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HOT TOPIC Have Smartphones Destroyed A Generation?

Stevee2K

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That's not correct to say so. The usage of em, maybe. ALmost the same situation as with many things invented in the last 20 years. The easier they make your life, the lazier you are. Once there won't be any devices, we will struggle. But not, I see no reason to give up using em.
 

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But not, I see no reason to give up using em.
No one here is saying to "give up using them".

Vicodin works to relieve pain. But just because it works, dosn't mean our kids should have unlimited access to it. Any tool (or drug) that f*cks with your dopamine is something not to be treated lightly.
 

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Agreed.

I have an interesting problem with smartphones. I like reading books on mine. I read all the time...so I'm sure it looks like I have a problem. I worry that my kids won't/can't make the distinction.
Have you tried an e-reader? I put off getting one for years figuring I already have a phone and tablet that I can read stuff on, so I don't need to waste money on yet another electronic device. But I found that e-readers are absolutely worth it. Reading on the e-reader is WAY better than reading on the phone. And, because it is a single purpose device, you are less likely to get distracted with other stuff (emails, other apps, etc.) while reading.

Nevertheless, I still find myself getting occassionally distracted with the e-reader. For example, I'll be in the middle of a business book and then, for no obvious reason, switch to the history book I'm working through. Just shows how much my smartphone has messed up my brain, getting it used to switching inputs constantly. Still, I definitely prefer the e-reader to physical books.
 
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MJ DeMarco

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Zcott

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I was looking for this thread!

I deleted Facebook off my phone and I've had nothing but improvements. Only on my phone for specific things now and not pointless scrolling.

It's kinda funny when you delete it. Your body/mind is in the habit of just going on your phone and you habitually go on Facebook without thinking. But when you delete it, for the first bit, you still have the habit of going on your phone and when you realise there's no Facebook your mind is like 'oh, right, yeah,... uhm, what should I do?' Now I don't even think about facebook of social media, allowing me to think about actual things in my life.

However I also feel a sadness when I see people on their phones, mindlessly scrolling like zombie hooked up to a heroin machine... Bit dramatic, I know, but still...
 

Guest921Y

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Have you tried an e-reader? I put off getting one for years figuring I already have a phone and tablet that I can read stuff on, so I don't need to waste money on yet another electronic device. But I found that e-readers are absolutely worth it. Reading on the e-reader is WAY better than reading on the phone. And, because it is a single purpose device, you are less likely to get distracted with other stuff (emails, other apps, etc.) while reading.

Nevertheless, I still find myself getting occassionally distracted with the e-reader. For example, I'll be in the middle of a business book and then, for no obvious reason, switch to the history book I'm working through. Just shows how much my smartphone has messed up my brain, getting it used to switching inputs constantly. Still, I definitely prefer the e-reader to physical books.

I love love love my Kindle. Couldn’t live without it.
 

MHP368

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I remember my parents saying the same about video games.

Their parents probably said the same about television.

And their parents about radio perhaps.

There will always be addicted people, doesn't mean the whole generation is doomed.
 
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MJ DeMarco

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I remember my parents saying the same about video games.
You weren't playing video games while waiting for the bus, while waiting for the doctor, while sitting on the toilet, while sitting at dinner, while talking a walk down the street, while running a treadmill...

None of these devices was virtually strapped to your face and likened to an appendage that can't be gone without.

You're comparing apples / oranges.
 

luniac

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Yea i feel that maybe for the first time ever the generation argument doesn't apply here.

This may be the downfall of the first world lol.
 

Longinus

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You weren't playing video games while waiting for the bus, while waiting for the doctor, while sitting on the toilet, while sitting at dinner, while talking a walk down the street, while running a treadmill...

None of these devices was virtually strapped to your face and likened to an appendage that can't be gone without.

You're comparing apples / oranges.
I do remember how parents let their kids play on their Gameboy everywhere. We don't see it now because its now just changed with tablet/smartphone.

There used to be a time when there was only one tv per household. Now there's at least 3 or 4 in every house and in every waiting room, dinner, shop...

I've known people that were suddenly vanished from the earth because they couldn't leave their houses since they had to play World of Warcraft.

But we didn't see all those addicted gamers and tv audience, they were sitting in their living rooms or bedrooms. Since smartphones are location independent, it's something that catches our eye all the time. Therefore our perception is completely different.

There's definitely more dopamine-stuff going on with smartphones, agree. But as usual with doom prophecies as these, we're so focused on the extreme examples, we even ignore the "normal people". "Research" like this tends to say that smartphones are rather a curse than a blessing which is something I can't agree with.
 

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You weren't playing video games while waiting for the bus, while waiting for the doctor, while sitting on the toilet, while sitting at dinner, while talking a walk down the street, while running a treadmill...

None of these devices was virtually strapped to your face and likened to an appendage that can't be gone without.

You're comparing apples / oranges.
Maybe he had a Gameboy or PSP lol.
 

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Valhalla

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The thing is, kids can't afford these phones, parents can just throw them out the car window and that's a wrap
 

astr0

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My daughter knows how to unlock the phones/tablet and turn on cartoons on youtube since she was like 2yo. She's 2 and 8 months now and knows how to turn on cartoons on Samsung SmartTV, pause/resume/switch cartoons on youtube, turn on and play kids games on tablet and post smileys in a telegram from PC using only the mouse. And I don't think it's bad at all, she doesn't spend more than an hour a day with tech. It's part of their lives now.

I'm thankful for video games for training my brains. Being regional semi-pro in CS and Warcraft really sharpened my reflexes and tactical thinking. Not much less useful than a university helped with learning how to learn fast. I don't mind my kids playing them too (except for the MMOs).

However, I've never hung out on Facebook and other social networks and try to keep my children away from them for as long as possible while teaching them the absurdity of it all. People do tend to spend too much time there without any purpose at all.

Smartphones are great, but I'll better read this forum and Google Now feed while waiting in a line than semi-fake useless updates from people I barely know.
 

moneytree3006

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A good tip @LightHouse gave me was putting the phone on do not disturb, but then setting a handful of people to come through all the time.

That was a good solution for me. I can get my wife's calls, and my 800 number calls, but block everything else.
This is a great idea. I think I might do this!
 

rpeck90

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Interesting take the British ministry of propaganda - likening the draw of Smartphones to that of religions.

I highlighted this idea in the branding post I have almost finished:



Ultimately, the draw of "smartphones" is people.

Their "USP" is the ability to interact with, learn from, and be inspired by the most vibrant, valuable and interesting people in the world. The majority of "killer apps" on smartphones revolve around people. Some don't, but most do.

If they were like PC's of the 90's (no Internet), they'd not be as popular (their value is portability, not compute resource); it was only with the introduction of the addicting "people-centric" applications that it became - as the article alludes - an opiate of the people.

I think of them as the largest online multiplayer game ever created... with every "like", "view", "subscription" and "purchase" being a metric in the ever-evolving tumult. Lesser-willed people succumb to its grasp, sucked into trying to build a fake life in the constant hunt for stronger metrics... humblebragging their way through Dubai etc.

It explains the likes of this:
Sheeple queuing to see their "hero".......... a middle aged woman who "built a huge instagram following" sharing............. cleaning advice. Think about that. Cleaning advice. And they went out in the rain to "meet" her.

All those Instagram pics of luxury locations, "beautiful people" are levels inside the game. All those garish "Supreme" products and other overpriced crap? Colourful armour that gives you +10% protection (or whatever it is).

You are the character and your digital "presence" is the means through which you're able to keep track of its progress. Just like in World of Warcraft, you go on "quests" (travelling), fulfill missions (gym/productivity) and generally work on improving your metrics so you - too - can finally be lvl 100 and able to defeat the biggest bosses in the world... except the bosses aren't real, and your shitty job won't change just because you "finally hit 30k on the gram".

I believe the main issue is they have essentially created a hyper-reality, with ever more attractive, sexualized, interesting, stimulating experiences found through the digital world. Whilst entrepreneurs can take advantage of this (which I have been working on myself), the majority of script-goers are using it to fill their brains with shit.

The addiction isn't to the phones themselves, they're just the window to the world of temptation within. The article alludes to the idea that each of the experiences created around a core community (which you may argue this forum is a part of) has created a series of different congregations, all following mini "cult" leaders. This is a core element of human behaviour, and has existed for millennia.

The difference today is that with everybody eager for their 15 minutes, the bar is falling ever lower...

MJ (the cult leader of this community) obviously has highlighted his take on the world, and the community has evolved around it.
 

Kade

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Ultimately, the draw of "smartphones" is people.
I would argue it is far more basic than that.
It is humanity's inherent need to be distracted from one's own life.
Music, video games, instagram story updates, etc...
Would be really cool to be able to live in a world without all this, but it is what it is-

I believe the main issue is they have essentially created a hyper-reality, with ever more attractive, sexualized, interesting, stimulating experiences found through the digital world.
I believe the main issue is that people don't learn to use their brain, and reflect, because they constantly absorb information but don't digest it. Cognitive obesity. We are spending all our time looking at interactive screens. Hell, 2 generations ago, these things didn't even exist.

As a consequence we are missing out on a big part of what people of prior generations would consider "living".

Have Smartphones Destroyed A Generation?
Yes and it also created the greatest consumer generation ever.
Which is good for the economy (in the short term ?)
 
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MJ DeMarco

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I would argue it is far more basic than that.
It is humanity's inherent need to be distracted from one's own life.
Bingo!

@rpeck90 's analysis is spot on, but more of a macro-level view ...

What's going on really?

People are digging for meaning in an empty, meaningless life...
People are digging for distraction...
People are digging for validation...
People are digging hoping to find another swipe of temporary happiness or laughter...

The smartphone is simply their pick-axe, a tool that allows it to happen all day, everyday.
 

Brian Suh

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Great article... bit of a long read, but good.

Have Smartphones Destroyed a Generation?



Of course it has. It’s literal cancer. That ancietynpeople feel? It’s useful. It’s saying go make friends. Go find your passions. Go help someone to ambe you feel better! This was nature’s agent for change. But we numb that anxiety with quick dopamine hits. That anxiety towards girls? It’s. Saying go approach her!
 

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BB13

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The clue is in the name. Smartphones are great for people who are not that smart i.e. who cannot figure out a terrain without a google map, who cannot maintain relationships without constant contact, who don't value their time, who think that all answers to life/business problems are on google search engine (and actually take that as gospel!), who rely on stimulation/have addictive personalities, who need to be needed, who constantly seek external approval etc etc.

A while ago, I owed a smartphone for personal use - it numbed my creativity, stole my time, ruined my relationships. I got rid of it 3 years ago and never looked back. I often wonder if smartphones were designed to take away our fundamental survival skills (as if television wasn't enough to brain-wash us).

Early on in my smartphone-free days, I found that my focus and concentration increased sharply, amongst other things. Now I have one rule only - I only use a phone/internet to 'make money' and that is it. It is not using me, I am using it.
 

Seth Goodluck

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Headsup: Contrarian Opinion

I'm a full-on millennial here... (26 y.o.). I posted earlier... but I've got to say:

I don't think Smartphones have destroyed my generation.
If anything, they've enabled me far beyond anything possible in the past.

The advance of Smartphones and "Social Media" are the most potent, influential, and powerful technologies on the planet today. Smartphones linked to a massive (and increasingly massive network) represent an exponential technology.

Of course there have been growing pains (this is like handing a baby a powertool) and of course there are people who abuse themselves with it. But this is to be expected when humans are handling a technology more powerful than anything in the past.
  1. I can connect with my friends and family all over the planet and have subsequently planned on and executed dozens of travel and experiences with them I couldn't have otherwise

  2. I can run my business on the move, from anywhere, at any time or turn on airplane mode and disconnect entirely (if anything, laptops are becoming a dated technology)

  3. Why would I waste my time using a normal map or looking up a train's timetable when the answers are mere seconds away from me and likely more accurate?

  4. Why would I waste my time memorizing a bunch of occasionally useful facts when the information are just a short query away? Do a google search (because how the hell else would you find the information quickly?) on "Transactive Memory"

    The internet today, google maps or search as a prime examples are a digital form of transactive memory.
In short, Smartphones have not destroyed anything (other than your sense of 'the good old days').
They're a technological miracle putting almost unrestricted access on information and leveraged action in the hands of billions.

For people like me (who've learned how to use the tech and not be consumed by it) - they are a 10x force multiplier on anything I want to do.

Most of the people I know, most of my network has capitalized on that technology and we live AMAZING lives. Traveling, learning, growing, and using Smartphones as the tools they are meant to be. Just like using a bandsaw or lathe, there is a learning curve. There is danger. There is great risk to focus, well-being, and withering of important analog abilities (like reading a real map).

But those are not smartphone problems.
All of those issues are individual people problems.

Give an idiot woodworking tools and you will see a lost finger.
Give a dedicated, hard-working, and focused craftsman the same tools and you'll witness masterpieces
 

Justice Beaver

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I used to have my group of friends in college all put their phones (including mine) in the middle of the table whenever we were hanging out or eating and then take it back when we were done. It's sad, but it was literally the only way I was able to break that barrier to force ourselves to talk to eachother. Like MJ said, even older folks are doing it. My parents are doing it, and my grandparents are doing it. This is an epidemic and it's creating a world I don't want to be in, but I hate that. It's a beautiful world with increasingly doomed people. Eric Weinstein said "we never knew that capitalism was going to get eaten by its son - technology." I think it goes beyond that, I think our society is getting eaten by technology in some ways.
 

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Headsup: Contrarian Opinion

I'm a full-on millennial here... (26 y.o.). I posted earlier... but I've got to say:

I don't think Smartphones have destroyed my generation.
If anything, they've enabled me far beyond anything possible in the past.

The advance of Smartphones and "Social Media" are the most potent, influential, and powerful technologies on the planet today. Smartphones linked to a massive (and increasingly massive network) represent an exponential technology.

Of course there have been growing pains (this is like handing a baby a powertool) and of course there are people who abuse themselves with it. But this is to be expected when humans are handling a technology more powerful than anything in the past.
  1. I can connect with my friends and family all over the planet and have subsequently planned on and executed dozens of travel and experiences with them I couldn't have otherwise

  2. I can run my business on the move, from anywhere, at any time or turn on airplane mode and disconnect entirely (if anything, laptops are becoming a dated technology)

  3. Why would I waste my time using a normal map or looking up a train's timetable when the answers are mere seconds away from me and likely more accurate?

  4. Why would I waste my time memorizing a bunch of occasionally useful facts when the information are just a short query away? Do a google search (because how the hell else would you find the information quickly?) on "Transactive Memory"

    The internet today, google maps or search as a prime examples are a digital form of transactive memory.
In short, Smartphones have not destroyed anything (other than your sense of 'the good old days').
They're a technological miracle putting almost unrestricted access on information and leveraged action in the hands of billions.

For people like me (who've learned how to use the tech and not be consumed by it) - they are a 10x force multiplier on anything I want to do.

Most of the people I know, most of my network has capitalized on that technology and we live AMAZING lives. Traveling, learning, growing, and using Smartphones as the tools they are meant to be. Just like using a bandsaw or lathe, there is a learning curve. There is danger. There is great risk to focus, well-being, and withering of important analog abilities (like reading a real map).

But those are not smartphone problems.
All of those issues are individual people problems.

Give an idiot woodworking tools and you will see a lost finger.
Give a dedicated, hard-working, and focused craftsman the same tools and you'll witness masterpieces
I could not agree more.

Smartphones if anything merely exacerbate what people want to do.

Those that want to be recluses are more able to do so. Those that want to be social are more able to do so.

I want to say it's unfortunate, but really, it's not, that more people naturally want to be recluses than social. It's scary to be social, to be frank. You're more overtly vulnerable facing the world and people, making new friends, meeting new people, than being a recluse and avoiding it. Of course at the end of the, THOSE THAT BUILD FORTRESSES, as in those that are recluses, end up being way more vulnerable than those that do not.

So destroyed? Hardly. It merely more quickly separates the what from the chaff. Those that bother to go out are even more developed, and it makes finding other people of higher development and value easier to find. But at the same time, those that choose to develop themselves later on, can find information and people to help pull themselves up as well.

It's ultimately a win win.
 

guy93777

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Anyone interested in this topic, I recommend this book, Pulitzer finalist.
Absolutely disturbing.


yes

this is why people who can learn to focus again will be masters of the markets, the crowd and society


View: https://youtu.be/LJ9lnspNNRE?t=3




---> your american bankers even explain it to you on the dollar bills but you haven't understood the message


25963



so i explain it for you :



25964




.
 

ChrisV

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Headsup: Contrarian Opinion

I'm a full-on millennial here... (26 y.o.). I posted earlier... but I've got to say:

I don't think Smartphones have destroyed my generation.
If anything, they've enabled me far beyond anything possible in the past.

The advance of Smartphones and "Social Media" are the most potent, influential, and powerful technologies on the planet today. Smartphones linked to a massive (and increasingly massive network) represent an exponential technology.

Of course there have been growing pains (this is like handing a baby a powertool) and of course there are people who abuse themselves with it. But this is to be expected when humans are handling a technology more powerful than anything in the past.
  1. I can connect with my friends and family all over the planet and have subsequently planned on and executed dozens of travel and experiences with them I couldn't have otherwise

  2. I can run my business on the move, from anywhere, at any time or turn on airplane mode and disconnect entirely (if anything, laptops are becoming a dated technology)

  3. Why would I waste my time using a normal map or looking up a train's timetable when the answers are mere seconds away from me and likely more accurate?

  4. Why would I waste my time memorizing a bunch of occasionally useful facts when the information are just a short query away? Do a google search (because how the hell else would you find the information quickly?) on "Transactive Memory"

    The internet today, google maps or search as a prime examples are a digital form of transactive memory.
In short, Smartphones have not destroyed anything (other than your sense of 'the good old days').
They're a technological miracle putting almost unrestricted access on information and leveraged action in the hands of billions.

For people like me (who've learned how to use the tech and not be consumed by it) - they are a 10x force multiplier on anything I want to do.

Most of the people I know, most of my network has capitalized on that technology and we live AMAZING lives. Traveling, learning, growing, and using Smartphones as the tools they are meant to be. Just like using a bandsaw or lathe, there is a learning curve. There is danger. There is great risk to focus, well-being, and withering of important analog abilities (like reading a real map).

But those are not smartphone problems.
All of those issues are individual people problems.

Give an idiot woodworking tools and you will see a lost finger.
Give a dedicated, hard-working, and focused craftsman the same tools and you'll witness masterpieces
I could not agree more.

Smartphones if anything merely exacerbate what people want to do.

Those that want to be recluses are more able to do so. Those that want to be social are more able to do so.

I want to say it's unfortunate, but really, it's not, that more people naturally want to be recluses than social. It's scary to be social, to be frank. You're more overtly vulnerable facing the world and people, making new friends, meeting new people, than being a recluse and avoiding it. Of course at the end of the, THOSE THAT BUILD FORTRESSES, as in those that are recluses, end up being way more vulnerable than those that do not.

So destroyed? Hardly. It merely more quickly separates the what from the chaff. Those that bother to go out are even more developed, and it makes finding other people of higher development and value easier to find. But at the same time, those that choose to develop themselves later on, can find information and people to help pull themselves up as well.

It's ultimately a win win.
I think the answer is simple. Or complex rather. Like many things, there are both Pros and Cons to tech use. I mean to call tech bad is just insane. There are so many obvious benefits to it, otherwise we wouldn't be using it. That being said, there are some glaring mental health effects that we're seeing. Teen depression is on the rise, self-harm, even suicide. And those effects are significantly worse in populations that use a lot of social media. To be clear, it doesn't seem to be smartphones specifically... but Social Media. It creates this scenario where people are constantly comparing themselves. And people only post the best aspects of their live son Social Media. So it give people this constant sense that they're not doing well in life, when in reality people are mostly putting on a facade.

Medical Express - Depressed by Facebook and the like

"Everyone else is better than me. That's the impression you get when you look at profiles on social networks.
Great holiday, fantastic party, adorable children, incredible food: everyone shows their life in the best light on social networks. Those who take a look around on such sites can find that their self-esteem takes a hit as it seems as though everyone is better than them. Users who use social networks passively, i.e. do not post themselves, and tend to compare themselves with others are in danger of developing depressive symptoms. This is what a team of psychologists at Ruhr-Universität Bochum (RUB) led by Dr. Phillip Ozimek discovered. The journal Behaviour & Information Technology reports the results July 12th 2019.”


Medical Express - Some Facebook users perceive worsening physical health

Researchers found that participants who compared themselves to others on Facebook had greater awareness of physical ailments, such as sleep problems, weight change and muscle tension.


Medical Express - Negative vs. positive social media experiences and depressive symptoms

"We found that positive experiences on social media were not related or only very slightly linked to lower depressive symptoms. However, negative experiences were strongly and consistently associated with higher depressive symptoms,"



Tech is obviously an overall good thing, but it does have some serious effects that we need to mitigate.
 

Tourmaline

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@ChrisV Seems like the issue there is people comparing themselves to others. That always leads to misery. Social media just makes it 10000% easier. One should only compare their current self to their previously selves. Never to others.

A lot of this is a symptom of the death of religion and the wisdom that came along with it.
 

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