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Rem

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Hey everyone. I have 3 projects going right now. These 3 projects will lead me to the fastlane to millions. One of these is a company I am now part of and we are selling a product and accessories for it. We need a little capital up front to get the ball rolling.

This new business has some instant sales up front (pre-orders) and huge revenue potential.

We are currently seeking just some simple micro-investors willing to invest at least $5K. The investor can pick from either of these:

1) Paid back within 12 months for a total return of 120% (20% profit).

2) Paid within 18 months for a total return of $130% (30% profit)

3) Receive .25% (point two five percent) equity in the company.

- $10K investment would get you .50% etc.

Currently we are working on a business plan but until then I can give some general information about the company. Our goal is to sell the company in 5-7 years for $10 million. I am willing to negotiate terms.

Thanks! :smx2:
 

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RealOG

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How much total are you looking to raise?

One of the things I would be concerned with, as an investor, is that you are spreading yourself super thin with investors. If you are looking to raise $200k, then there is potentially 40 investors in this deal.

Also, you need to include more details if you are trying to attract people. Most smart investors don't look at the return only to generate interest. They look at the type of investment it is, then at the folks running it, then at the return.

Lastly, if you are soliciting investors you are potentially violating blue sky laws. As an investor, the fact you are unaware of this would worry me about the viability of your project.

Blue sky law - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
 

Jonleehacker

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3) Receive .25% (point two five percent) equity in the company.
According to my math (which is admittedly sometimes shaky) this would give your company a current valuation of $2,000,000.

Seems a bit high for a pre-business plan stage company.
 

Bobo

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Your math ain't shaky.

...not duplicating that guy in Florida I hope :)
 

mkzhang

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According to my math (which is admittedly sometimes shaky) this would give your company a current valuation of $2,000,000.

Seems a bit high for a pre-business plan stage company.
Yes I calculated that as well, with a PE of 10 that would mean you're looking at least 200k net income this year end, higher since the PE for domestic private equity is low right now.

The market right now (depending on your industry) is like a 3-5, so you are looking at roughly 700k in net income to achieve your raise.

Not to mention early venture or private equity investors does not get interested in a 30% return (minus the original invested amount). 330% maybe.

Legal issues aside, investors would like to know where you get your projections from, your market research, feasibility study, and a pitch book of some sort.

Also then the investors might need to look for a lawyer to set up the convertible notes, what kind of share will the investor buy and how it will get converted to the payout method.
 

Blue

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1) Paid back within 12 months for a total return of 120% (20% profit).

2) Paid within 18 months for a total return of $130% (30% profit)
This just bugs me.

Total return 120% means I get back $11000 by investing $5000.
20% profit means I get back $6000 by investing $5000.
 

andviv

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How much have you guys got in pre-orders?

What is the general % of profit for this business?
 

Jason!

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How much total are you looking to raise?

One of the things I would be concerned with, as an investor, is that you are spreading yourself super thin with investors. If you are looking to raise $200k, then there is potentially 40 investors in this deal.

Also, you need to include more details if you are trying to attract people. Most smart investors don't look at the return only to generate interest. They look at the type of investment it is, then at the folks running it, then at the return.

Lastly, if you are soliciting investors you are potentially violating blue sky laws. As an investor, the fact you are unaware of this would worry me about the viability of your project.

That is a bad place to be. Never realized how much an SEC attorney was until I needed one... Holy cow.

OP - I'm not sure what your product is but I can tell you from personal experience the route you are taking right now is wrong. That many investors gets you into massive legal requirements, not to mention a huge headache.

If I were you I would work a little longer at my day job, bank the money and fund it myself. If you absolutely HAD to get funding you could ask family and friends or talk to a credit union about an SBA loan.

Set milestones that make money. If you can even run a portion of your business right now to bring in revenue and fund the next phase, do it.
 
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Rem

Rem

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Thanks guys. We are looking to raise $40K total to manufacture those battery powered outdoor wagons I mentioned earlier.

Right now in pre-sales I can give you a better estimate on Monday. We have a couple reps right now in the field and I will be getting updated after the weekend.

I understand if people are a bit shaky. I didn't really deliver a lot of info.

My plan was to instead of have 1 investor risk $40K I could find 8 investors to risk only $5K.
 

mkzhang

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That is a bad place to be. Never realized how much an SEC attorney was until I needed one... Holy cow.

OP - I'm not sure what your product is but I can tell you from personal experience the route you are taking right now is wrong. That many investors gets you into massive legal requirements, not to mention a huge headache.

If I were you I would work a little longer at my day job, bank the money and fund it myself. If you absolutely HAD to get funding you could ask family and friends or talk to a credit union about an SBA loan.

Set milestones that make money. If you can even run a portion of your business right now to bring in revenue and fund the next phase, do it.
How much did your SEC counsel quote you?

I work with SEC counsels all the time, can refer you some if the ones you asked are ridiculously expensive.
 

Bobo

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Just a thought, I know you were just throwing the idea out without any polish on it but, especially around here, you say opportunity and the glasses go on, the eyes narrow and the calculator comes out.

What I am saying is, you need to work on your elevator (30 secs) pitch for this. The questions being asked are good ones, ones you should answer in your literature.

I would recommend you go look over the prospectus for some different investments. In this day and age putting together SUPER nice looking literature and a slick website is not expensive. On the web, your literature and website have huge importance. If I walk into your suite of offices on the 129th floor then yeah, I see something that says "Real business, serious people". Online, you want to show me a professionally produced website that is very slick. You want it to direct me to the investors link and you want it to email me a slick PDF Brochure on your opportunity.

It's perception - I may love you to death and that will get me to offer some thoughts and perspective but when you want cold hard cash you really have to make an impactful pitch.
 

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OP
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Rem

Rem

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That was excellent advice. We are working on it. I tossed this up on 2 sites. This one I put up to garner insight. I love you guys... Good info. That polished stuff is coming. We may hire someone to take our business plan and economic summary and redo it professionally.

I actually went to the bank for a loan but I just bought a new house and it was a complete negative across the board.

So I have turned to find investors for this.

I have 2 other things I am doing. I may need to raise money from those two things to invest in this new endeavor.

By the way, has anyone heard of Chapco? That is where the wagons will be manufactured. They are going to take care of everything from manufacturing to shipping.
 
OP
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Rem

Rem

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I would like to leave a poll. When the Business Plan is complete who would seriously be interested in taking a look? You can PM me if you want to remain anonymous. I am also willing to negotiate terms.

Thanks guys.
 

Bobo

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I think I can speak for most here when I say that we're always interested in looking at an opportunity. When you look at the responses above the summary, forgive my bluntness, seems to be "Get your shit together and ask me again". I mean that with a smile, not a snarl.

...once you do that people will take a look and there will be a lot of hole poking but that's good. If you can refine your proposal to the point where this bunch is reduced to "Yes" or "No, looks good but I am fully committed right now" then selling to the average investor will be easier.

Keep going, it takes guts knowing that for every thing you think of, others will find five holes in your thinking but once you clog those holes and get to where nobody here can raise an objection that you can't easily overcome then ya gots yerself a solid plan.

...beats going to "Hey, I know dis guy who does private loans..."... we are skeptical but we don't kneecap people :)

PS> I am working on a proposal today, it's at revision 11 and hasn't been put in front of the customer yet... ya feel me?
 
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Rem

Rem

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Can I hire you to write one up for us? :smx2:

:smx9:
 

snowbank

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When the Business Plan is complete who would seriously be interested in taking a look?
I might be in the minority here but business plans are usually wack. They're usually a bunch of random info about nothing but noise that doesn't really have anything to do with whether the business will work or not. You should be able to explain in a couple paragraphs why the business makes sense. If you can't, chances are you don't have a business worth pursuing. That's just my feel on it.

Evidence based on due diligence proving why the couple paragraphs will work would be good, but a 'standard' business plan seems kind of silly to me.

The one's I've seen are filled with a bunch of random nonsense numbers that aren't really relevant to anything important tied to potential success of the business.

I am also willing to negotiate terms.
Ya, that'd be a good idea.:smx1:

No one who knows what they're doing is going to invest a pro-rated amount of $2m to gamble on a pro-rated $10m more than half decade from now.(unless it was a sure thing, which doesn't sound like it is)


Also, a 5-7 year plan doesn't make any sense. That is too long and is goofy to me. Nothing's going to randomly happen in year 6 that will make it skyrocket to exactly $10m.
 
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Rem

Rem

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If I were an investor I would want more than 2 paragraphs to determine whether or not it was worth my time and my investment. But I have seen business plans and some are real nice. Whether they ever reached their projections is beyond me but some projected out profits down to the last dollar through year 5.

5-7 year plan I think is good, as long as it is a goal and is subject to change depending on how things proceed. Goals are good.
 

Kung Fu Steve

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In the end (and anyone correct me if I'm wrong), a business investor invests in the person, not the business. Whether or not you have a great plan, product, or idea doesn't really matter as much as do you personally have the where-with-all to produce these results you are projecting.

And not to sound like a fuddy duddy, but isn't it illegal to offer securities (such as business equity) to the general public? Obviously none of us care but maybe telling you about this may save you from legal problems later. I think the only way around not filing with SEC is if it is a family member... I could be wrong though so don't quote me. I'm not a lawyer, nor do I play one on TV, I didn't even stay at a Holiday Inn Express last night so I could have no clue... maybe I should stay there tonight so I'm a little brighter in the morning? :smx19:
 

Bobo

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Can I hire you to write one up for us? :smx2:

:smx9:
LOL... I think the rate I get billed to clients for might be a little more than what you want to pay and a lot more than I am worth.

How about you PM me and when you have something put together I will do some wordsmithing for a fixed fee, say a bottle of wine.

Just let me know when you want me to edit, before or after the wine.

Before: Lots of big words, very professional
After: A tad more like I write on the forum and a hell of a lot funnier... or at least I think I am funnier than, better ask Jill :)
 

snowbank

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Whether they ever reached their projections is beyond me but some projected out profits down to the last dollar through year 5.
It doesn't seem like you know why you want to make this huge business plan, other than you've seen others make them that long. You need to have a reason for doing things in business. Making a big business plan because you think that's what you're supposed to do when seeking investors isn't the way to go. It's not WHAT you do, it is WHY do you do it.


5-7 year plan I think is good
Good for building a fire maybe. A 7 year plan wouldn't be relevant at all. Too many things change.

you: "from my calculations it seems like we should grow around 10% in the year 2017."

investor: "sounds like you've done your homework, i'm in.":nonod:


No one who knows what they're doing is going to take that seriously.
 
OP
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Rem

Rem

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LOL... I think the rate I get billed to clients for might be a little more than what you want to pay and a lot more than I am worth.

How about you PM me and when you have something put together I will do some wordsmithing for a fixed fee, say a bottle of wine.

Just let me know when you want me to edit, before or after the wine.

Before: Lots of big words, very professional
After: A tad more like I write on the forum and a hell of a lot funnier... or at least I think I am funnier than, better ask Jill :)
haha. Can I get both versions. I probably would like the after version better. You are also a wine drinker. I can send you something nice. Well the CEO is writing it up, not me. He was supposed to have it done by end of day today but you know how that goes. It will be middle of next week... so realistically maybe by next week at this time.
 

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mkzhang

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And not to sound like a fuddy duddy, but isn't it illegal to offer securities (such as business equity) to the general public? Obviously none of us care but maybe telling you about this may save you from legal problems later. I think the only way around not filing with SEC is if it is a family member... I could be wrong though so don't quote me. I'm not a lawyer, nor do I play one on TV, I didn't even stay at a Holiday Inn Express last night so I could have no clue... maybe I should stay there tonight so I'm a little brighter in the morning? :smx19:
It's not illegal, its the act of soliciting people to buy securities that is illegal unless you have the proper license and doing so under a registered broker.

Unless I am mistaken, any exchange of securities for money can be done privately as long as you prepare the necessary share exchange agreement and the certificates for stock or whatever. You do not need to file with the SEC.

I say this because that would mean the folks here setting up their commercial RE would have to file to the SEC every time they bring in investor for their apartments.

Openly advertising your company for investment, you better do this through a registered broker dealer / investment bank... unless you say you are strictly not soliciting and merely invite investor type people to look at your company in the footnote :p

Back on topic, just come up with a short & long term scenario.

Short term scenario is specific and covers many smaller items that will effect your company in the near future (2-3 years).

Long term is done on an estimate, aggregate level. Serves no purpose other than just extend your projection and give the investor a snippet of your goals.
 
OP
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Rem

Rem

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Thanks everyone. I have a product summary that explains in detail what the product is. If anyone wants to take a look at it shoot me a PM and I can email it out to you.
 

Blue

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I'm with Snowbank about the business plan. I haven't seen your other thread but I gather you are selling a wagon. If I were going to start selling wagons, I would start with a simple plan like this (just pulling numbers out of my a$$)

cost of a wagon: $20
retail price of wagon: $80 ($60 profit)
wholesale price of wagon: $40 ($40 profit)

Biz plan: Sell wagons on website, wholesale wagons to other stores

Sales year 1
Sell 5 wagons a day retail, 1825 total, revenue $109,500
Sell 300 wagons a month wholesale, 3600 total, revenue $144,000
Total revenue $253,000

Marketing Costs: $50,000
Shipping: $20,000
Other costs I can't think of:$30,000
Total expenses: $100,000
Profit Year 1 $153,000

Sales year 2
Sell 10 wagons a day retail (because you have better SEO, more traffic and marketing is working)
Sell 1000 wagons a month wholesale (by increasing retail store outlets by 2x)
Total revenue $699,000

Marketing Costs: $100,000
Shipping: $50,000
Other costs I can't think of:$30,000
Total expenses: $180,000
Profit Year 2 $519,000

It's pretty much useless to project Year 3 at this point because you don't know if Year 2 will go as planned. Heck, you don't even know if year 1 will be anywhere close to your plan.

Now the next question someone will ask you is,

"How do you know that you will sell 5 wagons a day?" This is where you pull out the data on how many people search for wagons online daily. You estimate your market share based on where you think your store will rank. You get a ballpark daily traffic number and then use 1% conversion to get to 5 sales.

"How do you know that you will sell 500 wagons a month wholesale?"
You have talked to Wagons R Us and they like you product and have committed to purchasing wagons and they're initial order would be 250 a month based on their experience. You have also talked to Home Depot and they want 250 a month also.

"How are you going to market with the $100,000?"
You have an estimate for SEO at $5,000 a month
You will run a couple 1/8 page ads in Wagons Monthly for $600 per issue
You will attend the Wagon convention in Vegas in 2011 at a cost of $10,000
You have a wagon giveaway planned during Wagon Wars Month in July for $5,000
 
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Rem

Rem

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Thanks for the info. Looks like I will be writing the plan. One of the Founders was going to write it but his sister is in the hospital right now and so I guess I am going to pick up the ball and run with it. This will be my first attempt at writing a Business Plan. Wish be the best haha!

:fastlane:
 

LagunaLauren

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How about you PM me and when you have something put together I will do some wordsmithing for a fixed fee, say a bottle of wine.

Just let me know when you want me to edit, before or after the wine.

Before: Lots of big words, very professional
After: A tad more like I write on the forum and a hell of a lot funnier... or at least I think I am funnier than, better ask Jill :)
Be cautious before you accept Bobo's generous offer, Remdog-Fair warning that he has refined taste! By "a bottle of wine" I don't think he means Gallo...But his expertise on wordsmithing is worth way more than any bottle of wine. I would jump at the offer!

In fact, Bobo- I'd buy you a bottle of Opus One just to read the "after consumption" version! Didn't think it would be possible, but you ARE even funnier after a cocktail or two!! :smx19:
 

BPA

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LOL... I think the rate I get billed to clients for might be a little more than what you want to pay and a lot more than I am worth.

How about you PM me and when you have something put together I will do some wordsmithing for a fixed fee, say a bottle of wine.

Just let me know when you want me to edit, before or after the wine.

Before: Lots of big words, very professional
After: A tad more like I write on the forum and a hell of a lot funnier... or at least I think I am funnier than, better ask Jill :)
So will a 1990 Chateau Margaux make it professional and funny?!
 
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Rem

Rem

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Alright here is my first attempt at a bio for my business plan. I figured the numbers are important but a lot of people invest in the "people" and not just the company since the ability to execute ideas is vastly important. So a good bio is important.

I dont' mind if you are critical. I want to do this right so please offer up and opinions on this. Thanks in advance.

-----------------------

Steven Remington: Is a successful businessman and entrepreneur. While pursuing a degree in Business/Management at college, Steven worked for a surveying company that specialized in professional surveying services including due diligence, acquisition, topography, right-of-way, residential and commercial land boundary surveys, to developers, builders, and lenders. Steve was on the surveying team that located structure corners, foundation footings, and steel beams for Jordan Grand Resort Hotel at Sunday River Ski Resort in Newry, Maine.

After college, Steven pursued his dream of writing. In 2003 he published a non-fiction book about his life growing up and hunting with his father in rural Maine. The "Legend of Grey Ghost and Other Tales From the Maine Woods" is written in journal form and takes the reader on parallel paths with two generations; a father and a son.

In 2004, Steven Co-Founded, and is presently, the Chief Executive Officer of Skinny Moose Media, LLC; a hunting, fishing, and outdoor blog network designed to provide a free platform for bloggers to publish news, articles, stories, and images. It has successfully grown into an active, highly recognized business and just recently partnered with a multi-million dollar company in an expansion effort. Skinny Moose Media has developed long term relationships with companies in order to fund the network, such as: Chevy Silverado, John Deere, L.L. Bean, Field and Stream, Outdoor Life, Bobcat, Arctic Cat, Copenhagen, Forbes, Honda, Mossy Oak, Orvis, Muzzy Broadheads, and more.

Steven recently (2010) Founded a new enterprise, S. Remington Company. This new and exciting venture offers many services including assisting other start-up companies to grow and become profitable through not only strategy but execution. Steven's business operational philosophy and leading principle is that "great ideas are thought of every day, but what separates those who are successful with those who fail is the ability to execute those great ideas."
 

snowbank

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Alright here is my first attempt at a bio for my business plan. I figured the numbers are important but a lot of people invest in the "people" and not just the company since the ability to execute ideas is vastly important. So a good bio is important.

I dont' mind if you are critical. I want to do this right so please offer up and opinions on this. Thanks in advance.

-----------------------

Steven Remington: Is a successful businessman and entrepreneur. While pursuing a degree in Business/Management at college, Steven worked for a surveying company that specialized in professional surveying services including due diligence, acquisition, topography, right-of-way, residential and commercial land boundary surveys, to developers, builders, and lenders. Steve was on the surveying team that located structure corners, foundation footings, and steel beams for Jordan Grand Resort Hotel at Sunday River Ski Resort in Newry, Maine.

After college, Steven pursued his dream of writing. In 2003 he published a non-fiction book about his life growing up and hunting with his father in rural Maine. The "Legend of Grey Ghost and Other Tales From the Maine Woods" is written in journal form and takes the reader on parallel paths with two generations; a father and a son.

In 2004, Steven Co-Founded, and is presently, the Chief Executive Officer of Skinny Moose Media, LLC; a hunting, fishing, and outdoor blog network designed to provide a free platform for bloggers to publish news, articles, stories, and images. It has successfully grown into an active, highly recognized business and just recently partnered with a multi-million dollar company in an expansion effort. Skinny Moose Media has developed long term relationships with companies in order to fund the network, such as: Chevy Silverado, John Deere, L.L. Bean, Field and Stream, Outdoor Life, Bobcat, Arctic Cat, Copenhagen, Forbes, Honda, Mossy Oak, Orvis, Muzzy Broadheads, and more.

Steven recently (2010) Founded a new enterprise, S. Remington Company. This new and exciting venture offers many services including assisting other start-up companies to grow and become profitable through not only strategy but execution. Steven's business operational philosophy and leading principle is that "great ideas are thought of every day, but what separates those who are successful with those who fail is the ability to execute those great ideas."
Remdog,

I don't think this is good- here's why:

You start this off by saying that you're a "successful businessman and entrepreneur." The first thing I'm going to ask if I'm a potential investor is, "how have you been successful?" The response from 99% of people is to talk about a lot of the things that you talked about following that. That doesn't explain "how" at all though. You're talking a lot but not saying anything. There's nothing following that statement in your bio relevant to why someone should consider investing in you. You are mentioning everything except the stuff that matters.

It doesn't matter if you worked a job while pursuing a college degree or if you live in a purple house.

How many books did you sell?

How much does Skinny Moose make?

How much does S Remington company make?

How much are the companies you're assisting making?

These are the only things that matter for an investor and you didn't answer any of them. These would tell what type of success you've had in your ventures.

Also, saying you partnered with a multi-million dollar company as part of your bio is showing that you think that is a big deal. If you are trying to convince someone to give you $2m that's going to be a red flag if a guy wanting $2m thinks partnering with a 7 figure company is worth mentioning in his biography.
 

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