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A Job Isn’t Giving Up

Kak

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Some people here just need to hear that getting a job isn’t quitting. It isn’t giving up on your dreams. Provision is necessary and worry isn’t a good place to start.

A job can provide relief from your worry and you can always quit any time you want.

My one caveat to this suggestion is not to be a fool and lock yourself to whatever job with liabilities. Control yourself. Make ends meet with the easiest and least time and emotion consuming job that will will provide for you. Afford yourself time to build.

Again… A job is not giving up. As long as you don’t do it foolishly, it’s providing for you and alleviating worry.

For those of you who have zero money and don’t know what to do with yourselves, following this advice might get you closer to the answer and you won’t have zero money anymore.

Unlike other side hustles here, it is also immediate. You don’t have to build anything. You don’t have to complete a project. Sell to anyone. Set up a website. Do your books. Track your expenses. You just have to show up and do what you’re told and they’ll put money in your account on Friday.

You can quit in a month if that’s all it takes. It is NOT GIVING UP. It is GRIT! It is doing what it takes even if it’s the last thing you want to do.

Survival doesn’t have to be that hard. Thriving is what’s worth the effort.
 
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BINGO.

Not to mention, unless you are taking the absolute lowest jobs available, you should be learning some pretty valuable skills, too.

That means not only are you getting paid, but you are getting paid to learn. Jobs are great stepping stones. They beat the hell out of other forms of paid education, if the things you are learning are equal - and many things can only be learned through firsthand experience!
 
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Kak

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In other words. Focus on thriving, not on survival.

If you make survival your number one concern, that’s all you’re going to get out of what you’re doing.
 
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Some people here just need to hear that getting a job isn’t quitting. It isn’t giving up on your dreams. Provision is necessary and worry isn’t a good place to start.

A job can provide relief from your worry and you can always quit any time you want.

My one caveat to this suggestion is not to be a fool and lock yourself to whatever job with liabilities. Control yourself. Make ends meet with the easiest and least time and emotion consuming job that will will provide for you. Afford yourself time to build.

Again… A job is not giving up. As long as you don’t do it foolishly, it’s providing for you and alleviating worry.

For those of you who have zero money and don’t know what to do with yourselves, following this advice might get you closer to the answer and you won’t have zero money anymore.

Unlike other side hustles here, it is also immediate. You don’t have to build anything. You don’t have to complete a project. Sell to anyone. Set up a website. Do your books. Track your expenses. You just have to show up and do what you’re told and they’ll put money in your account on Friday.

You can quit in a month if that’s all it takes. It is NOT GIVING UP. It is GRIT! It is doing what it takes even if it’s the last thing you want to do.

Survival doesn’t have to be that hard. Thriving is what’s worth the effort.
Fantastic reminder.

For me actually it's one of the key components to setting yourself up to having 'enough' to allot yourself room to work on and build up your business(es).

I would go as far as promoting certain degrees/majors to help you land a 'well paying' job - but again as summarized in my post below, I almost found it too good to be true how great it is in America to go through our education system and have solid job opportunities waiting for you once you get out.

To me it never was, and is still not 'giving up', just a strong foundational step and a building block towards getting on your feet to building bigger and better things.
 

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You're not giving value to anyone if you're struggling to eat and pay the bills. I've been there. Despite what some people will tell you, fear isn't that great a motivator, and customers/clients will smell the desperation on you.
 

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Phil Knight was compelled to get a job as an assistant professor at Portland State University in order to keep Nike going.

"It still couldn't justify a salary...so I decided to compromise, find a different day job, one that would pay my bills but require fewer hours, leaving me more time for my passion”.
 
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MJ DeMarco

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As I like to say, if you aren't willing to work for minimum wage in a job, how do you expect to work for nothing in your own business?
 

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“This too shall pass” is worth repeating as you work a job.

Whatever your job title is be the best at it. Be a professional broom pusher. Turn it into a “peak experience” as Maslow says. If you are flipping burgers flip-em like a pro with fast subconscious dexterous moves.
 

WillHurtDontCare

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You can also learn a shitload while getting paid well at the right job. One of the guys on this forum did it (G alexander or something) - he worked at an investment bank / private equity firm and learned how to evaluate and buy businesses, and he crushed it.
 
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Vigilante

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Some people here just need to hear that getting a job isn’t quitting. It isn’t giving up on your dreams. Provision is necessary and worry isn’t a good place to start.

A job can provide relief from your worry and you can always quit any time you want.

My one caveat to this suggestion is not to be a fool and lock yourself to whatever job with liabilities. Control yourself. Make ends meet with the easiest and least time and emotion consuming job that will will provide for you. Afford yourself time to build.

Again… A job is not giving up. As long as you don’t do it foolishly, it’s providing for you and alleviating worry.

For those of you who have zero money and don’t know what to do with yourselves, following this advice might get you closer to the answer and you won’t have zero money anymore.

Unlike other side hustles here, it is also immediate. You don’t have to build anything. You don’t have to complete a project. Sell to anyone. Set up a website. Do your books. Track your expenses. You just have to show up and do what you’re told and they’ll put money in your account on Friday.

You can quit in a month if that’s all it takes. It is NOT GIVING UP. It is GRIT! It is doing what it takes even if it’s the last thing you want to do.

Survival doesn’t have to be that hard. Thriving is what’s worth the effort.
I share your opinion on this, and it’s been a contrary opinion to the forum for years. I’ve always preached that when people are ready to quit the job to go fast lane, make your employer drag you out of there kicking and screaming because I want you to double down on your income while you build your business as long as you possibly can.

The goal has never been to be a financial kamikaze.
 

ZackerySprague

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Just remember to buy yourself a big enter key button. It will alleviate stress from the daily job grind on some days haha!

Especially in IT!

As *Smash Big Enter Key Button*

My *Smash Big Enter Key Button*

Last *Smash Big Enter Key Button*

Email *Smash Big Enter Key Button*
 
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RicardoGrande

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I know I'm walking into something here but I'll bite as a completely normal worker:

- Yes, you have relatively secure income
- Yes you may have opportunities to learn or opportunities to transfer
- Yes, you even have a chance to land in a REALLY GOOD job with GREAT people
- Yes, you may be able sneak in studying at work or doing some reading for action items/case studies and formulating an action plan

On the flipside, when you do have a job, the largest and often most productive part of your day is locked away and you have to commute on top of that- here's what I've noticed working a 12hr/day and normal job:
- Commuting and getting ready for work eats a tangible amount of time everyday, at least 1-2 hours if you're lucky and will always eat into your time even after you find ways to control for it
- You have to make a commitment to waking up early on the daily to work on your own projects
- You have to commit to working on them when you get home, but will you even have the energy or focus left?
- If you work in a critical job role like I do, you can get smashed with the overtime hammer at any point and be expected to work it or lose the job.
- In cases like the above, you may be working your nights and weekends to fix something you could've fixed but were held back on, and you come to realize you're a punching bag for middle management (again, no control)
- You could commit to trying to get a new job that will pay better but would have to put your normal entrepreneurial pursuits and education on hold as you learn for a new job and transition

Anything we may feel while working a job is a product of our own beliefs and control, but the largest chunk is out of our hands and I still come back from work somedays and hit my head on a wall trying to recoup some energy and focus to get some more leveraged work done- but it's been a brutal slog.

I don't know if there's any other ex-wagies here but most of the freelancers I talk to that make a living said they would never, ever go back to the employee life even for a second, and I can understand why.
 
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Ing

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When you have a job and make it good, there will come a time, where you can reduce hours, use the Pareto principle and reduce the place, the job fills in your day ( in time and thoughts) .
So though you have a job, you will have more and more time to work on whatever you want.
In that hinsight the kind of job is important.
If you work at MC Donalds 8 hrs a day, hour reduction is hard.
If you work as a technical expert, reducing time is possible with rising experience.

So as already mentioned, a high education may be a plus in that hinsight.
 

Kevin88660

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Some people here just need to hear that getting a job isn’t quitting. It isn’t giving up on your dreams. Provision is necessary and worry isn’t a good place to start.

A job can provide relief from your worry and you can always quit any time you want.

My one caveat to this suggestion is not to be a fool and lock yourself to whatever job with liabilities. Control yourself. Make ends meet with the easiest and least time and emotion consuming job that will will provide for you. Afford yourself time to build.

Again… A job is not giving up. As long as you don’t do it foolishly, it’s providing for you and alleviating worry.

For those of you who have zero money and don’t know what to do with yourselves, following this advice might get you closer to the answer and you won’t have zero money anymore.

Unlike other side hustles here, it is also immediate. You don’t have to build anything. You don’t have to complete a project. Sell to anyone. Set up a website. Do your books. Track your expenses. You just have to show up and do what you’re told and they’ll put money in your account on Friday.

You can quit in a month if that’s all it takes. It is NOT GIVING UP. It is GRIT! It is doing what it takes even if it’s the last thing you want to do.

Survival doesn’t have to be that hard. Thriving is what’s worth the effort.
A job is not just "not giving up", it is a necessity for most people for all dreams.

Where do you get the money to fund your idea?

Who pays for the bill before your business turns profitable in N years?

Everything in your life stops when you become cashflow negative.
 

Belesarius

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Most of the Most successful and moderately successful people had Jobs. Nearly all businesses are build in an industry in which the founder is extremely knowledgeable in? How to you build this knowledge? Working a job. A job also gives you inside into problems that you can never be aware of as an outsider.
 
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JAJT

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I quit my job to focus on entrepreneurship 100% years and years ago. I ran three businesses that failed to bring me the results I wanted and because I had no job, I was also forced to pull money from the businesses to live on more than I'd like. The last business I closed down was a very expensive misstep that set me back financially quite a bit. I had also been putting off various house maintenance things and other expenses for a number of years, instead focusing on the businesses, and that caught up with me as well. I was left with no job, no businesses and a bunch of debt and expenses that needed to be paid down.

I licked my wounds and got a stable job that pays what I needed it to. That's what I've been doing the last few years and why I've had no progress updates and less posting activity on here than I used to. I've been working, paying things down, fixing shit in my life, and saving up for the next business.

As a result, I'm now ready to get back on the entrepreneurial saddle. I'll be starting a new business by year's end (and more than likely in the next few months) while I continue to work the job.

This time around I'm keeping the job and plan to funnel job income into the business with no need to take money out of the business at all. It will be 100% reinvestment + extra cash infusions from the job. Plus I'll be able to still afford expenses and nice things in my personal life the entire time.

Side hustles can be great, but a job doesn't require you to stress or hustle like crazy every single day - you just show up, do your job, and get paid. It's stable and reliable.

Businesses need money to start and grow and that money has to come from somewhere.
 

Antifragile

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I know I'm walking into something here but I'll bite as a completely normal worker:

- Yes, you have relatively secure income
- Yes you may have opportunities to learn or opportunities to transfer
- Yes, you even have a chance to land in a REALLY GOOD job with GREAT people
- Yes, you may be able sneak in studying at work or doing some reading for action items/case studies and formulating an action plan

On the flipside, when you do have a job, the largest and often most productive part of your day is locked away and you have to commute on top of that- here's what I've noticed working a 12hr/day and normal job:
- Commuting and getting ready for work eats a tangible amount of time everyday, at least 1-2 hours if you're lucky and will always eat into your time even after you find ways to control for it
- You have to make a commitment to waking up early on the daily to work on your own projects
- You have to commit to working on them when you get home, but will you even have the energy or focus left?
- If you work in a critical job role like I do, you can get smashed with the overtime hammer at any point and be expected to work it or lose the job.
- In cases like the above, you may be working your nights and weekends to fix something you could've fixed but were held back on, and you come to realize you're a punching bag for middle management (again, no control)
- You could commit to trying to get a new job that will pay better but would have to put your normal entrepreneurial pursuits and education on hold as you learn for a new job and transition

Anything we may feel while working a job is a product of our own beliefs and control, but the largest chunk is out of our hands and I still come back from work somedays and hit my head on a wall trying to recoup some energy and focus to get some more leveraged work done- but it's been a brutal slog.

I don't know if there's any other ex-wagies here but most of the freelancers I talk to that make a living said they would never, ever go back to the employee life even for a second, and I can understand why.


Honestly, the hardest part wasn’t the energy. Quitting a high paying job is hard because I had to explain it to my wife. That’s we’ll be ok etc.

But the benefits were huge for me. Sure, sample of one… but hear me out.

Benefits:
- knew the business
- hired people I already knew and tested
- had investors who trusted me!
- lenders knew me and our team, we didn’t launch a typical “startup”, most saw us as a re-brand. Profitable from year 1.
- broker community knew and brought us deals
- my friend let me use his downtown office for months before we found a permanent home. That’s because he trusted me and I did right by him while being “an employee”.
- even technology, servers, storage, office renovations, printer - all was something I did for my employer first, and repeated
- when getting our office space (years ago!) office was hard to find. Demand from landlords was for personal guarantees. One phone call resolved it because of industry connections. Because of a job!

It was: experience, contacts, trust …

It’s not a typical path. I’m not advocating that’s what others should do. I wish I went on my own sooner! But it helped me start our business.

As I like to say, if you aren't willing to work for minimum wage in a job, how do you expect to work for nothing in your own business?

Truth. Love this analogy.

In the early years, I remember making less than my employees …
 

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when I read the millionaire fastlane , I initally thought that the book was implying that you should leave your job and just go all in business. However I knew that seemed unrealistic and I was sorta dismissing that when I read it, glad I wasn't wrong about that extreme view. Now reading this Im lowkey more confused now about what to do, all I know is that I need to increase my cash flow so I can move out of my moms because she is not part of my team.
 
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ericlozada

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Some people here just need to hear that getting a job isn’t quitting. It isn’t giving up on your dreams. Provision is necessary and worry isn’t a good place to start.

A job can provide relief from your worry and you can always quit any time you want.

My one caveat to this suggestion is not to be a fool and lock yourself to whatever job with liabilities. Control yourself. Make ends meet with the easiest and least time and emotion consuming job that will will provide for you. Afford yourself time to build.

Again… A job is not giving up. As long as you don’t do it foolishly, it’s providing for you and alleviating worry.

For those of you who have zero money and don’t know what to do with yourselves, following this advice might get you closer to the answer and you won’t have zero money anymore.

Unlike other side hustles here, it is also immediate. You don’t have to build anything. You don’t have to complete a project. Sell to anyone. Set up a website. Do your books. Track your expenses. You just have to show up and do what you’re told and they’ll put money in your account on Friday.

You can quit in a month if that’s all it takes. It is NOT GIVING UP. It is GRIT! It is doing what it takes even if it’s the last thing you want to do.

Survival doesn’t have to be that hard. Thriving is what’s worth the effort.
Thanks for the reminder!
 

ericlozada

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when I read the millionaire fastlane , I initally thought that the book was implying that you should leave your job and just go all in business. However I knew that seemed unrealistic and I was sorta dismissing that when I read it, glad I wasn't wrong about that extreme view. Now reading this Im lowkey more confused now about what to do, all I know is that I need to increase my cash flow so I can move out of my moms because she is not part of my team.
Right!
 

MJ DeMarco

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Kak

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I want to be clear and not to be taken out of context. This is not to say that jobs are awesome. I’m not saying jobs are mandatory. I’m not saying jobs are fastlane.

What I am saying… Having the grit to do something you don’t want to do, something that might even suck, in order to support your dream, IS GRIT and applause worthy DETERMINATION.

I don’t look at this like a permanent thing, and I don’t look at it like an alternative to freelancing. It also isn’t really a stepping stone for most. It’s survival checked off so you can aim your mind to higher things. Remember each need must be met before you go on to the next.
3B612C74-6BAF-4E01-AAB0-4AAE2A67E1F7.jpeg

If you dream of being an entrepreneur and physiological isn’t even met, you’re not about to become Steve Musk or Jeff Zuckerberg in the next year. This will take time, but you absolutely can set your sights on something bigger and more meaningful and achieve it.

Take care of physiological. Take care of some safety. Take care of those you are responsible to. And from that position, climb into esteem.

I think this is why I’ve had such an issue with aspirations out of a job and into freelancing. You haven’t climbed shit. It’s the grass is always greener. It’s trading one 1:1 gig for an arguably harder and less lucrative 1:1 gig. You haven’t left the safety section.

I understand many view it as a stepping stone, I don’t. It’s all the downsides of running a business with all of the downsides of a job combined into one way to earn money.

Let’s also remember that stay at home and flexible jobs are on the rise. The beauty is, you are only responsible for your job description and the rest is someone else’s problem. A job is a tool available to you to use to survive. It might be some of the easiest money some of you have ever made.

@Vigilante said you should make them kick you out. Once your time is more valuable to you than to them, it’s time.

Do I think you should use your hard earned job savings to fund a business? Not really. Your business, at least in my opinion, should reach outside of any resources you will likely amass from a job over a couple of months or even years. I understand I differ on that from a lot of people.

The world is your oyster folks. As long as you are intelligent and physically able, you have a shot. Take it, even if you have to do stuff you don’t want to do. Climb the pyramid. Don’t cop out.
 
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Antifragile

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Do I think you should use your hard earned job savings to fund a business? Not really. Your business, at least in my opinion, should reach outside of any resources you will likely amass from a job over a couple of months or even years. I understand I differ on that from a lot of people.

This may be severely under appreciated paragraph. Yet the importance of it, is hard to overstate!

Folks, read it 3x until you realize how important it is for your future.
 

Kak

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This may be severely under appreciated paragraph. Yet the importance of it, is hard to overstate!

Folks, read it 3x until you realize how important it is for your future.
It should really be its own thread.

There’s no way I could fund my current business with my personal resources. Let that sink in. It is likely to always stay that far out in front of me. And I’m OK with that.

Also, because I’m privy to it, there’s also zero way @Antifragile could fund his current business with his personal resources. I’m jealous of his level of capitalization.

In the coming weeks, I’m going to dive deeper into why private equity is my next trajectory and why an understanding of it is wildly beneficial to YOU even if you have zero intention of operating a PE business.

We will start with a simple concept. Your value to the market is not just a product or service. It could also be an opportunity.
 
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Antifragile

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Also, because I’m privy to it, there’s also zero way @Antifragile could fund his current business with his personal resources. I’m jealous of his level of capitalization.

Thanks brother!

This could be, maybe it should be... a whole thread on its own.

Business success is asymmetric. It isn't like sports where you get what you put in. Leadership creates a unique opportunity to leverage outside resources while creating a win-win. Resources are not all created equal to all people. Meaning that a $1MM is worth different to people (depending on their circumstances). Some view it as life changing sum of money, others view is excess cash. For one person losing $1MM would be devastation, for others... well, they may not even notice.

The point being is to expand you field of vision for opportunities! Don't let that ego of "I am the greatest, I am the boss of everything" prevent you from achieving higher business leverage.

By the way, same logic applies to finding partners, employees etc. Human capital can too be leveraged. Meaning, I don't need to be an architect to have access to such resources.

Like I said, it may well be one of the most eye popping realizations for young entrepreneurs. Yet it's almost like secret. No one is hiding it, few actually know it! Irony of life, I guess...
 

BizyDad

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This may be severely under appreciated paragraph. Yet the importance of it, is hard to overstate!

Folks, read it 3x until you realize how important it is for your future.

It should really be its own thread.

There’s no way I could fund my current business with my personal resources. Let that sink in. It is likely to always stay that far out in front of me. And I’m OK with that.

Also, because I’m privy to it, there’s also zero way @Antifragile could fund his current business with his personal resources. I’m jealous of his level of capitalization.

In the coming weeks, I’m going to dive deeper into why private equity is my next trajectory and why an understanding of it is wildly beneficial to YOU even if you have zero intention of operating a PE business.

We will start with a simple concept. Your value to the market is not just a product or service. It could also be an opportunity.

Looking forward to the upcoming thread.
 

mikecarlooch

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It should really be its own thread.

There’s no way I could fund my current business with my personal resources. Let that sink in. It is likely to always stay that far out in front of me. And I’m OK with that.

Also, because I’m privy to it, there’s also zero way @Antifragile could fund his current business with his personal resources. I’m jealous of his level of capitalization.

In the coming weeks, I’m going to dive deeper into why private equity is my next trajectory and why an understanding of it is wildly beneficial to YOU even if you have zero intention of operating a PE business.

We will start with a simple concept. Your value to the market is not just a product or service. It could also be an opportunity.

Hey Kyle awesome post - I'm curious (I was reading your ecom thread recently in INSIDERS) and I'm wondering - for something like an innovated and improved physical product / brand - do you have any explanations or examples you could share about how you leveraged this to make that brand successful? (I believe it was cigars)

In simpler terms - how could an innovated physical product that doesn't require as much human capital (at least in early days) use these concepts to get an advantage from the get-go?

I'm sure it's an obvious resounding yes, but just trying to wrap my head around how it can work
 
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Jadus

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I know I'm walking into something here but I'll bite as a completely normal worker:

- Yes, you have relatively secure income
- Yes you may have opportunities to learn or opportunities to transfer
- Yes, you even have a chance to land in a REALLY GOOD job with GREAT people
- Yes, you may be able sneak in studying at work or doing some reading for action items/case studies and formulating an action plan

On the flipside, when you do have a job, the largest and often most productive part of your day is locked away and you have to commute on top of that- here's what I've noticed working a 12hr/day and normal job:
- Commuting and getting ready for work eats a tangible amount of time everyday, at least 1-2 hours if you're lucky and will always eat into your time even after you find ways to control for it
- You have to make a commitment to waking up early on the daily to work on your own projects
- You have to commit to working on them when you get home, but will you even have the energy or focus left?
- If you work in a critical job role like I do, you can get smashed with the overtime hammer at any point and be expected to work it or lose the job.
- In cases like the above, you may be working your nights and weekends to fix something you could've fixed but were held back on, and you come to realize you're a punching bag for middle management (again, no control)
- You could commit to trying to get a new job that will pay better but would have to put your normal entrepreneurial pursuits and education on hold as you learn for a new job and transition

Anything we may feel while working a job is a product of our own beliefs and control, but the largest chunk is out of our hands and I still come back from work somedays and hit my head on a wall trying to recoup some energy and focus to get some more leveraged work done- but it's been a brutal slog.

I don't know if there's any other ex-wagies here but most of the freelancers I talk to that make a living said they would never, ever go back to the employee life even for a second, and I can understand why.
A lot of what you said reminds me of my old job at the phone company. I wanted to start my own business for years but the long hours and unpredictable work schedule made it very difficult. That's why I retired early and moved to Thailand for a lower cost of living while I built something of my own.
 

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I quit my job to focus on entrepreneurship 100% years and years ago. I ran three businesses that failed to bring me the results I wanted and because I had no job, I was also forced to pull money from the businesses to live on more than I'd like. The last business I closed down was a very expensive misstep that set me back financially quite a bit. I had also been putting off various house maintenance things and other expenses for a number of years, instead focusing on the businesses, and that caught up with me as well. I was left with no job, no businesses and a bunch of debt and expenses that needed to be paid down.

I licked my wounds and got a stable job that pays what I needed it to. That's what I've been doing the last few years and why I've had no progress updates and less posting activity on here than I used to. I've been working, paying things down, fixing shit in my life, and saving up for the next business.

As a result, I'm now ready to get back on the entrepreneurial saddle. I'll be starting a new business by year's end (and more than likely in the next few months) while I continue to work the job.

This time around I'm keeping the job and plan to funnel job income into the business with no need to take money out of the business at all. It will be 100% reinvestment + extra cash infusions from the job. Plus I'll be able to still afford expenses and nice things in my personal life the entire time.

Side hustles can be great, but a job doesn't require you to stress or hustle like crazy every single day - you just show up, do your job, and get paid. It's stable and reliable.

Businesses need money to start and grow and that money has to come from somewhere.
This is what I need to do at the moment... something stable and reliable to pay the bills. Thankfully, I don't have any debt and the modest house I live in is paid off, as well as, my vehicle. Thanks for the encouragement!
 

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