F*ck it, i'm learning to code

[Andy Black]

Thanks to both @eliquid and @csalvato .

This should be extracted in it is own thread :

Agreed.

@csalvato ... would you do the honours?

 

[MaciekWado]

Maybe it correlates with most of the scam artists disappearing

Focusing on learning to code is, imo, a shift back towards focusing on making an incredible product. That's what we should all be focusing on, anyway. I welcome this change!

Well I wouldn't call people who give advice about marketing scam artists only because they have a different opinion than you. Will you consider @healthstatus a scam for example?
Coding is good way but you need devote years for it. The problem is right now so called coding mania. Many people like sheep are starting this route, I'm CS graduate and really see this pattern. Many think that having skills like coding = success. Same in your thinking "shift back towards focusing on making an incredible product. " to create increadible product. You need to now the specific market in which you are creating product. Learning only to code is like saying I will learn how to use a hammer and will build a house. This doesn't work that way. Coding is one skill, knowing your area is crucial. With only coding skill you will be building products for others who have this knowledge.
Backing to scam artist. Same can be said about coding. Now when we have coding bubble course after course are popping up. If you look at them there are even scammers after their explanation of box model get severe headache.

In conclusion. Coding isn't stupid if there is interest in this(I mean someone really like it and will be able do it for rest his life day by day). Spending years to learn code because you smell money in IT then spend time to learn your market area is stupid. You think M.J without knowledge of transporation will be able to create good bussiness model? Probably right now will be working as S.E or creating coding courses.
In his time outsourcing was stupid as there was lack of developers. Right now due to marketing is one of the hottest job.
One more. I think you miss the point marketing is a product as a service. Apple is incredible due to marketing people are happy buying this experience. There are plenty of better products in technical and even quality term. Yet not even close to experience we get from Apple.

 

[MaciekWado]

@csalvato
Hi I'm not saying that you accuse others.
I mean your response can be taken as you are.
"Maybe it correlates with most of the scam artists disappearing "
The message is clear in this qoute. I understand it is a joke.
But in other hand sounds like less scammers equal less advice about marketing.

Rest of my post wasn't directly to you but to others who will read and think: I want more money, I will learn programming and will be milionaire.
Programming is good to do it. But it is only one way from many.
You like it. I after few years of coding looking to other niche from which I dont have outstanding skills but I learned how to outsource. Just starting, last month earned $8k (dont wanna share this with forum as dont know if it will be success or failure). Im leaving in Poland in Cracov. So called Dragon Valley of high tech, in other words most of highly developed nations like USA and other outsource to us. My salary was $5k and believe me it was one of high salary for the developer in Poland. Yes, I can work remotely and earn more but still, it will be a job, with weird hours due to time zones.

Many is also missing point in my country. They are cheap meat. If there will be any another crisis or codding bubble will burst, first developer who would lose the job will be this one from outsourcing. I know many who don't have knowledge about codding starting their software houses and earning a decent amount of money.

Again coding is trade like other learning it due to fact is fascinating for you great, forcing yourself because you smell money is stupid. Too many people are entering here in the next few years hiring a programmer will be a commodity(it just started).
I mean you and I have some experience so we don't have a problem finding job.
But look at juniors. There is a shortage of open positions for them.
Here you can find programming scammers, many will tell you how many programmers are needed. What they don't mention experts are needed not juniors.

From your post, I can easily notice that you are interested in programming, but because of that you fall in the trap that all other learn to program for the same reason, Most of them if they want to earn money can excel far more in other areas easly. Right now more than 50% of startup are from tech area. The competition is enormous, and like from other thread people point out. Coding is only one aspect of product like website.

 

[MrLynn]

F*ck it, i'm learning to code

Good luck, took business analytics in college and loved it. I would code in "R" and enjoyed it to death.

 

[MrLynn]

Nice. I'm considering Python for 2020.

Python is the next on my list to learn in terms of coding as well, good luck to you

 

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[SeanLewis]

February has been a month of uncertainty.

I’ve been learning ReactJS and progress has been slow and it's been getting harder to drag myself in front of the computer, not because i find it difficult but because my intentions have not been clear.

I’ve had to take a step back, I've had to really look at where I am in life.

I have a great idea for a Saas business. Businesses in this industry are currently paying tens of thousands of dollars and spending months doing what this could help them do in days if not hours.

The thing is..

I’m not sure which order to do things in, this is where I need your advice.

On one hand this project is a true fastlane venture, this business aligns perfectly with my 10 year vision.

On the other hand this will take a long time to develop so it might be smarter to build a smaller portfolio project(to show my skill), start getting some work and actually making some money first. Then once I have some more experience and disposable income I can focus on my fastlane venture.

What are your thoughts? Am i being foolish or realistic?

 

[SeanLewis]

Is there any way to segment your idea and work on a small part of it first?
When you start to get more experience, you`ll find yourself building up your own codebase.
Functions, structures, scripts etc.
Why not isolate the MVP for this SaaS that you`re thinking, and start working on that?
If you lack a mentor, the next best thing is to make something which people will use.

P.S.
Do not spend time worrying about your code.
Your only goal is to make something that works without bugs.
Once you get some experince, you can re-write parts of your code which you dont like.

I guess that could work, I think i'm still unsure of what skills i need to show in order to get hired. Would having functioning smaller segments on github be enough? if so i could easily start working on those and then just reuse them when building my actual MVP.

 

[alexkuzmov]

I guess that could work, I think i'm still unsure of what skills i need to show in order to get hired. Would having functioning smaller segments on github be enough? if so i could easily start working on those and then just reuse them when building my actual MVP.

It could happen, but its unlikely.
Even if you have functioning code snippets, there is no guarantee that a company will have interest in them, or that the company wont make you do a code test which is unrelated to what you want to do.
There is no downside though.
Either they accept it or not, but you gain experince so its worth it, even if just a little.

 

[AidenRafi]

With the advent of no-code communities and platforms like airtable + zappier, how important is it to learn coding?

 

[AidenRafi]

With the advent of none stick pans and pots, how important is it to learn how electricity works?

I hear what you are saying, but doesn't it depend if you are looking to be a chef or an electrician?

 

[SeanLewis]

I hear what you are saying, but doesn't it depend if you are looking to be a chef or an electrician?

Right there i think you answered your first question

 

[Edward5]

Which language is best to build a web app, php?

 

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[Deleted78083]

Also, there are concepts in programing which apply for any language (excluding HTML, XML, CSS, LESS, etc. the UI languages basically, or SQL and others). You should focus on them regardless of which language you choose.
Dont focus on ALL of them, just the ones which are available in the language you are learning.

1. Logical structures. (if then, else, switch ...)
2. Cycle/Loop operators (for, for..in, while, foreach ...)
3. Variable types(string, bool, int ...) and scope (learn where a variable is visible and where not, SUPER IMPORTANT!)
4. Data structures (Array, Matrix, Stack, Heap ...)
5. Object oriented programing (abstraction, inheritance, interfaces, implementation ...)
6. Design patterns (Repository, Factory, Singleton ...)

If you understand these, you can learn any language.

Any resources you'd recommend to learn these?

 

[Kepler]

Here’s a great course on building apps comparable on all platforms (it’s on sale at the moment too)

The Complete React Developer Course (w/ Hooks and Redux)

Learn how to build and launch React web applications using React, Redux, Webpack, React-Router, and more!

www.udemy.com

 

[Tubs]

@SeanLewis
Any updates?

 

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[alexkuzmov]

Hey @alexkuzmov , thanks for checking in. I've been wanting to update the thread for a while now.

To be honest i feel a bit like a failure, haven't been able to bring myself to write about it.

I lost my job and apartment due to covid, or I guess my failure to deal with the situation.

After a few months I got into university(prep year for computer science), tuition is free and the loans are almost 0% interest so I guess it’s not a terrible deal. Managed to get a student apartment last month so i’m not on the streets anymore.

Needless to say it’s been a shitty year and I handled it poorly.

I’m starting to build things again, thinking about doing it in public and build some authority.

Feel like this is the first time I've been able to take a deep breath in the past 10 months.

I’m re-reading unscripted to get my head in the right space.

This is a tough man.
Are you saying that you were homeless at one point?

 

[alexkuzmov]

Slept in my car for a bit, mostly stayed with friends.
Never had to sleep on a park bench or anything

What about the Upwork gigs, did it work out?
Also about the skills, did you build something yourself, finished a course?

 

[zhangmin_007]

这。比什么都重要。我对术语的任何定义都可以称为开发人员。但是除了大学过时的无关课程之外，我从未完成过任何形式的课程。我从一个问题开始，然后找到使用适合该过程的任何编程语言/工具/方法来解决该问题的最佳方法。通过研究其他应用程序/代码如何解决问题或实现所需的功能来学习。如果不相同，至少要接近它。然后，我研究所有我不了解的代码，并在此过程中学习大量知识。

因此，我强烈建议您定义要解决的问题/产品或应用要解决的问题，而不是遵循既定的课程。然后学习完成该任务所需的一切。

一切顺利...

Can not agree any more!

 

[brb]

Been a while..

I started this thread a little over 2 years ago, with a dream of being able to build whatever I want. In that sense you could say I've made it.

oh also.. I just launched my first Saas product!

It's in the lead generation/marketing space and I have 1 customer so far. Building it was a lot harder than I thought but I kept pushing and my confidence as a developer has never been higher.

It took 5 months to build but I probably spent 4 months too long on it before I launched.. but hey, you live and learn.

Now I face some new challenges, actually getting more customers.

My first customer is a contact I made through my last business. I know they’ve used a product like this before so I've sort of built it for them which was nice because it kept me grounded. Having an industry INSIDERS to talk to really helps in deciding which features to focus on first.

What i'm doing right now is building up a knowledge base on how to use the product which I’m also hoping will help with SEO. I don't really have that much money so my main focus is to do SEO along with some hustling to get the ball rolling.

It’s good to be back,
Sean Lewis

Hi Sean,

Congrats on launching your first SAAS. What niche is it in?

 

[Vasili27]

Why do you go with PHP over JS?

I am wondering, say you have someone:
- that is starting from scratch
- wants to learn enough code to be able to rapidly develop working prototypes of web apps
- has one year to gain that practical knowledge

which language would you recommend?

//tagging @eliquid and @csalvato

what about Python?

 

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[alexkuzmov]

Been a while..

I started this thread a little over 2 years ago, with a dream of being able to build whatever I want. In that sense you could say I've made it.

oh also.. I just launched my first Saas product!

It's in the lead generation/marketing space and I have 1 customer so far. Building it was a lot harder than I thought but I kept pushing and my confidence as a developer has never been higher.

It took 5 months to build but I probably spent 4 months too long on it before I launched.. but hey, you live and learn.

Now I face some new challenges, actually getting more customers.

My first customer is a contact I made through my last business. I know they’ve used a product like this before so I've sort of built it for them which was nice because it kept me grounded. Having an industry INSIDERS to talk to really helps in deciding which features to focus on first.

What i'm doing right now is building up a knowledge base on how to use the product which I’m also hoping will help with SEO. I don't really have that much money so my main focus is to do SEO along with some hustling to get the ball rolling.

It’s good to be back,
Sean Lewis

Hey man, congrats on not giving up
so how do you like developing so far?

 

[Vasili27]

Do you recommend any languages to learn?

I've been developing for two years as Java Dev (+Spring, SQL, ORM) and I think this language is mostly for big, corporate projects so I'm thinking about swapping to something else, but there're sooo many possibilities...

python?

 

[MishuAman]

Hey Sean,
I have about 11 years of experience as a developer
If I can help you with something, go ahead and drop me a question in this thread.

That being said, I believe in crossing bridges when you come to them.
If you have an app in mind, or some software you want to make, then focus on learning the tools needed for that.
If RoR is the tool you need, then great.
If not, then dont waste time on it. Instead learn what you`ll need.

Also, there are concepts in programing which apply for any language (excluding HTML, XML, CSS, LESS, etc. the UI languages basically, or SQL and others). You should focus on them regardless of which language you choose.
Dont focus on ALL of them, just the ones which are available in the language you are learning.

1. Logical structures. (if then, else, switch ...)
2. Cycle/Loop operators (for, for..in, while, foreach ...)
3. Variable types(string, bool, int ...) and scope (learn where a variable is visible and where not, SUPER IMPORTANT!)
4. Data structures (Array, Matrix, Stack, Heap ...)
5. Object oriented programing (abstraction, inheritance, interfaces, implementation ...)
6. Design patterns (Repository, Factory, Singleton ...)

If you understand these, you can learn any language.

JUST WANTED TO ASK HOW CAN WE LEARN FASTLY ,SHOULD WE GO FOR COURSES OR SHOULD WE START MAKING PROJECT,WHICH IS MORE EFFECIENT,,,,
PLZ REPLY SIR

 

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[SeanLewis]

what about Python?

python?

I would only recommend python if you plan on working with big data or AI, that pretty much all it's used for professionally.

If you want to build literally anything else than AI then it's better to go with Javascript, Rails or PHP(in that order..) You will get spammed with job offers and be able to build web apps fast.

 

[Ayush6543]

F*ck it, i'm learning to code

This has been nagging me for years now.

I'm sick of having great software ideas and not being able to build them.

I'm sick of not having any marketable skills.

And i'm sick of making excuses!

Why coding?

When my last business failed i realised i didn’t really have any “real” skills.

This is why i’m taking a step back before i launch another business and learning to program.

I’ve been interested in programming for a long time, but i never got around to learning anything more then HTML/CSS. I really like the idea of being able to build whatever i want, no matter how dumb it is.

I’m learning to code because i want to, not because it’s the fastest way to make money.


Here is the game plan:

I don't plan on wasting any time on this. Once i have a good understanding of the basics I plan on learning through DOING.

I'm currently going through the odin projects "web development 101". I already know HTML/CSS and Javascript is next.

I wasted a lot of time researching which back end language to learn but i've decided on "Ruby / Ruby on Rails". (there is no best language btw)

Once i know JS and I'm going to start applying to jobs/contracts while still learning RoR. My hope is to find something part time that is remote, that way i can spend the rest of my time learning and working on my own project.

Execution

The goal is to:

1. Learn programming.
2. Get a job and further develop this skill.
3. Create a “web app” of my own.

In this thread I'll share a weekly recap of the things i've learned, challenges encountered and wins. If you're a programmer and have tips, feel free to pm me or leave a comment.

The best way to learn anything is to apply what you learn. I will advice you to build small/tiny projects and then pick up the flow as you go. Just don't waste too much time on tutorials or researching Which programming languages are the best? or the best frameworks to learn. These are huge waste of time. Plus I will say to learn one language at a time then if you are comfortable with it or maybe you want to change your stack, you can move to other languages.

Exceptions
There may be time when you don't understand some parts or may be you think what's the use of putting so many semi-colons or brackets. But this just about the language which you choose.
If you want to learn programming fast and easily without spending too much time, with my own personal experience I will suggest to start with python as it is very easy. Except frontends you can build anything you want, and the fundamentals are same in most programming languages so very less friction will be faced when moving from python to javascript, java or c++.
Here are some YouTubers who will help you on your journey.
programming with mosh for tutorials and really good teacher
web dev simplified superb guy with good insights about code and really good teacher too
code with harry if you are Indian and want to learn in hindi

Note: Unless you belong to the family of gates, or if your dad has too much money, I will suggest you not to spend money on courses, because everything is free on the internet.

 

[alexkuzmov]

JUST WANTED TO ASK HOW CAN WE LEARN FASTLY ,SHOULD WE GO FOR COURSES OR SHOULD WE START MAKING PROJECT,WHICH IS MORE EFFECIENT,,,,
PLZ REPLY SIR

Go for projects.
Get courses only to sovle specific problems.

 

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[Guram112]

Nice man I like energy. I am also learning coding more specifically web design. If you need accountability partner you can text me, we can share our daily experience.
Best regards

 

[SeanLewis]

I'm curious. After people were willing to buy your software, why do you say you were too late? Do your competitors have all the other possible customers? It sounds like you did some market research with what you thought was a great product and found that the market is willing to buy it but you have some work to do.

Since you have it developed already if you updated the software, could it be successful? Can you talk to your customers to find out what would improve their experience and make releases to improve the product? You might be able to leap-frog your competitors in features or by not having too many features, but making it quick and easy to use.

You'll almost always have competition. Even if you don't start with it, it will come for you.

BTW, until you've made it in the SAAS space, these projects should make great portfolio pieces for you to show potential customers if you want to have your own software shop. Keep them polished and they will help you sell yourself especially early in your software career. It's your IP and isn't part of a team implementation at a larger company.

I agree with everything you say, it's just that i've been promoting this thing for 6 months now and there is no real traction or interest. At some point I have to cut my losses and move on. I'll definitely keep it running tho!

 

[Boogie]

I agree with everything you say, it's just that i've been promoting this thing for 6 months now and there is no real traction or interest. At some point I have to cut my losses and move on. I'll definitely keep it running tho!

Well in that case...

 

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