic designer put me onto the idea and showed me competitor apps and we both agreed they're charging ridiculous prices for the service they provide.

We're gonna give the masses a better deal :)

Wish me luck!
 

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@Rcaraway1989 @parkerscott @hatzil any thoughts regarding mobile app/game marketing?

It seems like I just have to give it a shot and prove whether it works or not...

"You don't learn until you launch" is very true here.
 

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mobile games are a mature market with lots of overhead and lots of profits. you will need a substantial amount of cash to "push" your game profitably.

have you looked into Facebook ads for mobile app installs? I would recommend it over AdMob to start with.
 
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My weakest link as an app developer.

I F*cking suck at marketing compared to my other skills.

A friend of mine is learning marketing in college and at a sales job, im hoping to use his skills when he's ready.



I have 1 or 2 very casual fun type app games, i haven't tried instagram, don't know anything about it. Maybe i should give it a shot!


Yeah instagram does make it easy to market your stuff. All you need is a great camera and good lighting. :)

For apps though, you could create demo records and place there and it's all for free. Using the right hashtags could get you lit in days on the platform. With those you can keep your app in people's minds and faces.

I'd opt to actually create a page for your app just to get your training wheels on. Part because I'm into app building myself and part because I'm also trying to get better at marketing on there. It's quite the deal... If you let me i could promote your stuff for you at no cost. Maybeee just a few nickels.
 

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I smell a huge opportunity for promoting your games and apps on Facebook. So underrated....!
 

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Facebook promotions always intimidated me because of all the filtering options, i felt like with one wrong choice id be filtering out my whole market!

Even if at first it would seem logical that a casual game could appeal to teenagers or something, all of a sudden a study comes out older people play more or something, im not sure what to believe.

Is there a good approach to figuring out what to set for age demographics, interests, etc.

Is it a waste of time to just do broad spectrum promotion?

Is 200 bucks of promotion even worth it at all? or do you have to do something like 200 a day?

Can very good promotion settings plus good marketing images and copy make a single 200 dollar promotion worth it?
 
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eTox

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Can very good promotion settings plus good marketing images and copy make a single 200 dollar promotion worth it?

I don't know man... how about you go spend $200 on a promotion and tell us?
 

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I smell a huge opportunity for promoting your games and apps on Facebook. So underrated....!

you are like 3 years too late.

i think there is an opportunity in app store (iOS) search ads and snapchat ads right now, Facebook is becoming a mature, expensive medium to advertise apps for indies.
 

toxicrain

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Facebook promotions always intimidated me because of all the filtering options, i felt like with one wrong choice id be filtering out my whole market!

Even if at first it would seem logical that a casual game could appeal to teenagers or something, all of a sudden a study comes out older people play more or something, im not sure what to believe.

Is there a good approach to figuring out what to set for age demographics, interests, etc.

Is it a waste of time to just do broad spectrum promotion?

Is 200 bucks of promotion even worth it at all? or do you have to do something like 200 a day?

Can very good promotion settings plus good marketing images and copy make a single 200 dollar promotion worth it?

Yes actually, $200 is enough to test. What you can do with $200 is setup a broad campaign targeting 1 country and maybe a competitor's app/Facebook page (candy crush, or clash of clans, etc.) Setup 1 campaign with $20-$40/day budget and few ads in it, then I suggest you bid on oCPM basis (optimized to app installs). Leave everything else broad (like age, gender, etc.)

After a few days you will have a demographic idea of who your app installers will be. Than you can adjust your ads accordingly. Or setup a new campaign and target only the demographic that is interested in your app.

Note: you will need to install Facebook sdk into your app for proper conversion tracking!

I would recommend reading adespresso blog https://adespresso.com/academy/blog/ they have a lot of good info on how to optimize your campaigns and how to target effectively, specifically for mobile apps.
 
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It never occurred to me to create a campaign for a competitor app to get data.

Thanks.
 

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well, not FOR a competitor app, but more like AGAINST the likers of competitor's Facebook page

lol wait im confused.
So i make a campaign to send traffic to a link.
The link is for example Clash of Clans Facebook page.
Then you see what kind of traffic bites.
Is this what you meant?
 
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lol wait im confused.
So i make a campaign to send traffic to a link.
The link is for example Clash of Clans Facebook page.
Then you see what kind of traffic bites.
Is this what you meant?

no not at all, that would be a waste of money :)

you created an app and placed Facebook sdk in it.
then you create an ad campaign for your app, and you target 1 country + people that liked "clash of clans" Facebook page
then you see the demographics and the kind of traffic that bites

after getting some initial results in, you create a new campaign and target the demographic (age+gender) that worked best for you and you no longer include "clash of clans" fans in that campaign.

then you can segment further by income, other page likes, geographics, etc.

but the real gold mine is in "lookalike audience" which you can only build after you include that Facebook sdk in your app. you can create a lookalike audience based on users of your own app, and Facebook will create a lookalike segment of Facebook users that are similar to your apps users, and you can target those people with your ads.
 

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no not at all, that would be a waste of money :)

you created an app and placed Facebook sdk in it.
then you create an ad campaign for your app, and you target 1 country + people that liked "clash of clans" Facebook page
then you see the demographics and the kind of traffic that bites

after getting some initial results in, you create a new campaign and target the demographic (age+gender) that worked best for you and you no longer include "clash of clans" fans in that campaign.

then you can segment further by income, other page likes, geographics, etc.

but the real gold mine is in "lookalike audience" which you can only build after you include that Facebook sdk in your app. you can create a lookalike audience based on users of your own app, and Facebook will create a lookalike segment of Facebook users that are similar to your apps users, and you can target those people with your ads.

oh ok thanks i get it, i forgot you can target people based on what pages they like! that's very useful.

Shame about the facebook sdk requirement, i can do it but man its so annoying dealing with third party SDK's.
Seems to be worth it for the lookalike audience.

I have question though, isn't the facebook sdk data gathering only work for apps that are hosted on facebook? or do i just need users to "log into" the app using their facebook account or something?

I make very casual apps and i like to keep things as minimal as possible for users.
 

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