Thread: Designing and inventing

I have started to sort out my plan, and even posted about a little in the thread called "which is the more logical choice?" Its about my struggle mostly. I think Im on a much clearer path now.

Heres my plan:

Ive been working on an invention for awhile. I came up with it about 18 months ago. I took it to a trade show last year, and everyone loved it. I filed for a provisional patent, and recently filed for the patent.
I struggled at first, because I thought I had to start a business to make alot of money. I spent countless hours reading about starting a business. I filed papers with the state, and found out all I could. Read books, and articles on websites, went to workshops, and counsuling, all that crap.
After all the work, and all the sleepless nights worrying, and all the time wasted talking to other business owners, etc... I ran across MJs book. I bought it, and read it. I loved it.
It changed the way I think about this whole thing. I dont have to manufacture this thing myself. And why would I want to? Why go into work everyday, to crack the whip at factory workers to make myself miserable for 70+ hrs a week, and a pathetic salary? Sounds like a job.
So, I gathered myself, and made a few phone calls I should have made months ago.
I was referred to a guy who has recently been through a few licensing agreements in the same industry Im in. And he has agreed to open a door with a major manufacturer, and get me in to see the Executive team, or whoever it will be who makes the decisions on these matters.
I spent over 16 months chasing my tail, and watching things fall apart, only to make more progress in 2 days by opening my mind, and thinking a little. I removed the thought of "you have to do it this way", and said "to hell with that, Im making this up as I go." I can do it however it works.
So, the plan is this: Ill finish the patent, and file a couple of provisional patents on other things I have come up with. Ill make an appointment with this company, and pursue a licensing agreement. Once an agreement is reached (maybe with this company, maybe not, but it should go well) Ill mention a few of the other ideas vaguely of course, and the fact that Ill be pursuing patents on them as well, and see what they think.
At this point, Ill have to play it by ear, as it could go several ways. Im sure there are scenarios I cant even imagine at this point. Im going to concentrate on the first idea, and the licensing for it. And this ( Potent Fastlane #2- Innovation, page 246) is one of the specific ways the book mentions as a fastlane approach, or "Rapid Wealth: The Interstates".
Im excited, because one deal can be the start of several. And if one is lucrative, 6 or 7 should be downright crazy lucrative. Of course, Im also a "dont count your chickens before they hatch" kind of guy.

We will see. Im cautiously optimistic at this point. And Ill post updates and results here.

Whatever you do, Don't file a provisional patent for your other ideas until you are sure you can absolutely commit to that idea. As you probably know, provisional patents only last for 1 year then you have to file for the patent. So you would use that year to determine if your idea is doable and actually needs a patent. Not all products may necessarily need a patent. It can be a waste of time and money. It can get very very expensive. Remember if you did your homework you'll know that only 2% of patents are ever actually turned into reality and only about 1% make it to store shelves. Sometimes patents are not worth it unless it is something completely new and innovative. I've done a ton of research on this and hope you did your homework too. If you want you can go read my thread "My path to the fastlane". I'm developing a product too and also have many future products I hope to develop. Read my story and you'll understand why I'm only getting a provisional patent. Good Luck and if you have any questions feel free to ask.

Oh yea one more thing- look into getting your product manufactured in China. You can probably get it for a fraction of the cost that you can the U.S.

Thank you for the input.

I have done research and studied. Ive been working on this thing for awhile, almost 2 full years. I did get input at the trade show, and by talking to anyone who would be in this particular industry. Retailers, professionals, and of course the magazine guys. It is unique, and innovative, and it fulfills a need. The item gives the user a precious commodity; time, by allowing them to perform a necessary, but time consuming and tedious task, when its more convenient.

Im still learning of course, but Ive learned so much up to this point, it would take a catastrophic failure to derail me. I started this road like everyone else, with little resolve. Now, my motto is : roadblocks are mearly a means to direct me on to a path I didnt notice before. Alot of the people Ive encountered to this point are like, " what do you mean we cant get a loan for start-up costs? I guess we cant do it then", or "what do you mean we have to buy 500 pcs? I guess we cant do it then", or my favorite " thats not the way its supposed to be done, so its not going to work".

As for the production, Im going to attempt to pass that off to someone else. And for the first time in months, I feel at ease with my direction. Im not worrying about numbers, profits, costs, margins, or any of the hundreds of details I would need to be looking over, things I have no experience in. I have a tangible plan, one I feel will be not only successful, but profitable. I know I still have alot to do, and Im working on it. Ill make the next direction change whenever its needed.

Im working with an attorney on the patent, and he is advising me as to when to file for what, and when and where to mention the item. Ive learned a few lessons on provisional patents, some the hard way. I look forward to the insight provided by some of the members here on situations I have yet to encounter. Maybe someday, we could exchange war stories. After we both get where we want to go, of course.

Well, I have some updates to post.

First, Im in the middle of the patenting of my item. The bad news is, this item was patented in 1984. It has expired, so I wont be able to patent the specific feature I was hoping for. However, the attorney and I think we can patent two or three other specific features, and still make this thing work. Ill post as soon as I find out.

Secondly, I got a phone call today from the guy I was going to deal with previously about producing these items. We talked, and I explained I was worried, especially since he didnt contact me for weeks. Well, excuses aside, he appologized, and sent me pictures of the item, already made. He had one already made for approval. And it looks pretty good.

It appears as if we are back on for production. The good news is, I should have one in hand in 2 weeks. Then we can make a few more and go to the trade shows, for pre-orders. The bad news is, I have alot more headaches coming. I had expected to pass the headaches on to a manufacturer, but that would have left me with the usual 5-7% for licensing. Now with this arrangment, itll be 51%, but Im responsible for the quality. Im not going to have to worry about the production side though. He has agreed to handle the financial ( up front costs of setting up the machines and the materials) and production aspects (pending an actual written agreement, which will be started next week) and I will handle the trade show, industry, and sales side.

And, I will still work on the other items, and maybe license some of them to the major manufacturer I was going to work with. I have some ideas based on some of my designs that would work on their existing products as well. Just have to file the patents for them first. And this time, I did my searches before getting in the middle of alot of work. I have three or four things that are clean, and should be patentable, maybe more.

Hopefully I will know more soon. My trade show is in July. But if I miss it, I there is a different one in October. After that, its magazine time. Ill keep the thread updated.

I got my parts today, and I must say Im impressed. The finish is a bit rough, but for the first piece, its nice. There are a few descrepencies, but Ill have to wait to get to work, where I have some machinists scales, to see if its on my end of the dimensions, or if they just missed. But so far, there arent any major flaws. Its crazy; Im looking at a piece that I designed, and fussed over, and worked on every little detail for weeks. It was built in another country, and shipped here for my final approval. I cant believe it, but this is going to happen.

So, Thursday I go to see the lawyer, and meet another potential investor he said is interested in getting this thing on the market. I have to get the agreements for the arrangement between me and the guy in California written up and settled as well. After that, hopefully Ill get word from the patent lawyer, and I can post alot more information to make a little more sense of this, if anybody is interested.

July is the show, and its looking like I might just make it. Then Im going to go one step further for the show in October, and really blow some minds. Its going to be a busy next couple of months.

Sounds awesome. Can't wait to hear what happens. Speed ++

Thanks guys
Update:

Had a meeting with the attorney, and we discussed the partnership. We talked over a few items, and I agreed to send the details to my guy in California for his approval or disapproval. Basically, we are going to start a seperate entity, that will be incorporated, and use both our original companies to make this happen.
So my company will design and engineer the item(s), and hold the patents and IP. I will license it to this newly founded Corporation, in which we are both 50% partners (after costs). Then we will contract his manufacturing company to have them made. I am over quality, sales, advertising and anything industry specific. He is over manufacturing, and all the logstics of filling the orders.

Personally, I think itll work great. This way, I have them made, and can hold them to a quality standard under license, which was a concern of mine. I also keep the IP. He is covering (including upfront expenses) the manufacturing, which is the part that worried me more than anything. I can also continue working on my other new ideas, and possibly license them through this company, when I get them further along. If his manufacturing infrastructure doesnt have the capabilities I need for a future project, I can license through someone else, or even possibly help set up the capability in his company, as another investment. And I know he will possibly be getting paid both ways; his cut of the new company, as well as a cut from the manufacturing of the product through his present company contacts. It doesnt bother me, and I think it was one of the reasons he has taken me so serious, when everyone else blew me off.

Also he (or his company) will be loaning the new company money, to help cover the expenses I have been paying for out of pocket. Trade shows, legal fees ($200 an hr for a lawyer, holy freekin' crap) and advertising, etc.. So, I can stop running up the credit cards, and borrowing from the bank. The wife will be thrilled.

There are a few details we have to work out still, but it looks like we are going to do this thing for sure. I still have more details to discuss with the patant lawyer, and he has asked me to keep quiet till we have paperwork in the mail at least.

I should be able to make my show in July, hopefully with a few examples in hand, and the ability to take some orders. Ill keep this updated. Things are moving fast now.

Outstanding. Speed+. Good luck, you've done the hard work.

Speed is for those who are moving and getting their dreams materialized.

Thanks for sharing. My friend ran into same situation over his provisionally-patented revolutionary product. He could take some tips from you; you're doing a great job!

I feel excited for you. This is what happens when you are willing to share and don't just keep all of the profits to yourself. Lol.

Not much to report as far as progress. I hate waiting on all this crap.

Both lawyers are on vacation(both, how does that happen?), but I got the LLC papers filed before they left. I will be flying to California to meet personally with my business partner, and go over some details in mid July. Should be able to iron out the partnership specifics, and work on getting a few minor issues with the product ironed out.

And I ruined the one and only product we had by trying to powdercoat it. Evidently powdercoat doesnt like cast parts. Oh well, it looks like crap, but it works. I have to miss my July show over this mistake, which is killing me. In the long run it wont actually hurt me though, as there is a bigger show in November. Its also more specific to my market. And before then Ill have 10 new ones to get to the magazines for review of the product, and we should have it in print before the November show. Looks like December this year might be a little busy.

On a side note, I will also start a new job in July. I know. Not very fastlane, but I like to hedge my bets. If this things takes off slower than expected, or not at all, I still have bills to pay, and a family to take care of. Plus, its just a beter job, in a better company, with alot more future security. Plus I HATE working in a family owned small business.

What category is your invention in? Houseware, construction, toys? just curious.

Originally Posted by IdleMogul

What category is your invention in? Houseware, construction, toys? just curious.

Id rather not say just yet. We are still working out the manufacturing and design bugs, and we arent ready to hit the market. Nothing personal, but there are people here with the money and connections to grab someones idea, and run with it. Ive worked to hard to let that happen. Keep checking back, and once we are 100% sure we can be ready, Ill reveal everything. Pictures, descriptions, maybe even web links, if that allowable.


Another update. I contacted a local group to do some real world testing. They can put it through more testing in 2 months than I can in a year. We had found a few descrepencies that had been overlooked when I got the last few sets. So, the design has changed, again. We are beefing it up alot in a few places, and looking into casting it with better material. Dont want to be selling junk. So, the CAD guy is re-doing the drawings, and then we will see how that goes.

And, my Business partner dropped a huge bombshell. A good one though. He has the means to set up a meeting with one of the largest names in our industry. We arent sure if the guy will want to be involved, but with an endorsement from him, we would be set. Imagine if you were in real estate. This guy would be Donald Trump. HUGE.
He has several friends who know the guy personally, and he has met him on a few occasions, and had lunch with him. The guy is know for using his considerable professional/celebrity status and money to invest in start ups, and side projects. I wish I could reveal his name, but that would reveal everything, so I cant. I guess it can be a teaser to keep people checking back in.

So we are still going forward. We just keep finding new obstacles to circumnavigate. We wont make the November show, but if we can get an endorsment from our possible contact, it would help more than any show. And I dont want to attend another show, without a perfect product. Things are getting crazy now....

Id love to help, if I can. Im no expert, by any stretch. And part of the process is learning. What is working for me, might not work for you. But I can give you a little general advice.

Do a patent search first. Go to the US Patent website, and do a thorough search. You dont want to spend time and money on something thats already patented. Also look for specific features that could be patented. For instance if you are working on a standard pencil, make sure the eraser, or one of the main materials used, the general shape, or even the lead ingredients arent owned by someone else. It should take you a couple of days to do this search.

If that comes back clean, then file for a provisional patent. That gives you "patent pending" status, and buys you a year to actually file. Then its up to you to figure out a direction. I can tell you, depending on the complexity of what you are doing, a year isnt alot of time. But before you start talking to anyone, about design or drawings, get some legal protection. At least a non-disclosure agreement.

By direction, I mean, are you going to pay to have it made yourself, or license it to someone who already has infrastructure in place? It will make a difference. And I think a working model or at least a prototype helps get the point across. But the most important thing is flexibility, and staying focused. You have to adapt, and stay focused in light of a serious lack of interest. Because noone else is going to have the vision and drive you have about this. You will face alot of complacent people along the way, who couldnt care less if you make it or not. Just brush it off, and keep going. Good luck.

Looking forward to seeing the final product drummerdad!

By the way, besides the US Patent website, I would recommend Google Patent. Google has the entire US Patent information, but you'll notice that it's a lot easier doing a search on Google Patent then on the US Patent site.

Why am I not surprised.

Originally Posted by lleone

Looking forward to seeing the final product drummerdad!

By the way, besides the US Patent website, I would recommend Google Patent. Google has the entire US Patent information, but you'll notice that it's a lot easier doing a search on Google Patent then on the US Patent site.

Why am I not surprised.

Agreed thats what I use and its much faster

Awesome thread drummerdad! As soon as you hit market, could you share some details about your invention? Some pics maybe? =)

If I'm guessing it has to do with drummer hardware how far off am I? Something like a stand or a different kind of pedal for example?