Do Any Of You Guys Think Apple Are Starting To Show Signs Of Falling?

[CPisHere]

Apple is on the back-half of the iPhone product Life Cycle. Businesses are built by creating value (aka revenue-generation) but profits are obtained by extracting value (aka business model + unit economics). That's what you are seeing. Apple is stacking cash until their next big breakthrough product.

 

[MJ DeMarco]

I can't speak for anyone else, but I told myself I would NEVER buy another iPad. I went with a Samsung.

When my iPhone kicks the bucket, I'll probably do the same.

I just feel that if they continue to go down this route, eventually people will feel ripped off and switch over to Android.

To quote a passage from Unscripted , Apple is simply squeezing the towel and they are no longer good at hiding it. Typical multi-national corporate BS.

 

[Almantas]

 

[million$$$smile]

Remember,
Woolworths, Pan Am, Borders, Blockbuster, Oldsmobile, Amoco, Enron, General Foods (acquired), Compaq, Eastern Airlines, E.F. Hutton, Paine Webber, Merry-Go-Round, MCI Worldcom, Standard Oil, Pullman Co., Arther Anderson, TWA, DeLorean Motors, Pets.com, Adelphia, Lionel Corp, Bear Stearns, Beatrice Foods, Atari, Drexel Burnham Lambert, Child World, Norton Motorcycle, Orion Pictures, Schwinn Bycycle, Wang Labs, Commodore Int'l, Simtek Corp, Chieftan Products, Bre-X, Game Tek, Tseng Labs, Daewoo, Napster, Bethlehem Steel, Bradlees.....

And perhaps soon,
Sears, J.C Penney, Zynga, Red Lobster, Volvo, Quiznos, Blackberry, Abercrombie & Fitch, First Solar, Trip Advisor, Avon, Payless Shoes, Macys, Aeropostale, Theranos, The Limited, Tiffany, Claire's, Twitter?

Who knows? I remember cutting my internet teeth on Netscape and AOL but few use then now...

The only thing I'm sure about is that nothing is constant.

And your only as good as your last sale.

 

[biophase]

If you have read Steve Jobs's book, then you probably know that Apple has swerved from his vision. Steve wanted everything looking smooth, sleek and most of all, easy to use. You can tell that many of the Apple decisions made are these so called "way ahead of their time innovations" but instead make the user experience worse. Jobs would have never let these headaches pass for innovation.

I am reminded of this every time I'm on a plane and I go to plug in my Bose noise cancelling headphones and then F*ck! I forgot the dongle. WTF.

Jobs, "so you want to remove the headphone jack?"
Apple Designer, "yes, we believe people will buy wireless headphones in the future""
Jobs, "what happens when their headphones run out of batteries?"
Apple Designer, "They can then use regular headphones"
Jobs, "so you want people to carry around this extra swing dick around so they can use headphones?"
Apple Designer, "Yes"
Jobs, "You're fired"

 

Dislike ads? Remove them and support the forum: Subscribe to Fastlane Insiders.

[Sanj Modha]

Apple has turned into Microsoft. They have so much money and market share and their technologies are so entrenched they will be around for a long time to come and make money for a long time to come.

They also have the same problem as Microsoft. Instead of listening to what the market wants they try throwing stuff out there and call it 'innovations' when little to no one finds it 'innovative'. Like the headphone jack. Oh yea that's SO BOLD removing an option and calling it innovative. That's a really big innovation there. Samsung is only slightly better.

I don't know what's wrong with these companies. It's like their completely disconnected with the market and just make up stuff thinking this is what they want.

Somebody please make a phone with a big battery (I don't care if it's as slim as a credit card) that's replaceable, that won't require me to update if I don't want to without having to keep 'rescheduling', that I can fully set to factory 0 without any updates so if I wanted I can get a brand new battery and reset it back to the old OS and get my 'like new' battery life back without all the extra crap running that slows down the phone and eats up more battery. Keep the headphone jack so I can use it if I want to.

Seriously all I want is a phone that I can get a new battery for and keep the old OS so it runs like it was new, that I can use a headphone with in case I lose my wireless ones so I have my backup, that has a decent battery life.

I don't need "innovation" and "waterproofing" (though its sort of nice but not that big of a deal) or a camera that can take pictures of the moon. Just make it so I can keep it with a good battery life and so it doesn't get slow, with an SD card so I can get more storage. Is that to much to ask?

There's a concept called 'Planned Obsolescence". Google it.

A bunch of corp execs got together in the 30s and 40s to figure out a way of milking consumers in perpetuity. The offshoot is Coca Cola turning Santa Claus from green to red, 'disposable' electric toothbrushes when it's 2 x AA batteries that anyone can replace, and non-refillable printer cartridges which are totally reusable.

 

[lowtek]

No, Apple is proof positive that marketing is queen. Even when their execution slipped (lagging comparable android phones in features) they still sell massive quantities of phones at a big profit.

With respect to innovation, nobody is really innovating - least of all Apple, who never innovated. We're seeing the effects of corporatism and easy money. If you can get capital for next to nothing, then it makes no sense to innovate. You don't have to take risk to get a big return on your money, just bank on something iterative and rake in the profits.

Got a breakthrough idea? Oh... well, better make sure it doesn't violate any of the hundreds of thousands of patents held by the entrenched oligopolies. Good luck trying to reinvent the phone as a startup, given that Apple F*cking patented rectangles with rounded corners.

 

Dislike ads? Remove them and support the forum: Subscribe to Fastlane Insiders.

[TonyStark]

Why not? Nowadays getting their phone for $999 isn't good value compared to the best Androids, so surely eventually people will notice and switch?

Just look at how many Apple stores are already sold out.

Apple is far beyond rationality at this point.

 

[jon.a]

I have never knowingly purchased an Apple product.

 

Dislike ads? Remove them and support the forum: Subscribe to Fastlane Insiders.

[lowtek]

I agree that nobody is really innovating in this space but I disagree that Apple never innovated.

They created iTunes and revolutionized the music industry when everyone said it was dying. They created the App Store and turned it into a $12bn industry (just Apple's revenue/year).

They launched the iPhone and turned how telecoms operators provide services on its head. This was all during Jobs' time so who knows what the future will bring. Except for the Mac - I do find their products less inspiring now.

I have the iPhone 6 and no plans to move. Not for a while.

I think we have different definitions of innovation. To me innovation is creating something brand new and never before seen and a clear leap forward for the consumer. We already had software repositories and peer to peer file sharing... so nothing really new there.

At their core, all the iTunes and app store are, are DRM systems that dictate how I can use the stuff I have purchased. I'm firmly in the anti DRM camp.

What if I don't want to use iTunes to play music, because winamp still whips the llamas a$$? Too bad, better burn it to a CD party like it's 1990. What if I want to download content and then watch it somewhere without internet access? Guess I better pray iTunes doesn't try to phone home - heaven forbid I be able to enjoy the content I paid for, without Apple's permission.

To me, everything Apple does is either a copycat or a step in the opposite direction of where we should be heading. To be fair, there is some zealotry in my position, but I don't think my assertion that I should be able to listen to the music I purchased in whatever software I want is off base.

 

Dislike ads? Remove them and support the forum: Subscribe to Fastlane Insiders.

[Vigilante]

I just switched from an iPhone to the Google pixel 2. Solid performance
and seamless Google integration. Taking a full, long drink of the Kool-Aid.

Their (Google's) voice recognition technology and digital assistant is far superior.

 

[eliquid]

When Apple started to offer previous models and make a knob for the camera I knew they were starting to falling.

Knob? Is this like that drawer handle crap I see the kids with on the back of their phone? I almost super glued a leftover handle I had from my kitchen remodel to mine just to see what the fuss was about.

 

[StevieB]

Apple has turned into Microsoft. They have so much money and market share and their technologies are so entrenched they will be around for a long time to come and make money for a long time to come.

They also have the same problem as Microsoft. Instead of listening to what the market wants they try throwing stuff out there and call it 'innovations' when little to no one finds it 'innovative'. Like the headphone jack. Oh yea that's SO BOLD removing an option and calling it innovative. That's a really big innovation there. Samsung is only slightly better.

I don't know what's wrong with these companies. It's like their completely disconnected with the market and just make up stuff thinking this is what they want.

Somebody please make a phone with a big battery (I don't care if it's as slim as a credit card) that's replaceable, that won't require me to update if I don't want to without having to keep 'rescheduling', that I can fully set to factory 0 without any updates so if I wanted I can get a brand new battery and reset it back to the old OS and get my 'like new' battery life back without all the extra crap running that slows down the phone and eats up more battery. Keep the headphone jack so I can use it if I want to.

Seriously all I want is a phone that I can get a new battery for and keep the old OS so it runs like it was new, that I can use a headphone with in case I lose my wireless ones so I have my backup, that has a decent battery life.

I don't need "innovation" and "waterproofing" (though its sort of nice but not that big of a deal) or a camera that can take pictures of the moon. Just make it so I can keep it with a good battery life and so it doesn't get slow, with an SD card so I can get more storage. Is that to much to ask?

 

[Thoelk]

Apple was & is Steve Jobs, just like Tesla is Elon Musk. While I'm a huge fan of both (especially Musk), the biggest reason their companies skyrocket is their own persona & vision. As soon as Steve passed away, Apple just became another multinational like all it's 'enemies'.

You still have the fanbase - which was created by Steve - but Apple doesn't serve a niche-market anymore, so they're also prone to mass-consumer critics/flaws. Is Apple failing? Maybe not (yet) monetarily, but I do have the impression that they lost their 'true essence' (if a company can have that) and that they just try to squeeze everything out of the Jobs-branding as long as they can... Until Apple-products are marked as a commodity like their 'enemies' and their premium price isn't justified anymore.

As a big Tesla fan, I'm afraid this will happen with the company as well. Tesla as a product is nice/great, yet over-expensive due to the fact that you're essentially funding their R&D. The reason the company keeps going, is because of Elon's huge vision & persona. But he has stated it before that he will leave the company alone, when the mass-production is on point. From that point on, I think Tesla's will become just another car manufacturer. The biggest difference with Steve Jobs/Apple? Tesla isn't Elon his endgoal, so he "cares less about it".

I hope I'm wrong though, but we'll see...

 

[TonyStark]

Nah

 

[Sanj Modha]

Jobs is gone, they can only fake it for so long. As long as the bean counters are in charge it will be more of the same with no meaningful innovation. Seems to happen a lot once a company is put on managerial life support like Apple. They just try to keep the ride going as long as possible. What is needed is someone with vision and the guts to implement it in top management. I don't see that happening. Google on the other hand...

Nail on the head for me. Steve Jobs was their greatest asset and weakness in my opinion. But the same is true for Musk/Tesla, Bezos/Amazon etc. How long can these companies flourish without the founder and visionary? It would be a challenge for anyone.

 

Dislike ads? Remove them and support the forum: Subscribe to Fastlane Insiders.

[PetePreneur]

Perhaps this exact thing is happening to Apple:

View: https://youtu.be/_1rXqD6M614

 

[Kak]

I can tell you that I have observed BIG lacking in terms of customer service. I have a business account at apple and buy things I need for my employees and also have apple care on all of my stuff. Thousands of dollars of apple stuff on my account.... I used to walk in to an apple store and they would roll out the red carpet and kiss my a$$.

The things I have gone through lately for service and the accusatory tone some of these hygiene lacking jackass hippy “geniuses” have taken with me about a hardware failure on 3 iPhones with ZERO external damage is ridiculous.

I did eventually get it taken care of but not without a huge suck on my time. I would say screw em, but I have learned there is nowhere else to go.

 

Dislike ads? Remove them and support the forum: Subscribe to Fastlane Insiders.

[BD64]

Why not? Nowadays getting their phone for $999 isn't good value compared to the best Androids, so surely eventually people will notice and switch?

Good value is all relative. To millions of people around the world the Apple brand is worth it.

And don't forget a huge part of their value equation comes not only from the physical product, but the buying experience in their stores. Their stores bring in crazy amounts of $/sq. ft. cuz they have a system that is so, so good.

 

Dislike ads? Remove them and support the forum: Subscribe to Fastlane Insiders.

[Iammelissamoore]

I understand the point you are making, but, at the end of the day, as I look at it, no one places a gun to our heads to purchase anything. Okay, so we won't deny the fact that apple built a reliable brand over the years and they have many products/gadgets housed under this brand's umbrella. Surely, there are a lot of people who have strictly apple products in their home, but if after a while people aren't happy and apple is ignoring the issues, then as you've said they'll switch.

However, apple is an established brand, at present, does it mean they have foreverbility? NO, there are some established brands from yesteryear who have gone out of business for varying reasons ending their once seemingly 'foreverbility'.

...and All that I've raised is from the Consumer perspective.

Now, from the Productocratic perspective, someone(s) are looking at all these faulty aspects of the apple products and they are creating replacement products/parts compatible with the apple brand (because, why not ride the apple woo-hoo wave in the meantime that it's still around?) and presenting it to the market while profiting - they're listening to the needs of frustrated apple users. Also, someone/a company somewhere is working on building remarkable electronics that may rival apple that can possibly be better than, and I know a lot of people would think - "what can be better than apple?" However, it isn't impossible, I guess it's a matter of time. The actions from the consumer side of things can only do one of two things - it can demand apple to get back into perfecting their products by continuously acting, assessing and adjusting based on consumers demands, or the consumers can put them out of business if they choose not to continue fulfilling their needs as they place money ahead of needs. At the end of the day, the choice AND the power lie in the consumer's hands.

 

Dislike ads? Remove them and support the forum: Subscribe to Fastlane Insiders.

[mikey3times]

I think Apple got rid of the headphone jack because wires are on the way out.

But seriously, this entire argument is pointless. Apple vs Android is just as polarized as politics. You cannot have a rational discussion about it without a fanboy making some ridiculous statement about how stupid the other side is.

 

[The-J]

I find they're been declining for a while now, but it's very possible that it's only temporary.

Apple risks falling into the same trap HP did: refusing to innovate more because they think they've 'done enough' and need to focus only on maintaining their products.

However, they're in new businesses now. They're in the self driving car business and the VR business. They sell wearable tech. Their 40-year success largely has been through going into different businesses, designing things to be better, and then making a huge splash. The iPhone doesn't really need to 'innovate' anymore, really. What they probably could do, is go into a new market where they see a big user experience problem, design something better with their huge stacks of cash, and release it to great fanfare.

People made fun of the iPad when it first came out. Turns out, it's about the best toy for kids that's ever been invented. People made fun of the Apple Watch when it first came out. Turns out, it's extremely useful in situations when you can't be looking at a screen.

Think about this: they've been in the personal computer business for something like 40 years now. Yet their most dominant product is the iPhone. They weren't in the phone business as long as Nokia, RIM, Motorola, or even Sony.

Despite the downward decline, Apple is gonna be fine.

 

[jon.a]

What did you think you were buying?

Third party PC parts, except for Intel processors. I used to build my own PC's.

Now I buy Dell PC's.

Samsung, Motorola, Panasonic, LG etc. for everything else now days.

 

[minivanman]

I've been an Apple user because the lil woman likes their products but.... next year when I get another phone it will not be Apple. This last update they gave me SUCKS (I just woke up one morning and my phone had updated. Never done that before)!!! It has so many things about it that I don't like now. It would take me an hour to type them all out... and I'm a fast typer! I don't know what I'll be getting next but not Apple.

 

[Spstepp]

Jobs is gone, they can only fake it for so long. As long as the bean counters are in charge it will be more of the same with no meaningful innovation. Seems to happen a lot once a company is put on managerial life support like Apple. They just try to keep the ride going as long as possible. What is needed is someone with vision and the guts to implement it in top management. I don't see that happening. Google on the other hand...

 

Dislike ads? Remove them and support the forum: Subscribe to Fastlane Insiders.

[PureA]

You just know Steve Jobs' reaction would not be a pleasant one if he saw Apple today...

They will fade IMO (as much as a $250b powerhouse can)

 

Dislike ads? Remove them and support the forum: Subscribe to Fastlane Insiders.

[Sanj Modha]

I think we have different definitions of innovation. To me innovation is creating something brand new and never before seen and a clear leap forward for the consumer. We already had software repositories and peer to peer file sharing... so nothing really new there.

At their core, all the iTunes and app store are, are DRM systems that dictate how I can use the stuff I have purchased. I'm firmly in the anti DRM camp.

What if I don't want to use iTunes to play music, because winamp still whips the llamas a$$? Too bad, better burn it to a CD party like it's 1990. What if I want to download content and then watch it somewhere without internet access? Guess I better pray iTunes doesn't try to phone home - heaven forbid I be able to enjoy the content I paid for, without Apple's permission.

To me, everything Apple does is either a copycat or a step in the opposite direction of where we should be heading. To be fair, there is some zealotry in my position, but I don't think my assertion that I should be able to listen to the music I purchased in whatever software I want is off base.

You just know Steve Jobs' reaction would not be a pleasant one if he saw Apple today...

They will fade IMO (as much as a $250b powerhouse can)

Steve would be horrified that Apple even had the audacity to launch plastic iPhones.

If you want more info - read his bio by Walter Isaacson and the chapter with the iPhone 4 (I think). The delays were caused by the internal antenna because Steve didn't want anything sticking out. He would fight with the engineers for months and when they suggested a plastic alternative - he lost it.

It's one of the best books I've ever read and there's great insight from titans like Bill Gates, Woz, Larry Ellison etc too.

 

Dislike ads? Remove them and support the forum: Subscribe to Fastlane Insiders.

[StevieB]

Nope.

Apple will depreciate because they no longer innovate. They don't have their claws in the market the same way Microsoft does.

I was around when they blew up, hell I was a salesperson of their products and saw why they did.

They will always have a fan following and those that try to use an android will be confused, but short of that, their brand will slowly die if they don't meet the commandments.

To me currently, they look like MySpace.

edit : but hey who knows maybe they'll do some crazy innovative thing like taking away the headphone jack! OMG -- thats SO BOLD. So INNOVATIVE. (seriously, why the F*ck do they even pay these idiots?)

 

[Sanj Modha]

It's like Warren Buffet says - Apple is a consumer business. They know how to market well or did (the new ads aren't as great IMO).

Look at the 1984 ad - that was ground-breaking for the time. Also the ads after during the iPod launch was pretty exceptional.

I like my iPhone 6 and my Macbook/Mac. For me it's unrivalled but I also like my Google Home, my Amazon Fire TV, my Bose headphones - I like great products and that's not always Apple. It's a closed system and that's always been Steve Jobs' 'why'. Can't fault that but now I'm not sure where they are heading.

You know there's going to be trouble when Buffet starts selling his stock. Keep your eyes open.

 

Dislike ads? Remove them and support the forum: Subscribe to Fastlane Insiders.

[MarekvBeek]

When Apple started to offer previous models and make a knob for the camera I knew they were starting to falling.

 

Dislike ads? Remove them and support the forum: Subscribe to Fastlane Insiders.