How to stop getting abused by people?

[Kid]

Didn't read all but: flipping the bird helps.

 

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[csalvato]

TLDR: Some people in life are particularly perverse and will abuse you and your kindness and when you realize it happened, it's too late.

How do you prevent this from happening?

------------------------------------------------------------------------

The full story:

IMPORTANT NOTE: THIS IS NOT A POLITICAL POST. We are not arguing political views here, I just told the story how it happened. The rules of the forum say we cannot discuss politics. Please comply. Thank you : )

My roommate invited some friends of hers for dinner yesterday night. I joined them at the end of the dinner because I wanted to work on my projects.

When I entered the room, I said hi to everyone, and took a seat. What followed happened fast and without me opening my mouth.

My roommate started saying out loud that I had complained earlier that I valued things less when they were easy to get than when they were hard (because I got an internship in a praised political institution and while I was happy at first, I told her my realization that it wasn't as hard to get as I thought it would be decreased the value I hold in the internship).

One guy, which I had never met before, found that outrageous. He started a monologue:
"Yeah, but you know, you can complain of that because you were born with a silver spoon in your mouth, you f*cking capitalists. Me, I never had the right to not care about money. It's always there. I never even thought about doing an internship where you will do yours. This is why I had to work 15 years as a bartender. Where do you find the money to pay your rent? Huh? Where do you find it?"

I was paralyzed. I didn't know what to answer because I didn't expect to be attacked by someone I did not know...in my living room. I answered the truth, that I wasn't paying any rent at the moment because I was staying with a family member. That made him even angrier.

"Yeah, you got a silver spoon in your f*cking mouth, you have the luxury not to think about money, you never had to, you never will".

I started shaking. I stood up and told him to wait 2 minutes. Everyone saw I was angry. The atmosphere got tense.

I went to get my computer, came back and showed him a draft of blog post I had written. I wanted him to read the two sentences where I explain running out of money is my number one fear, way ahead of death and public speaking due to my money-tight childhood (why do you think I ended up on this forum lol).

Then he said "hey chill out, we're discussing, I am not attacking you or anything".

I was angry. I was really angry. I had let my guard down (I was in my own apartment for crying out loud) and had been attacked as a result. I walked straight into a trap that that idiot had laid for me.

It took me three hours to fall asleep that night, because I was angry at myself for having been abused so easily.

I figure that this type of abusive and passive-agressive behavior happens often where the stakes are high (politics, business).

What are the resources you guys use to deal with it? Physically I am short, 5,8, I am trying to build muscles so that I would commend a bit more respect, but otherwise, I am used to put out a mean face to instantly repel anyone that tries to mess with me (especially in the street since Brussels is a very dangerous city).

I didn't do it yesterday, and this is what I got.

Ordinarily, I am trying to be a nice guy, to help people, to give value. Some see it as weakness and try to abuse you.

How do you prevent it from happening?

PS: I talked with a friend today which was there last night, and she apologized for this guy's behavior, saying her boyfriend almost got into a fight with him last week.

You handled it better than me.

He would have been thrown out of my house, immediately, at a minimum.

The way I deal with losers like this is to not engage with these people in any way. I distance myself from them as much as possible. If not, I'll get poisoned.

 

[James Klymus]

It sounds like this guy is just an insecure bully. He never matured past 9, because this is shit that little kids do.

In this case specifically, you were intimidated because you didn't know if you could handle a physical confrontation. 5'8 isn't small IMO, and sure pack on some muscle and hit the gym, but also train in some combat sports like kickboxing or Muay Thai. Just knowing you can fight and handle your self if it came down to a physical fight, oddly enough can help prevent fights. Once you're confident in your ability to protect your self, you don't have to "try to put on a mean face", people can sense the confidence that you can handle your self.

Learning to defend your self does wonders for your self confidence, and I think the problem here fundamentally is low self confidence. I want to make sure you understand I'm not insulting you either, This is what i'm gathering from the way you talk about your self.

Also if you live in a dangerous city, I would move as soon as i can. Why have that added stress of potentially getting robbed, or in a fight with some criminal? Life is stressful enough.

I wish you the best and hope to see your confidence grow over time.

TLDR: Some people in life are particularly perverse and will abuse you and your kindness and when you realize it happened, it's too late.

How do you prevent this from happening?

------------------------------------------------------------------------

The full story:

IMPORTANT NOTE: THIS IS NOT A POLITICAL POST. We are not arguing political views here, I just told the story how it happened. The rules of the forum say we cannot discuss politics. Please comply. Thank you : )

My roommate invited some friends of hers for dinner yesterday night. I joined them at the end of the dinner because I wanted to work on my projects.

When I entered the room, I said hi to everyone, and took a seat. What followed happened fast and without me opening my mouth.

My roommate started saying out loud that I had complained earlier that I valued things less when they were easy to get than when they were hard (because I got an internship in a praised political institution and while I was happy at first, I told her my realization that it wasn't as hard to get as I thought it would be decreased the value I hold in the internship).

One guy, which I had never met before, found that outrageous. He started a monologue:
"Yeah, but you know, you can complain of that because you were born with a silver spoon in your mouth, you f*cking capitalists. Me, I never had the right to not care about money. It's always there. I never even thought about doing an internship where you will do yours. This is why I had to work 15 years as a bartender. Where do you find the money to pay your rent? Huh? Where do you find it?"

I was paralyzed. I didn't know what to answer because I didn't expect to be attacked by someone I did not know...in my living room. I answered the truth, that I wasn't paying any rent at the moment because I was staying with a family member. That made him even angrier.

"Yeah, you got a silver spoon in your f*cking mouth, you have the luxury not to think about money, you never had to, you never will".

I started shaking. I stood up and told him to wait 2 minutes. Everyone saw I was angry. The atmosphere got tense.

I went to get my computer, came back and showed him a draft of blog post I had written. I wanted him to read the two sentences where I explain running out of money is my number one fear, way ahead of death and public speaking due to my money-tight childhood (why do you think I ended up on this forum lol).

Then he said "hey chill out, we're discussing, I am not attacking you or anything".

I was angry. I was really angry. I had let my guard down (I was in my own apartment for crying out loud) and had been attacked as a result. I walked straight into a trap that that idiot had laid for me.

It took me three hours to fall asleep that night, because I was angry at myself for having been abused so easily.

I figure that this type of abusive and passive-agressive behavior happens often where the stakes are high (politics, business).

What are the resources you guys use to deal with it? Physically I am short, 5,8, I am trying to build muscles so that I would commend a bit more respect, but otherwise, I am used to put out a mean face to instantly repel anyone that tries to mess with me (especially in the street since Brussels is a very dangerous city).

I didn't do it yesterday, and this is what I got.

Ordinarily, I am trying to be a nice guy, to help people, to give value. Some see it as weakness and try to abuse you.

How do you prevent it from happening?

PS: I talked with a friend today which was there last night, and she apologized for this guy's behavior, saying her boyfriend almost got into a fight with him last week.

 

[Kung Fu Steve]

Three thoughts:

1. "Nobody can hurt you without your permission." - Ghandi

Words will only affect you if you let them. A complete stranger can call you an a**hole and make you angry. A close friend can call you an a**hole and to you it means they love you. What's the difference? Same word. But one you let it hurt you, the other you let it endear you.

2. "You get what you tolerate." - Henry Cloud

There's a subtle difference between being aggressive and being assertive. You don't have to be a dick but there are times when you need to stand up for yourself. Most battles are not worth fighting but you shouldn't let people walk all over you.

It's a fine line and takes some real communication skills. But some people need correcting at times.

All communication is a loving response or a cry for help. His anger shows he was definitely crying for help.

3. You must to fill up your cup.

Your "cup" should be overflowing with self-love, self-confidence, and self-assuredness.

Nobody should be able to put anything in or take anything out because it's overflowing.

If someone insults you, your cup is already full and it just spills out.

If someone compliments you, your cup is already full -- meaning you don't need the validation from anyone but yourself.

If your cup had been full in that moment -- that interaction wouldn't have bothered you so much. You might have let it roll off your back. You might not have said anything. You might have cracked a joke. You might have diffused the situation. Or maybe you could have got really curious "why do you think that way?" or "what makes you say that?" or "tell me about your life"?

In a more connected way, of course. But I hope you see what I mean.

 

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[Speculatooor]

First of all, your roommate is not your friend. He talked this guy into attacking you.

One guy, which I had never met before, found that outrageous. He started a monologue:
"Yeah, but you know, you can complain of that because you were born with a silver spoon in your mouth, you f*cking capitalists. Me, I never had the right to not care about money. It's always there. I never even thought about doing an internship where you will do yours. This is why I had to work 15 years as a bartender. Where do you find the money to pay your rent? Huh? Where do you find it?"

This right here is disrespect. NEVER engage disrepect.
'Who the F*ck are you, get the F*ck out of my house' is the only right action in this moment.

But the problem is this happening in the first place.

You project some kind of weakness for this to happen, because people only attack when they feel safe doing it. (Spotting weakness, having backup etc.)

Let this be a moment of change. Start being more dominant. Learn dominant body language. Lift weights. Start boxing. Start being a man.

 

[Deleted78083]

Learning to defend your self does wonders for your self confidence, and I think the problem here fundamentally is low self confidence. I want to make sure you understand I'm not insulting you either, This is what i'm gathering from the way you talk about your self.

Also if you live in a dangerous city, I would move as soon as i can. Why have that added stress of potentially getting robbed, or in a fight with some criminal? Life is stressful enough.

You're right. I was in a situation where I had low confidence. Confidence comes with results, so I might as well start to practice now. I was actually thinking about taking Krav Maga classes.

I live in Brussels now cuz it enables me not to pay rent : P

 

[Deleted78083]

You project some kind of weakness for this to happen, because people only attack when they feel safe doing it. (Spotting weakness, having backup etc.)

For sure, I look harmless. My sister also made a lot of fun of me when i was a kid, constantly calling me a victim (she still does it by the way) which I think plays on my subconscious.

I know that, and have been distanciating myself from this idea a lot by...stopping to be a victim.

I have been lifting weight for two years (with very small changes) and lost everything when they closed the gyms. Now I bought a kettlebell and a pull up bar and do 50 pushups every day.

Wanna learn krav maga when things reopen.

 

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[Andy Black]

For sure, I look harmless. My sister also made a lot of fun of me when i was a kid, constantly calling me a victim (she still does it by the way) which I think plays on my subconscious.

I know that, and have been distanciating myself from this idea a lot by...stopping to be a victim.

I have been lifting weight for two years (with very small changes) and lost everything when they closed the gyms. Now I bought a kettlebell and a pull up bar and do 50 pushups every day.

Wanna learn krav maga when things reopen.

That’s 50 press-ups a day more than me. There’s a press-up thread in here somewhere. Maybe you can resurrect it?

 

[j0elsuf]

today's society has created too many nice guys with low testosterone and high cortisol - no fight or flight response, just flight.

To me it's more polarizing than that.

It's either "nice guys" with low T and high cortisol or try-hards with low T and high cortisol.

Both are what I call NBCs (see what I did there?) - Natural Born Cowards.

The former group is so afraid of confrontation that they avoid it at all costs and it results in them being stepped on.

The latter group starts trouble like it is their job. Until they get into some REAL trouble and get shot at or something.

Neither have no idea how to actually be courageous.

I'm seeing a lot of talk about dominance in this thread, but this is getting more and more twisted.

Starting trouble for the sake of it (which is what I am seeing in this thread) is not dominant behavior at all. It's just as cowardly as sheepishly avoiding confrontation and getting all bent out of shape about it.

In most cases when someone verbally assaults you the best thing to do is just shrug and go "...kay."

THEN see if they start trouble. If they do start trouble (very small chance), finish it. THAT is what being "dominant" looks like.

If someone swings at me or someone who I am with, they're getting hospitalized. Most people know this just from my posture and how I carry myself, avatar notwithstanding lol.

It isn't about being loud or overly confrontational, it's simply your ability to protect yourself and others who you care about if you feel like they need to be protected. Nothing more, nothing less.

The kid who was talking down to OP? Not even worth paying any attention to. A shrug followed by "...kay" would be my exact response. Would this provoke that kid even further? Probably. Enough for them to swing at me? Probably not.

Like I said previously, I would have just politely asked them how long they were going to be there and if they were going to be loud. And if their answer was yes, I would have very politely asked them if they could do it somewhere else.

As far as the roommate who started that? Later on I would have told them "did I say or do something in the past to cause you to do that? Because what you did wasn't right and I don't feel like I deserve that kind of treatment." Firm yet polite.

Leadership, boundaries, courtesy, accountability for self and others, ability to protect yourself and others if necessary. That's what being an "alpha male" is about. Not picking fights, telling people how big your dick is, or standing up for yourself out of some weird paranoid sense of foolish pride.

 

[Deleted78083]

The kid who was talking down to OP? Not even worth paying any attention to. A shrug followed by "...kay" would be my exact response. Would this provoke that kid even further? Probably. Enough for them to swing at me? Probably not.

That guy was 40. He behaves like a 16-year-old, but he was 40. My roommate is 34. My friend is 33. I am 26.

Leadership, boundaries, courtesy, accountability for self and others, ability to protect yourself and others if necessary. That's what being an "alpha male" is about. Not picking fights, telling people how big your dick is, or standing up for yourself out of some weird paranoid sense of foolish pride.

Agreed.

 

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[Simon Angel]

To me it's more polarizing than that.

It's either "nice guys" with low T and high cortisol or try-hards with low T and high cortisol.

Both are what I call NBCs (see what I did there?) - Natural Born Cowards.

The former group is so afraid of confrontation that they avoid it at all costs and it results in them being stepped on.

The latter group starts trouble like it is their job. Until they get into some REAL trouble and get shot at or something.

Neither have no idea how to actually be courageous.

I'm seeing a lot of talk about dominance in this thread, but this is getting more and more twisted.

Starting trouble for the sake of it (which is what I am seeing in this thread) is not dominant behavior at all. It's just as cowardly as sheepishly avoiding confrontation and getting all bent out of shape about it.

In most cases when someone verbally assaults you the best thing to do is just shrug and go "...kay."

THEN see if they start trouble. If they do start trouble (very small chance), finish it. THAT is what being "dominant" looks like.

If someone swings at me or someone who I am with, they're getting hospitalized. Most people know this just from my posture and how I carry myself, avatar notwithstanding lol.

It isn't about being loud or overly confrontational, it's simply your ability to protect yourself and others who you care about if you feel like they need to be protected. Nothing more, nothing less.

The kid who was talking down to OP? Not even worth paying any attention to. A shrug followed by "...kay" would be my exact response. Would this provoke that kid even further? Probably. Enough for them to swing at me? Probably not.

Like I said previously, I would have just politely asked them how long they were going to be there and if they were going to be loud. And if their answer was yes, I would have very politely asked them if they could do it somewhere else.

As far as the roommate who started that? Later on I would have told them "did I say or do something in the past to cause you to do that? Because what you did wasn't right and I don't feel like I deserve that kind of treatment." Firm yet polite.

Leadership, boundaries, courtesy, accountability for self and others, ability to protect yourself and others if necessary. That's what being an "alpha male" is about. Not picking fights, telling people how big your dick is, or standing up for yourself out of some weird paranoid sense of foolish pride.

You sound like my father whom I hate. You also sound like me.

If you're interested in personality types and want to learn more about yourself, check out a description of the ENTP personality type, the 8w7 enneagram type, and the ENTP 8w7 combo.

 

[csalvato]

That guy was 40. He behaves like a 16-year-old, but he was 40. My roommate is 34. My friend is 33. I am 26.

He's a loser. You're a winner. He doesn't even deserve all this attention. If we continue to give it, he's won.

 

[MJ DeMarco]

Incredible responses by everyone, marked GOLD. Stuff like this makes me proud to have such people here at the forum, with mostly, reasoned responses.

I for one, would have just nodded my head and shown him the door. I don't have time for people like this in my life, much less in my home.

 

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[Andy Black]

He doesn't even deserve all this attention.

Something I learned when I became a dad is that kids (and adults!) crave attention. People do the dumbest things to get attention, including getting into trouble.

Getting attention is what kids prize more than anything, and can be used to encourage the behaviour we want (see the video linked below).

As a parent you give attention, and that was one of my aha moments: Boys crave attention, men give attention (likewise for girls and women of course.)

I like framing it as becoming a man. It makes me think of someone putting down others to get the attention as a little boy, even if they're in their 20s, 30s, 40s (aka old enough to know better).

Something to think about if you're putting down others to get attention.


Here's that video:

• Are you a man amongst boys?

Oh, and what's the other saying:

"Walk softly, carry a big stick."

Loud mouths aren't the ones I'm worried about...

 

[BizyDad]

Toughen up, bulk up, set boundaries, show them the door, shut it down, let it go, don't engage. For some reason, I can't shake this thread. I've been thinking about it for a day now. All the advice here is solid and has obvious benefits.

I think there is an opportunity being missed.

Instead of asking yourself "How do I stopped being abused like this" what if you asked yourself:

"How can I turn situations like these to my advantage?"

My junior year of high school I was the new guy in school. That year I had 3 bullies. I'm talking tormenting, harrassing, threatening, assaulting type bullying. The first one literally started on me day one, like some movie scene.

By my senior year of high school I developed some of the thickest skin around. And all three had become my good friends. They'd give me rides to and from school, and again out at night. Twice they helped me land jobs. We'd hang out, they introduced me to more friends. They set me straight when I was up to no good and headed down a dark path in my early 20's. I went to college with one. I later became roommates with another. The third was in my wedding party. I am still really good friends with 2 of them, texting regularly even though they live 2,000+ miles away. We've chatted every day this week in fact.

If you show someone the door, you'll never find out the impact they could have had on your life.

I'm not suggesting you and 40 yr old guy are going to become besties. And I certainly would not expose myself to a year of bullying for anybody.

But my point is there is a skill that can be developed, and if you develop this skill, you can go quite far in life.

You can turn enemies into friends.
You can turn haters into allies.
You can turn doubters into evangelists.

You're never going to please all people, nor should you try. I'm not suggesting that. Heck, I'm a guy who tends to piss some people off.

With this skill, you can have more friends, close more sales, get yourself out of more hot water, generate more engagement and have more people/friends/mentors/partners/employees/associates believe in you than you would if you just shut the door on every jerk that comes across your path.

But what entrepreneur doesn't want this skill? Imagine needing to close a huge sale but the prospect is giving you bullying vibes. What do you do?

Sure, you can tell yourself you don't want his business and move on. Case closed. No f$#%s given, no money received.

But what if you could flip the script, make him a fan of yours and close the sale anyways? Is that not better? What if he sends you 2 more clients? Is that not better?

The truth is you don't develop this skill by surrounding yourself only with people who like you.

You develop it by surrounding yourself with people who don't like you and you get them to change their mind about you. To get there, you have to be able to embrace some conflict.

How do you connect with people like that?

Well, there a ton of different tactics. You can express interest in them. You can make them laugh. You can find common ground. You can share similar stories. You can mirror their language, their cadence, their dialect or euphamisms. You can validate their positions. You can change their circumstances. You can express a desire to help them. You can help them feel good about themselves. You can help them achieve a goal. You can buy them a beer.

You can react differently to bullying than they expect.

There's lots of ways you can stand out. Through your words and deeds, you can change some one else's perception of you. Every situation, every person is different. What will work in one situation won't work on another. But over time you can learn to read people.

Since junior year, I've talked my way out of every fight I didn't want to have. This skill has also helped me talk my way out of more speeding tickets than I care to count.

There are huge benefits to learning to work through conflict rather than avoiding or eliminating it. For those older folks in this thread, I'm sure they are happy with how they are. No one here is wrong. We all have to choose the life we want.

But for the younger folks here, I would suggest you at least consider learning to work through some seemingly unnecessary conflict rather than avoiding it entirely. Take a genuine interest in people who have views that you feel are opposite yours or just flat out wrong. Even the occasional bully. Learn to see the world through other people's eyes. Do that and you can connect with people from many different walks of life.

When you learn how to change how people perceive you, life becomes more of an adventure and business becomes easier.

I just wanted to offer a different take based on my personal experience. Hope that helps someone.

 

[Deleted70138]

TLDR: Some people in life are particularly perverse and will abuse you and your kindness and when you realize it happened, it's too late.

How do you prevent this from happening?

------------------------------------------------------------------------

The full story:

IMPORTANT NOTE: THIS IS NOT A POLITICAL POST. We are not arguing political views here, I just told the story how it happened. The rules of the forum say we cannot discuss politics. Please comply. Thank you : )

My roommate invited some friends of hers for dinner yesterday night. I joined them at the end of the dinner because I wanted to work on my projects.

When I entered the room, I said hi to everyone, and took a seat. What followed happened fast and without me opening my mouth.

My roommate started saying out loud that I had complained earlier that I valued things less when they were easy to get than when they were hard (because I got an internship in a praised political institution and while I was happy at first, I told her my realization that it wasn't as hard to get as I thought it would be decreased the value I hold in the internship).

One guy, which I had never met before, found that outrageous. He started a monologue:
"Yeah, but you know, you can complain of that because you were born with a silver spoon in your mouth, you f*cking capitalists. Me, I never had the right to not care about money. It's always there. I never even thought about doing an internship where you will do yours. This is why I had to work 15 years as a bartender. Where do you find the money to pay your rent? Huh? Where do you find it?"

I was paralyzed. I didn't know what to answer because I didn't expect to be attacked by someone I did not know...in my living room. I answered the truth, that I wasn't paying any rent at the moment because I was staying with a family member. That made him even angrier.

"Yeah, you got a silver spoon in your f*cking mouth, you have the luxury not to think about money, you never had to, you never will".

I started shaking. I stood up and told him to wait 2 minutes. Everyone saw I was angry. The atmosphere got tense.

I went to get my computer, came back and showed him a draft of blog post I had written. I wanted him to read the two sentences where I explain running out of money is my number one fear, way ahead of death and public speaking due to my money-tight childhood (why do you think I ended up on this forum lol).

Then he said "hey chill out, we're discussing, I am not attacking you or anything".

I was angry. I was really angry. I had let my guard down (I was in my own apartment for crying out loud) and had been attacked as a result. I walked straight into a trap that that idiot had laid for me.

It took me three hours to fall asleep that night, because I was angry at myself for having been abused so easily.

I figure that this type of abusive and passive-agressive behavior happens often where the stakes are high (politics, business).

What are the resources you guys use to deal with it? Physically I am short, 5,8, I am trying to build muscles so that I would commend a bit more respect, but otherwise, I am used to put out a mean face to instantly repel anyone that tries to mess with me (especially in the street since Brussels is a very dangerous city).

I didn't do it yesterday, and this is what I got.

Ordinarily, I am trying to be a nice guy, to help people, to give value. Some see it as weakness and try to abuse you.

How do you prevent it from happening?

PS: I talked with a friend today which was there last night, and she apologized for this guy's behavior, saying her boyfriend almost got into a fight with him last week.

How is this an abuse? It's not even dramatic enough for being fun.

 

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[csalvato]

Toughen up, bulk up, set boundaries, show them the door, shut it down, let it go, don't engage. For some reason, I can't shake this thread. I've been thinking about it for a day now. All the advice here is solid and has obvious benefits.

I think there is an opportunity being missed.

Instead of asking yourself "How do I stopped being abused like this" what if you asked yourself:

"How can I turn situations like these to my advantage?"

My junior year of high school I was the new guy in school. That year I had 3 bullies. I'm talking tormenting, harrassing, threatening, assaulting type bullying. The first one literally started on me day one, like some movie scene.

By my senior year of high school I developed some of the thickest skin around. And all three had become my good friends. They'd give me rides to and from school, and again out at night. Twice they helped me land jobs. We'd hang out, they introduced me to more friends. They set me straight when I was up to no good and headed down a dark path in my early 20's. I went to college with one. I later became roommates with another. The third was in my wedding party. I am still really good friends with 2 of them, texting regularly even though they live 2,000+ miles away. We've chatted every day this week in fact.

If you show someone the door, you'll never find out the impact they could have had on your life.

I'm not suggesting you and 40 yr old guy are going to become besties. And I certainly would not expose myself to a year of bullying for anybody.

But my point is there is a skill that can be developed, and if you develop this skill, you can go quite far in life.

You can turn enemies into friends.
You can turn haters into allies.
You can turn doubters into evangelists.

You're never going to please all people, nor should you try. I'm not suggesting that. Heck, I'm a guy who tends to piss some people off.

With this skill, you can have more friends, close more sales, get yourself out of more hot water, generate more engagement and have more people/friends/mentors/partners/employees/associates believe in you than you would if you just shut the door on every jerk that comes across your path.

But what entrepreneur doesn't want this skill? Imagine needing to close a huge sale but the prospect is giving you bullying vibes. What do you do?

Sure, you can tell yourself you don't want his business and move on. Case closed. No f$#%s given, no money received.

But what if you could flip the script, make him a fan of yours and close the sale anyways? Is that not better? What if he sends you 2 more clients? Is that not better?

The truth is you don't develop this skill by surrounding yourself only with people who like you.

You develop it by surrounding yourself with people who don't like you and you get them to change their mind about you. To get there, you have to be able to embrace some conflict.

How do you connect with people like that?

Well, there a ton of different tactics. You can express interest in them. You can make them laugh. You can find common ground. You can share similar stories. You can mirror their language, their cadence, their dialect or euphamisms. You can validate their positions. You can change their circumstances. You can express a desire to help them. You can help them feel good about themselves. You can help them achieve a goal. You can buy them a beer.

You can react differently to bullying than they expect.

There's lots of ways you can stand out. Through your words and deeds, you can change some one else's perception of you. Every situation, every person is different. What will work in one situation won't work on another. But over time you can learn to read people.

Since junior year, I've talked my way out of every fight I didn't want to have. This skill has also helped me talk my way out of more speeding tickets than I care to count.

There are huge benefits to learning to work through conflict rather than avoiding or eliminating it. For those older folks in this thread, I'm sure they are happy with how they are. No one here is wrong. We all have to choose the life we want.

But for the younger folks here, I would suggest you at least consider learning to work through some seemingly unnecessary conflict rather than avoiding it entirely. Take a genuine interest in people who have views that you feel are opposite yours or just flat out wrong. Even the occasional bully. Learn to see the world through other people's eyes. Do that and you can connect with people from many different walks of life.

When you learn how to change how people perceive you, life becomes more of an adventure and business becomes easier.

I just wanted to offer a different take based on my personal experience. Hope that helps someone.

Don’t you think some people are just a waste of time, though?

I get where you’re coming from, but practically speaking I find that these folks are simply toxic and best ignored.

You can be around people who dislike you or disagree with you and that builds a terrific foundation for success.

But trying to get every possible relationship to be positive seems like a fool's errand to me.

that’s just my personality though, I’m not huge on neighborliness

 

[Guest-5ty5s4]

Toughen up, bulk up, set boundaries, show them the door, shut it down, let it go, don't engage. For some reason, I can't shake this thread. I've been thinking about it for a day now. All the advice here is solid and has obvious benefits.

I think there is an opportunity being missed.

Instead of asking yourself "How do I stopped being abused like this" what if you asked yourself:

"How can I turn situations like these to my advantage?"

My junior year of high school I was the new guy in school. That year I had 3 bullies. I'm talking tormenting, harrassing, threatening, assaulting type bullying. The first one literally started on me day one, like some movie scene.

By my senior year of high school I developed some of the thickest skin around. And all three had become my good friends. They'd give me rides to and from school, and again out at night. Twice they helped me land jobs. We'd hang out, they introduced me to more friends. They set me straight when I was up to no good and headed down a dark path in my early 20's. I went to college with one. I later became roommates with another. The third was in my wedding party. I am still really good friends with 2 of them, texting regularly even though they live 2,000+ miles away. We've chatted every day this week in fact.

If you show someone the door, you'll never find out the impact they could have had on your life.

I'm not suggesting you and 40 yr old guy are going to become besties. And I certainly would not expose myself to a year of bullying for anybody.

But my point is there is a skill that can be developed, and if you develop this skill, you can go quite far in life.

You can turn enemies into friends.
You can turn haters into allies.
You can turn doubters into evangelists.

You're never going to please all people, nor should you try. I'm not suggesting that. Heck, I'm a guy who tends to piss some people off.

With this skill, you can have more friends, close more sales, get yourself out of more hot water, generate more engagement and have more people/friends/mentors/partners/employees/associates believe in you than you would if you just shut the door on every jerk that comes across your path.

But what entrepreneur doesn't want this skill? Imagine needing to close a huge sale but the prospect is giving you bullying vibes. What do you do?

Sure, you can tell yourself you don't want his business and move on. Case closed. No f$#%s given, no money received.

But what if you could flip the script, make him a fan of yours and close the sale anyways? Is that not better? What if he sends you 2 more clients? Is that not better?

The truth is you don't develop this skill by surrounding yourself only with people who like you.

You develop it by surrounding yourself with people who don't like you and you get them to change their mind about you. To get there, you have to be able to embrace some conflict.

How do you connect with people like that?

Well, there a ton of different tactics. You can express interest in them. You can make them laugh. You can find common ground. You can share similar stories. You can mirror their language, their cadence, their dialect or euphamisms. You can validate their positions. You can change their circumstances. You can express a desire to help them. You can help them feel good about themselves. You can help them achieve a goal. You can buy them a beer.

You can react differently to bullying than they expect.

There's lots of ways you can stand out. Through your words and deeds, you can change some one else's perception of you. Every situation, every person is different. What will work in one situation won't work on another. But over time you can learn to read people.

Since junior year, I've talked my way out of every fight I didn't want to have. This skill has also helped me talk my way out of more speeding tickets than I care to count.

There are huge benefits to learning to work through conflict rather than avoiding or eliminating it. For those older folks in this thread, I'm sure they are happy with how they are. No one here is wrong. We all have to choose the life we want.

But for the younger folks here, I would suggest you at least consider learning to work through some seemingly unnecessary conflict rather than avoiding it entirely. Take a genuine interest in people who have views that you feel are opposite yours or just flat out wrong. Even the occasional bully. Learn to see the world through other people's eyes. Do that and you can connect with people from many different walks of life.

When you learn how to change how people perceive you, life becomes more of an adventure and business becomes easier.

I just wanted to offer a different take based on my personal experience. Hope that helps someone.

this comment alone is gold.

Friendships/connections are worth a lot more than being right.

It does require two willing participants of course, but when you have both, great things can happen, even if things didn’t start out so good

(however in OP’s case, this guy is not a willing participant so he’d be a straight up bridge burn imo)

 

[Raoul Duke]

How To Stop Getting Abused By People?

I don't.

Because, I hate people.

Problem solved.



#onlyjoking
#dont-tazemebro

 

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[TheCj]

For these types of situations:

1) When you hold yourself to your own standard, you won't care what other people say.

2) Extremism begets extremism. Chances are, you have more to loose than most people that are this clueless. Why waste your time and/or put yourself at risk. ie: shoving, fighting, guy falls gets seriously injured, you get arrested etc... etc...

3) Those that throw mud, are the only ones that get there hands dirty.

4) Always take the high road.

It does make it more awkward that it is a guest of your roommates, since it seems that he was following the lead of your roommate? It really should have been your roommate to call him out on his remarks, and end that. Which would just have me being more mindful of what I tell my roommate, again depending on your relationship with them leads to how to handle that if it needs to be addressed.

Sidenote on all the suggestions for self-defense and working out, for a verbal remark???. Sure if that gives you self-confidence great. I'd say a person willing to stand there ground is dangerous enough in most of these situations, speaking with conviction, with or without lifting weights or taking self-defense is usually more than enough to diffuse or remove yourself from these situations.

Also, befriending this type of person doesn't even cross my mind. Sure you could get to a point that they treat you great, but you already know how they can treat people they don't know. Why even be associated with that.

 

[socaldude]

Psychological violence and lashing out is a form of sadness and confusion.

Real “power” is not “getting back” or “vengeance” but rather rising above the situation with awareness.

It’s like watching a movie. The director made the movie with the intention of trying to manipulate your emotions. But because you step back and not let the action on the screen disturb you. You hold a power over the situation. Weak people let themselves get carried along with the action on the screen in life.

 

[DavidTT]

IMHO, I started realizing as I got older than us men, those who do not reason as much, tend to respect you not based on being nice but rather, if you are perceived as being dangerous.

I used to think that if I would be nice to others, they would be nice to me. After all, you have to have a certain 'savoir vivre'. We have to be civilised and conduct ourselves in this world. However, just because you think this way, doesn't mean others think the same way.

Now did train a large portion of my life in martial arts but mostly kickboxing, muay Thai, boxing etc. I'm also very proficient with firearms. However, I don't look like an intimidating person. And because of that, I always used to have people getting under my skin and I try to shake it off and let it slide but sometimes it's too much. I always have to end up resolving to physically threaten people in order to get them off my back and I'm sure this is the case for you.

I guess I changed my approach this year and decided to just act civilised instead of 'looking civilized'. I decided to bulk up and grow a big beard lol. Mind you, I'm already 6'1 but was 175lbs and I'm currently 218lbs. I feel like people are a lot nicer now and life seem to be a lot easier too.

I think bulking up and growing a thick beard does help potential confrontations IMHO.

 

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[Andy Black]

Toughen up, bulk up, set boundaries, show them the door, shut it down, let it go, don't engage. For some reason, I can't shake this thread. I've been thinking about it for a day now. All the advice here is solid and has obvious benefits.

I think there is an opportunity being missed.

Instead of asking yourself "How do I stopped being abused like this" what if you asked yourself:

"How can I turn situations like these to my advantage?"

My junior year of high school I was the new guy in school. That year I had 3 bullies. I'm talking tormenting, harrassing, threatening, assaulting type bullying. The first one literally started on me day one, like some movie scene.

By my senior year of high school I developed some of the thickest skin around. And all three had become my good friends. They'd give me rides to and from school, and again out at night. Twice they helped me land jobs. We'd hang out, they introduced me to more friends. They set me straight when I was up to no good and headed down a dark path in my early 20's. I went to college with one. I later became roommates with another. The third was in my wedding party. I am still really good friends with 2 of them, texting regularly even though they live 2,000+ miles away. We've chatted every day this week in fact.

If you show someone the door, you'll never find out the impact they could have had on your life.

I'm not suggesting you and 40 yr old guy are going to become besties. And I certainly would not expose myself to a year of bullying for anybody.

But my point is there is a skill that can be developed, and if you develop this skill, you can go quite far in life.

You can turn enemies into friends.
You can turn haters into allies.
You can turn doubters into evangelists.

You're never going to please all people, nor should you try. I'm not suggesting that. Heck, I'm a guy who tends to piss some people off.

With this skill, you can have more friends, close more sales, get yourself out of more hot water, generate more engagement and have more people/friends/mentors/partners/employees/associates believe in you than you would if you just shut the door on every jerk that comes across your path.

But what entrepreneur doesn't want this skill? Imagine needing to close a huge sale but the prospect is giving you bullying vibes. What do you do?

Sure, you can tell yourself you don't want his business and move on. Case closed. No f$#%s given, no money received.

But what if you could flip the script, make him a fan of yours and close the sale anyways? Is that not better? What if he sends you 2 more clients? Is that not better?

The truth is you don't develop this skill by surrounding yourself only with people who like you.

You develop it by surrounding yourself with people who don't like you and you get them to change their mind about you. To get there, you have to be able to embrace some conflict.

How do you connect with people like that?

Well, there a ton of different tactics. You can express interest in them. You can make them laugh. You can find common ground. You can share similar stories. You can mirror their language, their cadence, their dialect or euphamisms. You can validate their positions. You can change their circumstances. You can express a desire to help them. You can help them feel good about themselves. You can help them achieve a goal. You can buy them a beer.

You can react differently to bullying than they expect.

There's lots of ways you can stand out. Through your words and deeds, you can change some one else's perception of you. Every situation, every person is different. What will work in one situation won't work on another. But over time you can learn to read people.

Since junior year, I've talked my way out of every fight I didn't want to have. This skill has also helped me talk my way out of more speeding tickets than I care to count.

There are huge benefits to learning to work through conflict rather than avoiding or eliminating it. For those older folks in this thread, I'm sure they are happy with how they are. No one here is wrong. We all have to choose the life we want.

But for the younger folks here, I would suggest you at least consider learning to work through some seemingly unnecessary conflict rather than avoiding it entirely. Take a genuine interest in people who have views that you feel are opposite yours or just flat out wrong. Even the occasional bully. Learn to see the world through other people's eyes. Do that and you can connect with people from many different walks of life.

When you learn how to change how people perceive you, life becomes more of an adventure and business becomes easier.

I just wanted to offer a different take based on my personal experience. Hope that helps someone.

I agree that it’s a good skill to have to be able to converse with many different types of people, including those overly loud and aggressive. Sometimes that’s just their normal.

I’m also a fan of the “sales is a screening process” approach. I’d rather spend my time with people who have similar values to me.

I got into Twitter last week. I thought it was great chatting to founders and indie hackers, then found some dumb tweets from folks saying billionaires shouldn’t be allowed etc. I made the mistake of engaging. It was a mistake because I don’t want to spend my valuable time trying to unravel their thinking. Life’s too short, there’s too many directions we can go, and I want to surround myself with people going in the direction I want to go.

Yes, when life gives us lemons we can make lemonade. I just prefer to go get an orange.

 

[Deleted78083]

But what if you could flip the script, make him a fan of yours and close the sale anyways?

I agree with you, I spoke earlier about de-escalating and taking ownership of the conversation.

These situations happen when you let others taking ownership of the conversations, but if you jump in, and suggest "how about we speak of something else, what we're talking about now doesn't bring anything to anyone", or you can even joke about it "how about we speak of something else than me, I am shy, I don't like it" in a playful manner, that's how you can turn people around.

This made me think of a great scene from the movie "Thank you for smoking", where the main character tries to persuade the Marlboro Man not to speak to the press about the fact that cigarettes gave him cancer and that he is dying.

He just reframes the problem, changes the focus of the conversation, and....

View: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DtzyCOiUmF8

 

[Fox]

My roommate invited some friends of hers for dinner yesterday night. I joined them at the end of the dinner because I wanted to work on my projects.

When I entered the room, I said hi to everyone, and took a seat. What followed happened fast and without me opening my mouth.

My roommate started saying out loud that I had complained earlier that I valued things less when they were easy to get than when they were hard (because I got an internship in a praised political institution and while I was happy at first, I told her my realization that it wasn't as hard to get as I thought it would be decreased the value I hold in the internship).

One guy, which I had never met before, found that outrageous. He started a monologue:

I think the physical context here is important - this is your house.

The roommate thing complicates it a bit but if someone talked to me like that they got about 30 seconds to get their stuff and be out the door. Whatever points this guy might have (and he has none) he loses when he doesn't know how to talk so someone with even a bit of respect. No respect = his a$$ is going out the door pronto.

Since its a roommates friend though a better approach to do is to "go meta".

Basically don't engage his point but instead draw attention to his behaviour...

"Is this how you talk to someone you don't even know - that is messed up man, I never even meet you before - what is wrong with you!!?" - said calmly but with a tone of "you are being a total loser right now".

In NLP terms this is just taking control of the frame. He wanted you to get into defending yourself - but you switch it around and he is on the back foot trying to defend his own actions.

Now he is stuck - either he keeps arguing and looks like more of a loser or he starts back up and has to apologise. This works very well with a group/crowd cause it makes the other person look like a moron (and they are being one).

I use this technique whenever this happens - if someone is trying to be super passive aggressive with me and I just call them out on it and draw attention to what they are doing. Stay calm and just call it out nice and loud.

A good video on this is...

It is the same idea - don't engage what they are saying but call out the overall situation/their behaviour.

---

On another note I would be reassessing that housemate situation.

I would suggest directly telling that roommate - "don't ever do that again - if I come in and you start arguing with me about some BS in front of some strangers either I am gone or you are. You can introduce me properly and show some normal respect towards me in front of your friends."

Or just move out - birds of a feather flock together and if a roommate brings home idiot friends more than then just cut them out of your life quickly. There too many high value people around to waste time with losers.

Look at just having your own place if possible or move in with someone more on your wavelength.

 

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[Andy Black]

I think the physical context here is important - this is your house.

The roommate thing complicates it a bit but if someone talked to me like that they got about 30 seconds to get their stuff and be out the door. Whatever points this guy might have (and he has none) he loses when he doesn't know how to talk so someone with even a bit of respect. No respect = his a$$ is going out the door pronto.

Since its a roommates friend though a better approach to do is to "go meta".

Basically don't engage his point but instead draw attention to his behaviour...

"Is this how you talk to someone you don't even know - that is messed up man, I never even meet you before - what is wrong with you!!?" - said calmly but with a tone of "you are being a total loser right now".

In NLP terms this is just taking control of the frame. He wanted you to get into defending yourself - not you switch it around and he is on the back foot trying to defend his own actions.

Now he is stuck - either he keeps arguing and looks like more of a loser or he starts back up and has to apologise. This works very well with a group/crowd cause it makes the other person look like a moron (and they are being one).

I use this technique whenever this happens - if someone is trying to be super passive aggressive with me and I just call them out on it and draw attention to what they are doing. Stay calm and just call it out nice and loud.

A good video on this is...

It is the same idea - don't engage what they are saying but call out the overall situation/their behaviour.

---

On another note I would be reassessing that housemate situation.

I would suggest directly telling that roommate - "don't ever do that again - if I come in and you start arguing with me about some BS in front of some strangers either I am gone or you are. You can introduce me properly and show some normal respect towards me in front of your friends."

Or just move out - birds of a feather flock together and if a roommate brings home idiot friends more than then just cut them out of your life quickly. There too many high value people around to waste time with losers.

Look at just having your own place if possible or move in with someone more on your wavelength.

That’s a good tip about calling out the behaviour rather than what they’re saying.

 

[The-J]

I was just thinking about this. I probably would have let it escalate way too far and it would have been a worse outcome for everyone involved. I'm not a fighting type of person but sometimes my temper does get out of control. I see red and then I'm off the handle and it's hard to know what'll happen after that. If I were you and I reacted with anger and rage, it would have been much worse.

Your battle right now is internal. You're fortunate that you don't have to replace broken dishes, pay for other people's medical bills, deal with your own injuries because you took some blows, deal with a potential lawsuit, or have to explain to your now-terrified friends why you flew off the handle.

Hopefully you're able to let it go now. But again: assholes like that aren't allowed over anymore, and your roommate better know and be on board with it. If he's not, then he can F*ck off too.

 

[Mattie]

TLDR: Some people in life are particularly perverse and will abuse you and your kindness and when you realize it happened, it's too late.

How do you prevent this from happening?

------------------------------------------------------------------------

The full story:

IMPORTANT NOTE: THIS IS NOT A POLITICAL POST. We are not arguing political views here, I just told the story how it happened. The rules of the forum say we cannot discuss politics. Please comply. Thank you : )

My roommate invited some friends of hers for dinner yesterday night. I joined them at the end of the dinner because I wanted to work on my projects.

When I entered the room, I said hi to everyone, and took a seat. What followed happened fast and without me opening my mouth.

My roommate started saying out loud that I had complained earlier that I valued things less when they were easy to get than when they were hard (because I got an internship in a praised political institution and while I was happy at first, I told her my realization that it wasn't as hard to get as I thought it would be decreased the value I hold in the internship).

One guy, which I had never met before, found that outrageous. He started a monologue:
"Yeah, but you know, you can complain of that because you were born with a silver spoon in your mouth, you f*cking capitalists. Me, I never had the right to not care about money. It's always there. I never even thought about doing an internship where you will do yours. This is why I had to work 15 years as a bartender. Where do you find the money to pay your rent? Huh? Where do you find it?"

I was paralyzed. I didn't know what to answer because I didn't expect to be attacked by someone I did not know...in my living room. I answered the truth, that I wasn't paying any rent at the moment because I was staying with a family member. That made him even angrier.

"Yeah, you got a silver spoon in your f*cking mouth, you have the luxury not to think about money, you never had to, you never will".

I started shaking. I stood up and told him to wait 2 minutes. Everyone saw I was angry. The atmosphere got tense.

I went to get my computer, came back and showed him a draft of blog post I had written. I wanted him to read the two sentences where I explain running out of money is my number one fear, way ahead of death and public speaking due to my money-tight childhood (why do you think I ended up on this forum lol).

Then he said "hey chill out, we're discussing, I am not attacking you or anything".

I was angry. I was really angry. I had let my guard down (I was in my own apartment for crying out loud) and had been attacked as a result. I walked straight into a trap that that idiot had laid for me.

It took me three hours to fall asleep that night, because I was angry at myself for having been abused so easily.

I figure that this type of abusive and passive-agressive behavior happens often where the stakes are high (politics, business).

What are the resources you guys use to deal with it? Physically I am short, 5,8, I am trying to build muscles so that I would commend a bit more respect, but otherwise, I am used to put out a mean face to instantly repel anyone that tries to mess with me (especially in the street since Brussels is a very dangerous city).

I didn't do it yesterday, and this is what I got.

Ordinarily, I am trying to be a nice guy, to help people, to give value. Some see it as weakness and try to abuse you.

How do you prevent it from happening?

PS: I talked with a friend today which was there last night, and she apologized for this guy's behavior, saying her boyfriend almost got into a fight with him last week.

This happens in life in general with any topic or subject. It depends on the situation. Who the people are. I mean someone who you don't know is not the same thing as a boss, family member, friend, or romantic/partner.

This also depends on how much emotional, mental, spiritual, financial, and physical investment you have in the situation and the other person. If there is no investment, you really shouldn't worry about the impact you have on standing up for yourself, setting personal boundaries, and using your voice .

When it comes to other types of relationships, it can be quite destructive on both parts. Since it is self-sabotage and sabotage at the same time on both sides. It may be two people calling the "Victim" card at the same time, and not realizing they are both doing something in the situation to create the mess.

This comes down to power, control, and domination. We love to boost our ego's. We love being right and making someone else wrong. We love creating conflict, arguments, debates over the smallest things in life.

Both sides can be right at the same time, but stuck in their own point of view and experience. Rarely, do we like to place ourselves in someone else's shoes and see from their point of view. It's easy to bash any social class, because they all play be different rules of the game to survive.

Society loves pinning the social classes against one another, and thrusting the superiority over the inferiority.

In 2020 and 2021, I believe all social classes are being hit financially. Perhaps a life lesson of it doesn't matter where you stand in life, the tree can still be cut down with the same saw whether you're the tree that stands tall in the sky or the little one just planted. Either way if you take a saw to it, it will cut, and fall. One tree might just crash a little louder and bigger crash to the ground than the other.

You might have more wood to sell, then the little guy, but still then the termites can eat your wood just as fast as the little guy. It's just a matter of perception. The arguments, debates, and abuse is just a waste of time and energy. Not productive, and doesn't solve anything. It's learning to allow other people to argue with themselves, because it's an inside job, more than it is about you.

Has nothing to do with you at all. Giving them any kind of power over your emotions, thoughts, and feelings, is where they get something out of it, but you're always in control over what you say and how you react or respond. If you don't react or respond, they have nothing to feed off you.

 

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[Deleted78083]

I think I figured it out.

One needs to adopt a mindset of striving for a positive outcome no matter what happens.

If someone seeks to destabilize you, you should:

1. Directly take control of the conversation
2. Use that control to strive for a positive outcome by reframing the attack

This can be done with a change of focus of the conversation:

"I'm not sure this is a topic we should dig any more than that. Tell me rather what are the things you're working on now, and that excite you".

Most people have a f*cked up past. No need to go there. Talk about positive future events:
- where will you go on holidays
- what are you gonna do next weekend
- when is the next party
- any movie you're excited to see
- any book you want to read
- when is your birthday

Or this can be done by acknowledging the suffering of the one that attacks you:

In this case:

"I can see you find my political opinions and thought processes quite offensive because you have suffered in your life. I understand. If I had gone through what you have, I would probably feel the same way".

The idea is to tell people that you would do exactly what they did if you were in their shoes (even if it's not the truth). People crave connection and understanding. They want to feel that those around them are like them. Once you validate them, they will move on.

From now on I'll approach every interaction with a mindset of striving for a positive outcome. Let's start to seek what we have in common instead of what differentiates us.

 

[Olimac21]

Personally I would just ignore it because I do not think is worth it to take the energy to send him to hell or creating a big scandal by throwing him out of the house lol that being said if you get easily offended that will not be your natural/rational reaction.

Also lets assume you decide to get into a fight and the dude is black belt in some martial arts or just a psycho who is willing to hurt you with a knife or beer bottle lol. I read the other day something like " 98% of people will not get your vibe or simply like you" so just ignore them inmediately.

Remember though most of the times is about them, not about you.