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Bitcoin goes parabolic, up 20% in one day, rises from the dead

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MJ DeMarco

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I own some and never sold.

I didn't buy the dip though...

Just kinda forgot about it.

GOLD has also been slowly rising...

Really interesting movements...

Is the market signalling trouble in the traditional financial markets?
Dollar collapse?
World market collapse?
Will Peter Schiff finally be right after decades of dire predictions?

 

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msufan

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The thing I don't understand about Bitcoin's rise in value is that it is really bad for daily use. I receive Bitcoin payouts for online gaming, but that's it. You can't use it at stores because it takes to long to process a payment, and you get hit with large fees when the network gets busy. It doesn't scale well enough to be used globally, either.

So all you have left is Bitcoin as a store of value. But that is completely based on faith/public sentiment and is dangerously close to tulips IMHO.
 

ApeRunner

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Maybe I am naive or too poor to invest. But I don't trust this Bitcoin thing. Too volatile, secretive founder/designer, hipster fanatics...
 

GPM

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It is not even close to the Tulip craze. Every single person mining or using these digital currencies are putting their faith in them. People have less faith in the government these days, which means decentralized currencies such as these are just going to become more popular.

I think that Facebook and their buddies announcing their own "crypto" bodes incredibly well for the industry as a whole, as it legitimizes a lot of it and will draw a lot of attention. Anyone who does any research will realize that Facebook and friends controlling theirs rather than having it decentralized will steer them in the direction of BTC and ETH.
 

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Luckily I did buy some bitcoin at $4k while I was messing around with it as a currency remitter to Mexican pesos. Even after paying market maker fees you still come out making a small arbitrage profit. Better than giving it to HSBC or Bank of America.

Although I never thought it would go up that fast, I think it will go down further.

More and more red flags are popping up that we might be heading to something bad. Transports data doesn't look too good.

Sure our economy has created jobs but these jobs are not high paying middle class jobs. Worrisome for sure.
 

JimK

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strength of currencies is about the confidence in them. I'm not in the bitcoin game.
But gold is interesting, as it has its cycles.

Estimates of what gold should be are $10k+, but from the dow/gold ratio chart below, it's setting up to be $25k+, i.e. one or two gold coins for one share of dow.

Dow to Gold Ratio - 100 Year Historical Chart
 

Damien Dev

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Yes it's gone up 20% in a day. It could also drop 40% in an hour. People only crow when they're 'making money' I see little difference between investing in cryptocurrency and rolling a roulette wheel. Good money if you can take it off the table at the right time, not for me though. The smart money is in there pumping and dumping and it's alarming that many are now looking to buy in at $12,000 *AGAIN* Buy high sell low.
 

GPM

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@Damien Dev what if that persons plan is to hold it for 5 years and ignore the swings?
 

Yzn

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As I quoted Talal Abu-Ghazaleh before, here it is again.

 

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LinorCG

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Would it be because of the news that Facebook released Libra (their own cryto)?
 

maverick

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Interesting to see that crypto is splitting people into two camps:

Camp 1 is filled with people that have educated themselves on what blockchain is, how the technology works on a high-level and what possibilities/opportunities it will bring.

Camp 2 is filled with people that do not understand it, dismiss it outright and only focus on the negatives (e.g. the current volatility).

Amazon lost more than 90 percent of its value in two years during the dotcom bust however long term investors still made a lot of money. Only thing we need to figure out is which crypto is Amazon and which crypto is Webvan.
 

JordanS

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Yes it's gone up 20% in a day. It could also drop 40% in an hour. People only crow when they're 'making money' I see little difference between investing in cryptocurrency and rolling a roulette wheel. Good money if you can take it off the table at the right time, not for me though. The smart money is in there pumping and dumping and it's alarming that many are now looking to buy in at $12,000 *AGAIN* Buy high sell low.
The difference in your example is that on a roulette wheel you either win a little bit or lose 100%. If you are trading properly(whether it be crypto, forex, or the stock market) you aren't just going to $0. You know your targets for both your take profit and for your stop loss, which results in you winning good or losing a little.
 

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I own some and never sold.

I didn't buy the dip though...

Just kinda forgot about it.

GOLD has also been slowly rising...

Really interesting movements...

Is the market signalling trouble in the traditional financial markets?
Dollar collapse?
World market collapse?
Will Peter Schiff finally be right after decades of dire predictions?

In 1977, an engineer named William LeMessurier built an office building. It was considered a marvel of design. After it was finished, a college student that was writing their thesis on the building's design, asked a simple question. She asked how the building handled strong winds that blew on the corners of the building. This question eventually reached LeMessurier, who quickly realized that a flaw in the design meant that each year the building stood, it had a 1 in 16 chance of collapsing. At 59 stories, this building was the 7th tallest building in Manhattan. LeMessurier said in an interview, his first thought was to commit suicide, but decided he would be more useful helping others work out a solution, which a large team eventually did.

My question for people investing in Bitcoin is this, how do you know the math behind Bitcoin is not flawed?

I'm sure a lot of really smart people, both white-hat and black-hat, have examined the math that guarantees there can only be 21M Bitcoins, and have so far not found a flaw. That doesn't mean they wont in the future. Many encryption and cryptography algorithms have been attacked mathematically, and been defeated.

Because I don't understand the math behind BTC, and have seen a lot of "bullet-proof" systems fail, I will personally stick with Gold/Silver.

Having said all that, I fully expect the USD to eventually be valued at 0, because the US cannot stop printing money. If they stop printing, they will crash the economy, and if they keep printing, they will crash the economy. I use to think this would happen in about 50 years, but now I am afraid it will happen in like 5 years. Throw in some reparations, college debt forgiveness, free healthcare, open borders, free college, guaranteed basic income, and a few more wars, and it might be even sooner than that. I remember Regan talking about how a 2 trillion dollar debt was enough to stack $1000 dollar bills to the moon and back. Currently the debt is 22 trillion. Little did we know, we were living in the "good old days". It will be really interesting to see how all this plays out, but I didn't want a front-row seat.


 

Damien Dev

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@Damien Dev what if that persons plan is to hold it for 5 years and ignore the swings?
In my opinion buy and hold is only a good strategy when acquiring assets that fundamentally have value and you have sufficient data to determine whether the asset in question is either 'overvalued' or 'undervalued' relative to other assets you ultimately desire.

Bitcoin hasn't yet proven itself to be a store of value or a medium of exchange, and there's only 10 years of historical price data behind it. That isn't long enough (for myself) to make an informed investment decision.
 

Roli

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People getting ready for the halvening. Which is when block rewards get halved. Everytime that happens Bitcoin pumps.
 

Ilya C

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Is the market signalling trouble in the traditional financial markets?
Dollar collapse?
World market collapse?
Will Peter Schiff finally be right after decades of dire predictions?

I see that there is another global (long-term) trend. When the Internet came, it was like Wild West at first. No laws, no money/people's attention to be gained, nothing. Merely a playground. Then it grew to become a place where extreme power can be built/accessed from your couch. And it also became regulated and closely watched because of that power. Entities like Alphabet, Facebook, Apple, MS, Amazon do have data and attention. That would be enough to exercise control, but they are bound with something they can't influence directly — laws and money (cough... Libra... cough).

But things are going to change in an interesting way. My prediction is that the decentralized internet is going to come, returning the power to its source — the users. It is already happening, but slowly and under the shadows (there are social networks with privacy guarantees, no ads, completely free and run by their users, there are similar blog platforms, the technologies are being built to transport traffic securely over the existing routes, etc). Cryptocurrencies could be a part of that trend. In that sense, Bitcoin is merely a playground. What we see is the process, not the event. We'll recognize the event when/if it happens. (Of course I don't know if it will be Bitcoin or some other thing).

On a side note, Bitcoin is great for entrepreneurs because it has tons of issues. For it to become mainstream we need it to be easy and fast like credit card payments, we are nowhere near it atm.
 

Kid

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Interesting to see that crypto is splitting people into two camps:

Camp 1 is filled with people that have educated themselves on what blockchain is, how the technology works on a high-level and what possibilities/opportunities it will bring.

Camp 2 is filled with people that do not understand it, dismiss it outright and only focus on the negatives (e.g. the current volatility).
I'm in Camp 3.

And btw. all cryptos are webvan.
 

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Bitcoin went sideways for awhile.. I am guessing the small group of people holding most coins got tired of waiting for volatility from outside forces and began moving the markets again themselves.
 

Jeff Noel

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I'm still curious about John Mcafee's predictions a few years ago.

I choked to invest back when it was CA$8.00/BTC (I used to mine them with my gaming PC). Sold 0.3BTC when they were worth $800/BTC. This time, I'm holding until it crashed and burns... or it skyrockets. I'm not selling under 250K/BTC.
 

ChrisV

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I'm still curious about John Mcafee's predictions a few years ago.

I choked to invest back when it was CA$8.00/BTC (I used to mine them with my gaming PC). Sold 0.3BTC when they were worth $800/BTC. This time, I'm holding until it crashed and burns... or it skyrockets. I'm not selling under 250K/BTC.
I have a bunch of BTC in an account I lost the password to. I bought it when it was like $700 per coin. Every time it rises I rage.
 

brief

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The thing I don't understand about Bitcoin's rise in value is that it is really bad for daily use. I receive Bitcoin payouts for online gaming, but that's it. You can't use it at stores because it takes to long to process a payment, and you get hit with large fees when the network gets busy. It doesn't scale well enough to be used globally, either.

So all you have left is Bitcoin as a store of value. But that is completely based on faith/public sentiment and is dangerously close to tulips IMHO.

I think the core is perfect as it is and that layer 2 solutions like the lightning network will fix those issues.

That being said, imo the true stability of bitcoin will come if we start to use it.

Imo this will happen soon as the lightning network will get some attenion. Then, it will become truly valuable and people will understand why it's a better form of money and not a scam.

Just my two cents ...
 
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brief

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I think the core is perfect as it is and that layer 2 solutions like the lightning network will fix those issues.

That being said, imo the true stability of bitcoin will come if we start to use it. Then, it will become truly valuable and people will understand why it's a better form of payment and not a scam.

Just my two cents ...
 

Soder

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I don't believe in BTC, but I recognize that it could be a good trade. Due that the human psychology it could go crazy high like historic bubbles or more due this internet era that makes bigger the Fear Of Missing Out.
 

spreng

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I'd say Q2 2020 we will see the market crash. Most businesses in my space have cut back budget already and sales orgs are not hitting their bookings. The Fed is going to have to do some crazy S*** to keep the economy afloat.

Bitcoin is up because of hype probably, over the new facebook coin and then JP morgan has started using it. BTC price rises after institutional recognition and public market follows suit.
 

lewj24

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I own some and never sold.

I didn't buy the dip though...

Just kinda forgot about it.

GOLD has also been slowly rising...

Really interesting movements...

Is the market signalling trouble in the traditional financial markets?
Dollar collapse?
World market collapse?
Will Peter Schiff finally be right after decades of dire predictions?

Peter Schiff is always right. He's a very smart Austrian Economist. He just can't time it. Nobody can.

Gold is up over 10% in the last 2 months. That is crazy. And not much has even happened economically speaking. The dollar hasn't gone down that much. The CPI barely changed. Imagine when the downturn gets worse and the Fed gets looser and looser.

Gold has beaten the stock market in the last 20 years and the score is about to widen. Gold has just begun.
 
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HackVenture

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I hold a bunch of crypto including BTC; I've never tried to convince people whether BTC is good or bad or whether it's a scam or whatever, but my question to any person with "surplus" money is this.

What IF BTC one day actually does become an asset class that institutions actually have access to?

No need to argue how that will NEVER happen, how this is just a bunch of crap etc.

What IF.

And then decide your allocation accordingly.

I do believe any individual with surplus money he can afford to lose and and able to understand what it takes to buy, store and protect their own BTC should at least buy some, depending on risk appetite and comfort level.

Even if you think BTC is a piece of crap that will disappear tomorrow, the upside potential vs downside risk just makes it a no-brainer.

If or when the magical, maniacal bull market comes again, 20% wouldn't really be considered parabolic.
 

lewj24

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I hold a bunch of crypto including BTC; I've never tried to convince people whether BTC is good or bad or whether it's a scam or whatever, but my question to any person with "surplus" money is this.

What IF BTC one day actually does become an asset class that institutions actually have access to?

No need to argue how that will NEVER happen, how this is just a bunch of crap etc.

What IF.

And then decide your allocation accordingly.

I do believe any individual with surplus money he can afford to lose and and able to understand what it takes to buy, store and protect their own BTC should at least buy some, depending on risk appetite and comfort level.

Even if you think BTC is a piece of crap that will disappear tomorrow, the upside potential vs downside risk just makes it a no-brainer.

If or when the magical, maniacal bull market comes again, 20% wouldn't really be considered parabolic.
This is one of the most illogical posts I've ever read.
 

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