Importing-Shipping from China to Canada

[rexxkai]

Hey everyone,

I have recently been looking at products to sell on Amazon, and I have emailed the supplier.

He told me FOB Ningbo/Shanghai, so I guess I'll have to find a shipping company to get the product to Canada.

Anyone have any recommendations for good shipping companies from China to Canada?

 

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[Vigilante]

@JAJT

 

[Walter Hay]

Hey everyone,

I have recently been looking at products to sell on Amazon, and I have emailed the supplier.

He told me FOB Ningbo/Shanghai, so I guess I'll have to find a shipping company to get the product to Canada.

Anyone have any recommendations for good shipping companies from China to Canada?

First I need to know the weight, number of packages, package dimensions, and whether or not you want them in a hurry, then I can give you a specific answer.

It is traditional to receive your first quote on an FOB basis, but you might not want to buy on an FOB basis. If it is a small shipment, chances are that you will want it sent on a door to door basis via air courier, in which case you ask the supplier to quote you on that basis.

When you refer to a "shipping company", that term relates to see freight. The generic term that covers all types of transport is "carrier". Sea freight for small shipments can often cost more than air freight and sometimes more than air courier.

Whichever way you want to freight the goods, especially as a first time importer, you really should make sure that the carrier is providing door to door delivery.

There is a lot of confusion over freight. I have been reviewing a well known importing blog in which the "expert" could not correctly answer an inquiry regarding shipping by sea. He gave advice that if followed could cost the newbie hundreds of dollars, possibly more than a thousand.

This is why I asked you for more information. If I can help you avoid getting a nasty surprise like the one that awaits the newbie mentioned above, I need a few facts.

You might like to read my post Freight Options Dec 3 2014 Sharing my lifetime experience in export/import. Product sourcing specialist.

Regards,
Walter

 

[rexxkai]

Per unit box size is 10*9.5* 9.5cm
And I need to order at least 12 for samples, so around 120*114*114cm.

 

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[Walter Hay]

Per unit box size is 10*9.5* 9.5cm
And I need to order at least 12 for samples, so around 120*114*114cm.

I calculate a different total dimension substantially lower at 30 x 19 x 19 cm.

The "Dimensional Weight" is so small, only 2.5 kg, that unless you are shipping feathers the single parcel will be charged at its actual weight, whatever that may be after you add the outer carton that will hold all 12 of the smaller boxes.

This means door to door air courier would be the preferred option. Ask the supplier to quote you on that basis. It would not hurt for you to get some quotes from couriers yourself. Here is a link to the UPS calculator. https://wwwapps.ups.com/ctc/request?loc=en_CN Just use it for comparison.

Get all your quotes in writing.

Sorry about the delay but my ISP has been offline intermittently.

Walter

 

[rexxkai]

Ah, I made a mistake there. How do you normally calculate the total dimensions? I see you stack 2 unit boxes by 3boxes.

I asked manufacturer to quote me via china postal service, and I gave her sample amounts for 3 different products. Now she has not replied me, even though it was clearly still work hours in china. Normally it takes her 5min to 1 hour to respond. What is up with the slow response? Its been a day. Is this standard procedure? This is the second time..

I will check ups link.

When u say 'get quote in writing', does email count?

 

[Walter Hay]

Ah, I made a mistake there. How do you normally calculate the total dimensions? I see you stack 2 unit boxes by 3boxes.

I asked manufacturer to quote me via china postal service, and I gave her sample amounts for 3 different products. Now she has not replied me, even though it was clearly still work hours in china. Normally it takes her 5min to 1 hour to respond. What is up with the slow response? Its been a day. Is this standard procedure? This is the second time..

I will check ups link.

When u say 'get quote in writing', does email count?

I look at the most efficient and practical way of packing small boxes in an outer container. You can do it by roughly sketching one box and adding more until you have the total.

Your request regarding China Post is outside her normal way of dealing with the issue and may be too hard for her to handle. This could be due to the factory location being a long way from a post office, involving a long trip through shocking traffic conditions. You could help things along by telling her that if it is inconvenient for them to use China Post, please quote for delivery by their usual Air Courier.

Emails are acceptable as evidence of a quote.

 

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[Vick]

Hey everyone,

I have recently been looking at products to sell on Amazon, and I have emailed the supplier.

He told me FOB Ningbo/Shanghai, so I guess I'll have to find a shipping company to get the product to Canada.

Anyone have any recommendations for good shipping companies from China to Canada?

I use DHL

 

[Bossopolis]

Ah, I made a mistake there. How do you normally calculate the total dimensions? I see you stack 2 unit boxes by 3boxes.

I asked manufacturer to quote me via china postal service, and I gave her sample amounts for 3 different products. Now she has not replied me, even though it was clearly still work hours in china. Normally it takes her 5min to 1 hour to respond. What is up with the slow response? Its been a day. Is this standard procedure? This is the second time..

I will check ups link.

When u say 'get quote in writing', does email count?

I would go with Walters advise on use courier for that relatively small shipment. I have imported a lot from China into Canada, here are some of my observations...

1) If a Chinese supplier does not reply to your emails "sometimes" that means its a "no" (but could also be on holidays, out of office, etc...) ... its a cultural thing you must understand... they consider it rude to say "no" in many cases. Just be aware of the possibility and If a week goes by with no reply, then I think you have your answer...

2) Contact UPS and setup an account. I ship over 100 packages a month with UPS and get about 50% discount. They will review your discounts on a regular basis so if your volume changes so will your discounts... Actually I charge my customers $29 to ship a product, and my shipping cost is around $14. Times that by 100 shipments and that is nice little bonus at the end of the month. Or you can choose to offer free shipping as part of your business model. And if my customers went to a UPS store then they would pay AT LEAST $30 and my competitors all charge $30+ as well. If you intend to hit the ground running right away just contact UPS to open a commercial account tell them you forecast to ship X amount per month and you should be able to get some kind of discount even on smaller volumes. Then next time tell your Chinese supplier you will email them the UPS label, have them attach to the package along with their commercial invoice. Now you get your discounted UPS rates applied that way. But get a quote if they use their own account just to compare... (some suppliers like to gouge on the shipping)

http://www.ups.com/content/us/en/bussol/browse/ups-small-business/ups-shipping-account.html

3) Make sure you have registered your GST # / Import # before you import commercially and also set up a brokerage account which can also be done with UPS at the same time.

http://www.cra-arc.gc.ca/bro/

First get your GST / IMPORT #, then get UPS shipping & broker account setup.

Good luck !

 

[rexxkai]

Your request regarding China Post is outside her normal way of dealing with the issue and may be too hard for her to handle. This could be due to the factory location being a long way from a post office, involving a long trip through shocking traffic conditions. You could help things along by telling her that if it is inconvenient for them to use China Post, please quote for delivery by their usual Air Courier.

She was ok with the shipping procedure I assume, it was when I sent her the sample amounts that she stopped replying.

I ordered 3 different sample products in different amounts.

I was wondering if that was what had got her stuck. Since it might not be normal to order say - 10 of this, 5 of that, and another 5 of that.

It is so damn hard to communicate with her, I don't even know what they are thinking, they never respond when there is a problem, they just stop replying..

Maybe I will call them directly tonight.

 

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[Bossopolis]

If you get larger shipments for For freight shipments, a company in Vancouver I recommend www.iff-logistics.com speak to Danny if he still works there...

 

[rexxkai]

1) If a Chinese supplier does not reply to your emails "sometimes" that means its a "no" (but could also be on holidays, out of office, etc...) ... its a cultural thing you must understand... they consider it rude to say "no" in many cases. Just be aware of the possibility and If a week goes by with no reply, then I think you have your answer...

Yep, I think that's what happened lol

2) Contact UPS and setup an account. I ship over 100 packages a month with UPS and get about 50% discount. They will review your discounts on a regular basis so if your volume changes so will your discounts... Actually I charge my customers $29 to ship a product, and my shipping cost is around $14. Times that by 100 shipments and that is nice little bonus at the end of the month. Or you can choose to offer free shipping as part of your business model. And if my customers went to a UPS store then they would pay AT LEAST $30 and my competitors all charge $30+ as well. If you intend to hit the ground running right away just contact UPS to open a commercial account tell them you forecast to ship X amount per month and you should be able to get some kind of discount even on smaller volumes. Then next time tell your Chinese supplier you will email them the UPS label, have them attach to the package along with their commercial invoice. Now you get your discounted UPS rates applied that way. But get a quote if they use their own account just to compare... (some suppliers like to gouge on the shipping)

http://www.ups.com/content/us/en/bussol/browse/ups-small-business/ups-shipping-account.html

3) Make sure you have registered your GST # / Import # before you import commercially and also set up a brokerage account which can also be done with UPS at the same time.

http://www.cra-arc.gc.ca/bro/

First get your GST / IMPORT #, then get UPS shipping & broker account setup.

Good luck !

Thanks for this, this is one of the things i'll be doing after I get my sales process setup- Amazon account, advertising, and other who knows what...

 

[P3HSB]

It is so damn hard to communicate with her, I don't even know what they are thinking, they never respond when there is a problem, they just stop replying..

I am having a similar issue. I might say one thing wrong and the whole conversation stops. They won't even talk to resolve the issue.

Emails are acceptable as evidence of a quote.

When u say 'get quote in writing', does email count?

When u say 'get quote in writing' would a message on Alibaba's TradeManger count?

 

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[rexxkai]

I am having a similar issue. I might say one thing wrong and the whole conversation stops. They won't even talk to resolve the issue.

i feel you brother, i feel you...

When u say 'get quote in writing' would a message on Alibaba's TradeManger count?

if it can be deleted by someone other than you, i think not- maybe walter can clarify if im wrong

 

[Walter Hay]

i feel you brother, i feel you...


if it can be deleted by someone other than you, i think not- maybe walter can clarify if im wrong

They can be deleted by the B2B site operator. In fact that technique is often used by websites such as Alibaba, DHGate and Tradekey etc., to remove any proof you may have if you lodge a claim.

To be safe when dealing with suppliers on those sites you need to save copies of all communications as well as screenshots of the original page on which the product was advertised.

It's a jungle out there, and most of the B2B websites protect their advertisers rather than the customers. That is why you must read the fine print of all the terms and Conditions and the rules for buyer protection. Even then you will find some of them are contradictory and confusing. I wonder if that is deliberate?

I have written on my AMA thread about buyer protection including escrow.

 

[Walter Hay]

I would go with Walters advise on use courier for that relatively small shipment. I have imported a lot from China into Canada, here are some of my observations...

1) If a Chinese supplier does not reply to your emails "sometimes" that means its a "no" (but could also be on holidays, out of office, etc...) ... its a cultural thing you must understand... they consider it rude to say "no" in many cases. Just be aware of the possibility and If a week goes by with no reply, then I think you have your answer...

2) Contact UPS and setup an account. I ship over 100 packages a month with UPS and get about 50% discount. They will review your discounts on a regular basis so if your volume changes so will your discounts... Actually I charge my customers $29 to ship a product, and my shipping cost is around $14. Times that by 100 shipments and that is nice little bonus at the end of the month. Or you can choose to offer free shipping as part of your business model. And if my customers went to a UPS store then they would pay AT LEAST $30 and my competitors all charge $30+ as well. If you intend to hit the ground running right away just contact UPS to open a commercial account tell them you forecast to ship X amount per month and you should be able to get some kind of discount even on smaller volumes. Then next time tell your Chinese supplier you will email them the UPS label, have them attach to the package along with their commercial invoice. Now you get your discounted UPS rates applied that way. But get a quote if they use their own account just to compare... (some suppliers like to gouge on the shipping)

http://www.ups.com/content/us/en/bussol/browse/ups-small-business/ups-shipping-account.html

3) Make sure you have registered your GST # / Import # before you import commercially and also set up a brokerage account which can also be done with UPS at the same time.

http://www.cra-arc.gc.ca/bro/

First get your GST / IMPORT #, then get UPS shipping & broker account setup.

Good luck !

@Bossopolis, Good post! I will just add a couple of comments on the points you make:
1. The word "NO" is not in polite use by Chinese business people. If they say yes, it can mean: maybe, sometimes, possibly, perhaps, and occasionally it will mean yes. Rather than say no, the most popular approach is for them to ignore the issue.
You can use this to your own benefit, and if they ask you a hard question you can just ignore it, and it would be impolite for them to push the issue, so you can get away with not answering those hard questions.

2. I have often written about discounts by freight companies. The published rate schedule is only for dummies. Never pay the full rate. Discounts go deeper than 50%, and as low as 25% is not uncommon. When they review the discount based on your volume, don't take it lying down if the rate goes up more than marginally. Bargain just as you did in the first instance. If they quote you a discount rate, make sure you have that in writing! That is extremely important when it comes to shipping goods from China. Make sure it includes Customs clearance work. It should automatically, but dot every i and cross every t so that there are no nasty surprises.
Yes, as you say, definitely compare when your supplier quotes. Sometimes they try to gouge you, other times they may have struck a deal with the Chinese office of the air courier, and based on their huge volume they might be getting rates you can only dream of.

3. For the benefit of readers outside of Canada I comment: All countries require importers to have an identifying number that stays with them for as long as they import. In many cases this number is routinely obtained for the importer by the carrier. The Canadian government has cleverly tied the application for that number to a compulsory application for a business number, GST, payroll tax, and corporate income tax. In many other countries the importer's number is obtained in the individual's name without the need to register for GST (or VAT), income tax, payroll tax etc.

Walter

 

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[Walter Hay]

She was ok with the shipping procedure I assume, it was when I sent her the sample amounts that she stopped replying.

I ordered 3 different sample products in different amounts.

I was wondering if that was what had got her stuck. Since it might not be normal to order say - 10 of this, 5 of that, and another 5 of that.

It is so damn hard to communicate with her, I don't even know what they are thinking, they never respond when there is a problem, they just stop replying..

Maybe I will call them directly tonight.

You new request should not be a problem if they are manufacturers, but to allow her to save face, be ready to return to your original proposal, otherwise you may never hear from her again.

If you do contact her by phone, be prepared for her to answer in Chinese. The usual Chinese word for "Hello" sounds like Huh -way. Just respond with either "Huh -way", or Hello and continue on in English.

Your new experience with the Chinese culture could be teaching you a valuable lesson that almost all westerners need to learn. Patience. Business is not done in China at the speed we usually expect.

 

[rexxkai]

You new request should not be a problem if they are manufacturers, but to allow her to save face, be ready to return to your original proposal, otherwise you may never hear from her again.

If you do contact her by phone, be prepared for her to answer in Chinese. The usual Chinese word for "Hello" sounds like Huh -way. Just respond with either "Huh -way", or Hello and continue on in English.

Your new experience with the Chinese culture could be teaching you a valuable lesson that almost all westerners need to learn. Patience. Business is not done in China at the speed we usually expect.

Thanks for the advice!

I am actually Chinese and can speak/write Chinese. However, I'm more westernized due to being raised in Canada..

but I'm turning more and more like Chinese the more I deal with them lol

 

[Walter Hay]

Thanks for the advice!

I am actually Chinese and can speak/write Chinese. However, I'm more westernized due to being raised in Canada..

but I'm turning more and more like Chinese the more I deal with them lol

Interesting. One of my former franchisees was Chinese, born in Hong Kong, and he used to bemoan the "Chinese mentality." He became westernized after migrating at the age of 18.

I am convinced that I got to understand it better than he did. I certainly learned to accept it better than he did.

 

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[rexxkai]

Interesting. One of my former franchisees was Chinese, born in Hong Kong, and he used to bemoan the "Chinese mentality." He became westernized after migrating at the age of 18.

I am convinced that I got to understand it better than he did. I certainly learned to accept it better than he did.

Haha, I can totally understand that. He was still young when he became westernized, I think maybe it's a generation gap thing..

Finally the supplier just replied me! Before that, I even apologized for being rude, to let her save face. I am not even sure if it was because I apologized or they just don't want to reply.

Still confused. Now they say I can only have 1 or 2 samples.. I am thinking whether or not they are legit suppliers/manufacturers... maybe they get my trust and then scam me with larger order..

Lesson learned:
-Saving face is supreme importance to Chinese
-When Chinese don't reply, maybe you said something wrong, did not ask in a way that gives them a choice, or maybe the way you phrase the question will make 'you' lose face when they answer it.
-Analyze every detail about how they communicate. How long does their reply take? Is the punctuation changing?

 

[Walter Hay]

Haha, I can totally understand that. He was still young when he became westernized, I think maybe it's a generation gap thing..

Finally the supplier just replied me! Before that, I even apologized for being rude, to let her save face. I am not even sure if it was because I apologized or they just don't want to reply.

Still confused. Now they say I can only have 1 or 2 samples.. I am thinking whether or not they are legit suppliers/manufacturers... maybe they get my trust and then scam me with larger order..

Apologizing was a good move. Saving face is of supreme importance and now she has every reason to communicate with you again.

Like you, I would be suspicious that she would limit you to 1 or 2 samples if they really are manufacturers. If you would like to PM me the name of the supplier, I can usually determine within a couple of minutes whether or not they are genuine manufacturers. I deal with such matters in complete confidence, as quite a few Fastlaners have found.

 

[Walter Hay]

Check your PMs. You will get two pleasant surprises.

1. They are genuine manufacturers.

2. The whole North American market is wide open for you with no competitors selling that company's products. As I told you in my PM, the company you are dealing with has only ever handled one export order.

Signing off for the day now,

Regards,
Walter

 

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[rexxkai]

Thanks Walter for de-mystifying the supplier.

Now it's sample quote time, and it looks like they wanna contact through skype.

 

[rexxkai]

Update: So I contacted the supplier yesterday.

Made myself look like a complete noob.

Apparently they don't ship out parcels, but want me to send a postal worker to pickup and send package to me.(going with DHL).

But at least, after she knew I was a noob, she helped me out by saying I would need the gross weight and CuBic Meter.

Then she asks me to wait while she calculated this.. I wait for 30 minutes, not done.. Wait another 30 minutes, still not done. By this time, it's past 1am. I am dead tired and dizzy in the head.

I ask if there is any info I need to provide, and if not, please send the details to my email.

She says ok, and I go off.

Today, check my email and no response. OMG... driving me crazy... shouldn't it only take like 30mins max to calculate this???

I think she's just making me wait on purpose..

Lessons Learned:
-You will make a fool of yourself a few times, but it is better/faster to try and screw up than reading about it.
-You will have to improvise and think on the spot.
-Recap previous convo before starting new chat.

 

[rexxkai]

Update: Supplier actually replied me!!

Sample is ready and just waiting for shipping.

Because the supplier did not want to ship via China Post, I had to find freight forwarding company.

DHL needed business #, gst #, and import #. So couldn't go with that.

Then I got quoted for $70 for the 3lbs sample. Arrives within 4 business days. Includes pickup from warehouse.

Is this a good price for this weight?

 

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[LateStarter]

I wouldn't get too hung up on the shipping costs of samples at this stage. You're not out to make money on the samples, you're trying to validate the product and the market potential.

Pay the $70, get the samples here and keep moving! Don't let this one-off cost bog you down. You can negotiate freight costs for bulk buys later.

 

[Walter Hay]

That price is not excessive. You say "includes pickup from warehouse". Do you mean that you have to pick it up from courier's depot, or that they will pick it up from supplier.

An air courier service should include door to door delivery.

 

[JAJT]

@JAJT

Wow, March 11? I've been away from the forum for a while. Been busy like crazy juggling a dozen things on my own businesses - sorry I missed this

Sounds like you are getting solid advice here. I'm also in Canada so feel free to drop me a line via PM anytime if needed (I get notified of those immediately via email).

Cheers and good luck with everything

 

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[rexxkai]

You say "includes pickup from warehouse". Doe you mean that you have to pick it up from courier's depot, or that they will pick it up from supplier.
An air courier service should include door to door delivery.

They will pick up parcel at China warehouse and send to my home. Actually they say they are using UPS, but I cannot get lower than $130 from DHL,UPS,Fedex with one time shipping. Possibly they have multiple shipments per month?

Also trying to find out if they are actually legit freight companies, because they want me to pay via Western Union/or direct to their company. And I pay after they show me air B/L.

However, The thing that really caught my attention is the fact that their logo font/style is the same as another logistics company, even the name is the same. Except for 1 word. Possibly trying to piggyback off a legit company..
I have contacted the legit company about this, now just waiting for reply.

Wow, March 11? I've been away from the forum for a while. Been busy like crazy juggling a dozen things on my own businesses - sorry I missed this

Sounds like you are getting solid advice here. I'm also in Canada so feel free to drop me a line via PM anytime if needed (I get notified of those immediately via email).

Cheers and good luck with everything

Thanks! Your a busy man! Hope business is going well! I'll pm you soon for sure!

 

[Walter Hay]

I thi

They will pick up parcel at China warehouse and send to my home. Actually they say they are using UPS, but I cannot get lower than $130 from DHL,UPS,Fedex with one time shipping. Possibly they have multiple shipments per month?

Also trying to find out if they are actually legit freight companies, because they want me to pay via Western Union/or direct to their company. And I pay after they show me air B/L.

However, The thing that really caught my attention is the fact that their logo font/style is the same as another logistics company, even the name is the same. Except for 1 word. Possibly trying to piggyback off a legit company..
I have contacted the legit company about this, now just waiting for reply.

Thanks! Your a busy man! Hope business is going well! I'll pm you soon for sure!

I think you are right to be suspicious if the freight company asks you to pay via Western Union. It will be interesting to see if they are just copying a big company's style.

When you are doing business in a country where counterfeits are commonplace, never take anything on face value. Business registration certificates, compliance certificates, inspection certificates, are all items that are frequently forged or copied, so websites, logos etc., can be too.

You may have to deal with the real UPS. They will normally allow you to pay on (or just before) delivery.