This thread has been a great read and provides a lot of insight into SEO. Thanks
I've been reading a lot on these "linkwheels". Does Google somehow know when you sign up or post to different web 2.0 accounts that it is the same person who owns the "niche site" that you are trying to direct traffic to?
I am considering trying out the strategy in this post:
THE Backlinking Strategy That Works
But it seems like a lot of work if I am just going to get penalized for it. It might be better to spend the energy (or money) in a more direct fashion.
I'd like to hear your thoughts. Thanks!
This thread has been a great read and provides a lot of insight into SEO. Thanks
My boss wants me to get backlinks on real website without using forum profiles..
How could I possibly do this and what websites could I go to..?
That is a start however when your doing manual link building and competing with people like me who are using automated software which can produce the same results just 10,000 times faster, your going to have a hard time competing.
This is a HUGE myth that google knows your IP or knows when you sign up for accounts. No, google does not know this however it does matter the sites you get your links from as you want to have diversity and not getting the same link from the same 5 sites.
You will not get penalized. The amount of links that you are creating won't even draw any attention from google. I build 100,000 links in a day for testing purposes and nothing happens. So you should be fine
These f*ckers call me too ... total scam that targets the uneducated business owner.
Guido 65 and others, if you could please PM me contact information that would be great. We are in need of building up SEO on our sites and have not been impressed to this point with the folks we currently have.
Just to let people know, I haven't been active in the forum for a long time. I am out of the SEO game (although still doing for own company) however if you really do want some advice send me a PM and I will try to answer.
Thanks for the input Guido65. If you could PM me anyone you may suggest that would be great.
This thread started out with good advice, but the past few pages are full of bad advice and misinformation.
Tactics such as linkwheels and tier link building are horrible. Anything automated is garbage. There is such a thing as the sandbox and penalties. This has been confirmed by Google and seen by experienced SEO's, including myself.
These lazy attempts at SEO are very popular with the affiliate marketing crowd. This is the same crowd who is crying right now about loosing their rankings to manual penalties for "unnatural links" which were handed out a few months ago or algorithmic penalties from Google's Panda and Penguin updates. Their most popular solution for this issue? Trash the site and start with a new site. Obviously, not an option if your business relies on one main site.
You can play this game of trying to stay one step ahead of Google and pray that you don't loose a main source of revenue when Google does catch up to you. The other option is to generate real popularity to your site and build a real business. Real marketing, interesting content, a real social following, and good manual link building will generate revenue on its own AND get strong, long lasting rankings in Google.
I just don't understand the desire to keep spamming the internet with garbage. Google is trying to stop this. Why use these tactics? They will just keep rolling out updates to combat this stuff.
If you are using these tactics and you are doing well, good for you. But, I recommend that you start to treat your business like a business instead of a hobby. Stop being lazy and learn real marketing.
I think he means that if you have some bullshit blog or site that is absoulte crap, stop trying to spam it out to people who don't want to visit it. Man does that piss me off, when I visit a site that blows but ranks so highly. These kind of sites should be banned, especially garbage blogs that offer people 0 value and are run by somebody who doesn't want to help anyone, they just want to string two words together and then watch $$$ come in.
I've never bothered with "SEO" and my page doesn't even rank that high on Google. Almost 100% of my traffic comes from direct input of the URL into the address bar or facebook wall posts. I guess I sell a product though, and I'm not into writing blogs for money. What a boring slow way to make cash, too many people are doing this, why would you want to
It has nothing to do with being lazy and learn real marketing. The fact is that not everyone can be"not lazy" when it comes to SEO. Google has forced us to behave in such ways of using automated tools because simple white hat marketing does not work. And if it did, it is not very cost effective at all! I am sure you charge an arm and a leg for your little white hat google loving SEO tactics.
It also has nothing to do with staying ahead of google as well. If you had a site that was completely unique selling a unique product with a unique service that really caused people to go out of their way and link to you, then sure that is awesome! Most of us are not going to have some extremely unique service that will cause people to "naturally" link out to us. That is why we force google to give us attention by shoving links down it's throat.
This does not mean that we are not providing value or being "lazy" (obviously you don't understand automation) because we are providing tons of value. If I can't rank then who is going to find me to build links for me "naturally". Noone will!
Say I have a site selling stools. I have a great site providing value but I just sell ordinary stools. Now, people who are looking for stools are looking to just buy stools. Nothing else! Are they going to love that I wrote an awesome ebook on stools and made wonderful colorbook drawlings about my stools and the nice cool stool widget i just created? Hell no! They just want to buy.
Your experience seems to be very one sided and to say very popular in the "affiliate crowd" reiterates my point nicely. I did work for big companies such as "Linens & things" and very many others who still build links with automation even with a huge brand. Why? Because it works and it makes sense. Yes you have to be knowledgeable about what you are doing and no it is not completely safe but so is building any links.
Matt Cutts, is that you?
Really, you sell linkwheels as an SEO tactic to Linens n Things??? Wow, I guess we'll get to read about them getting a 90 day Google ban just like we did JC Penney...
I am not against link building. I think Google is crazy to think that only organic linking will work. You NEED to market a site and build backlinks. I am just against automated links that are nothing but garbage on the Internet. The output is not even close. You don't get the same backlinks from automated tools as you do manual.
Google IS getting better at finding these. They don't want them. So, yes, it is or will be a game to stay a step ahead of Google. TONS of sites that use these tactics were crushed in the past 12 months.
There is a place for this automated link building. That place is affiliate marketing. The margins for sites that rely on adsense or affiliate commissions is not high enough to invest into SEO. I don't consider this a real business. I sold my affiliate marketing business in 2008 because it was way to unstable and real companies are pushing affiliates out.
The good thing about building a lot of small affiliate sites is you can throw them away and start over. You can't throw out a domain where you built a legit business and start over with a new domain.
Sure, major sites that have a boat load of authority can't really be hurt by some automated links. But, lets be realistic, most sites don't have the authority to hold up if they have a bunch of automated links and Google brings out more updates to sniff these out. This is why "negative seo" is becoming such big talk. Many sites can be hurt with automated link building. Google has made it easier than ever after the latest updates. As Google continues to roll out more updates to devalue automated links, automated links will become more and more harmful to the average site.
You can't deny it. You kind of admit it in your post. Google HATES automated links, spun content and fake sites. They are doing everything they can to punish sites that use these... so why use them? You know it will bite you in the ass eventually.
There are ways to rank well without automated links. What I find funny is people using automated links to generate thousands of links for keywords, but the competition is ranking for those keywords with only a few thousand links which were built over a year or two, not a week or two.
You DON'T need thousands of links in a couple weeks to rank for good keywords. People need to try to stop spamming the internet with links and garbage content and first do backlink analysis of the top 10 sites for a variety of keywords they want to rank for. See what the competition has and one up them by throwing in a few more high authority links or a better quality site.
People don't need as many links as they think. It is lack of knowledge that is fueling this and you know it. People do not even know how to do basic analysis of the competition and their marketing efforts to see why they rank. Instead they are taken in by the snake-oil salesman who is selling thousands of links and promising top rankings.
Google created this problem in the beginning. It was an arms race to get links. Today it is different. Quality content and links over link quantity. If you want to rank in Google in the long term, this is the direction you must go...
Trust me, there is a lazy way to automate your backlinks and there is a smart, future oriented way to build backlinks. I agree that guest posting and all that stuff is cool but even then those tactics are not for sure. Google doesn't like any sites getting organic traffic. You and I both know that Google is only out to make money and if they could eliminate all of the organic listing they would. BUt we know that cannot.
Google has forced businesses to resort to such tactics. I have only had one site hit so far (knock on wood) because I don't get lazy and I make sure that my site provides value which it does. At the end of the day that is all that matters right?
How would you summarize Google's Panda Update and Google's Penguin Update?
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