How to take on a big SaaS project when you lack confidence

[gabeb1920]

I've posted a couple of times before here on the forums and have spent quite a bit of time reading here plus some of the books recommended by MJ however I haven't taken any real action yet.

I work a slow-lane job which I'm not in a position to let go currently so I'm looking to start something on the side which can grow to replace and exceed my 9-5 income.

A lot of the successful progress threads I have been reading seem to revolve around e-commerce (I know not all but it seems to be a quick way to begin generating an income with a fairly low barrier to entry) and I've been considering going down that route.

However as the title of this post suggests I'm also thinking about a SaaS business. The main reason for this is that I work in IT and love technology and what it can enable people to achieve! It's actually something I'm fairly passionate about and I'd love to be able to use my skills and knowledge to build a business which helps people leveraging technology.

I've had a few ideas about SaaS businesses I could start but before I even do any research into if they are viable I get intimidated by the potential scope of the project. It seems to me that any SaaS idea worth its weight is going to be quite complex which means it is either going to have a long development time or a large cost. I don't really have any spare income so its going to take some time for me to develop the idea on my own in my spare time.

And even though I work in IT and have some programming knowledge I've never made any kind of project of any real size.

Sorry for the rant I guess it just comes down to:

• Is this just me making excuses or is it a genuine concern that a SaaS business is somewhat difficult to start?
• Am I just looking at things in the wrong way? A high barrier to entry does fit in with the entry in CENTS.

I think I'm in need of a little tough love here.

Cheers

 

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[Jon L]

Contrary to what "The Foundation" says, starting a SaaS business is really quite difficult. My eventual goal is to start one too, but I've decided to start a consulting business instead. I'm into my third year running the consulting business, and we're about to start making enough month to fund a SaaS startup of our own.

If SaaS scares you, listen to that fear and start something you can wrap your head around. Once you get more experience (and money), then you can venture into the world of building a software product. When you have the money, you can hire project managers and developers fairly cheaply (overseas) that will allow you to keep your head screwed on straight

 

[Empires]

Heres how I looked at things when I decided what business to start. I thought less about what type (e-com, saas, etc) of business to start, and more about problems/needs to solve. I have no experience with web development or anything, yet I am in the process of having a web app built. It was simply where I saw I could add the most value.

With that being said, you should play to your strengths. For me it was a learning experience no matter what type of business I started. For you, if you have programming experience then it is only natural that it might be best to start something online. Listen to your gut, but don't make it an excuse.

 

[GIlman]

Yes they are somewhat difficult to start. Is that a reason not to start? The fact that it's difficult == barrier to entry == $$$ == good.

I've built a prior SAAS and am working on my second as we speak. I probably have less technical background than you, all self taught never took a single CS or technology class in my life. I coded my first SAAS all by myself and was making well into 6 figures with it. Surely you can do better than me with your background.

There's people in this forum who have no little or no technical background that are building big projects.

From your post it seems you have an idea. Something in your area of expertise or a problem you have personally. If so this is a fantastic starting point. Being both a potential consumer of your own product and the visionary behind it is powerful.

In all fairness, the area I'm betting you might struggle...sales and marketing. Technical minded people, like us, tend to think about products. How to make them cool. Fast. Etc. Build a great product and it will sell itself. Or so we believe.

Don't fall into this trap. Great products become great because they have strong marketing behind them. Marketing is emotional, it's about trust and buy in. This is why social proof is so important, but seems so nonsensical to many.

Marketing can and should start before your first line of code. Find and talk to people that would need your product.

Find what frustrates them with current products on the market == needs. Your best ideas come from these people. For example, I was texting with @Iwokeup this morning and he gave me an idea for a killer feature to add to my product...and most importantly he is someone who would actually be my ideal customer.

So the question of can you do it. I'm sure you can. All it takes is baby steps executed one after the other 1000x.

One other thing. You have to stop asking CAN I do it. This is self defeating reinforcement that will destroy your confidence. Start asking HOW can I do it. Things get done with how's not can's.

Will you do it??




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[gabeb1920]

Thank you all for the feedback, I really appreciate it.

@GIlman - You're right that I do have an idea which I'm thinking of pursuing. I only thought of this idea in the last couple of days and now that I think about it I feel silly for almost discounting it before I even do any kind of validation!

I'm going to at least try to do some validation of the idea by calling/emailing some of my perspective customers to see if I can discuss possible solutions to the problem.

Even though I've only been in the forums for a few months I've learnt a lot about idea validation but I'm sure I'll learn a lot more when I actually try to do it!

I'm also aware that idea validation/extraction can be a painful process because cold calling is not comfortable for people. Well I'm about to find out!

Does anyone have any threads/resources they could recommend for how to validate an idea? In particular
@GIlman as my idea relates to the health niche with medium to large size GP practices and I know you've worked as a physician.

Thanks again for the advice everyone

 

[Supa]

To me it sounds like your focusing on the wrong things. It's like you're standing in front of a big mountain that you have to climb (=process) and are overwhelmed by it. Instead of thinking of easier ways to get to the top of it (=event) think about the first step that you gotta do, think one step at a time and after a while you will realize that you're actually in the middle of climbing this big mountain.

Do you think MJ would have built his business back then if he would've thought like you?

I understand that you are overwhelmed, it definitely is a big mountain. But would it be better to stand in front of this mountain starring at it for the next 40 years always wondering how great it may be at the top of it, just to die without even doing one step of climbing it?

 

[gabeb1920]

To me it sounds like your focusing on the wrong things. It's like you're standing in front of a big mountain that you have to climb (=process) and are overwhelmed by it. Instead of thinking of easier ways to get to the top of it (=event) think about the first step that you gotta do, think one step at a time and after a while you will realize that you're actually in the middle of climbing this big mountain.

Do you think MJ would have built his business back then if he would've thought like you?

I understand that you are overwhelmed, it definitely is a big mountain. But would it be better to stand in front of this mountain starring at it for the next 40 years always wondering how great it may be at the top of it, just to die without even doing one step of climbing it?

Thanks for the comments. I think you're exactly right and I have been looking at the event and not the process. As I mentioned in my last comment I'm going to start with the first step I can think of which is to validate the idea with potential customers through phone calls, emails and in person where I can organise it.
Thanks again for the feedback

 

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[apexstrat]

Have you read Lean Startup?

Think about how you can build an MVP to test your idea. Mock something up and get it in front of people. It could just be a video.
Then as you get traction and feedback you add more and more features over time. You don't have to do everything at once.
As you start to see some money coming in, you can reinvest this in paying someone with superior dev skills to enhance the product.

 

[gabeb1920]

Have you read Lean Startup?

Think about how you can build an MVP to test your idea. Mock something up and get it in front of people. It could just be a video.
Then as you get traction and feedback you add more and more features over time. You don't have to do everything at once.
As you start to see some money coming in, you can reinvest this in paying someone with superior dev skills to enhance the product.

I haven't read it yet but it is on my list!

I'm kinda familiar with the idea of a MVP but even trying to think of the smallest version of my idea I can still seems like a big task.

Remember I've never created an app and have only coded small projects and scripts. Granted some of these have been a little complex but certainly not up to the standard of a commercial app even an MVP. That's why I'm lacking confidence because rice never done it before so I don't know for sure if I can.

I plan to start with validating the idea and from discussions with potential customers I will try to identify the smallest version of the app that will solve a problem for them that they'll be willing to pay for. Then as you say I can iterate on that and add features/polish over time and up the price as I go.

I'll also make The Lean Startup the next book I read

Cheers

 

[GIlman]

Thank you all for the feedback, I really appreciate it.

@GIlman - You're right that I do have an idea which I'm thinking of pursuing. I only thought of this idea in the last couple of days and now that I think about it I feel silly for almost discounting it before I even do any kind of validation!

I'm going to at least try to do some validation of the idea by calling/emailing some of my perspective customers to see if I can discuss possible solutions to the problem.

Even though I've only been in the forums for a few months I've learnt a lot about idea validation but I'm sure I'll learn a lot more when I actually try to do it!

I'm also aware that idea validation/extraction can be a painful process because cold calling is not comfortable for people. Well I'm about to find out!

Does anyone have any threads/resources they could recommend for how to validate an idea? In particular
@GIlman as my idea relates to the health niche with medium to large size GP practices and I know you've worked as a physician.

Thanks again for the advice everyone

@gabeb1920 You've done your research, you are correct that I am in the medical field. I also see you are from Australia. So I have some questions for you...BTW you may want to PM me instead...because you may not want to talk publicly about some of this.

But...a few very pertinent questions.

1) What markets are you aiming for? Are you planing to aim for the US?
2) If you are aiming for the US, are you planning to deal/store/otherwise have patient information in any form what so ever? If yes and you are aiming to market in the US I would strongly urge you to look for something else. The regulatory climate in the US for patient information is beyond absurd. As an example, did you know that if you are an OB (delivers babies), that you are in violation of the law if you hang a picture of a patients baby that they give you to hang on the wall....many OB's in the past have had baby's photos on their walls. Now if you want to do that, gotta use generic stock photos, not actual babies from your practice...

I would rarely discourage anyone from trying to penetrate a market if they have a good idea...but the pain and suffering you will have if you are dealing with patient data (at least in the US) is probably enough to greatly increase the risk of failure. I personally won't go within a 1000 ft of dealing with patient data of any kinda...

BTW I'd be happy to discuss the specifics of what you are thinking if you want.

Also, if you actually start actively working on this...i.e. to the stage of coding or looking to hire a coder. We have a very active SaaS mastermind group on slack I started that has a very good group of people (7 at the moment) that are all actively building products...

Good luck.

 

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[Royael]

It sounds like you want to build SaaS for the wrong reasons. It probably isn't good to build a SaaS just "to start something."
The thing is.. its 2016 and the SaaS market is getting really competitive (but of course, don't let that be an excuse for you!). There is even software for every tiny vertical out there, and the trends are not looking really good. With Zapier and IFTTT you can basically already build your own "SaaS" out of available blocks. I think that trend will only emerge, making standalone SaaS solutions more unnecessary. But that may be just my opinion.

I've had a few ideas about SaaS businesses I could start but before I even do any research into if

I've rarely seen people succeed this way. Its a huge risk when starting from your "idea". A better way would find a problem/a pain and reverse engineer the idea. Take a look at the foundation by dane maxwell.

Regarding the MVP, I have just written an article (online this sunday) which provides a better approach to the common MVP. The summary is basically, you shouldn't start with an MVP but rather with an experiment by 1. proving the existence of the market/customer/need, 2. proving that your customer is willing to pay for it and 3. then only starting to think about continuing with the development/MVP.

 

[apexstrat]

shouldn't start with an MVP but rather with an experiment

Fair point, by MVP i don't necessarily mean write any code, but get something in front of people that you can learn from. This could be a landing page, some wire frames, a video (make some slides and do a voice over), images with embedded links so it looks like a real app etc.

Asking people whether they will pay for it is very different to asking them for money.

With Zapier and IFTTT you can basically already build your own "SaaS" out of available blocks

Have a play around with these and make something.

It's a process of stochastic tinkering, and learning along the way.

 

[gabeb1920]

@gabeb1920 You've done your research, you are correct that I am in the medical field. I also see you are from Australia. So I have some questions for you...BTW you may want to PM me instead...because you may not want to talk publicly about some of this.

But...a few very pertinent questions.

1) What markets are you aiming for? Are you planing to aim for the US?
2) If you are aiming for the US, are you planning to deal/store/otherwise have patient information in any form what so ever? If yes and you are aiming to market in the US I would strongly urge you to look for something else. The regulatory climate in the US for patient information is beyond absurd. As an example, did you know that if you are an OB (delivers babies), that you are in violation of the law if you hang a picture of a patients baby that they give you to hang on the wall....many OB's in the past have had baby's photos on their walls. Now if you want to do that, gotta use generic stock photos, not actual babies from your practice...

I would rarely discourage anyone from trying to penetrate a market if they have a good idea...but the pain and suffering you will have if you are dealing with patient data (at least in the US) is probably enough to greatly increase the risk of failure. I personally won't go within a 1000 ft of dealing with patient data of any kinda...

BTW I'd be happy to discuss the specifics of what you are thinking if you want.

Also, if you actually start actively working on this...i.e. to the stage of coding or looking to hire a coder. We have a very active SaaS mastermind group on slack I started that has a very good group of people (7 at the moment) that are all actively building products...

Good luck.

Thanks for the offer of PM for advice. I'll probably send you a message shortly

I've read your progress thread as I went through the forum looking for anything to do with SaaS. Your thread came up so I read it.

I'm planning to focus on Australia for the moment as that's where I'm based. It'll be easier to talk with customers and it means I can provide onsite support/sales if needed.

I might make it into the US later but as part of trying not to get overwhelmed I'll just start with a small market and see how it goes.

My 9-5 job is actually at a hospital so I've got a bit of an idea about the legal side and I agree 100% that handling patient data just isn't worth the effort. The idea I have in mind doesn't handle patient data so it should be ok. Also I don't think our laws here are nearly as strict as in the US.

I like the idea of the mastermind but I wouldn't want to be a burden. If the idea progresses I'll let you know


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[Exuberant]

Hi @gabeb1920 , I'm from Sydney too.
I wish you had posted this a day earlier, I would have invited you to a meetup at fishburners in the city last night discussing this topic of starting a software company and figuring out the development path.

The replies here are all pretty much what the panel members last night said but being able to network afterwards was great.

Some of the key points from them were:

• Sell/market the solution without coding software (if possible)
  • Can you do the tasks manually in the background without the customer knowing?
• Try and use white label software if you can - workible.com.au used white label software for their earlier versions
• Once idea is proven, then build the MVP
• A simple but decent quality MVP will usually cost around $5K-10K
  • This is important as it is apparently very hard to find a tech co-founder who will build the MVP for you. Reason being that the tech guy is usually already working on their dream idea and is unlikely to quit that just to partner with you
• Once you are ready to actually build the software, there should be at least two people when starting
  • one is the multi-hat person doing management of tasks/sales/marketing,etc (likely to be you)
  • the other is the coder who you want to just focus on the code

Not sure if you work near the city but there's a breakfast tomorrow discussing products & tech. Link here http://www.meetup.com/Product-Hunt-Sydney/

 

[gabeb1920]

It sounds like you want to build SaaS for the wrong reasons. It probably isn't good to build a SaaS just "to start something."
The thing is.. its 2016 and the SaaS market is getting really competitive (but of course, don't let that be an excuse for you!). There is even software for every tiny vertical out there, and the trends are not looking really good. With Zapier and IFTTT you can basically already build your own "SaaS" out of available blocks. I think that trend will only emerge, making standalone SaaS solutions more unnecessary. But that may be just my opinion.


I've rarely seen people succeed this way. Its a huge risk when starting from your "idea". A better way would find a problem/a pain and reverse engineer the idea. Take a look at the foundation by dane maxwell.

Regarding the MVP, I have just written an article (online this sunday) which provides a better approach to the common MVP. The summary is basically, you shouldn't start with an MVP but rather with an experiment by 1. proving the existence of the market/customer/need, 2. proving that your customer is willing to pay for it and 3. then only starting to think about continuing with the development/MVP.

Thanks for the feedback and advice.

The reason I'm considering a SaaS product is that as I have some skills and knowledge in IT it would give me a bit of an advantage over some less experienced competitors.

Also because I work in IT and am passionate about technology a lot of the insights and ideas I have for businesses/products are SaaS based.

Im not sure I agree with the comments about IFTTT taking away SaaS products. Yes the tools are improving and becoming more accessible but there will always be a need for more complex solutions.

In fact as technology becomes more accessible and businesses take advantage of this there will also be a corresponding need for the more complex solutions.

For example electronic medical records systems are now much easier to use. This hasn't removed the need for system administrators it has just changed the focus. Perhaps now these technically minded people can focus on how to use the data being collected or ways to better optimise to systems. There will always be opportunities for improvement.

As for the fact that I came up with the idea instead of talking to the business first I agree it may be riskier. However the idea does come from a pain point I experienced my self as a patient at a doctors office. I guess that means that the idea would appeal more to patients rather than the business owner.

But the idea definitely hits on a pain point of the patients. Not sure exactly how I'd be able to market it to the doctors/practice managers. Perhaps that may be an issue?

And finally I do agree with the idea that the MVP should be developed after consulting with potential customers so that we can make sure the product will solve a problem.

Pre sales would be nice but I'm not sure how viable that would be. Certainly I'll do some due diligence to ensure the idea will be of interest before making the MVP.

 

[gabeb1920]

Hi @gabeb1920 , I'm from Sydney too.
I wish you had posted this a day earlier, I would have invited you to a meetup at fishburners in the city last night discussing this topic of starting a software company and figuring out the development path.

The replies here are all pretty much what the panel members last night said but being able to network afterwards was great.

Some of the key points from them were:

• Sell/market the solution without coding software (if possible)
  • Can you do the tasks manually in the background without the customer knowing?
• Try and use white label software if you can - workible.com.au used white label software for their earlier versions
• Once idea is proven, then build the MVP
• A simple but decent quality MVP will usually cost around $5K-10K
  • This is important as it is apparently very hard to find a tech co-founder who will build the MVP for you. Reason being that the tech guy is usually already working on their dream idea and is unlikely to quit that just to partner with you
• Once you are ready to actually build the software, there should be at least two people when starting
  • one is the multi-hat person doing management of tasks/sales/marketing,etc (likely to be you)
  • the other is the coder who you want to just focus on the code

Not sure if you work near the city but there's a breakfast tomorrow discussing products & tech. Link here http://www.meetup.com/Product-Hunt-Sydney/

Great to see another Aussie on here!

Damn I wish I'd known as that would've been good.

I work in Darlinghurst but I'm not in tomorrow otherwise I would've gone. I'll keep an eye out on the Meetup page for ones in the future.

Thanks for the information from the Meetup. I agree with most of the points though I'm not going to be able to pay $5-$10K for an MVP!

Because I have a technical background in planning to do at least some of the work myself though I might outsource some parts to get it done quicker. Not for $5-$10K though!

And I'm curious about what others think of the idea of needing to have 2 people involved once you start developing.

At his stage I'm planning on doing both the development and managerial stuff myself. I've read somewhere that in solo businesses it's important to be able to wear both hats and switch between them. So when dealing with development tasks then you need to only think about development. When dealing with managerial or sales or customers then you're only focused on those things. Certainly not easy but is it possible? I'm interested to hear what other people think.

Thanks again for the advice and feedback. I really appreciate everyone's comments

 

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[GIlman]

Because I have a technical background in planning to do at least some of the work myself though I might outsource some parts to get it done quicker. Not for $5-$10K though!

And I'm curious about what others think of the idea of needing to have 2 people involved once you start developing.

At his stage I'm planning on doing both the development and managerial stuff myself. I've read somewhere that in solo businesses it's important to be able to wear both hats and switch between them. So when dealing with development tasks then you need to only think about development. When dealing with managerial or sales or customers then you're only focused on those things. Certainly not easy but is it possible? I'm interested to hear what other people think.

Thanks again for the advice and feedback. I really appreciate everyone's comments

Many people are going to scream blasphemy, but I'm going to raise some points that go against the gospel of starting a business.

1) There is no structure that will ensure you success or doom you to failure.

One founder wearing all hats. 2 technical co founders. 1 technical 1 marketing. 1+ technical outsource sales. 1+ sales hire out technical...look they all have been done and people have had success. I could point out examples of each, but no need they are not hard to find.
​

2) There in no one formula or roadmap for success.

Pre-selling, it's quite the rage these days it seems. But what if you go out and don't get a single pre-sale. What does that tell you? Either you have a really crappy idea, or your just not a good enough sales person to sell an idea without a product to back it up and show. I'm willing to bet that the later is more common. I've known several SaaS builders that could get no love until they had a product in hand.

Concept validation. This has a lot of the same problems as pre-selling. You may have a hard time getting to decision makers or influencers to discuss your idea. They are being bombarded by these requests now days, and quite frankly people are now viewing them as a foot in the door strategy for salespeople....not a positive thing in most peoples minds. If you are going after people that can't say "yes" to purchase it after you are done, say a product for secretaries, then your not validating much because they aren't really the person writing the check.

Idea Extraction. The problem here is that people don't know what they want...honestly. Look for problems...maybe you'll find something. But the single biggest problem with idea extraction. Often people that are using this method are searching for a problem in areas they are not familiar. They have no domain knowledge so your hugely dependent on the people you are extracting ideas from. You can easily be misled.

MVP. This has to be the most sacred gospel of all at the moment. People build MVP's for one reason. To fail fast - this is a risk mitigation strategy - a foot half in strategy. Sometimes it works and you abandon an idea thats truly bad. But this is the real question I have. How many failed MVP's were just not appealing enough YET for people to want them. Also when do you decide to fail, when is good enough good enough. For an MVP to work you are still making a lot of judgment calls and there is huge room for error.
​

3) The advice of gurus or their system

I hear Dan Maxwell brought up all the time. He has a system, supposedly some people have followed it to success...maybe maybe not. All I know is he charges a lot of money to show you how to make money. And honestly I'm highly skeptical when I see this setup. Usually the person getting rich by telling other people how to get rich is the person collecting the tuition money. The biggest problem I have with any "system" is that it proclaims to allow people to turn of their brains...follow these 5 easy steps...and this is usually a recipe for failure for most people. You've got to adapt and improvise to make things work the way that they work for you and for your market.
​

So, what's my point. Here it is. Take everything you read and learn. Take all the experiences of others, the does and don'ts and then work to find what works for you. This is your most likely path to success, doing things the way you do things.

Here's my approach that I use - because it works for me. Find itches of my own to scratch, usually there's some lousy product getting lots of customers. Or no product at all. I don't go outside of my industry or areas of expertise, I stick to things I know really well. I am usually a solo founder, I hatch the idea and then start to build the business from scratch. Lately I've been hiring freelancers to do the heavy lifting, but I have a good job and it's more efficient for me to work for $ and pay someone to do the coding. I spend a lot of time and effort to build a functional streamlined product, not always the most feature rich but it's very well put together. I then use the internet and direct mail to build my initial audience. Then I start doing trade shows once I start getting traction.

Why this method? Because it works well for ME. This is not a formula for success, this is MY formula for success, individuated for me and my own aptitudes.

But this is the one thing that seems to be constant for everyone. You gotta start doing something. Actively engage towards your goal. Try different things. Figure out what works for you. You will find your own process that you excel at - some of the things I don't like for the reasons state YOU may actually love and thrive at.

 

[Delmania]

I spend a lot of time and effort to build a functional streamlined product, not always the most feature rich but it's very well put together. I then use the internet and direct mail to build my initial audience. Then I start doing trade shows once I start getting traction.

You state that validation isn't important, and then right here you essentially say you do it. You may not agree with the buzzwords, but the concept itself is sound: the sooner you can get something in front of potential customers, the sooner you ca identify if it's worth pursuing or if you need to rethink the product of the marketing approach.

 

[GIlman]

You state that validation isn't important, and then right here you essentially say you do it. You may not agree with the buzzwords, but the concept itself is sound: the sooner you can get something in front of potential customers, the sooner you ca identify if it's worth pursuing or if you need to rethink the product of the marketing approach.

Selling a product inherently "validates" it I suppose. And yeah, I defiantly feel validated after the first sales...I guess what I meant is that I build the product and invest a lot of time and money before I really set out to validate it. I know many people are wanting to validate the product before the first line of code is laid (i.e. pre-selling). Or very early on when it's still an ugly duckling.

Certainly every product undergoes the same events in it's lifecycle. Idea, product creation, iteration, sales, etc...the question is the order and how each process is managed. Right now the in vogue method is start with any idea, create some sort of product, try and get users, iterate, try and get users, iterate, try and get users, iterate...with sales sprinkled in along the way or deferred until you get an audience.

To be fair, I'm not meaning to be critical of that technique. Just saying if that's now what works best for you do it another way...the way that feels the best to you.

 

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[Delmania]

Selling a product inherently "validates" it I suppose. And yeah, I defiantly feel validated after the first sales...I guess what I meant is that I build the product and invest a lot of time and money before I really set out to validate it. I know many people are wanting to validate the product before the first line of code is laid (i.e. pre-selling). Or very early on when it's still an ugly duckling.

I'd agree that getting paid is probably the most literal definition of product validation around.

The size and the scope of the MVP just depend on a few factors. One is how good at marketing you are. It's definitely not something everyone enjoys doing. It also depends on your market. Since you focus on areas you are strong in, I'd suspect you have a good idea of what will sell and what won't.

 

[GuestUser450]

SaaS is stubborn, with long timelines, significant growth issues, churn issues, payment issues, tax issues etc. all unique and inherent to the model; point being: it's not a great place to start.

Not saying you can't rather you shouldn't if you've never sold software before. Maybe building a plugin, or even buying one and using it to learn would be better...

Idea extraction: the term is great, but it's like a marine biologist studying his pet goldfish. Too many variables that have to be exactly the same. Customer interviews and their reported needs are neither predictable nor repeatable, they have to be honest, accurate, rational, and do what they say they will...unlikely.

Also: I think the entire Foundation process can be automated with incentivized surveys and upwork. [HASHTAG]#INE[/HASHTAG]

I haven't read it yet...

Skip it. Do data-driven, observational research instead.

 

[Andy Black]

Have you read Lean Startup?

I started this but didn't make it past many pages...




Try "The 7 Day Startup" by Dan Norris.

He talks about product-founder fit.

Is this your first rodeo? Then maybe don't do something too complicated.

Dan's thinking is: If you can't start it up in 7 days, then maybe it's too complicated, for *you*, at this stage in your entrepreneurial career.




If I recall, this podcast mentions SaaS too:

• www.tropicalmba.com/consulting

But most of all... this:

Take everything you read and learn. Take all the experiences of others, the does and don'ts and then work to find what works for you. This is your most likely path to success, doing things the way you do things.

 

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[gabeb1920]

Thank you to everyone who's commented and left advice.

I think for me it comes down to GIlman's comment about the need to take some sort of action.

Andy is right in that his is my first rodeo and even though SaaS is a difficult area to start with I still feel the need to take some action.

Because this SaaS idea of mine is the most developed idea I have currently in at least going to try calling some prospective customers to see if I can get some feedback/identify needs. I may crash and burn on this idea from that feedback very quickly but the feedback will still be very valuable and more valuable than if I just sit around and keep reading or looking for the 'perfect' action to take.

Thanks TeveTorbes and GIlman for the comments about The Foundation. I've been reading a number of threads about The Foundation and at this stage I agree that I'd be better off just taking some action myself and observing the results.

And thanks Andy for the book recommendation. I enjoy reading so I'll probably still also read The Lean Startup and I'll add The 7 Day Startup to my list as well.

Again the biggest take away for me from almost all the forum threads and books I've looked at is the need to take action and I think this is especially true in my case as I have a tendency to get stuck in analysis paralysis. I'm at the stage where I've done quite a bit of reading and learning, now taking action is my next step.

I'm not expecting to make any money on this idea and to be honest I probably won't even end up building the product! But at the very least I should try it out and get feedback. If it is well received then sure I'll take the next step and start building something. If not then at least I'll be more likely to identify needs/problems in the future and have a better intuition about how to solve them.

"Go as far as you can see; when you get there, you'll be able to see farther." - J. P. Morgan

Cheers


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[HiMyNameIsTom]

Thanks very much for this post -- its helpful to hear your experience of your path.

Also this mindset of "How are we going to do it?" not "Can we do it?" is a great reminder, thanks!

Yes they are somewhat difficult to start. Is that a reason not to start? The fact that it's difficult == barrier to entry == $$$ == good.

I've built a prior SAAS and am working on my second as we speak. I probably have less technical background than you, all self taught never took a single CS or technology class in my life. I coded my first SAAS all by myself and was making well into 6 figures with it. Surely you can do better than me with your background.

There's people in this forum who have no little or no technical background that are building big projects.

From your post it seems you have an idea. Something in your area of expertise or a problem you have personally. If so this is a fantastic starting point. Being both a potential consumer of your own product and the visionary behind it is powerful.

In all fairness, the area I'm betting you might struggle...sales and marketing. Technical minded people, like us, tend to think about products. How to make them cool. Fast. Etc. Build a great product and it will sell itself. Or so we believe.

Don't fall into this trap. Great products become great because they have strong marketing behind them. Marketing is emotional, it's about trust and buy in. This is why social proof is so important, but seems so nonsensical to many.

Marketing can and should start before your first line of code. Find and talk to people that would need your product.

Find what frustrates them with current products on the market == needs. Your best ideas come from these people. For example, I was texting with @Iwokeup this morning and he gave me an idea for a killer feature to add to my product...and most importantly he is someone who would actually be my ideal customer.

So the question of can you do it. I'm sure you can. All it takes is baby steps executed one after the other 1000x.

One other thing. You have to stop asking CAN I do it. This is self defeating reinforcement that will destroy your confidence. Start asking HOW can I do it. Things get done with how's not can's.

Will you do it??




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[HiMyNameIsTom]

Yes I notice I need to transition my thinking from "This is annoying for me as a consumer so other consumers would be happy if this was solved" (when it would cost the business to solve it) to "This is annoying for that business owner so obviously he will pay for it."

Interesting to see that was a potential issue in your thought process too. Definitely find out if the doctor or whoever will pay, rather than assuming the owner wants the patients to be less annoyed.

Thanks for the feedback and advice.

The reason I'm considering a SaaS product is that as I have some skills and knowledge in IT it would give me a bit of an advantage over some less experienced competitors.

Also because I work in IT and am passionate about technology a lot of the insights and ideas I have for businesses/products are SaaS based.

Im not sure I agree with the comments about IFTTT taking away SaaS products. Yes the tools are improving and becoming more accessible but there will always be a need for more complex solutions.

In fact as technology becomes more accessible and businesses take advantage of this there will also be a corresponding need for the more complex solutions.

For example electronic medical records systems are now much easier to use. This hasn't removed the need for system administrators it has just changed the focus. Perhaps now these technically minded people can focus on how to use the data being collected or ways to better optimise to systems. There will always be opportunities for improvement.

As for the fact that I came up with the idea instead of talking to the business first I agree it may be riskier. However the idea does come from a pain point I experienced my self as a patient at a doctors office. I guess that means that the idea would appeal more to patients rather than the business owner.

But the idea definitely hits on a pain point of the patients. Not sure exactly how I'd be able to market it to the doctors/practice managers. Perhaps that may be an issue?

And finally I do agree with the idea that the MVP should be developed after consulting with potential customers so that we can make sure the product will solve a problem.

Pre sales would be nice but I'm not sure how viable that would be. Certainly I'll do some due diligence to ensure the idea will be of interest before making the MVP.

 

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[HiMyNameIsTom]

i agree having the conversation is a good idea, even if they don't like it, its possible the conversation could redirect you to a better idea when you hear what they REALLY worry about...

Thank you to everyone who's commented and left advice.

I think for me it comes down to GIlman's comment about the need to take some sort of action.

Andy is right in that his is my first rodeo and even though SaaS is a difficult area to start with I still feel the need to take some action.

Because this SaaS idea of mine is the most developed idea I have currently in at least going to try calling some prospective customers to see if I can get some feedback/identify needs. I may crash and burn on this idea from that feedback very quickly but the feedback will still be very valuable and more valuable than if I just sit around and keep reading or looking for the 'perfect' action to take.

Thanks TeveTorbes and GIlman for the comments about The Foundation. I've been reading a number of threads about The Foundation and at this stage I agree that I'd be better off just taking some action myself and observing the results.

And thanks Andy for the book recommendation. I enjoy reading so I'll probably still also read The Lean Startup and I'll add The 7 Day Startup to my list as well.

Again the biggest take away for me from almost all the forum threads and books I've looked at is the need to take action and I think this is especially true in my case as I have a tendency to get stuck in analysis paralysis. I'm at the stage where I've done quite a bit of reading and learning, now taking action is my next step.

I'm not expecting to make any money on this idea and to be honest I probably won't even end up building the product! But at the very least I should try it out and get feedback. If it is well received then sure I'll take the next step and start building something. If not then at least I'll be more likely to identify needs/problems in the future and have a better intuition about how to solve them.

"Go as far as you can see; when you get there, you'll be able to see farther." - J. P. Morgan

Cheers


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[DaveC]

Have you looked at competitors in the spaces you are considering? Rather than starting from scratch, it may be more economical to try to buy them out, partner with them, work an affiliate deal with them, etc.... Having a base of customers/revenue/product is a lot easier to work with