Gym is counter-productive to work. Or is it?

[luniac]

I get the skepticism though.
The whole trick of it is to "rest" while not sleeping, to minimize physical and mental tensions which lowers net energy expenditure.
To be in the bodily rest state as long as possible, so not anxious, not stressed, etc etc
If you can REALLY do that all day, ull need less and less sleep to recover.
Consider the possibility of that.

 

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[Delmania]

I get the skepticism though.
The whole trick of it is to "rest" while not sleeping, to minimize physical and mental tensions which lowers net energy expenditure.
To be in the bodily rest state as long as possible, so not anxious, not stressed, etc etc
If you can REALLY do that all day, ull need less and less sleep to recover.
Consider the possibility of that.

There's a reason I said 99% and not 100%. There is a portion of the population ~1% who are known as short sleepers, who do only need 4 to 6 hours of sleep. They wake up feeling fully rested and are naturally energetic. I'd theorize the majority of people on that list are short sleepers. The assertion that most adults need around 7 hours of sleep isn't mainstream, "scripted" dogma. It's based on science and physiology. Are you even remotely aware of what happens internally when you sleep?

I have a better idea. Stop trying to outsmart or "hack" your body. Sleep is too precious to mess around with. If you need 7 hours to feel rested, alert, and energentic, make sure to get 7 hours. Rather than trying to give yourself more hours, make the most of the hours you have.

 

[fhs8]

ur peddling mainstream dogma "99% of us need at least 7 hours of sleep..."

It's not mainstream dogma. It's science. Anecdotes of a few people who said that they don't get much sleep doesn't mean that it's a good idea to not get enough sleep. Also we don't know if the anecdotes are true or not fabricated since they are not based on actual testing of how much sleep they've gotten. Show me a credible source that shows Leonardo da Vinci didn't get much sleep since the sources in the infographic don't support it. Also the infographic says that Trump gets 3 hours of sleep yet Trump said he gets 4-5 hours of sleep so which one is it?

Also just 12 people out of the thousands of "successful" people who apparently get 7-8 hours of sleep. For every successful person that doesn't get enough sleep I can list 100 more that do get enough sleep. So that must mean that it's better to get enough sleep right?

Is it a good idea to listen to a bunch of people with PhD's on how much sleep I should get or random people on the internet?

CDC - How Much Sleep Do I Need? - Sleep and Sleep Disorders

 

[luniac]

ok how bout this guys.
I ain't planning on leaving this forum anytime soon, so since I'm actively trying to get to at least 4 hours a night, ill be the guinea pig for this experiment, and will report my results a few months.

Now all my life I've slept from 7-12 hours a night to be rested so I'm not that 1%.
In the last 6-12 months since I started fleshing out my health routine I've had random days where id wake up rested after 5-6 hours of sleep.
A lifetime of habit still makes me feel like I should lay in bed for longer cause its just "too soon" to get up, but i'm slowly getting used to less hours here and there.

My goal is 4 hours no alarm natural wake up.
wish me luck.

 

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[fhs8]

My goal is 4 hours no alarm natural wake up.
wish me luck.

What does having less sleep do? Magically make you successful? I don't get it at all.

The results are already out. It's a FACT that it's bad for your health and mental abilities in almost EVERY metric. Hundreds of scientific experiments all show the same thing.
Sleep deprivation: Impact on cognitive performance
Sleep deprivation: Impact on cognitive performance list of studies and tests

 

[luniac]

What does having less sleep do? Magically make you successful? I don't get it at all.

The results are already out. It's a FACT that it's bad for your health and mental abilities in almost EVERY metric. Hundreds of scientific experiments all show the same thing.
Sleep deprivation: Impact on cognitive performance
Sleep deprivation: Impact on cognitive performance list of studies and tests

With "average" test subjects. Have they done studies on people who do regular breath work, relaxation exercises, etc

Obviously if u take the average joe and sleep deprive him, it won't be pretty. I'm not denying that at all.

 

[fhs8]

With "average" test subjects. Have they done studies on people who do regular breath work, relaxation exercises, etc

Obviously if u take the average joe and sleep deprive him, it won't be pretty. I'm not denying that at all.

I don't see a reason why they would do studies on those who do regular breath work and relaxation exercises. There's nothing to indicate that doing those things is a substitute for sleep.

Why would doing tests on "average" test subjects be any different? The physiology of people who are wealthy/successful aren't different. If someone that's wealthy smokes cigarettes they are just as likely to get lung cancer as the average person doing the same. If someone that's wealthy doesn't get enough sleep they are just as likely to get sleep deprived.

I wouldn't give up sleep unless I absolutely had to. Even if that means waking up at noon.

 

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[luniac]

I don't see a reason why they would do studies on those who do regular breath work and relaxation exercises. There's nothing to indicate that doing those things is a substitute for sleep.

Why would doing tests on "average" test subjects be any different? The physiology of people who are wealthy/successful aren't different. If someone that's wealthy smokes cigarettes they are just as likely to get lung cancer as the average person doing the same. If someone that's wealthy doesn't get enough sleep they are just as likely to get sleep deprived.

Got nothing to do with wealth, everything to do with health.
So to you there's nothing to indicate doing those things are a substitute for sleep, well we'll find out cause i'm gonna try it out.

 

[ExaltedLife]

People at my gym probably think I'm weird. I go in once, MAYBE twice a week. But my gains are great. The secret is rest. People totally underestimate how long it takes their body to completely recover. I lift super heavy, do compound lifts like deadlifts, squats, bench, bent over rows, and kill it on biceps and triceps at the end. And then I rest for 5 or 6 days. When you workout too often, it's completely counter productive because you tear muscle fibers that haven't healed yet. You get in the way of your own hypertrophy.

So if you want to make gains and save time, concentrate your workouts into intense sessions and rest a lot in between. Anabolism occurs during rest - muscle stress is essentially catabolic. If you have time, read Body by Science to see the data that supports this.

 

[TTG SS]

At a certain point in your fitness career in does not take any effort to maintain and build an elite natural physique ( <10% BF, large muscles/strength).

The eating is out of habit, it is no harder for me to eat "healthy" to maintain my body then it is to eat junk food. Sure the time going to the gym is the only thing but that can be minimized by smart programming & living close to your gym.

At the end of the day I always make time to get in a workout 4-5 days week.

 

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[Delmania]

Got nothing to do with wealth, everything to do with health.
So to you there's nothing to indicate doing those things are a substitute for sleep, well we'll find out cause i'm gonna try it out.

Humans are fascinating animals because we have the most capability to learn from one another, and yet we continually refuse to do so.
Many people have tried the things you have done. Do you think the scientists who say the majority of us need 7 hours of sleep are just making it up? Do you not think they run experiments and monitor and measure data? Do you not think they understand on a physiological level what happens when you sleep? I believe sleep is the only time you will flush out the various neurotoxins that accumulate in your brain due to the daily stress of living. People try these sleep hacks all the time, they find some success, but over an extended period of time it catches up and they return back to a normal sleep pattern.

Now all my life I've slept from 7-12 hours a night to be rested so I'm not that 1%.

Sleeping upwards of 12 hours is just as unhealthy as not getting enough sleep.

In the last 6-12 months since I started fleshing out my health routine I've had random days where id wake up rested after 5-6 hours of sleep.

I was the same way. When I lost weight on put muscle there were some days when I only slept 6 hours and woke up feeling refreshed. That's because you're addressing your health

With "average" test subjects. Have they done studies on people who do regular breath work, relaxation exercises, etc

Yes, yes they have. Those activities are good in and of themselves but they are no substitute for sleep.

Your entire post is nothing but shitty broscience that reeks of someone who has done no research on the science of sleep and things he can "hack" himself. You're not the first person who thinks that way, and you won't be the last. If you honestly want to modify your sleep, the most effective tactics are to stop using your phone an hour before bed, read a fiction book before you sleep, and get up the same time every morning.

In regards to this post, proper sleep and maintaining your health are crucial to be happy and productive. Entrepreneurship is a marathon and not a sprint. You're going to fail a lot and face disappointment, so you need to be resilient. It's much easier to do that when you're feeling your best and your mind is not burdened by exhaustion.

 

[luniac]

Humans are fascinating animals because we have the most capability to learn from one another, and yet we continually refuse to do so.
Many people have tried the things you have done. Do you think the scientists who say the majority of us need 7 hours of sleep are just making it up? Do you not think they run experiments and monitor and measure data? Do you not think they understand on a physiological level what happens when you sleep? I believe sleep is the only time you will flush out the various neurotoxins that accumulate in your brain due to the daily stress of living. People try these sleep hacks all the time, they find some success, but over an extended period of time it catches up and they return back to a normal sleep pattern.



Sleeping upwards of 12 hours is just as unhealthy as not getting enough sleep.



I was the same way. When I lost weight on put muscle there were some days when I only slept 6 hours and woke up feeling refreshed. That's because you're addressing your health



Yes, yes they have. Those activities are good in and of themselves but they are no substitute for sleep.

Your entire post is nothing but shitty broscience that reeks of someone who has done no research on the science of sleep and things he can "hack" himself. You're not the first person who thinks that way, and you won't be the last. If you honestly want to modify your sleep, the most effective tactics are to stop using your phone an hour before bed, read a fiction book before you sleep, and get up the same time every morning.

In regards to this post, proper sleep and maintaining your health are crucial to be happy and productive. Entrepreneurship is a marathon and not a sprint. You're going to fail a lot and face disappointment, so you need to be resilient. It's much easier to do that when you're feeling your best and your mind is not burdened by exhaustion.

like I said, we'll see.

 

[BD64]

At a certain point in your fitness career in does not take any effort to maintain and build an elite natural physique ( <10% BF, large muscles/strength).
.

Are you at an elite natural physique? Because I'm pretty sure this statement is absolute horseshit or you don't understand what elite truly means.
I'm certainly not elite myself but look at 99% of athletes who are, tell me they don't have extreme discipline and put in the work everyday to maintain their impressive physicality.

 

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[TTG SS]

Are you at an elite natural physique? Because I'm pretty sure this statement is absolute horseshit or you don't understand what elite truly means.
I'm certainly not elite myself but look at 99% of athletes who are, tell me they don't have extreme discipline and put in the work everyday to maintain their impressive physicality.

Ok maybe elite might be a little much, bc I’m not a professional physique competitor.
I would say my physique is in the top 5% at a natural level in any commercial gym I’ve been too across the country. Without coming across as arrogant it isn’t exactly average.

Just for some raw #’s I maintain no more than 10% BF (a true 10%) My lifts are solid too. In a surplus it isn’t uncommon for me to DL 455+, squat 405 and bench 315 for a couple reps @188# give or take

I’m not saying this to brag as those numbers aren’t all that impressive. I’m just saying it doesn’t really take any perceivable effort to maintain & make gains. Of course it takes extreme discipline/work to do, but it doesn’t feel like work or stress me out.(I know that sounds kinda contradictory ha)It’s just part of my life and how I live. Which is why I said once you get to a certain level in training it is easy, for me training is a fun not work. Keep in mind I’ve been training 6 years without ever taking more than a single week off.

 

[BD64]

Ok maybe elite might be a little much, bc I’m not a professional physique competitor.
I would say my physique is in the top 5% at a natural level in any commercial gym I’ve been too across the country. Without coming across as arrogant it isn’t exactly average.

Just for some raw #’s I maintain no more than 10% BF (a true 10%) My lifts are solid too. In a surplus it isn’t uncommon for me to DL 455+, squat 405 and bench 315 for a couple reps @188# give or take

I’m not saying this to brag as those numbers aren’t all that impressive. I’m just saying it doesn’t really take any perceivable effort to maintain & make gains. Of course it takes extreme discipline/work to do, but it doesn’t feel like work or stress me out.(I know that sounds kinda contradictory ha)It’s just part of my life and how I live. Which is why I said once you get to a certain level in training it is easy, for me training is a fun not work. Keep in mind I’ve been training 6 years without ever taking more than a single week off.

Hey man, those are certainly good #'s (your well into the 1k club)! I see more what your saying now that you've cleared it up a bit. I'm very much in the same boat as you, 6 years training and before that state-level athlete. I guess for guys like us it is easy but keep in mind it only feels that way cuz we've had a habit of doing so that has been going strong for over half a decade.

Also once your at a good point then maintaining what you built becomes much easier as you tend to naturally become a calorie-burning machine and you start focusing on small, realistic gains more so than anything else. But I'd say that actually starting and ingraining the habit can be really tough and especially when you hit plateau's. All about laying a good foundation.

 

[Daniel A]

I'm currently going to focus on HIIT (via INSANITY MAX 30) and boxing. Lifting weights at the gym has become too boring for me, and I'm more into functional strength now. I'm sure I'll lift weights at the gym again, but for now, the previously mentioned exercises will be my focus.

If you just want to get a great workout in and save time follow INSANITY MAX 30 (same company that created P90X). It's a 30-minute long workout for each session. Perfect.

It's been a while since I posted that. Honestly, I haven't worked out much since then. I'm about to start the first workout of INSANITY MAX 30 right now supplemented with Convict Conditioning. I most likely would've kept procrastinating BUT...

I signed up for four GORUCK events. Two "Light" and two "Tough" events with three of the four within 2017. So I now have good enough reasons to begin training. I love the company's story. The founder Jason McCarthy and everyone else involved created an awesome brand and business. About GORUCK the Rucksack & Rucking Events Company

P.S. I'll be doing all my GORUCK events in the Bay Area here in California if anyone wants to join in.

P.P.S. I learned that Beach Body has P90X3 which is another 30-minute workout. Pair that with Insanity Max 30 and you got a great workout in about an hour's time.

 

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[KrzyszWawrzyniak]

You don't have to work out in a gym if you don't want to - playing volleyball, running, gymnastics, dancing or martial arts could be a good substitute.
You are supposed to enjoy your workouts all the time and feel total ease about them. If you feel bad about the gym - quit for a few weeks to try something else and don't feel bad about quitting. There are many things you've probably never tried before but would definitely enjoy. You might find out that gym is not for you or that you can do both gym + something else, but you won't know until you go and try.

Working out ought give you energy, keep healthy in the long term, physically destroy you (so you'll have no power to run/lift/jump/fight anymore) and make you feel very fresh and "productive".
I recommend doing it outside as much as you can - working out outside is significantly better than doing it indoors, but you'll find it out after you try.

 

[RayAndré]

DavidTT I know the feeling. The gym lifestyle can really suck time from your day, week, and life.

I would highly recommend a progressive calisthenics workout methodology that you can do at home. Its FREE...the only cost is your determination. It is focused on strength, so you may have to get up an go on a run for cardio...but that is also FREE and only requires the same motivation.
It also takes very little time...I probably work out for maybe 45 minutes spread throughout my day, and all in the comfort of my own room.

Grab the book Convict Conditioning and it'll teach you everything. It changed my life and it can change yours. (I'm in no way affiliated with it.)
Here's a post where I talk about my journey with it: To the Slowlaners from a Slowlaner...we CAN do this.

 

[DonnyDinero]

I've been thinking about this too.

Here's a Home workout 3 days a week 45-1 hour I've been using. You can even split it half.

View: https://www.reddit.com/r/bodyweightfitness/comments/5ls6to/full_video_explanation_of_the_recommended_routine/


Personally, I can't go on for too long without working out because of health concerns. My outer successful self would be a Fastlaner while still looking like a snack. Not aiming to be a Body Builder just average good muscle mass.

 

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