Living in a van down by the river

[Jakeeck]

I lived in a van while building my business and it was the best thing I could have done for myself for 2 main reasons.

1. I stayed in beautiful remote areas in nature (that still had cell signal for hotspot), which was great for my mental state.

2. No distractions.

Drawbacks?

Limited food options - you can still cook using propane stove but its a pain in the a$$ to do dishes/clean oily pans.

A little uncomfortable depending on how you outfit your van. Sprinters can be big enough to fit in a desk. I was just in my bed propped up with pillows working on my laptop.

If you're not going to be traveling and working from beautiful locations, don't do it IMO. That's what made it worth it for me.

I did it for a total of 9 months. Living in an apartment again but now already wishing I was back out on the road this time of year

 

[Jakeeck]

Anywhere parking lot that's open 24 hours I found best. Or Rest Areas work, but there's no wifi at the ones around here. But Fast food places were open 24 hours/day and usually you could get wifi outside, so that was honestly the best. I would switch it up so I wasn't over-staying my welcome at any one place. I had a power-strip in my car so I could charge my laptop, a sleeping bag rated for 30 below if it ever got cold and didnt feel like running the engine all night

Also the confidence you gain from it it unbelievable. Like my whole life I feared 'what gonna happen if everything hits the fan and I lose everything' but I really don't fear that anymore. It show you that almost no matter what.. if you were to lose pretty much everything you can still live pretty well. I honestly recommend it for everyone. Part of me kinda wished i didn't even have the car and make it with only camping gear.

Can second all of this. Also, staying overnight in any motel/hotel parking lot is really easy so long as you don't make it obvious you're in there.

I even ran into a couple sketchy folks in the places I stayed.

One guy seemed to be an old military vet. I ran into town for 30 mins and left my tent and a couple other things in my spot. I come back and he had my tent tied up to his truck and put my stuff in the bed of his truck.

It was dark out at this point, and he was in an enclosed cage in the back of his pickup. I yell into him that he took all my stuff. He says "okay take it" with a kind of pissed off tone.

He ended up tying my tent to the tree and his truck and I couldn't untie the crazy knot he did in the dark. I kept asking him for help but he ignored me or was passed out already. I ended up just cutting the damn tie for my tent. He also bent the tent rods lol. I was fuming pretty hard at this point because I felt like he was just ignoring me asking him for help to untie my tent.

I was going to leave a couple nails propped up to pop his tires along with an angry note. I wrote the note and then I was like "nah just let it go everything's fine now".

Ended up just driving a little farther down to a new spot. Actually ended up being a pretty friendly guy when I passed him walking a few times around the lake. Strange.

Then when I was sleeping on the street in Denver, some guy opened the back door of my van at about 3am (forgot to lock it), and was going through my stuff stored under the bed. My dog started growling and woke me up and then when he saw someone was sleeping in there he got scared shitless and booked it.

Also had a sketchy run-in with an angry farmer who said his neighbor would shoot my dog if he saw my dog chasing the cows that were on this public land. Got out of there the next day.

So yeah it def does give you the confidence to not only sustain yourself on very little, but also to deal with confrontation since you'll inevitably run into some weirdos.

 

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[Runum]

IMHO, the YouTube channels, especially with the hot girls, glamorize this lifestyle. They absolutely do not show the crappy stuff.

I am looking at being more mobile and self sufficient myself. My wife and I have taken 6 week trips during the summer to test some of this stuff out.

My experience so far:

I did consider a van, but, as has been stated vanning is hot now and I don't like to follow the crowd. Within vanning there are different lifestyles. There are urban vanners that sleep in parking lots, on the streets, in parks, trying to be stealthy. They try to use public restrooms and scarf free wifi. I know it's hot but to me it's a little like squatting and stealing. They seem to always try to get something for nothing.

There are rural vanners that stay in the national forests. You are allowed to stay for up to 14 days in most locations and it's cheap or free. There may be a pit toilet and fresh water. Usually no wifi or cell and no other facilities.

There are vanners that stay in RV parks. Some parks are fairly cheap for no frills and the price goes up with amenities. Some parks are amazing resort type parks. Vanners in RV parks always get lots of questions.

For us, I already had a 6x12 cargo trailer and a pickup truck. I decided to put a bed and kitchen in the trailer and we are traveling in it this summer for 6 weeks. We have tanks, porta potty, solar, and batteries. It weighs 3000 pounds loaded and we can put the trailer in some small spaces.

We have met some awesome people and some asswipes. Walmart parking lots in Colorado are shady places. Some national forests are amazing and some have crazy people in them. We have boondocked(camped with no facilities, off grid) in some fantastic BLM sites. We do not do the city stealth thing at all.

Now some of the negatives. Space is at a premium. Everything has to be organized. The inside will start to stink so you have to clean it and air it out often. You can't pack a lot of clothes so you are always having to do laundry or wear clothes multiple times. If your van does not have holding tanks and a functioning toilet you will learn to pee in a bottle and poop in a bag. Then you have to properly/legally dispose of your waste. If you do have tanks you will have to dump those often.

If your van breaks down you are homeless. Your van is in the shop and you can't be in it. Gasoline will be a huge expense and the price of gas in some states is around $3.50/gallon. You have to maintain your van mechanically and no one wants you to do it in their space, not the city, not the parks. Just popping the hood raises eyebrows.

It can be very cold in the van in the winter and very hot in the summer. I have seen a lot of van dwellers this summer in Colorado, Idaho, Wyoming, and Montana where the high temps are low 80's. I don't think they hang around when the snow starts piling up. Most are not 4wd vans.

Sleeping in a van in a storm keeps me awake, not sure about others.

East coast, west coast, forest, and city dweller's experiences are different. Watch their youtube channels for the differences. We are not stealth, we are efficient. We can't camp under trees off grid. We can plug in at RV parks and are right now. Wifi and cell signal is always a hassle.

Everything, every task, requires more time, thought, and energy than you would expend in a stick and brick house.

We have met many couples in their 30's living mobile lifestyles in RV's. Some got wiped out in Houston(Hurricane Harvey) and never rebuilt.

This is my experience so far. We are enjoying it but not for any money savings. We are enjoying moving to where the weather and climate is not working against us. We will be finished late July. To me, there is a right way to do it. Stealth and being subversive is not the right way. Walmart parking lots is definitely not the right way.

To each his own, good luck.

 

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[Kak]

I thought I would let this go, but I’m not going to.

Am I the only one willing to point out the paradox of a group of people dedicated to millionaire entrepreneurship advocating living in a van?

If you want to travel the country in an RV, do it by choice, in a cool RV. Not out of some notion that you need to save $600 in rent money for your “business.”

This reminds me of the dumpster diving thread where someone was proud of themselves for finding a 10 year old MacBook that “worked.”

I know, I’m a relic. I live in a home, have a wife, have good grammar, buy my own computers and wear suits sometimes.

“Gasp! Suits are uncomfortable. Grammar nazis are stoopid. I know, let’s live in a f****ng van and go dumpster diving! Oneitis!”

Living in a van doesn't make you cool, it makes you homeless.

 

[Fox]

Ha love this thread and have a bit of experience with this.

I ran out of money before and lived in a car...

I had just moved to New Zealand when I was younger and I had been working in Christchurch for a while. I thought Queenstown seemed like a more fun place to be so I packed up everything and moved down there to get a job. One week in I had blown all my money partying and had no job.

I ended up sleeping in a car for about 2/3 weeks. I would go to the local hostel in the morning and walk in like I was a guest. I could use the kitchen and also raid the "left behind" freebie bin. At night I would drive the car into this campground with the lights off. The owner lived in a house nearby and would never notice.

The only money I spent in those 2/3 weeks was on a few loaves of bread, a massive tub of peanut butter and some bananas. I still didn't get a job (I was really young and no one would hire me) and had to drive back to Christchurch with just a few dollars for gas. I remember freewheeling down every hill and driving like 80km the whole way to keep the revs low. Not even using the air conditioning and keeping the windows up for maximum mileage haha. I was that broke.

While the idea of living in a van is romantic and appeals to my inner "wilderness man" it is pretty rough. Especially if you are living in a van to save money, as opposed to someone who can afford to live in a proper van ha. I think focus on learning how to make more (like @Kak and @Andy Black are saying). Once you have more get the van and take weekends off to go travel.

There is no shortage of money out there so don't live in a van because you think you have to. Live in a van cause you have a business making plenty of money and it is fun to do on the side.

 

[AgainstAllOdds]

If you're actually doing it for your business, then do it.

If you're doing it because you like the idea of living in a van, then don't.

The mindset in the first scenario will allow you to succeed. The mindset in the second scenario will lead you to being a mediocre low paid bum.

 

[Kak]

@Kak I don't know that the OP is doing this just to save $600... I read it more as a way to eliminate distraction and do something he wants to do along with starting his company. Like Thoreau staying at Walden Pond while he wrote... well yeah, Walden Pond. I agree it's not worth it to save money this way. There are as many problems (electricity, running water) as benefits (no reason not to work because wth else are you gonna do in a van). It might be worth it for someone who needs a change of scenery though. And temporary... not for years, I imagine.

I see the point everyone is trying to make, but I call bullshit. If you can't take care of business at home you are not going to do any better just because you live in a van. It is an excuse, an action fake and a dodge of responsibility.

"I'm movin' to a van to grow my empire." Yeah ok. Let me know when the millions start flowing and be sure to bring your food stamps with you.

 

[Vitaly the Winne]

This is what came to mind when I read the title.

View: https://youtu.be/Xv2VIEY9-A8

 

[SteveO]

A small motorhome or travel trailer and a pickup. Set them up with a 250W or more solar panel system, good batteries, and a 1000W or larger invertor and you are set. There are plenty of free campgrounds. Stay at higher elevations in the summer and lower in the winter. You can't run air conditioning but there are thermostatically controlled fans you can install. You can buy signal boosters for your internet as well.

I do this a lot just for enjoyment. Love to travel the southwest. I have a great setup that allows me to get into the wide open areas of nature. Still have all the conveniences also.

I enjoy it so much that I just sold this trailer and bought a 39' diesel motorhome. Decked it out with 600W of solar. It even has a washer dryer combo unit.

 

[bdb]

Hey guys,

I've been thinking about going full time with my business instead of dedicating my best hours to my slowlane job, but I need to pay for the roof over my head plus vehicle expenses and food every month. What do you guys think about living in a vehicle in order to quit my job, cut expenses and do actual work on the business every day?

I'm a developer and I'm finding it very hard to come home after a long day of work and start coding websites & apps for my business. I tried waking up earlier but again 3 hours a day (max I could do efficiently without it affecting my slowlane job) is not enough time to get some of these development projects to a MVP state. My biggest concern is not feeling comfortable in a vehicle, but then that might be an additional help in forcing me to put the long hours to get out of that self imposed homelessness.

I know this does not apply to those with families but has anyone done it in the past successfully ?
For those who have experience, Is it harder to get a business going if you are living in a vehicle ?
Is it nonsense ? would it be better to move to the cheapest apartment in the cheapest state instead ?

 

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[ChrisV]

What did it take, and where did you park your car?

Anywhere parking lot that's open 24 hours I found best. Or Rest Areas work, but there's no wifi at the ones around here. But Fast food places were open 24 hours/day and usually you could get wifi outside, so that was honestly the best. I would switch it up so I wasn't over-staying my welcome at any one place. I had a power-strip in my car so I could charge my laptop, a sleeping bag rated for 30 below if it ever got cold and didnt feel like running the engine all night

Also the confidence you gain from it it unbelievable. Like my whole life I feared 'what gonna happen if everything hits the fan and I lose everything' but I really don't fear that anymore. It show you that almost no matter what.. if you were to lose pretty much everything you can still live pretty well. I honestly recommend it for everyone. Part of me kinda wished i didn't even have the car and make it with only camping gear.

 

[Andy Black]

Let's throw some real numbers

- My current rent is around 900 a month for a cheap apartment under a 1 year lease. If you add internet and utilities, its ends up being about 1200 dollars a month.

- In addition to that I pay around 160 bucks for vehicle insurance and around 200 dollars a month in gas.

- 350 bucks roughly for food

- Finally about 100 bucks for gym and cell phone plan

1200 + 160 + 200 + 350 + 100 = ~2010 USD per month

If I remove the apartment out of the equation I'm left with:

160 + 200 + 350 + 100 = 810 USD per month

Let's round it up to 1000 USD for other expenses like paying for a small storage unit or more gas etc.

In total it would be around, 1000 USD per month living out of the car/van.

Showering can be done at the gym, just need a 24 hour gym plan and you can shower every day after exercising.

Food, there is definitely going to be a change of diet, lots of cheap vegetables, seeds, nuts, healthy shakes and the like. For storage there are things like these,

Amazon.com: Alpicool C20 Portable Refrigerator 21 Quart(20 Liter) Vehicle, Car, Truck, RV, Boat, Mini fridge freezer for Driving, Travel, Fishing, Outdoor and Home use -12/24V DC and 110-240 AC: Kitchen & Dining

How much would I save ? around 15k a year. It's not about saving for me though (although its related), its more about allowing you to quit the job and go fulltime into whatever you want with minimal expenses. Also if you are into that lifestyle you can play around with your expenses, want to save more money ? eat cheaper food, drive less etc.

As NengHer above said (great youtuber btw) some people do it for the money, specially in the bay area.

Thanks for your thoughts.

You’re talking about saving $1k/mth.

What can you do to earn an *extra* $1k/mth instead?

What if you put your ingenuity and energy into earning more money rather than saving money?

What do you need to do to get a client **this week** who will pay you $250/mth?

If you got an extra $250/mth client this week then what does that do to your runway?

Can you get a new $250/mth client each month? What would that do to your runway?

Can you get a new client each week? What would that look like in 3 months?


As much as I like the idea of the freedom (and cool factor) of having a mobile van office I could live in at a stretch, I think you’re asking yourself the wrong questions. Do it because you can, not because you need to.



The super computer between your ears is going to solve whatever questions you ask it.

What if you were to ask yourself better questions?

 

[GuestUser4aMPs1]

FFS everyone's situation is different.

The leap from Employee -> Full Time Entrepreneur is one of the hardest thing you can do, and there's no magic bullet. Living in a Van, Househacking, 2nd Job, Move to Thailand, AirBnB, Living with Parents, Get a Roomate, Save up Cash, Disowning your Children, Selling your Organs...

Honestly there's so many options that it makes my head spin.

There's only two goals for this transition.
-Spend MORE time on the business (so you can focus on growing it)
-Spend LESS time working for someone who owns your time.

Expenses can be part of that equation, but it doesn't have to.

Sure if you're spending less money you won't have to work as much and that gives you the time freedom to focus on business. But what you decide to do is unique to each person, and each path has their own downsides.

-> Good RE market and credit? Househack or AirBnb
-> Love your parents as much as sliced bread? Live a couple months there.
-> Job demands 100% of your mental focus? Get a job with lots of downtime.
-> Live somewhere expensive? Move.

I did a combo of #2 and #3. Had a tech support job for a web dev company. When we didn't have tickets or calls coming in, I worked on my business and read. This was for a little over a year and worked well for me.

Sometimes the simplest answer is right in front of you, and is also likely the least romantic.

What can you do so you can spend MORE time on the business and spend LESS time working for someone who owns your time? Examine your own situation and answer.

You need a strategy and a plan.
If this van stuff makes sense, go for it.
But nothing is the end-all, be-all.

 

[B. Cole]

I’m gonna say that all the things that come with living like that - hygiene, food, where to park, etc etc., are gonna be distracting and not conducive to focusing on a business. My biggest distraction would be the scenery and lifestyle itself - I’d be exploring, fishing or doing something besides sitting in my van on a laptop. Not to mention perception from other folks you’ll do business with - though that might be the case with what you’re doing, but my biggest bet is that you’ll get no more work done.

Why not drastically cut living expenses by renting a room somewhere, where you have amenities for hygiene, food prep, etc. on hand not requiring a lot of planning and distraction, and do freelance or part time work instead?

Let’s be honest about self discipline for a second - some of the folks on here executing the hardest and making the biggest strides, also have a 40 hour job.

Good luck!

 

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[Andy Black]

My favourite trips ever were motorbike trips. You realise how little stuff you need. Just wash clothes every night. Or buy new ones Jack Reacher style.

I planned a 3 month solo bike trip round Europe, but some scumbags set fire to a car near my bike and a couple of other things happened that made me think I’d better skip that trip.

Even last year I toyed with the idea of getting a van and kitting it out as an office I could work in, and drive to different places and work there for the day.

I like the idea of being able to live in a van and tour a country or two, growing my business at the same time. I’m amazed and thankful how much can be done remotely, even with just a phone.

 

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[SteveO]

Motorhome parked in Utah. Trailer at the beach.

 

[Real Deal Denver]

I have a brother that lives in a van.

Tight.

Instead, go to Craigslist and you can get a "real" RV cheap. You will not only get a lot more space, but a real bed, and a real toilet. Roof mounted A/C is also a big bonus. Spend more money and you can get a furnace and solar power, with a decent kitchen even.

 

[ChrisV]

I think it's an amazing idea. I've literally lived out of my car for a while while building a business. As strange as it sounds, It was honestly the happiest I ever was... no rent.. no house payments. Jacked wifi from whereever. Sometimes stayed at friends, showered at the gym. It was the least stressful period of my life. Hakuna Matata.

 

[Roli]

I was going to say what a bad idea it was because of stuff like, comfort, hygiene and security, but apparently everyone seems to think it's great. So who am I to argue?

 

[reedracer]

The lifestyle is getting huge. There are the full time RV retirees doing it because they broke.
But, there are also affluent people doing it for all the above reasons.
I know Ashley in the below video. They home school which I think is the greatest gift you can give your child. They just added a camper to the pickup to be Ashley's office and their oldest's art studio.
The kids mostly watch Documentaries and are seeing the country in a very real way.
As for the upcoming entrepreneur/professional I see it as a much better choice than disparate roommates and all the distractions that entails. Live like Kung Fu's Kwai Chang Caine a few years, set injustices right and make more than a few bucks then move on to a more traditional setting if that is your desire.

View: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XjED-iHYGzQ

 

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[Jakeeck]

Similar related story, although this more so involves vagabonding.

This couple dreamed about frugally traveling around in a van — until reality smacked them in the face

Maybe #vanlife isn’t all it’s cracked up to be, one woman found

www.marketwatch.com

Idk what that lady was expecting, but she clearly didn't do much of any research/planning for living in a van. You can't just go anywhere for free and have a wonderful time.

And yeah, solar power is critical. It's mandatory. The fact that this surprised her shows she bought the van without looking into anything.

Weapon? Sure, knuckle taser or mace is fine. Chances of having anything happen are still very low but yes be prepared.

You can really only do van life on the west coast where there are tons of free campsites/BLM land. The east coast and middle of the country has almost nothing. It's all in ND, MT, ID, CO, AZ, CA, OR for the most part.

And yeah the weather thing. You are very limited in where you can go during the summer without A/C because it's low 80s just about everywhere, too hot to cook in a van.

I had to search the highest elevation cities in the country for lower temps and find free campsites out there, and I did find beautiful places.

This was my office view for a while:

Behind me is another lake that I would walk around 4x a day. It was very stress relieving and peaceful out there. Sometimes I was the only person there, especially on the weekdays. On the weekends about 5-10 people/groups would be there. I met some really cool people. It was fun.

I would never try to do it with a family or even a significant other (not a van anyway).

I think people have this idea that you can just find cheap/free campgrounds anywhere, and you can't, especially not in or near national parks, but that doesn't mean there aren't some beautiful places you can find, and all the ones I found had cell phone signal for internet because you can look that up before you go too.

 

[Jakeeck]

That's what I'm saying. There's nothing like that freedom. I had friends texting me like 'you can come stay here if you'd like' I was like 'no that's okay lol.'

In my opinion it's best to do this somewhere urban. That way you can just get food whenever you want and everything is near by.



Not if you get a nice 30-below sleeping bag


Absolutely. It makes you really realize how little you really need to have a good life. It's almost Zen or Fight Clubby in a way. I went back to my house with all the couches and nick-nacks and bookshelves and books like 'what is all this shit and why do I ever need it?' But I definitely think this is easier to do in the day of iPads and WiFi everywhere.

I wouldn't have enjoyed it in an urban area. My time in Denver was my least favorite part. The places I stayed were still within civilization - 25 min drive to grocery store/town with restaurants an hour to big city if I wanted to get fancy and go to whole foods or something.

And for sure with the furniture and stuff. I moved into my apartment 4 months ago and have almost no furniture still. No living room furniture, no TV, I still only use my hotspot instead of paying a cable company for internet.

This does a couple things:

1. I want to be more social with friends when I don't have the option to crash on the couch and numb myself with TV.
2. I have limited data for hotspot so I have to spend it wisely to not end up with terribly slow internet speeds at the end of the month, which means no Youtube/streaming binges.

It also does another thing for me... makes it basically impossible to have a girlfriend. One because I have next to no furniture, and also because I still drive the big ugly van as my daily driver

 

[Jakeeck]

"Hey girl.. come here often? "

I'm awkward as shit so I'd prob say something like "hey you from around here often?"

 

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[ChrisV]

I'm awkward as shit so I'd prob say something like "hey you from around here often?"

Well that actually makes perfect sense at an RV park.

 

[Rabby]

This is what came to mind when I read the title.

I'll have plenty of time to follow that link when I'm living in a van down by the river!

Such a great skit.

@bdb I see no problem with going minimalist, especially if you feel optimistic and "up" in natural surroundings. We don't need a lot of distractions when we're starting things. Logistically, if I were doing this, I would make sure I had good shower facilities, and maybe a coworking/reading space (library even) nearby for when the van felt cramped or isolated.

 

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[Vitaly the Winne]

I'll have plenty of time to follow that link when I'm living in a van down by the river!

Such a great skit.

@bdb I see no problem with going minimalist, especially if you feel optimistic and "up" in natural surroundings. We don't need a lot of distractions when we're starting things. Logistically, if I were doing this, I would make sure I had good shower facilities, and maybe a coworking/reading space (library even) nearby for when the van felt cramped or isolated.

Hahaha, it gets me every time .

As far as minimalism goes it can actually be a huge advantage in this sense. You eliminate a lot of things that are wasting your time or crowding your space, and only leaving room for the bare essentials and the things that you're really looking forward to. Like Bruce Lee once said, eliminate the non essentials, instead of adding more.

 

[YoungPadawan]

 

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[Kak]

Well personally the only thing I can do is...

Why do you think you can only do that? Who decided that? Why?

 

[Matt Sun]

Looking at your numbers I feel very lucky. I'm living in Brazil just 100km from Rio de Janeiro, paying just 300$ month for an apartment and i'm at 4 blocks from an amazing beach. the world is crazy. At the same time people pay 1500$ for one bedroom in new york wtf.

 

[Runum]

Here's my YT channel if anyone wants to see my build. I started in October 2018.

GB Adventures