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Black_Dragon43

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Well, it we are to take it like that, imo, 99% of people would have trouble with the direct response approach as well in terms of making it big. The top is always dominated by a select few… 80/20 right? The winner takes it all. The main difference between sports and business are that in business you can always get better and improve… in sports, after a certain age, no matter how hard you try it’s hard to improve!
 
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Well, it we are to take it like that, imo, 99% of people would have trouble with the direct response approach as well in terms of making it big. The top is always dominated by a select few… 80/20 right? The winner takes it all. The main difference between sports and business are that in business you can always get better and improve… in sports, after a certain age, no matter how hard you try it’s hard to improve!

Their point is that in content your odds are way lower. For example, 95% take most of the market in e-commerce but in content it's 99.9%.

Edit:

Also, the corollary to that is that your odds of hitting big numbers are lower, too. The more crowded a niche is, the more the market share is divided between them (or actually, the more the big few players capture at the expense of everyone else).

Self-publishing is a great example of that. A few years ago there were fewer authors and more space to grow. This meant it was way easier to hit 6 figures. These days, with so many new authors and so much competition, even if you're top 1%, you're still going to make less money than before. You need to be 0.1% to hit it big while previously you could have been only, say, top 5%.
 
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Just wanted to add on the topic of differentiation as described in that short video above...

@Andy Black, @Black_Dragon43, @Speed112

I came up with a new idea recently, started working on it, and just realized that there's very little differentiation there (it's an idea for a newsletter). Consequently, the offer sucks. Even if it's a free newsletter, it's still an offer and it fails the first requirement of a strong offer.

Most content-based ideas (if not all) can't ever become a category of one. You'll always be struggling as a sort of a commodity. Content is too easy to produce and its value these days is extremely low (compared to something like a super customized service, a live event, or a strong e-commerce brand selling products people love).

The only exception I see for a content-based business is if you have a rare personality and don't mind turning yourself into an icon/meme, like for example David Goggins, or if you're a hot girl creating content on something usually dominated by men. Regular boring people don't stand a chance to create a truly lucrative (high 6-figures or 7 figures plus) content-based business.

The only thing you can do to differentiate is pick a more obscure topic, a subcategory within a subcategory. But with time, if others start writing about the same topic, your only difference will be that you were the first one, unless in the meantime you figure out a way to offer something unique besides your content.

Thoughts?
I don't think you need to have a rare personality to succeed with content. Plenty of big YouTube channels aren't built around personalities.

We've got to educate and/or entertain, and get in front of the right people.

Content creation/publishing can be direct response. You can get one piece of content in front of someone and that can be enough for them to take action (buy, signup, share, whatever).

I'm getting back in the content saddle. I dropped it the last few months as it felt more like a content treadmill. My thinking though is that we can post on Twitter, Facebook, etc and find what resonates and gets the response we desire, then put ad spend behind it.

I like the phrase: "Don't tell different things to the same people. Tell the same thing to different people." For years I've been telling various little stories to different people until I've got a few little ones that seem to work. Now I should figure out how to format them for various platforms, get them to "work", then put ad spend behind them - so more people see them.

Maybe I only need a few pieces of content, and my regular content publishing is to find what works and then scale it?



I've had the feeling for years that brevity and clarity are key differentiators. I opened an email this morning and it had a whole hero's journey in it before getting to the point. I can't be bothered with that format, and he should have known better as it's a B2B newsletter.

I logged into Twitter again after a few months off and tweeted something that I now think had way too many words.

Posted to Twitter.png

I deleted it this morning and tweeted it again:

Posted to Twitter - shorter.png

I'll put some ad spend behind that soon to see how it resonates with people.

Next up is to make a short video of that an publish to TikTok and as a YouTube Short.

One of my key takeaways from Nicolas Cole's book "The Art and Business of Online Writing" was that our audience/list isn't our biggest asset - it's the content that got them onto that list. Not just any old content of course, but content that people value enough to share and signup/buy via. Once you've built up that library you can get it in front of different people by running ads as well as publishing to other platforms (with tweaks no doubt).
 

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Over here, over there.
I've had the feeling for years that brevity and clarity are key differentiators. I opened an email this morning and it had a whole hero's journey in it before getting to the point. I can't be bothered with that format, and he should have known better as it's a B2B newsletter.

Yes. People who appreciate long-form content and people who appreciate short-form are different audiences. It depends on the audience.

I'm most definitely a long-form guy. If someone sends me 4 words that barely tell me what they want, it doesn't make me curious... it makes me tag them as junk and send them to trash. Meanwhile I will spend 5 minutes reading a well-written email and it may evoke my interest by the end, even if I'm not exactly the target audience. In turn, my emails are like that as well. The difference can probably be seen between our posts too haha.

I can't stand twitter or tiktok. There's not enough space to engage or make a point. You have to rely on assumptions and I hate assumptions.

But... being super succinct is a great differentiator. I'm quite good at synthesizing super long-form rambly content in highly efficient long-form content, but I suck at the next step. Headlines. Hooks. Quips. It takes me a lot of effort to find the quintessence of the subject. For the ADD audience on the internet or "too busy" businesspeople that's a problem.

On average, long is strong.

If you're going multi-channel, you need to mix in short and super-short pieces of content as well to max your reach.

Any tips for being on point?

Testing social media for engagement then boosting that and reframing the same content on every channel/format is highly effective. I think your strategy is sound. Would recommend.
 
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I'm getting back in the content saddle. I dropped it the last few months as it felt more like a content treadmill. My thinking though is that we can post on Twitter, Facebook, etc and find what resonates and gets the response we desire, then put ad spend behind it.

Lol yes content treadmill sounds like a nightmare yet I can see it being pimped as one of the best strategies out there. I mean, really? 20 stories a day on Instagram, several dozens tweets on Twitter, a few YouTube videos a week and then cut it into several dozen short videos? It doesn't seem like a particularly thought-out strategy but more like throwing stuff at the wall.

I like your idea of putting ad spent behind content that resonates. This way at least you can get some scale from your efforts.
 

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Just wanted to add on the topic of differentiation as described in that short video above...

@Andy Black, @Black_Dragon43, @Speed112

I came up with a new idea recently, started working on it, and just realized that there's very little differentiation there (it's an idea for a newsletter). Consequently, the offer sucks. Even if it's a free newsletter, it's still an offer and it fails the first requirement of a strong offer.

Most content-based ideas (if not all) can't ever become a category of one. You'll always be struggling as a sort of a commodity. Content is too easy to produce and its value these days is extremely low (compared to something like a super customized service, a live event, or a strong e-commerce brand selling products people love).

The only exception I see for a content-based business is if you have a rare personality and don't mind turning yourself into an icon/meme, like for example David Goggins, or if you're a hot girl creating content on something usually dominated by men. Regular boring people don't stand a chance to create a truly lucrative (high 6-figures or 7 figures plus) content-based business.

The only thing you can do to differentiate is pick a more obscure topic, a subcategory within a subcategory. But with time, if others start writing about the same topic, your only difference will be that you were the first one, unless in the meantime you figure out a way to offer something unique besides your content.

Thoughts?
Lots to dissect in this @MTF.

My worry is you're possibly overthinking (solving problems you don't have) and closing yourself off from possible solutions.


"there's very little differentiation there (it's an idea for a newsletter). Consequently, the offer sucks."

Does it help people? I'm not a fan of differentiating for the sake of differentiating. I've been in business workshops as an attendee and introduced myself as a Google Ads guy. That's enough for people to ask for help at the coffee break. I didn't tell them I'm any good, or what I've done, etc. I just happen to be in the same room as them. If someone only sees your offer then is it good enough to help them?


"Most content-based ideas (if not all) can't ever become a category of one."

Is that true? Even if it was, does it really matter? I subscribe to quite a few YouTube channels that are on the same subject. I've watched pretty much all the breakdowns of Vasyl Lomachenko's boxing style.


"You'll always be struggling as a sort of a commodity."

Honestly, I don't even think about what is and isn't a commodity.
  • Does my content/service/courses help people? Check.
  • Do they pay for it (ideally regularly)? Check.
  • Let's scale.

"Content is too easy to produce and its value these days is extremely low"

Good content isn't easy to produce. Getting it found isn't easy. Getting it found by the right people isn't easy. Getting it shared like crazy to the right people isn't easy. Etc.

Why is the value of content extremely low? I expect some people would pay thousands for blueprints from Alex Hormozi.


"The only exception I see for a content-based business is if you have a rare personality and don't mind turning yourself into an icon/meme"

A personality based business is just one way to do it. There's others. Some of the biggest channels on YouTube aren't personality based.


"Regular boring people don't stand a chance to create a truly lucrative (high 6-figures or 7 figures plus) content-based business."

Is this a limiting belief?


"The only thing you can do to differentiate is pick a more obscure topic, a subcategory within a subcategory."

Be wary when you tell yourself "The only thing you can do", "You need to/must/should". Those typically come straight before a limiting belief.


"But with time, if others start writing about the same topic, your only difference will be that you were the first one"

Why? Will others write exactly the same as you? Will consumers even know or care who was first?
 

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People who appreciate long-form content and people who appreciate short-form are different audiences. It depends on the audience.
Maybe. I'm happy watching a 60 minute video if they keep to the point and don't ramble too much. Sometimes I don't mind the rambling if it's entertaining. I can also appreciate short-form get to the point stuff.

Some of my replies in the forum are super short. Some are much longer.

I think the true art is getting the point/emotion/etc across in as short a time as possible, without it feeling too rushed.

What I like about Twitter and TikTok is how it encourages people to stick to one point. I'm still unsure about Twitter, but I did learn a bit about writing because of the constraints. Same as writing Google Ads actually.

What I like most about Twitter is no-one really sees your experiments. If I was to post to Facebook, LinkedIn, or YouTube, take it down, redo it, and iterate a few more times then it would annoy my friends and followers. I can do that on Twitter knowing most didn't see it anyway, and that they know I'm fiddling because Twitter doesn't allow us to edit tweets.


@Speed112 @MTF

I don't think the world doesn't need more and more content churned out. I don't want to turn people into consumers either. The world could do with less content, but more thought out, and more that's been battle-tested and proven to help/entertain. I like these social media platforms for allowing us to churn out small nuggets, polish them over time, then add them to our library. We can delete the ones that don't work.
 
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I've not caught up on the other replies.

This jumped out at me:

don't sell info products if you don't want to spend years building your reputation, turning yourself into a personal brand, or creating products in a format you don't like (video/audio).

I don't know if that's tongue in cheek.

I bet there's someone out there that sold info-products without spending years building their reputation, turning themselves into a personal brand, or creating products in a format they didn't like.
 

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My worry is you're possibly overthinking (solving problems don't have) and closing yourself off from possible solutions.

Just trying to look and analyze things from all angles. I wasted too much time on businesses I launched too quickly and don't want to repeat that.

Does it help people? I'm not a fan of differentiating for the sake of differentiating. I've been in business workshops as an attendee and introduced myself as a Google Ads guy. That's enough for people to ask for help at the coffee break. I didn't tell them I'm any good, or what I've done, etc. I just happen to be in the same room as them. If someone only sees your offer then is it good enough to help them?

It's just my personal approach. I'm most loyal to stuff that's very different and I like being contrarian/working with unconventional people.

Is that true? Even if it was, does it really matter? I subscribe to quite a few YouTube channels that are on the same subject. I've watched pretty much all the breakdowns of Vasyl Lomachenko's boxing style.

Of course, but that's free stuff. What did the owners of these channels get from you watching their breakdowns? Probably zero. Would you buy access to a few different platforms where they would publish these breakdowns? I guess probably not. And if you did, you'd probably pick just one of them.

Honestly, I don't even think about what is and isn't a commodity.
  • Does my content/service/courses help people? Check.
  • Do they pay for it (ideally regularly)? Check.
  • Let's scale.

Yeah I'm a crazy overthinker and like to strategize a lot. I don't want to get into things where the future is very unclear/where I can't easily see how it could scale a lot.

You can have stuff that helps people and for which people pay regularly, yet it's still a terrible business model in most cases. Example: a restaurant.

Granted, I don't like to figure things out along the way. I like to have at least a rough plan and make sure beforehand that the path forward is possible.

Good content isn't easy to produce. Getting it found isn't easy. Getting it found by the right people isn't easy. Getting it shared like crazy to the right people isn't easy. Etc.

Why is the value of content extremely low? I expect some people would pay thousands for blueprints from Alex Hormozi.

Alex Hormozi (and other make money gurus) can charge high prices because they sell the dream of earning a lot more.

A freediving coach, for example, in most cases won't be able to sell their content for thousands of dollars, no matter how reputable they are. A few hundred, maybe yes. I gave this example because I'm debating buying some courses (for a low price of around $50) from a freediving coach who has already helped me, yet I'm hesitant because it's just not that enticing compared to buying a book/course about business/marketing/investing where it can help me make me a lot of money.

In my mind, I find it hard to rationalize spending even $50 on such content compared to a new business tool, a service (a session with my own freediving coach), or even perhaps buying freediving gear. All of these are way, way, more valuable in my mind than content. So that's why I said that the value of content is IMO extremely low. There's too much of it and very little of it is THAT much different from others that it's worth paying for.

A lot of the value of content comes purely from how much money/time it can generate for the reader. If it's not easy to sell as an investment, it will be hard to sell it.

With Google Ads services, you're essentially selling money, too. You know that people spending, say, $1000 with you will make at least double that. But in many niches that's not the case. You can't even put a realistic price tag on that because it's too abstract.

For example, unless I'm boxing professionally, what's my return from a course on proper boxing footwork? It's very hard to sell it for any meaningful price unless perhaps it comes from a world champion. Other than that, I'd rather hire a coach (so use a different vehicle, service in this case) than buy content.

A personality based business is just one way to do it. There's others. Some of the biggest channels on YouTube aren't personality based.

Though most are personality-based, aren't they? The odds of making it big without building a personal brand are very low.

Is this a limiting belief?

Possibly :)

Be wary when you tell yourself "The only thing you can do", "You need to/must/should". Those typically come straight before a limiting belief.

Noted.

Why? Will others write exactly the same as you? Will consumers even know or care who was first?

I meant it as a marketing angle. "The first community of X" is a unique advantage (longevity) when otherwise you share similar content to your competitors. But you're right they probably wouldn't know or care much if someone did it better. So you are a commodity then.

I don't know if that's tongue in cheek.

I bet there's someone out there that sold info-products without spending years building their reputation, turning themselves into a personal brand, or creating products in a format they didn't like.

I based my response on the conclusions from @Black_Dragon43's post. There are definitely people like that. The question is how many (or how few) of them there are.

It's sort of like saying "I bet there's someone out there who became a national champion in boxing after 3 years of training." There probably is. Is it realistic? Not at all. Again, I'm calculating the odds and comparing them between different approaches.

Also, I'm probably overthinking a lot because I can afford it. A person new to business should definitely go with the first viable business model and take it from there.
 

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Their point is that in content your odds are way lower. For example, 95% take most of the market in e-commerce but in content it's 99.9%.

Edit:

Also, the corollary to that is that your odds of hitting big numbers are lower, too. The more crowded a niche is, the more the market share is divided between them (or actually, the more the big few players capture at the expense of everyone else).

Self-publishing is a great example of that. A few years ago there were fewer authors and more space to grow. This meant it was way easier to hit 6 figures. These days, with so many new authors and so much competition, even if you're top 1%, you're still going to make less money than before. You need to be 0.1% to hit it big while previously you could have been only, say, top 5%.
I disagree about those odds. The odds aren't fixed, and you can improve them by working on yourself and investing in yourself. Look at Grant Cardone. 15 years ago he was nobody. Now his face is everywhere. Why?

It's because he had the right strategy, and executed it continuously. Same with Gary V, and so on. Anyone can do this, problem is they don't know how. They have no idea what they should be doing in the first place.

Most people on this forum say mindset mindset mindset.

To me it's know-how, know-how, know-how.

Because it's pointless to have the mindset, when you have no clue how the world works, and what you should be doing in the first place. The mindset will just get you to do more of the wrong thing.

Direct response teaches you in-the-moment persuasion and influence. That's useful for direct sales and also for scamming people (á la Z - since we were talking about him in the other thread). But it's NOT so useful for building a business. And the reason being that the number one difficulty for a business is getting awareness. Building a large volume of activity.

Now take this principle, and ask yourself what is required for you to get eyeballs. And the easiest answer is that you need a BRAND. Apple has an easy time getting attention if they want it. As does Microsoft, Facebook and so on. They can sell anything, including CRAP.

But you don't really learn brand building from direct response do you? In direct response you learn CONVERSION. What you need though is TRAFFIC.

Here's the thing. From a direct response perspective, me paying $10,000 to appear on an obscure page of Forbes magazine is a waste of money. But from building a BUSINESS perspective, it's not. It's not something that is trackable either, so it goes completely against traditional direct response. And it may not even have an offer to boot.

BUT - think about it. Next time I write a direct response sales letter, and I picture myself on a page of Forbes, what effect will that have? Ah... so that's it. Brand. Authority. Investing in image. Awareness.

What about paying to appear on TV? The same thing.

So what most people need, paradoxically, is exactly this sort of untrackable, indirect methods to generate large volumes of traffic that they can then use direct response to sell anything to.

Halbert made a ton of money. But he ended up broke. Most of the direct response guys ended up broke. Or close to it. Why? Because they never built a sustainable way to make that money, a BRAND. Money is difficult to make, but easy to spend. To reverse that, you've got to build a brand, which makes money easy to make, since you can literarily sell anything.

I had a very interesting episode on my podcast with Rory Sutherland, the Vice Chairman of Ogilvy UK. He is someone I'm comfortable calling a genius, and his book is absolutely fantastic on this side of persuasion. It talks precisely about these indirect, illogical means of persuasion that we don't often think about, but actually make a huge difference. Here's the episode if you're interested, but I think you'll like it.

And you don't need to build a personal brand. There are people like Gordon Alexander (I can introduce you to him if you wish), who built a publishing business - a brand. And people know about him from his publishing business. He has actually worked directly for some of the direct response greats, including, for example, Ben Suarez, who build a $400M direct response company at one point. It's important to build a brand, even if it's not a personal one for long-term success.
 
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Any tips for being on point?
Keep saying it over and over to different people until you figure out what causes the aha moment. Keep trying to get there quicker. This is where me posting again and again in the forum helps me refine my thoughts and writing.

Beware of “clearing your throat”.

And try to “Start as close to the end as possible.”
 

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On the topic of selling content:

I asked Sam Parr how he'd start a paid newsletter business today, and he outlined four very similar steps: pick a tiny-but-growing audience whose members have lots of money to spend; write utilitarian content that helps them make more money; charge between $500 and $1k annually; and grow your subscriber base via ads and free viral written content.


These rules aren't hard and fast. For example, Sam started his mailing list from scratch by opting in all of his friends, family, and colleagues. Anne-Laure is one of the most prolific tweeters I know, and she's leveraged Twitter to acquire subscribers without paying a dime. Ben's articles for Stratechery are widely shared on social media and often forwarded via email, no ads required. And both Ben and Anne-Laure are charging far less than $500/year.


But they're also writing valuable content for a niche audience of high earners (entrepreneurs and investors, respectively), and that seems non-negotiable if you want to get paid.

Lol I'm really NOT trying to confirm my bias but he essentially says the same thing - you can only make solid money from selling content that helps people make more money or if you write for high earners which is usually a business/money/investing topic.

Edit: updated to clarify I meant selling content, not content in general. You can publish free content, build a list, and make money selling other people's products and services. This makes it a super lean and quite resilient business (as you can promote various businesses, not just one).
 
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Lol I'm really NOT trying to confirm my bias but he essentially says the same thing - you can only make solid money from selling content that helps people make more money or if you write for high earners which is usually a business/money/investing topic.
How about selling content to people who want to learn about health?

How about selling content to people who want to learn about relationships?

Those three are evergreen markets. Content and products will always sell.

But fundamentally, what any coach, consultant, info product creator, etc. sells isn't a product - but a transformation. People want to be richer, healthier/fitter/sexier, and attractive to the opposite sex.

Now these markets, because they are evergreen, are also hypercompetitive. The challenge isn't to have a product to sell, even a great one. The challenge is all in the marketing... in the A from AIDA. Getting attention.

If you can generate sufficient attention and bring it upon yourself or your product, then you don't have to do much, it will sell by itself.

However, the problem is that most people can't generate attention cheaply enough. So they pay exorbitant costs for ads, and so products must be expensive to pay the ad costs. And the copy has to be genius, because the attention is expensive. Hence the available market shrinks to the richer folks.
You can publish free content, build a list, and make money selling other people's products and services. This makes it a super lean and quite resilient business (as you can promote various businesses, not just one).
Yes, but you can only hope to capture 30-40% of the money at the most with other people's products. In some cases even lower. Just sell your own and capture 100%.
 
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Now these markets, because they are evergreen, are also hypercompetitive. The challenge isn't to have a product to sell, even a great one. The challenge is all in the marketing... in the A from AIDA. Getting attention.

If you can generate sufficient attention and bring it upon yourself or your product, then you don't have to do much, it will sell by itself.

However, the problem is that most people can't generate attention cheaply enough. So they pay exorbitant costs for ads, and so products must be expensive to pay the ad costs. And the copy has to be genius, because the attention is expensive. Hence the available market shrinks to the richer folks.

Do you mean all types of products for these markets or just info products?

I find that most digital products for these niches are BS because real advice doesn't sell. "2 weeks to big arms" will sell for sure. The reality can't match that (should be more like "train for years, have a strict diet, sleep well" etc.). So you're essentially selling very low probability hope or miracles, knowing it can't work.

Most marketers don't care. But I do so I don't see a place for myself in this.

I did remember buying some products like that in the past but now I know better and wouldn't feel good preying on others like that.

Yes, but you can only hope to capture 30-40% of the money at the most with other people's products. In some cases even lower. Just sell your own and capture 100%

You can't create all types of products yourself.

Imagine you have a list in the survival niche. On your own, maybe you can create some ebooks and stuff. But you can't create a survival knife, a wilderness survival live course, a survival medical kit, a survival bunker, a BJJ seminar, a gun shooting training in the forest, etc.

I mean, of course technically you can but you'll be spreading yourself super thin trying to manufacture it well and manage it all.

This goes back to Jay Abraham's JV ideas. As far as I remember he often didn't even have any products, just found a way to use other people's resources for everything.
 

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Do you mean all types of products for these markets or just info products?
All products since to me it’s the same thing. Whether you call it coaching, consulting, info products, books, courses - bottom line, you’re selling advice no?

I’ve worked extensively for myself and other people in the “make money” markets.

I find that most digital products for these niches are BS because real advice doesn't sell. "2 weeks to big arms" will sell for sure. The reality can't match that (should be more like "train for years, have a strict diet, sleep well" etc.). So you're essentially selling very low probability hope or miracles, knowing it can't work.
Is the advice BS though? That’s what everyone says, but they’re wrong imo. As I said I worked in the make money markets. Including for people who are considered gurus. I’ve also bought many many thousands worth of make money courses, just to see what the competition is offering.

There are some surprisingly good courses out there. That are easily worth even 5x what these gurus charge for them (and they do charge thousands).

Now, most people are going to fail to reach the success levels marketed by the courses. 95% or so will fail. Is that the fault of the courses and the information? Personally, from what I’ve seen in many cases, I’d say no. At least generally no.

People don’t apply, and you’d be surprised by how “retarded” the average buyer is. These people are so lazy, they buy the course, and go through like 1 module and that’s it! Never open it again. Of course, if that’s how you behave, nothing will help you. But I can say that if I bought one of those courses 10 years ago it would have been a HUGE help for me. HUGE.

Another example, someone paid me $350. After 1 year - ONE FULL YEAR - they texted me saying their download expired and they never got access to the material. Of course I gave them access, but that fact alone is SHOCKING to me. And you’re wondering why these people aren’t more successful…

Sure, these courses are often marketed as low effort, but you’re a smart guy… do you really believe that? Imo if you want to become a gazilionaire, you better be ready to put in hard hard work, course or not.

But I also know people on the other hand who have used the foundation that the courses gave them and built 6, 7, in some cases 8 figure businesses. Many of these courses are businesses in a box. It’s gotten to the point that the creator is expected by these “retards” to give them a functioning business that they can just press play on. And in many cases, they do give them such a business, EXCEPT that the business doesnt run itself. The user still has to do sales, they still have to get people to sign contracts, they still have to understand those contracts and so on. Your average person’s expectations are just so incredibly stupid that they shoot themselves in the foot before even starting.

And yeah, most of these courses are for beginners. I bought a course recently, I will keep anonymous which, just to join their FB community. After buying, turns out the community was closed. Asked for a refund. Had a look around the course though, and it’s solid info. I’ve been using a lot of the stuff covered there in my business for years already. So someone with experience like us, yeah, maybe we’d not get a lot of value, unless it’s in a niche that’s very different from what we’ve done so far. But a real beginner, with a real desire to start a business from scratch will receive a TON of help from such a course.

Imo, the biggest blame here is on the consumer, not the producers. And the more I’ve worked in this industry, the more this has occured to me. Most consumers, honestly, just buy the HOPE that they will make money. They don’t want to actually make money. They just want to be able to keep dreaming. Cynical, but it’s what I’ve observed over the past 3 years or so.

You can't create all types of products yourself.
I think you can. I know an info marketer in finance who had 24 products and kept shifting them around, month by month. One month promoting one, another month the other. After 2 years, the merry go-around would start again, with different marketing. $100M/yr biz.

I mean, of course technically you can but you'll be spreading yourself super thin trying to manufacture it well and manage it all.
Generally you’d hire out manufacturing, but the bigger you grow the more you’ll want to cover all products you can sell. You grow into a bigger business basically and have others handle it.

Regarding Jay Abraham and JVs… most people in this market need JVs regardless of wether they’re selling their own product or someone else’s… JVs control the traffic. So deals with JVs are always happening, to buy access to the traffic. Show on their podcast, have them endorse you, whatever.
 

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All products since to me it’s the same thing. Whether you call it coaching, consulting, info products, books, courses - bottom line, you’re selling advice no?

There are some digital products that don't sell advice and there are also physical products and services that clearly don't sell advice either.

Job boards don't sell advice but leads for potential employees. Business directories don't sell advice but leads. In both cases you get paid either through paid listings or per lead or whatever, but not per advice you share. Online marketplaces sell various products you use for your business (plugins, templates, software, etc.). No advice either. All of these are still in the "make money" niche but don't sell content.

Services may involve some advice but often people who buy them don't want advice, they want the problem solved. For example, I can access tons of information on freediving online, including paid courses, but I prefer hiring a coach who makes training decisions for me. Same with my calisthenics coach. In a way, he's selling advice but IMO it's not the primary value (or even secondary). The value is saving time and stress and selling certainty.

Imo, the biggest blame here is on the consumer, not the producers. And the more I’ve worked in this industry, the more this has occured to me. Most consumers, honestly, just buy the HOPE that they will make money. They don’t want to actually make money. They just want to be able to keep dreaming. Cynical, but it’s what I’ve observed over the past 3 years or so.

So if you know this to be the case and are in the make money niche, does it bother you that you're playing this weird game with your clients where you promise them to earn more money but you know it's most likely not going to happen?

Or applying it to the health industry - if I were a fitness coach and I knew that almost none of my clients would ever make it, I don't think I'd be able to honestly look them in the eye.

I think you can. I know an info marketer in finance who had 24 products and kept shifting them around, month by month. One month promoting one, another month the other. After 2 years, the merry go-around would start again, with different marketing. $100M/yr biz.

That's super solid.

Generally you’d hire out manufacturing, but the bigger you grow the more you’ll want to cover all products you can sell. You grow into a bigger business basically and have others handle it.

Makes sense. I just prefer lean businesses and I think I'd rather sacrifice some profit for ease of operation.
 
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There are some digital products that don't sell advice and there are also physical products and services that clearly don't sell advice either.
Good point! I didnt have those services/products in mind.
So if you know this to be the case and are in the make money niche, does it bother you that you're playing this weird game with your clients where you promise them to earn more money but you know it's most likely not going to happen?

Or applying it to the health industry - if I were a fitness coach and I knew that almost none of my clients would ever make it, I don't think I'd be able to honestly look them in the eye.
I am satisfied if I give them the best information/advice possible. That’s how I judge myself. Whether they’re successful or not after that, is frankly not my business. I’ve done my half of the deal - gave them the best information available that they need to make it a success. Now if they’re going to sit on their bums and do nothing about it, should I feel guilty for that in your opinion?

Or if they try once (half-assed try too) and fail, should I feel guilty for that?

Back when I first started working online, 10 years ago, I had to go on forums to find work. Believe me, I had no courses, but I was 100% devoted to make it work, every waking hour. These people expect to work 30 minutes a day on their business and somehow start seeing massive cash roll in - that’s crazy brother!

Maybe if you buy a course, go through it, and then spend 90 days at least trying to make it work and you don’t get any sort of results or positive feedback… then yes, you can say that there’s probably something wrong with it. But the number of people who do that is virtually identical with the number of people who are highly successful… around 1% or less.

If I was a fitness coach, I’d focus on making sure I did everything in my power to help my clients build the physique of a greek god. But if my client didn’t show up at the gym, or was like today I will only lift fpr 10 minutes, or stuff like that, am I supposed to feel guilty that they’re not achieving the Greek god body? Or if we create a diet plan, and then my client is like, sorry my girlfriend came around and we splurged on food and drinks last night… That’s on the client.
 

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If I was a fitness coach, I’d focus on making sure I did everything in my power to help my clients build the physique of a greek god. But if my client didn’t show up at the gym, or was like today I will only lift fpr 10 minutes, or stuff like that, am I supposed to feel guilty that they’re not achieving the Greek god body?

This made me think of a friend I helped learn how to swim freestyle. I corrected his technique, I gave him exercises, and told him he needs to work on it himself (the same way I had learned it). He stopped going to the pool and still hasn't learned it (while I was able to dramatically improve in a few months of similar work and eventually even become an instructor).
 

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This made me think of a friend I helped learn how to swim freestyle. I corrected his technique, I gave him exercises, and told him he needs to work on it himself (the same way I had learned it). He stopped going to the pool and still hasn't learned it (while I was able to dramatically improve in a few months of similar work and eventually even become an instructor).
Yes. This is literarily the most common thing I see.

So what are we to conclude about these people? They just want to have the idea of learning, or the idea of making money in their minds. All they really want is to keep the dream alive. And that’s what they spend money on right? They don’t REALLY want that greek god physique or that perfect swimming stroke or the money, no?

As Joe Karbo used to say, most people are too busy earning a living to make any money…
 
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I watched a video of his last night where he quoted the book “Ready, Fire, Aim” and reminded me to focus on one product, one avatar, and one channel.
Thanks for posting that video of Alex's... watching it right now.

Im curious, when you say one product are you running an Ecommerce store? or this more of a general comment?
 

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Thanks for posting that video of Alex's... watching it right now.

Im curious, when you say one product are you running an Ecommerce store? or this more of a general comment?
It’s a reminder to focus.

I’m a consultant for hire, and also sell a course/membership, a budding productised service, and had a couple of very small paid email newsletters.

Granted it’s all related to one skill, but I suspect I’d do better if I focused on either building a consultancy, the membership, or the productised service.

Not only are they all different products, but they all seem to serve different avatars.
 

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Thank you for this thread! I checked out Alex Hormozi last month because of this and I can honestly say no other online course and book has impacted me as much as his. And I'm part of a $3000/year mastermind group - his free course is honestly better than the course for mastermind members. Now it's time to implement everything I've learned.
 
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And I'm part of a $3000/year mastermind group

Guess that "I'm not selling anything" angle went out the window pretty fast.
 

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Content is too easy to produce and its value these days is extremely low (compared to something like a super customized service, a live event, or a strong e-commerce brand selling products people love).

Quality content is always in demand.

Regular boring people don't stand a chance to create a truly lucrative (high 6-figures or 7 figures plus) content-based business.

Most people are boring as hell - the market for boring things is massive. People like to know that there are other people boring as them and will watch boring videos for hours.

There are even videos of stupid things like fat idiots eating junk food on YouTube that get hundreds of thousands of views.

There are always opportunities in every space. Always.
 

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Guess that "I'm not selling anything" angle went out the window pretty fast.
I realize now that what I wrote was unclear. Let me clarify:

Alex Hormozi isn't selling anything, the $3000/year mastermind group I'm part of is Ryan Stewman's Apex Entourage group and courses - completely unrelated to Alex. I just brought it up to contrast Alex's free course which I honestly found had more unique and well-thought-out advice than the Apex Entourage courses.
 
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I realize now that what I wrote was unclear. Let me clarify:

Alex Hormozi isn't selling anything, the $3000/year mastermind group I'm part of is Ryan Stewman's Apex Entourage group and courses - completely unrelated to Alex. I just brought it up to contrast Alex's free course which I honestly found had more unique and well-thought-out advice than the Apex Entourage courses.
he is actually selling books now. But it's good to know that he's not doing this $3000/year group thing.
 

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Im watched a few videos of him right now, and he shares his experience in a very entertaining way, then mostly he connects the moral with a story.

For me, he doesn't look like a guru or anything.
I bought his book and will see how that is.
 

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he is actually selling books now. But it's good to know that he's not doing this $3000/year group thing.
Not really - the books are 99 cents on Kindle. I honestly think his business model, from everything I've seen, is free value for people making up to $3m a year, after which he gets businesses doing $3m-$10m in his funnel to become a potential portfolio company.
 
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Not really
Yes, that is still selling something.

No, the book "100M dollar offers" is not only $0.99 on kindle, it does come in paperback and hardcover as well for $22.38 and $24.95, respectively.

I just pointed out he does in fact sell things. You said "not really." Yes. He does sell things.

A book is a product...
 

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I don’t think he even needs to say he has nothing to sell. He mentions it at the start of each video like a catch phrase. I think he can come up with a different catch phrase. I don’t mind if he has something to sell either.
 

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