How to Learn Code, Start a Web Company, $15k+ per month within 9 months

[Born-To-Run]

Alright, finished a website for a client and have moved them to my server for hosting.

Website was developed for free and I am charging $50 for 30 days of hosting. I have offered them a discount if they pay for more months upfront, currently it's 30 days (no discount), 90 days (10% off), 365 days (20% off). They are discussing going with the 365 day option which will be $480 a year.

I am having some trouble deciding how they should pay for this. I have a contract I've done up but i'm iffy about doing contracts online (no face to face, cant guarantee who is signing it), how do you guys go about this?

On that note instead of a contract I was thinking of putting a link to an agreement form on my web design website for them to agree to which lists the options for their hosting plan. Once they've agreed to the terms and selected their hosting plan they go to payment where its processed and they get sent an invoice.

Also, depending on the client I will need to charge different prices for hosting. One client may only be the work of $50 for 30 days of hosting, while another may be $200 for 30 days. I need an agreement form I can change on the fly (tailor to individual clients) and link them to.

I have no idea how to go about this so any info would be appreciated. In the time being I will do some research of my own.

 

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[BigSheep29]

This is great practical advice, and perfectly mirrors my current experience as I'm doing research / pre-sales / Customer Development for my SaaS startup.

Prospect at night (use time wisely), make a HUGE list of potential contects (play the numbers).
Use email templates (yup!)
Prospect every day (in my case I do outreach 3 days a week because I'm using the other 4 to learn coding)
Persistence is key.

Hey, if you have a chance to join my SaaS progress thread, I'd love your input.
Sounds like you definitely know what you're talking about

Checking it out now!

 

[daru]

That was pretty mind blowing. I'm a full stack developer so the coding stuff was not the big takeaway for me, but Fox and many contributors to this thread really did a good job of explaining the selling value part. Thank you!

I have built a couple of sites for my former employer and updated a old web site I did for a family friend that runs a small construction company. So I have a small portfolio already. I also live in a town with big industries and have joined a local business network so I get to talk to them in person about their needs regarding new websites. I mainly see this as a way to learn sales, make some money to pay the bills and get in touch with people to find needs of a Saas business.

Since I'm a full stack developer I see that there are some confusion about programming languages, frontend, backend etc. which I will try to clear up a bit below.

What Fox is doing is mainly frontend development which means he's using HTML and CSS. Maybe some Javascript which I guess is part of the theme and perhaps never even edited? What does frontend mean? Basically it's all code that is run (executed) by the web browser (IE, Chrome, Firefox etc.).
Of HTML, CSS and Javascript that's used for frontend development it's really only Javascript that is a programming language. As explained over and over throughout the thread, stick with HTML and CSS and frontend design if you just getting started. Why?
Because you don't have to learn programming (steep learning curve) to get started. You also don't need any web server to start designing your frontend web site. Just edit the HTML file and CSS file in any folder on your computer and then open the HTML file in your web browser. It's when you need to put the website online that a web server is needed but that pretty much boils down to FTP your files to a specific folder on a web server (on GoDaddy, Bluehost or whatever).

Backend development becomes a lot more complex pretty fast. Here you use programming languages like PHP, JavaScript, Python, Ruby, Java (Javascript and Java is completely different things!) and C#. One could use C, C++, Lisp etc. for web backend development but it's not that common. They are mainly used for systems programming and desktop apps.
With backend programming you often need to learn a bit about databases, set up a development environment with a bunch of tools and a development server.
If you wan't to do backend programming or just learn programming Ruby and Ruby on Rails web framework is good. Personally I prefer Python programming language and Django Web framework to get started. Why? The documentation is just awesome for Python ( Learn Python the Hard Way - Read for Free) and for Django (Django documentation | Django documentation | Django) and/or (Django Web Framework (Python)). Also, Django generates a really nice admin interface that's really helpful!

Wordpress seems to fit somewhere in between Frontend and Backend.

 

[#nowhere]

Hi Fox,

thank you for the great thread. Helped a lot! I'm now doing my first site. I purchased the theme and the variant theme builder.

Variant seems to be a bit like drag and drop? Do you use it nevertheless or do you just use the HTML-template?

Thanks!

 

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[Drew D]

I still love this thread. But it comes off as too easy so it's gonna attract tire kickers and people who want the exact steps.

That's what's nice about this.

There's a ton of really easy money in it for people who want to put in the work, and nothing for people who don't. Someone ain't gonna make money if they aren't picking up the phone and calling businesses.

 

[Fox]

I am sure people have noticed my posts have dropped off the last few pages. I have been flat out with trips to four different countries in four weeks and have done three sites alone this week! I have a new thread coming very soon that will have a lot of video and some more insight into coding and starting a web design business.

 

[leviathan]

Hello,
I'm having some second thoughts about a project, would appreciate the opinion of the fastlaners.

Started my web design adventure about a month ago, made a free one-page site for my young friend who has just opened her attorney office.

She got me a lead, her former boss, a wealthy senior attorney with 30 years of experience who has never had a website before.
I met with him today, we discussed his needs and he feels he needs a 1-1.5 month project.

Then he also told me that he wants me to do the whole project for free, as well as pay his hosting and domain costs. In exchange, he assured me several times that he will find more clients for me in the future.

I reluctantly shook his hand, thinking I have to start somewhere but now I have some serious second thoughts.
What is your opinion?

 

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[Fox]

Hello,
I'm having some second thoughts about a project, would appreciate the opinion of the fastlaners.

Started my web design adventure about a month ago, made a free one-page site for my young friend who has just opened her attorney office.

She got me a lead, her former boss, a wealthy senior attorney with 30 years of experience who has never had a website before.
I met with him today, we discussed his needs and he feels he needs a 1-1.5 month project.

Then he also told me that he wants me to do the whole project for free, as well as pay his hosting and domain costs. In exchange, he assured me several times that he will find more clients for me in the future.

I reluctantly shook his hand, thinking I have to start somewhere but now I have some serious second thoughts.
What is your opinion?

F*ck that. There is free portfolio work to get going and then just being taken advantage of. I would say no way. Ask him if represents people for free?

Work a new deal or move on. At least $3,000 and probably much more. My range for law sites is $4,000 - $8,000.

 

[Drew D]

Hello,
I'm having some second thoughts about a project, would appreciate the opinion of the fastlaners.

Started my web design adventure about a month ago, made a free one-page site for my young friend who has just opened her attorney office.

She got me a lead, her former boss, a wealthy senior attorney with 30 years of experience who has never had a website before.
I met with him today, we discussed his needs and he feels he needs a 1-1.5 month project.

Then he also told me that he wants me to do the whole project for free, as well as pay his hosting and domain costs. In exchange, he assured me several times that he will find more clients for me in the future.

I reluctantly shook his hand, thinking I have to start somewhere but now I have some serious second thoughts.
What is your opinion?

No way. Why would u do 1+ months of work for free?

 

[c_morris]

I reluctantly shook his hand, thinking I have to start somewhere but now I have some serious second thoughts.
What is your opinion?

I agree with @Fox. If anything, charge in full up front and offer him a finders fee for referrals. I think you can do it on your own though.

Sent from my SM-G930W8 using Tapatalk

 

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[leviathan]

Thanks for the responses everyone!

I'm going to call him up tomorrow and try to renegotiate the deal with my standard sum.
If he declines my offer (which is expected since we shook hands and all), I'll politely decline the project.

 

[Guest06196]

Thanks for the responses everyone!

I'm going to call him up tomorrow and try to renegotiate the deal with my standard sum.
If he declines my offer (which is expected since we shook hands and all), I'll politely decline the project.

You've made the right decision. People making future vague promises wile taking advantage of you will only keep taking advantage of you. They will never follow through the promises. It is so typical. I'd go back and politely ask for a very high price and inform him that I'm already offering a huge discount, compared to the industry standard. The only reason I'm doing the discount is I'm building a portfolio. You get more respect and might actually get the deal!

Hey @Fox, thanks very much for this thread. One quick question: How did you handle the contract part? (Did you hire a laywer? Do you make the client sign or just get a confirmation from payment or email?)

 

[PedroG]

Great thread! I've considered doing something like this on the side. The problem is that I'm not really good at the design side of things and most business websites are all design (no programming).

 

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[Fox]

Great thread! I've considered doing something like this on the side. The problem is that I'm not really good at the design side of things and most business websites are all design (no programming).

Thanks. Where are you at at the moment? Have you done any sites so far?

 

[PedroG]

Thanks. Where are you at at the moment? Have you done any sites so far?

I've been a software engineer for about 14 years, but I've never wanted to do freelancing work, although it has crossed my mind. I love programming but I'm just not that good at design. I've focused on creating SaaS-type applications that I can scale, but nothing has turned into anything meaningful yet.

 

[Everyman]

Thanks Fox for sharing your experience here. I will start my every thread/comment with this remark.

I finished my first website (finished is a big word - there is always something to adjust/correct) and will see what happens next. I am going to work on this process until it's ready and I can prove to myself it works (I know it does). I don't want to say anything until I have my first paying client - although I predict this to be around June (it's my plan, by paying I mean real money, above 1k).

During this learning stage it has been a lot of frustration and spending 3hrs on finding that solution to "why this small f£&*!$ thing doesn't work" - a lot of these moments, which are even more daunting because I know other programming language, which I am fluent in, and it takes me no time to build anything complex....

My greatest discovery (I hope some of you at least will smile here) - it is so easy to learn anything these days. You don't even have to leave home. I am not just talking about web design, programming etc... Fixing a car - done! (the guy wanted 35 euro just for checking the error with the computer + probably another 35 euro for fixing the problem - 70 euro for 15mins of work ), changing touch screen in your mobile - done! (145 euro in the repair store, it cost me 60 euro and 30 mins)... I could go on ... There are so many small business opportunities. These above may not be the best - remember CENTS - but they are literally everywhere. To start.

 

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[johnnyfriendly]

5k sales call. First sales call for me this year...

Some context...

- First time I have talked to this client, ever
- Also first call of the year - I am a little rusty and also was working remotely so little bit of a delay (I cut him off once or twice)
- The work was already done with solid emailing. He was already pretty much sold. Either way I always assumer the sale and talk as such
- This jobs is for a person I am helping with web development who couldn't call himself. I have been helping him put together some emails and he lined this up. He found it straight out of a google search
- We used my portfolio since I am helping him and he doesn't currently have his own. Thats what he means when he says "past sites"
- So the next step is to send a plan and a quote. This will be closed for a little below or above the 5k mark, we will go through it and do up a great plan and quote for the client
- My phone calls probably seem very relaxed and not very "saley", this works best in my experience and this is the same approach I use to close huge sales, although I am a little rusty

I'm trying to listen to the sales call but it says "This video is private"
Also @Fox, what OS do you use on your computer?

 

[Fox]

I'm trying to listen to the sales call but it says "This video is private"
Also @Fox, what OS do you use on your computer?

Fixed. I am on a Macbook Pro.

 

[johnnyfriendly]

Fixed. I am on a Macbook Pro.

Great, thanks. I am looking into revamping the website of a neighbour who is an electrician since it would be good practice.

@Fox this is his site: Falco Do you have any tips for what you (in your design mind) would find fault with this site. It's kind of bland and basic. Also if you do a google search of "Dubin electricians" this site is nowhere. Not even in the first 10 pages. I stopped looking after that. How do you get your clients' site to the top of the list or at least to get more exposure and traffic to them. Do you have them fork out a few hundred each month for SEO?

Thanks again

 

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[Fox]

Great, thanks. I am looking into revamping the website of a neighbour who is an electrician since it would be good practice.

@Fox this is his site: Falco Do you have any tips for what you (in your design mind) would find fault with this site. It's kind of bland and basic. Also if you do a google search of "Dubin electricians" this site is nowhere. Not even in the first 10 pages. I stopped looking after that. How do you get your clients' site to the top of the list or at least to get more exposure and traffic to them. Do you have them fork out a few hundred each month for SEO?

Thanks again

Paging @Andy Black !

I will have to have a look at this later though, got three sites on the go at the moment.

 

[johnnyfriendly]

5k sales call. First sales call for me this year...

Some context...

- First time I have talked to this client, ever
- Also first call of the year - I am a little rusty and also was working remotely so little bit of a delay (I cut him off once or twice)
- The work was already done with solid emailing. He was already pretty much sold. Either way I always assumer the sale and talk as such
- This jobs is for a person I am helping with web development who couldn't call himself. I have been helping him put together some emails and he lined this up. He found it straight out of a google search
- We used my portfolio since I am helping him and he doesn't currently have his own. Thats what he means when he says "past sites"
- So the next step is to send a plan and a quote. This will be closed for a little below or above the 5k mark, we will go through it and do up a great plan and quote for the client
- My phone calls probably seem very relaxed and not very "saley", this works best in my experience and this is the same approach I use to close huge sales, although I am a little rusty

Nice laid back style. The customer felt at ease and wasn't being subjected to the boiler-room hard sell by someone desperate to make a sale for commision.

 

[Andy Black]

Paging @Andy Black !

I will have to have a look at this later though, got three sites on the go at the moment.

These should help:

• www.thefastlaneforum.com/community/threads/the-biggest-reason-websites-suck.68179
  
• www.thefastlaneforum.com/community/threads/lead-gen-for-local-service-businesses.61148

 

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[jpanarra]

These should help:

• www.thefastlaneforum.com/community/threads/the-biggest-reason-websites-suck.68179
  
• www.thefastlaneforum.com/community/threads/lead-gen-for-local-service-businesses.61148

Bookmarked those two threads... Great info here for lead generation for alot of things... Thanks @Andy Black

 

[Fox]

5 figures in sales today between future work and selling some already created assets. About 4-5 hours phone talk time too, my ears are fried.

 

[jpanarra]

5 figures in sales today between future work and selling some already created assets. About 4-5 phone talk time too, my ears are fried.

Awesome News! Also, that's new to me... Ears can get fried ... What a peaceful world I live in I guess...

 

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[Valsore]

5 figures in sales today between future work and selling some already created assets. About 4-5 phone talk time too, my ears are fried.

Reading your posts at a time where I have been nowhere close to selling a website is what motivates me to keep going.

 

[Fox]

Reading your posts at a time where I have been nowhere close to selling a website is what motivates me to keep going.

Thanks. That was meant to say 4-5 *hours* talk time. It is a lot of work but it is possible for anyone who puts in the time and effort.

How are you going about getting sales at the moment.

 

[Valsore]

Thanks. That was meant to say 4-5 *hours* talk time. It is a lot of work but it is possible for anyone who puts in the time and effort.

How are you going about getting sales at the moment.

I am sending value giving emails. I prewrite them and then schedule them to be automatically sent Tuesday and Wednesday from 10 AM to 12PM. I read a report that emails have the highest chance of being opened when sent at that time. I send around 10-15 per week and then follow up on Thursday with a phone call. So far the best I have gotten is a 5 minute conversation with a guy last thursday where he did not hang up and he said to call back in a few months and try again.

Btw I am reading Cashvertising, and I wrote up this template which I use to send emails, is it too salesy?

"
Hi (Name)


It will take you 3 minutes to read this email, but it’s worth it.


You are wasting more than £5000 every year.


Do you want to know why?


You are spending money advertising (Name). But when your prospects click on your Ad. Your home page is not effective. It doesn’t convince visitors to take out their wallets and contact you.


Don’t get me wrong, you are getting some leads from your online presence. However, it’s not nearly as many and as high quality as they can be.


You pay money for every click on your ad. You pay money for each visitor your ad brings. What does this mean? Every Ad click that leads to your website but doesn’t result in a sale is an extra cost for your business.


Many small business owners don’t know this. But, it is a science designing a webpage that convinces people to buy and that rings your cash register. It’s not enough to just pay for hosting and write down your life story, relying on blind hope that it works.


A smartly designed online presence can be the difference between £10,000 and £20,000 in revenue for your business.


Having said that, here’s what you can tweak with your website. I can guarantee that if you do these tweaks right, your business will grow.


i) Testimonials. Right now you don't have testimonials on your main page. Testimonials are a crucial step in establishing your business as credible. More credibility = more trust = more sales. Try it and see.


ii) Organize your content and focus the page on your call to action. Your website should have the purpose of bringing you clients and growing your business. Having a clear message and a clear path for your visitors to follow is very important. Right now it reads like a brochure. Your website should be it's own 24/7 salesman. Clarity and focus is how to accomplish that.


My partner and I currently optimize business websites for clients in Germany. I have worked on the online presence for clients such as 1&1(largest internet service provider in Germany) and Autoscout24(largest used vehicle marketplace in Germany).


I would be glad to design a landing page for you free of charge and implement it for 2 weeks. I will show you how many more clients you could be getting. If it makes sense for us to talk, you can contact me at (number), or reply to this email. You can find some of our portfolio on our website : (website)


Thanks,

(Name)




PS. As a short recap, you could increase your revenue by tweaking your website. I will do it for free. You can contact me at (number) or reply to this email.
"

 

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[Fox]

Its good that you are making this level of effort but I would suggest changing your email. It isn't you that is the problem, its the 100 guys before you who sent something similar and left a bad taste in the clients mouth.

Keep it non "salesy" and authentic. Same way you would write to them if they were already your client. I would also keep it shorter.

This is a longer version but this is an email I sent out yesterday.



Hey ________,

I am hoping we can possibly do some business together. I specialize in web design for ****** and ****** companies in ******. I have worked with improving sales for ******,******, ****** and many others. The work I have done so far has seen a huge increase in customer leads and also revenue for the owners I have helped.

I like your current site but I think there is a lot of potential to do something great. I know from connections in the ****** industry that having a great visual portfolio for sales is a huge factor and I would love to build a new website that really helps target the your most profitable customers but while still appearing very approachable for regular smaller clients too.

I build websites that focus on sales and results. I know a lot of web designers like to talk about design but my focus here is on the bottom line. Building a website that gets you a lot of new sales and satisfied customers. If you want lot of new clients then that is what I specialize in.

In the link below you will find a previous job i did for a similar company:

****** (link removed)

We focused on overhauling their old design and really focusing on sales. Their new site sells over 5 times more, with two major new contracts within a few months and also greatly reduces the time spent on the phone selling. Customers are already sold or very close to closing by the time they make contact.

I have a few ideas on where you can improve on the site, and why I think it will benefit your business:

- Better sales path for different types of clients - lets split the different types of clients (by using intelligent design) and then sell each client separately on the benefits that matter most to them. This will result in more sales, better informed customers and less time for you on the phone.

- Current site looks a little non professional and outdated (although it has a lot of potential). As you can see with my previous job I made their site modern, easy to navigate and more appealing to future clients. I really think you would benefit a lot from a more professional looking site.

- We can in proven sales techniques to get people taking more action (and not just browsing) and have them get in touch more often. This will greatly improve possible leads and the number of client interactions you have.

Lets talk soon, at the moment can you let me know if you have ever considered updating the site.

Thanks,

Rob

 

[c_morris]

So I’m about 5 weeks in and really enjoying the learning process. I feel like I should be further ahead though. I’m not sure if it’s because I expect more from myself or if it’s simply my lack of available time that’s slowing me down. Juggling this, work and family is a major challenge.

I have the basics down and I have been messing around building a site from scratch to reinforce what I’ve learned. It’s going ok, but again, I feel like I should be ready by now and using my time getting clients vs. parking my a$$ in front of my screen trying to perfect this.

On top of that, I am digging into some of the GOLD threads here and on the INSIDERS forum which is raising some internal conflict. I see the great e-comm progress that others have made/are making and I am now 2nd guessing if I’m on the right path or not.

I know there are countless other posts on this board similar to this and I’m not expecting anyone to spoon feed me the answers. I know what I need to do. I think I just needed to get it out there on “paper” to help myself gain some clarity on my direction.