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OFF-TOPIC fast thoughts or advice(child and school related)

Discussion in 'Off Topic: Sports, Funnies, Pop-Culture' started by CarrieW, Jan 25, 2008.

  1. CarrieW
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    CarrieW Gold Contributor Read Millionaire Fastlane Speedway Pass

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    I am so beside myself and need some imput. since its almost 130am figured this was a good a place as any to ask for opinions.

    My ds came out to me about 20 minutes after he went to bed and told me Mommy I have to tell you something.

    He then went on to tell me that one of the teachers strapped him into the baby chair( thats what he calls it its like a highchair kinda with staps) so I asked him why and he told me cause he was bad.(he isnt supposed to be restrained at all its in his iep) and then he says and then she smacked me in the face like this and he hit himself in the left cheek. then he proceded to ask me if I could tell his teacher that she isnt allowed to smack little boys...

    Now my ds is only 5 yrs old and is developmentally delayed. Hes about 3 or so mentally. he said it didnt happen today or yesterday but he doesnt really know those terms yet. so Im not sure when this happened...

    I am so beside myself I believe he is telling me the truth but without him being a reliable wittness I dont know how to prove it. I am going up to the school first thing in the morning I justhave no clue how to even approach someone about this...

    any thoughts?

    I dont know how I am supposed to send him back to school... He needs school he doesnt need to be strapped down and slapped tho. I am sick to my stomach over this...
     
  2. AlwaysCurious
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    AlwaysCurious Contributor

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    Now, this is serious. It can´t be solved in a day!

    I´ll doubt that confronting the teacher directly would clearify anything. You can examin the reaction carefully, if body language and spoken message are in line, but honestly, chances are that you´ll be as smart as before. Even worse, maybe you son will have more problems in class after that.

    My first advise, though hard to follow (I know!), is not to overreact emotionally. You will have a much better standing in coming confrontations, when keeping calm and rational. But that also means that you need more facts.

    So I would definetly try to contact other parents, asking about their experiences. I can´t believe, that if this really happened, that it would be a single occurence. So line up and investigate. If it turns out to be a general problem and not just a single event, then you are in a much better position than on your own. Together with others you have a much better chance to move things.

    Hope things turn out well...
     
  3. CarrieW
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    CarrieW Gold Contributor Read Millionaire Fastlane Speedway Pass

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    Thanks for the advice I do plan to go in there and be as calm as possible. I am taking him into school myself tommorow(instead of the bus) and I dont know if he will be staying...

    the problem with asking others is that its a special school and Im pretty sure it was his pre school class. alot of the kids are disabled and dont speak yet. its not like they can exactly tell someone like my ds did.

    I actually saw them restrain him and then drop him about 6 inches to the floor in his second week of school last year.

    It was the first day I was leaving him alone too. I do know some of the kids do need restraints but my son does not.

    I freaked and pulled him literally out of his teachers arms of her holding him down not even 5 minutes after we got there.

    I called an iep meeting and everything was discussed and written down and they are not allowed to restrain or physically force him at all. he was out of school for 4 days when that happened and then I sat in the classroom for a few more weeks everyday all day after...

    hes also had 2 or 3 questionable injuries that we got no documentation on that now im really wondering what happened. when I asked him he never said anything even remotly that a teacher did it so I didnt think twice I figured he just hurt himself being lenny...now im not so sure

    he goes to half day his psi(preschool intervention) and half to pre k. Im not even 100% which class it is or when it happened due to his delays but from what he said I think its the psi one. and hes one of the better off ones communication wise out of both classes...

    I also dont know how far as a parent I can take this myself. I need to notify the school but should I involve some outside source(like police) to investigate into it on our behalf or something?

    If it was day care or if it was not needed for his delay hed be soo out of there... but he does need to go to school!

    sorry to ramble I am just so upset!
     
  4. tbsells
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    tbsells Contributor

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    I think I would ask the teacher for an explanation of exactly what took place. If he/she admits that your child was restrained I would go straight to the building administrator, then to the school board, then to the police. The teacher will never admit to striking your child but may admit to restraining. If the restraining took place then the striking probably did too. I agree with the others that this is probably not an isolated incident. Sounds like video monitoring of these classrooms would be a good idea. It would protect the students from these types of things and protect the teachers from false accusations. If I were teaching in that environmenmt I would want to be taped. Please keep in mind that I am not a teacher or a parent of a developmentally challenged child, so my opinion may be worthless. I'm sorry that you are having to deal with this heartbreaking situaton.
     
  5. CarrieW
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    CarrieW Gold Contributor Read Millionaire Fastlane Speedway Pass

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    as you can imagine its been a long day... the update is almost as long! sorry lol...

    went to the school and talked to an administrator who happen to be there. told them the whole thing.

    when we got there he saw his old teacher and she asked him how he was and he blurted out miss debbie put me in the baby chair and smacked me in the face.(so much for plan of investigating before telling them lol) she looked at him then at me and i was like yeah he told me the same thing last night thats why Im here...

    we sat down and I had him sent to another room while the administrator lady and I talked and I told her the whole story. then she left and went to talk to the teacher he named this morning and she came back a few mintues later and told me what she said

    they told me that there was an incident in the gym earlier this week with ds and he was put in a stroller becasue he refused to walk back to class.

    they brought the teacher in and we all talked for a bit and then I asked to bring lenny in.

    when they said that he was like yeah went for a drive in the stroller. I totally dont think its the same incident at all... they said that was this week. last week on his daily note on thursday the note simply said he would not listen. i think its 2 different instances...

    then he looked her right in the face and told her that she smacked him in his face like this and hit the left cheeck again. she didnt deny it to him!

    I am really regretting leaving him there with the other class today. they were having activities (clifford came and read stories) and doing stuff he wanted to do so I let him stay at the prek class(pretty sure the incident was in psi) then I came home and started calling everyone i could think of.

    when i left it was basically he made it up no one smacked him. it was a misunderstanding...I believe my child.

    when he got home i tried to find out if they put him in the stroller and a chair he totaly refuses to answer any questions at all about it. said nobody did anything and nthing happened... i asked him if he was talking about today or the other day and he just said yeah.
    I asked whhe doesnt have ato talk and his answer is he cant he doesnt have any more words. I told him he could tell mommy anything he said no he cant...

    me and dh are taking him in to school on monday and we are going to sit and talk with the director i talked to at legnth today(not the administrator from this morning)and try to get more info. I also have spoken to the superintendant and she is personally looking into it. she may even be at the meeting on monday.

    now ds is saying he wants me to stay at school with him all day. he doesnt want me to leave him there at all.

    I know he needs to go to school but i dont want to send him back ever!!!!!!!!! wtf am I going to do?????????
     
  6. CarrieW
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    CarrieW Gold Contributor Read Millionaire Fastlane Speedway Pass

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    update


    He was pulled from the psi class. put in prek full time. ever since this incdent he has been having alot of problems at school.

    I am pulling him out of school all together as of today. every day I get a call from the school for him being in trouble. I get long notes everyday of all the things hes done.
    he has been in school for over 2 yrs and most of it has been this school

    I never got any notes about his behavior untill after confronting the school. now all of a sudden every single day he goes hes in touble.

    he tells me every night he doesnt want to go. I hate sending him there to get yelled at and pulled out of class for misbehaving.

    I cant comprehend why all of a sudden they have issues.(I can but I dont want to go there) so I am taking him out untill he is ready to go to kindergarden.(fall of 10) he could start next year but I want him to have extra time to mature so I wont be signing him up untill he is already 6.

    My mom and my dh disagree but I dont care lol. He hasnt been to school since thursday last week and he is not going back. I will go to the school on friday and sign whatever papers I need to have him withdrawn from prek and the psi programs totally.

    I feel so much better now that I am doing this. the kid doesnt need a complex over school at pre k level.
     
  7. Luke12321
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    Luke12321 Bronze Contributor Read Millionaire Fastlane FASTLANE INSIDER

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    wow, I am not ready to be a parent. You have to trust your own kid though no matter what and do what is best for them. Good-luck and keep us updated.
     
  8. rcardin
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    rcardin Contributor

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    Carrie as an educator for ten years and a husband of a special ed teacher I would be glad to help in any way, but need more info. IEP recommendations, how he qualified, etc. My wife taught PPCD for 3 years at one of the best pre primer special ed classrooms in tha area. Feel free to PM me if you don't want to answer in the forum.
     
  9. BeingChewsie
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    BeingChewsie Silver Contributor Read Millionaire Fastlane Speedway Pass

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    Hi Carrie,

    Can I ask what is his IEP for? ..and welcome to the club..its one you never planned on joining :). I have gone more rounds with the school system over my son and IEP issues and behavior issues and over teachers intentionally setting him off..it sucks. There is a great forum called www.conductdisorders.org

    They are all parents dealing with children with special needs, behaviorial issues, and school systems. It is very supportive.

    Pulling him out may or may not be the best choice...they are mandated to provide him with an apppropriate education in the least restrictive environment. If they can't meet his needs, they need to bring in help or place him some place that can and they must pay for it.

    Does he have a 1 on 1 aide in the pre-k class? It sounds like he should. I'd be glad to talk about this more with you. I have plenty of battle scars but my son has his own 1 on 1 aide, an excellent IEP in place, and the staff cross their t's and dot their i's in following it. Feel free to PM me.

    Sue
     
  10. AroundTheWorld
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    AroundTheWorld Be in the Moment Speedway Pass

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    There are several educational options for you and your family Carrie.

    Step One - get to the bottom of what is actually happening with your son. What is provoking this behavioral issue? Try to look at it in the most objective way that you can.

    What needs does he have that are not being met? What are the negative factors in his environment? What are the positive factors in his environment?

    Step Two: Take a whole-istic view of his life and education. How can you eliminate the negative factors and build on the positive factors in his environment?

    Pre-K is definately NOT a requirement for school success later in life. Many many children do not go to pre-k. Providing him with an enriching environment at home can be a positive at this point.

    Beyond that, let your intuition guide you. Look at the heart of the matter (those things mentioned above) and ignore all the drama.
     
  11. CarrieW
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    CarrieW Gold Contributor Read Millionaire Fastlane Speedway Pass

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    there is nothing in his iep for behavior. they wanted to have an iep meeting for behavior this week obviously I am not going.

    He is qualified for significant developmental delay.

    Iep recommendations were-
    He is not to be restrained. streamlining him into a regular class. special instructions were to call his name out during teaching times(to make sure he knows hes supposed to be listening) and to give him extra time to adjust to changes. like from one area of class to another. he has a difficult time with any change.

    specifically for psi, to work on writing his name and the alphabet. only for his academics.

    Obviously I will be working with him from home on behavior, and the academics.

    Theres lots of stuff they test for in his iep. the only area he isnt behind in is gross motor skills. every other area they tested him in needs improvment. he is about 1-2 yrs behind where he should be for fine motor, speech and a few other areas.

    He gets speech for 1 hr per week(2 30 min sessions). no other classes other then the prek.

    Thank you for the offer of help. anything you can add or ideas for me to do at home would be great.

    if you need more specifics from his iep let me know and Ill pull it out. this is the only stuff I remember off the top of myhead.

    (its in his iep he isnt supposed to be restrained. just on thursday they held him down into a crisscross with his legs and arms forcefully. this is restraining in my eyes)
     
  12. CarrieW
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    CarrieW Gold Contributor Read Millionaire Fastlane Speedway Pass

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    thanks atw and being,

    I tried to deal with the school at first. we just had an iep meeting like 3 wks ago. he does not have his own aide. when something happens they take him to the benefit coordinator. only thing he qualifies for is speech help.

    I am just fed up. basically they are trying to tell me this has been going on all along (I seriously doubt it) and it needs to be addressed. I dont trust them. not one bit!
    the teacher in prek is new and she is very strict. this is where most of his issues are coming from I am sure.

    Hes the kind of kid that needs advanced warnings of changes and extra time to comply. if you try to force him to do something he does the exact opposite. if you let him do it on his own time he is fine and 99% of the time will do what was asked. sometimes he needs to be told a few times before it sinks in.

    if you try to restrain him he will bite, kick, pinch, and head butt people.(miss julie the benefit coordiator found this out after being told he was not to be restrained) he never does this unless he is being restrained. he is very affectionate towards everyone and thats his other big problem at school. he is always wanting to touch people. their arms or their hair he gets right in peoples faces when he talks to them.

    If someone pushes him or hits him or knocks him down or tries to take a toy he will defend himself with the other kids(who are all about2x his size) he never is the first one to hit.(unless its his sister lol)

    I have observed him in school for over 9 wks between his old school and new school and I observe in every class he has been in. I have never seen any of what they are saying is going on now. I observed his new teacher and she is very strict with the kids and very intolerant of bad behavior. that would be just fine if it were a class of normal pre k kids. more then half in the prek program are from psi.

    I dont feel comfortable sending him back. I dont trust them and I think they are messing with him. (as in not following the iep)

    I will work with him from home untill he is ready for k. then we (me and the district) will have him evaulated to see what services he needs when its time for kindergarden.
     
  13. rcardin
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    I'll talk to my wife tonight and get her input. she used to teach a behavior class and did alot of restraining. She has to go get re-certified every year as she is the one on her campus now who is called if a child needs to be restrained.

    From what I know, don't quote me, a child should only be restrained if they are a danger to themselves or others. Whenever a child is restrained it must be documented at the campus level and probably the district level. The teacher doing the restraining should be certified by the state? or maybe just the district. the crisscross that you speak of is the best restraining technique for children that age. Less chance of them getting hurt or hurting others.

    Couple of more questions to help me understand.
    How did he get referred for testing? When he was being tested did you mention any behavioral issues with the diagnostician? Since it is a pre-k class they would have no way of knowing if a behavior intervention plan (B.I.P) was needed. How did you get it out in his IEP that no restraining was to be used. Sounds like it had been used before for behavior problems at school and you specifically asked in the IEP that it not be used. I have never seen an IEP that specifically lists that.
     
  14. BeingChewsie
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    BeingChewsie Silver Contributor Read Millionaire Fastlane Speedway Pass

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    I understand they didn't follow the IEP and that clearly needs to be addressed. A more pressing issue is what is causing the behaviorial outburts. What is going on in his environment that it setting him off? Could be social issues, could be noise, lights, smells in the classroom, could be they are not giving him the right amount of time to transition..this is where you as the parent have to be the investigator and get to the bottom of it.

    If you are pulling him out then none of this matters but I wouldn't be able to call a team meeting fast enough to address the behavior intervention plan they would be putting in place..effective immediately. A child who is years behind his peers doesn't need a punitive plan in place..he needs a plan that encourages positive interaction in the classroom.

    Have you contated your pediatrician or the specialist that diagnosed him about the increase in behaviors? Has he had a neuropsych eval? That is a great place to start. You need an accurate diagnosis of what is going on with him, though at age 4 or so that can be a little harder to figure out.

    How is he at home?..if he is fine at home..figure out why and suggest that the school staff handle him ther same way. I had to do that with my son and it made a world of difference. He is like a different child now in school.

    You can and should go to www.wrightslaw.com to explore some things you can do.

    I would offer you should address this head on now. If you don't you'll just be addressng it in 2010.

    Sue






     
  15. CarrieW
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    CarrieW Gold Contributor Read Millionaire Fastlane Speedway Pass

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    sorry this is a bit choppy I tried to answer each question. sorry if its hard to read.


    in the 2nd or 3rd week of class in this new school I dropped him off,(first day I was leaving and not observing too) he wasnt cooperating to go to sit on the carpet.
    he was hiding in the toy house. so the teacher went and grabbed him by the arm and pulled him out of the house he was in and proceeded to pick him up to move him physcially. he resisted and ended up getting dropped about 6-8 inches to the floor on his face.

    thats when that was put in the iep. cause I freaked. I pulled him out of the teachers arms and took him home and didnt return him to school untill there was a new meeting and everyone was told they arent to restrain or force him physically to do anything.

    I was told they usually dont put it in there to NOT BE restrained. becuase they need permission to restrain. which I never gave.

    due to his response to being physically forced or restrained it is much worse to restrain him then to let him be. if he gets restrained or forced he freaks out and you dont get him back for quite some time.

    he has never viciously tried to injure another child. he will only bite and kick and stuff if he is restrained. so it was put in there for that reason. for him not to get hurt(trying to get away from restraint) or hurt a teacher. there was never a question or incident of him hurting another child or himself.

    He was originally tested at 28 months old. I had to demand his pedi send us to childrens hospital to get hearing tests done because he wasnt speaking at all still. chop refered me to a company that tests for the state. there were never behaviour issues untill recently. most of them he learned in class from the other kids.

    he is very distractable, he will be totally fine untill someone else does something then he joins right in, the other kids will stop when told and he keeps going.

    He is in pre k in addition to his psi. psi is for under k kids. his psi class is where he got restrained and slapped. they do his psi stuff in a small group setting with a different teacher 2 days a week for 1 hr at a time since he was pulled from the class.

    His pre k teacher is the one who called the meeting for the behaviour plan. they know about and have read his iep.

    he is generally fine at home. he has times when he doesnt listen or gets out of hand and he gets sent to his room. usually with a little coaxing he will cooperate.

    I am going to talk to the school to see about getting him services maybe 1 day a week in psi. if they cant then I will just work that much harder here at home with him.

    I dont know what he is entitled to, I pulled him from the psi class but not the program. I am definatey pulling him from pre k tho. the way it worked before, if he acted up he got sent back to psi. now he has no fall back.

    I feel like I am sending the kid off to be tourtured when I put him on the bus. he looks so sad to be going. this from a child who loved school up till last month. when he was off for breaks everyday he would ask me when he was going back. now all he says is I hate school.

    it makes me sick, I cant send him there anymore. I swear everyday he has been there for the last 2 wks I get a phone call from julie or his teacher with him crying in the background. I just cant do that to him anymore.
     

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