55 kph
Selling my van for a fastlane attempt
When I made my introduction a couple of members here pointed out that I should focus on just one of my ventures and that is exactly what I have decided to do.
I looked at the one that had the biggest fastlane potenial and I have decided to go full throttle on this one idea.
To do so has meant that I needed some capital (about $6000)
To get that without getting in debt the only way I can do it (without saving up for months) is to sell my van and buying a rock bottom run arround.
The van is up for sale at a low price and I have everything set up to launch my project, I am now commited 100% to making it real.
It is a very exciting and high pressure time for me, the way I like it.
I have a slowlaner wife and have not explained to her yet (she is great and does allot for me but is happy to plod along and save and earn miserable ammounts of money each month). It is all about timing with her. If I tell her beforehand I would never be able to do anything.
Anyway, my project, a new slant on a social network, is set for launch in about 5 weeks time!!!
This is my biggest attempt yet.
I am not really entertaining failure of this project but in the event that it does I will follow it up with another and another and another until something works.
195 kph
55 kph
Wow!!! What a struggle, I just announced my plan to my other half and it went just as I expected. A great tidal wave of negativity because I have taken her outside of her comfort range.
I got blurtings of "I'm happy with my simple life" "I don't want money" "you'll not have any time to spend with us" "why waste your life chasing money" "how are people going to react to this" "what the hell are you thinking" and the list goes on and on!!!!
I told her I just want her to encourage me and perhaps help me with my translations into french
It is deffinately a lonely road, but at least I feel like I am the driver as opposed to being a passenger.
(after 3 hours she still has her big sulk face on lmao)
I'm commited now and their is no going back.
35 kph
To the question of 'how will people react,' well, expect a lot of laughs and ridicule from those who are insecure and who are "slowlaners". ESPECIALLY if the first project ends up being nothing more than a valuable learning experience. May want to not say a word to anyone about it until you have a successful business with paying customers. Then they can laugh all they want (but they probably won't). Very generally speaking, many people may be programmed both externally and genetically to think extremely small and to be oblivious to the objective reality that one's income is in direct proportion to one's contribution to the world.
“The toughest part of success is trying to find someone who is happy for you.” Bette Midler
I don't agree with this comment, but at first it can feel this way before you start surrounding yourself with like-minded ppl (as you have already done by joining this forum).
I have no idea what you are planning to do with the $6K and it isn't my business to comment on this but I'll do it anyway - I wouldn't drop a few thousand into web design for the project. For those on a budget, a site can be built by a programmer for way less than that on one of the outsourcing sites like Odesk or something and it can just be a thin prototype so you can get traffic to it first and see if it works i.e. if people sign up to it.
Best wishes.
55 kph
Thank you. Sorry I should have mentioned that this is not my first effort but it is my first real effort that involves making a big sacrafice. I,e selling up my van that is only a couple of years old. I have made lots of little efforts before and tried lots of useless money making schemes.Originally Posted by deepestblue
Just to outline my previous exp so you can understand me a bit and hopefully realise I am not doing this with no life experience.
I have been a hotel manager, which I hated, huge hours crap pay big responsability.
I have tried creating some websites before, even a PTC site, but pretty much out the box failures that disobeyed the commandment of entry.
At the moment I am a team leader on construction sites but I earn about 3.5K$ per month for quite allot of hard graft.
So after reading half of Think and grow rich and then MJs book I decided I'd need to do make a real effort.
I had a vision for something and the perfect website for my vision was with a domain name called tell (dot) me
I approached the owner of this domain name, the co-founder of code.me
I could not offer him (anywhere near) the ammount of money he wanted to buy the domain name.
However he was prepared to listen to my vision for this site and we did some negociating and we have struck a deal.
I supply the platform and he supplys the domain name tell.me
I have 50.1% of the venture he has 49.9% although I pay a small lease fee to use the premium domain name otherwise out of my reach
Due to the nature of this deal I cannot launch with some half baked crap made by somebody on Odesk that promises the earth but delivers a steaming heap of turd. (I got burnt on Odesk before, paying somebody to sit arround all day doing nothing!!!)
I am paying 6K because I am passing by a reputable company based in Florida to bring me V1 of my platform.
We are launching Tell(dot)me end of May beginning of June
185 kph
20 kph
Honestly, id rethink the decision to go with the Florida company. You really can get good results from sites like odesk/freelancer etc. Just make sure you get the right person/team, and set up milestones correctly so you only risk a small amount at first, and only pay once they have made certain amounts of progress.
I dont know what your planning to build but im willing to bet it should cost $2k maximum.
140 kph
I'm not sure if I understand completely. Are you leasing the domain name from the same person/company that is going to do your site for you? If so, could you still lease the domain name even if you decided not to go with them for the website development?
If you are going to have other individuals involved, I would be very, very careful during the set-up of the business to make sure that you protect the potential future value of the company. Let's assume it really takes off and becomes worth $5 billion in two years. Will there be any loopholes in the contracts where they can screw you out of your percentage in any way? What happens when they decide they don't want to lease the domain to you anymore or they demand a huge ransom for its use in the future?
Be careful that you don't violate the commandment of control!
I agree with the person that suggested Odesk. Or, you could probably find other talented designers via trustworthy word-of-mouth recommendations.
BEST of luck! It sounds like an exciting idea and you are definitely showing all of the signs of commitment!
35 kph
When a person puts ideas on this, it is good to expect that some of the ideas will get critiqued in some cases. Yet it is totally natural to feel a bit defensive, especially when slowlaners are panning one's ideas but here is a group of like-minded entrepreneurs. As a previous poster indicated watch that Commandment of Control. As another previous poster mentioned a site build-out on one of the freelancer sites wouldn't likely be any more than $2k tops, and could end up around a few hundred dollars for world-class work with the right coder. A thin prototype could be around $75.00 for testing purposes. It's not that $6k is a lot for a site design, it's that the responses in the thread are based on the scenario as laid out by the original poster, i.e. selling a valuable asset to obtain the capital. It is interesting to note sometimes the lengths some may go to before acquiring a customer. The adage, find a customer first. Then if something works it's a cinch to scale it up piece by piece. The OP could deploy potentially dozens of different site/business ideas or dozens of iterations of a single idea with the seed capital, working them hard one at a time, as opposed to going all in since in practice the first round rarely works. But I can appreciate the initiative and guts this would take. All the best with your endeavors OP, specifically this new concept! Exciting stuff! Out.
195 kph
5 kph
55 kph
Merci!
I did put this out on Freelancer and Odesk originally but everybody who responded was a website designer and I needed a coder. Most of them wanted between 1.5K$ and 3K$ When I sent them the full specifications for my site, I heard nothing back and the ones I did hear back from had not prior feedback. After 2 days I decided that this was not an option and I started searching for some companies that had experience in the field I am looking for.
No they are not the same company who are designing the platform. However the potential issue that you have raised there is a very big concern of mine.
Thanks very much and I have taken that on board. I need to get this out as quick as possible because I feel that the timing is right. I am sure that there are some great coders on odesk and freelancer but they did not react quick enough to my tender.
Yeah, 18 hrs later she is still like a cat on hot bricks
I wanted to give away 20% to 30% max but I would have needed min 6K up front for the domain and the owner was not going to come down more. If I paid 6K for the domain then I couldn't get the work done to build the site. Having either two options. Use a different domain name of much lower value and much less brandable and keep 100% control. Or, give a way allot in return for a super brandable domain, but in the meantime partner with somebody who is credible and clearly has the potential of being a great asset.
The contract has yet to be drawn up so there are clearly some areas I need to get defined to protect me further down the line. Such as the fact the I do not have the domain name in my control therefore the owner could flip the switch on me at any time. I need to make sure this cannot happen.
150 kph
These guys have hundreds of "premium domains" that they just hold on to until someone comes around and puts an offer down, I would be willing to bet that if you told him you would give him 2-3k for a domain and 10-20% equity (if you had to give away any) and told him that was your final offer before you go find another domain (be nice about it though), he would most likely take you up on the offer because to put it nicely he doesn't have a waiting list of people waiting to buy the domain your after and 2-3k is better than no money at all. Maybe tell him before you get to deep into web development so if you have to find another name your not already to far invested in the other domain, I would also suggest backing up your website so that if he were to pull the plug for any reason you could just transfer the data over to another domain instead of starting over from scratch.
Hope this helps,
Mike
55 kph
First contact I offered $500 and he made a counter offer miniumum straight buy of $50K
I proposed a joint venture
He suggested $10K plus 30% equity
I proposed $1K plus 40% equity
Then he put forward the following options
We are getting closer on the number ! This are my other options:
I went for number 3.
OPTION 1
a. $6,000 Upfront
b. $0/month
c. 49% Ownership
OPTION 2
a. $3,000 Upfront
b. $200/month
c. 49% Ownership
OPTION 3
a. $1,000 Upfront
b. $200/month
c. 49.9% Ownership
OPTION 4
a. $2,000 Upfront
b. $0/month
c. 49.9% Ownership
OPTION 5
a. $0 Upfront
b. $500/month
c. 49.9% Ownership
What is so important between 49.9% and 49%?
20 kph
Hes basically making 50% off all your risk and hard work because he bought a $12 domain name? Looks like buying domain names is the superior fastlane path!
Personally, i think your risking too much upfront. If you are totally set on getting the domain name, id start off as something else (groupon started as "groupon.thepoint.com", dropbox as "getdropbox.com" and theres a million other examples). The 'brand' will honestly make little difference in your failure/success when starting out. If you make $6k profit and still really want the domain, then go for it. (woops i noticed he still wants 49% Honestly- dont be suckered into a bad deal, just forget about the domain name if those are the options. Find another one, and may i also suggest getting a .com rather than a "cool" .me or .ly). If you are ABSOLUTELY DETERMINED to get the domain, id try something like hiring someone whos a good negotiator to get it from him for cheap- offer them an incentive e.g (I want it for $3k,if you can get it for less, you keep the difference).
Think about it this way- the domain is costing you 50% of the business. Is the brand domain seriously going to make the difference between you having a $10m or a $20m business?
One of the most important idea that struck me about getting rich was from Felix Dennis on ownership.
"To become rich you must be an owner. And you must try to own it all. You must strive with every fibre of your being,
while recognising the idiocy of your behaviour, to retain control of as near to lOO per cent of any company you can.
That is the dirty, rotten little secret of it all.
To become rich, every single percentage point of anything you own is crucial. It is worth fghting for. It is worth suing
for. It is worth shouting and banging on the table for. It is worth begging for and grovelling for. It is worth lying and
cheating for. In extremis, it is even worth negotiating for.
Never hand over a single share of anything you have acquired or created if you can help it. Not one share; no matter
what the reason - not for loyalty, not for fairness, not as an incentive - unless you genuinely have to. (Shares as an
incentive rarely work in any case; there are far better ways to motivate employees.)
Nothing counts but what you own in the race to get rich.
If you haven't much skill, or much wit, or much talent, or much luck, and yet you insist on owning more than your
fair share of any start-up or acquisition, then you can become rich.
If you choose to forget or to ignore everything else in this book, just retain this:
Ownership isnt the most important thing in the getting of money - it is the only thing. "
Like Mike mentioned, i also think that 49.9% was down to poor negotiation, and possible not being able to find decent freelancers might have been down to being too vague with the project (they want to be told what to do in as much detail as possible- not be creative and think up site features/design for themselves-generally. I had a site build with great design and mentioned very little other than providing a few examples of an overall feel/colour scheme etc)).
I know this might sound like harsh criticism, please dont think im trying to put you down or anything- just noticed a few things that I, personally would do differently.
55 kph
Thanks for your input.
I have asked other domainers about the value of the domain name tell_me and they have told me that if was purchased in 2008 for $3500
They have also valued it as being worth the purchase price in 2008 of $3500 to being worth much more $xx,xxx
So, it seems that the general consensus is: I should not give away so much equity
I will see what I can do to re negociate a better figure although I don't want to annoy the owner and scare him off alltogether.
I appreciate the advice I am getting which will help guide me in this crossroad of my life
140 kph
I was thinking considerably about this. If you are 100% determined to have the domain that you need, I would much rather see you purchase the domain for the $6000 free and clear. Then, you could find a great coder who would do the work for 2-3% of your company. It is all about how you "sell" your idea to your potential partner. But I would definitely start at 2-5% and work SLOWLY up.
I remember reading a book about Felix Dennis (the founder of Maxim magazine and many others). He says in his book that he would give his brother ALL of his money if he needed it (which is hundreds of millions of dollars), but he wouldn't give anyone a share in his company. So, if you HAVE to give a small percentage of your company away to make your idea happen, make it as small as possible.
I am all about finding ways around obstacles. So I am also thinking that if you spend a little time brainstorming and come up with a really cool domain name (plenty of which still exist), you could still give a 2-5% of your company away to a coder and then you can spend your $6000 on marketing or some other expense.
If you think you'll have trouble convincing a coder to go with you for such a "small" amount, just think of it this way. Tell him (or her!) that you expect your company to have a value of $5 million within a 2 year period. Tell him that this is a very conservative estimate. His 2.5% will be worth around $125,000. That's not bad for him. Like I said, you can go higher, but negotiate every percentage like it is your last.
140 kph
@townhaus, for some reason, your post didn't show up when I clicked through from my inbox to the thread. You basically said the same thing that I posted... lol. The idea about hiring someone else to do the negotiating is a good idea, as well. And it looks like Felix Dennis has been a good influence on both of us!
55 kph
Ok, in view of the fact I should keep maximum control of my company as possible,as everybody points out, I have made the following proposition.
It allows for me to continue down my current path but gives me some flexibility and hope.
I have sent an email saying I would like a contract that gives me a 12 month window whereby for $xxxx? I have a complete buyout option. For example in three months time if I get the funds I can buy 100% for a pre determined sum. This will be a written and signed contract.
Surely that gives me some more leverage? But at the same time allows me to carry on and get the site done immediately using the domain I want so badly (because it fits exactly).
Awaiting the response from my futur partner......
UPDATE - The response : That is not what we agreed
190 kph
Is there a way that you can test a micro version of your concept, with paid traffic, on a different domain before committing to the partnership deal?
It might be a way to keep the wife happy too if, after testing, you can show her that people are paying for your product / service and that by partnering with this guy, you're just going to scale it up. And if the testing flops, well, you still get to keep your van. =)
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