The SEO Marketplace - here goes nothing...

[bernieshawn]

Well, I'm finally starting a progress thread and revealing what my little business is after the thread I made last week in the Failures section.

For most of the background info, please read the thread mentioned above (here).

Anyway, in a nutshell, here's my service: It's called The SEO Marketplace, it's located at theseomarketplace.com, and what it does it provide a way for SEO service providers to create order forms, host their order pages, manage their orders, and communicate with their clients all in one place.

My goal for this website goes beyond this single functionality, however. I have made it possible for the service providers to make sales page on my site. I want my site to be a thriving marketplace where SEO services are bought and sold. If I achieve that, I can sell advertising and even charge a small % of each order.

However, this is where SEO Marketplace stands now: 1 paying member who actually has been using it and pushing buyers through it, 4 paying members who haven't been using it, 8 members with free beta test accounts who haven't used it or given me any feedback, and 1 member with a free beta test account who hasn't used it BUT has been giving me tons of feedback.

Oh yeah, as I said in the other thread, 1 member just canceled - I've been trying to contact him to see why he canceled but I haven't been getting any response yet.

The fact that so many members have not been using it worries me - I'm sure they're going to cancel.

Here's what I've been doing so far to market my service: So far, I have only done 2 things: I have made a sales thread at wickedfire.com and at backlinksforum.com. And, I'm waiting for approval of a sales thread at blackhatworld.com.

Those 3 forums are the largest collection of my target market. After I get my thread approved at blackhatworld.com (it's taking forever), I'm not completely sure what I'm going to do. I might do a re-launch at wickedfire.com (because it's been a couple months since I posted the sales thread there). I might try to advertise it at some other forums where my target market hangs out, but not in as much volume. Other than that, I have no idea.

I'll keep this thread updated - most of the work has been done, obviously, since I have already put it together. Most of the work from here is all marketing, although I'm always trying to improve the service.

With that said, here are the things that I'm working on right now:

• The beta tester that has been giving me so much feedback wants a way to have both a single order and a bulk order option on the same order page. While I think this would be confusing to the buyer (just make 2 separate order pages!), I'm going to implement this feature. I haven't had a chance to do it yet, but as soon as I get a chance I will (probably with in the next few days).
• 1 of my new members requested that I integrate Aweber and GetResponse in with the order pages. After looking at the APIs, I realized that Aweber doesn't allow this function with their API. GetResponse, who will NOT give me an API key, does, but since I can't get a key I don't know how I will get this installed. The member who requested it is supposed to give me his API key to use but hasn't yet.
• I want to install an affiliate program. I've been looking at iDevAffiliate, but I'm not sure it it supports recurring payments. Still not sure if it even makes sense to install it yet.

Would love to get some ideas on how to market this, but if not I'll have to figure it out myself. Who knows, maybe some people here might find my service helpful.

So, that's my intro, and here goes nothing....

[Gymjunkie]

Nice idea. Now you go to WarriorForum - Internet Marketing Forums and post a thread that you need 10 beta testers, you will find tons of SEO specialists there I believe, it is the biggest forum for internet marketing so it's closely related to your niche. Looks like you missed that forum...

And btw, I'd drop blackhat forum.. if it''s really the place were people who use black hat techniques come to hang out you don't want that type of people as clients, they will be looking for freebies, ways to game YOU and will be pain in the butt... if they cheat in one sphere, they will tend to do this everywhere..

[bernieshawn]

Nice idea. Now you go to WarriorForum - Internet Marketing Forums and post a thread that you need 10 beta testers, you will find tons of SEO specialists there I believe, it is the biggest forum for internet marketing so it's closely related to your niche. Looks like you missed that forum...

And btw, I'd drop blackhat forum.. if it''s really the place were people who use black hat techniques come to hang out you don't want that type of people as clients, they will be looking for freebies, ways to game YOU and will be pain in the butt... if they cheat in one sphere, they will tend to do this everywhere..

Well, your response is interesting. I had originally NOT wanted to market this in blackhatworld for that same reason. Then, I actually took a look at their Buy/Sell Services section and they have the most active Buy/Sell SEO services forum on the internet.

Plus, the black hat techniques: technically, doing ANY kind of linkbuilding is black hat, so in that instance, my service already promotes black hat SEO (but without stating it outright).

The reason that I've been waiting to post on Warrior Forum is that while it's a huge internet marketing forum, but it's not real big in the buy/sell SEO services area. Warrior Forum is kind of funny obviously. Everyone tries to be a guru and they all make ebooks/"Make Money on the Internet" type products and sell them to each other.

I was planning on making a thread on WF, but it's not high on my priority list because they are a small player (at least from what I've been able to figure) in the SEO services area.

Thanks for the feedback, though.

Edit: Just made a sales thread on Warrior Forum. It still has to be approved, but hopefully they won't take as long as other forums do.

[Gymjunkie]

Well, your response is interesting. I had originally NOT wanted to market this in blackhatworld for that same reason. Then, I actually took a look at their Buy/Sell Services section and they have the most active Buy/Sell SEO services forum on the internet.

Plus, the black hat techniques: technically, doing ANY kind of linkbuilding is black hat, so in that instance, my service already promotes black hat SEO (but without stating it outright).

The reason that I've been waiting to post on Warrior Forum is that while it's a huge internet marketing forum, but it's not real big in the buy/sell SEO services area. Warrior Forum is kind of funny obviously. Everyone tries to be a guru and they all make ebooks/"Make Money on the Internet" type products and sell them to each other.

I was planning on making a thread on WF, but it's not high on my priority list because they are a small player (at least from what I've been able to figure) in the SEO services area.

Thanks for the feedback, though.

Edit: Just made a sales thread on Warrior Forum. It still has to be approved, but hopefully they won't take as long as other forums do.

WF is huge... there are hundreds of threads started everyday... 350k members, very active forum. And you can get beta testers at general forum, just say you are developing a product and need them.

I think you will find a lot of SEO consultants in there too, or even if not, you can get connections there and maybe get more ideas for a new business or something

Good luck

[fm1234]

WarriorForum is a toilet where failed marketers flush their only viable target customers (gullible newbies a six-year-old could pitch) down the bowl $7 at a time. DigitalPoint is not much better, but does generally have a more "SEO services" mindset among members (largely due to the demographics of the membership, I would think. WickedFire providers who have a good reputation are already making bank at WickedFire, and probably simply do not see the benefit to hitting another venue. What your site is lacking, I think, is a compelling argument that you can deliver customers to the providers. Especially at $50 a month, when Wicked is free (as are DigitalPoint and BHW.)

Say what you will about the porn and the idiot political arguments; you spend enough time really reading WickedFire and you'll understand that it almost certainly has the highest ratio of actually successful marketers to burnouts and newbies of any marketing forum. So -- if you can get noticed there and start working up a reputation the BST section, you'll end up getting as much business as you can feasibly handle. If you have not already, you might consider contacting some of the older, established SEO guys directly for some professional feedback -- Red_Virus and MDSandB have both been there for years and are generally considered the top guys for such services, and both are very nice and very smart guys who might be able to offer you insights from the standpoint of a serious service provider.


Frank

[bernieshawn]

Say what you will about the porn and the idiot political arguments; you spend enough time really reading WickedFire and you'll understand that it almost certainly has the highest ratio of actually successful marketers to burnouts and newbies of any marketing forum. So -- if you can get noticed there and start working up a reputation the BST section, you'll end up getting as much business as you can feasibly handle. If you have not already, you might consider contacting some of the older, established SEO guys directly for some professional feedback -- Red_Virus and MDSandB have both been there for years and are generally considered the top guys for such services, and both are very nice and very smart guys who might be able to offer you insights from the standpoint of a serious service provider.


Frank

Well, wicked fire is where I originally got my beta testers from and where I first launched this service, back in June.

I even had some well-known (around the forum) members beta testing it, but they didn't give any feedback. When I asked them to try it out, they said they didn't have enough time.

I want to do a re-launch there, but I want to make sure that I have improved it enough and added enough extra value to justify a re-launch. Right now, I'm not sure if I have improved it enough yet.

What your site is lacking, I think, is a compelling argument that you can deliver customers to the providers. Especially at $50 a month, when Wicked is free (as are DigitalPoint and BHW.)

This is where my "Thriving Marketplace" vision comes in - if I can offer a busy marketplace full of buyers, then $50/month is easily justifiable since my site will be able to increase their sales.

BTW, BHW is not free at all - in order to make a sales thread, you have to be a $97/year paying member plus $20 per thread.

[fm1234]

BHW is not free at all - in order to make a sales thread, you have to be a $97/year paying member plus $20 per thread.

My mistake -- been a long time since I even loaded up BHW in my browser, let alone sold something there.


Frank

[Talisman]

So, you provide.. a sales page, with some payment options, a return page, and some subscription/product management backend?

Most of these jokers have a one-page sales page, and/or an ad on the previously mentioned forums, with a cheap and nasty paypal button. Which seems to work quite well, it's simple, and often there's no need to track subscriptions, as it's done in a couple of days, wham-bam-thank-you-ma'am.

Now, I'm absolutely not having a go here... and I'm wondering - what is your value add? Your USP? It's either unclear, or not present?

Cheers!

Edit: And with regard to WickedForum.. I had a quick look and if ever I have seen a forum run by a bunch of 12 year olds - that would be it.

[bernieshawn]

So, you provide.. a sales page, with some payment options, a return page, and some subscription/product management backend?

Most of these jokers have a one-page sales page, and/or an ad on the previously mentioned forums, with a cheap and nasty paypal button. Which seems to work quite well, it's simple, and often there's no need to track subscriptions, as it's done in a couple of days, wham-bam-thank-you-ma'am.

Now, I'm absolutely not having a go here... and I'm wondering - what is your value add? Your USP? It's either unclear, or not present?

Cheers!

Edit: And with regard to WickedForum.. I had a quick look and if ever I have seen a forum run by a bunch of 12 year olds - that would be it.

Well, I don't know, maybe I don't have a USP.

The other thing it does is handle client communication and reports. Usually, when you buy these services on a forum, you have to pay for the order, then PM the service provider your Paypal transaction ID, and then message back and forth about the status of the order. Then, when he finishes the order, he'll email you his work report.

My service allows you to do all of that in one place. It automatically notifies the service provider when the payment has been completed and the transaction ID. So, that eliminates the whole payment/txn id issue.

Each order has a order details page. This is a page where all the order details are listed and there is a communication thread where buyer and seller can communicate - the buyer can ask about the status of their order and the seller can provide updates.

Then, once the service provider has finished the work, he can upload the report to this page.

[fm1234]

@Talisman: That quick look will cost ya. I once asked one of the mods why they let such an otherwise excellent forum get filled with 4chan-level garbage, and his response was that, as a matter of policy, it drove away 90% of the WarriorForum guru types, who won't post there (not openly, under their own names at least) for fear that their customer base would associate them with porn, offensive (and occasionally hilarious) Photoshop contests, political bickering and so forth. It's an odd and questionable practice, but it does keep the stupid to a minimum. Dig around in the non-general sections and you'd be amazed at the value there.

[easymoney99]

Well, I don't know, maybe I don't have a USP.

The other thing it does is handle client communication and reports. Usually, when you buy these services on a forum, you have to pay for the order, then PM the service provider your Paypal transaction ID, and then message back and forth about the status of the order. Then, when he finishes the order, he'll email you his work report.

My service allows you to do all of that in one place. It automatically notifies the service provider when the payment has been completed and the transaction ID. So, that eliminates the whole payment/txn id issue.

Each order has a order details page. This is a page where all the order details are listed and there is a communication thread where buyer and seller can communicate - the buyer can ask about the status of their order and the seller can provide updates.

Then, once the service provider has finished the work, he can upload the report to this page.

dang, this is exactly what i started working on 2 weeks ago. i have a different way of monetizing it tho which might/should make it a bit easier to get things running. I'm no where near the progress you have made tho. all I have is a domain name and a drawing board with ideas and notes. I'm having a hard time finding a script I can use for my idea of how it should work. However, I did do some homework and PMed a lot of the sellers on BHW and asked them what kind of problems they have with selling on multiple forums and got some interesting feedback.

but dude i have the same vision as you for the site. just remember that there are many ways to skin a cat. i think you should re-think your monetization plan. or if you want I'd be super down to shoot you my ideas via PM.

maybe a JV??

[bernieshawn]

dang, this is exactly what i started working on 2 weeks ago. i have a different way of monetizing it tho which might/should make it a bit easier to get things running. I'm no where near the progress you have made tho. all I have is a domain name and a drawing board with ideas and notes. I'm having a hard time finding a script I can use for my idea of how it should but. However, I did do some homework and PMed a lot of the sellers on BHW and asked them what kind of problems they have with selling on multiple forums and got some interesting feedback.

but dude i have the same vision as you for the site. just remember that there are many ways to skin a cat. i think you should re-think your monetization plan. or if you want I'd be super down to shoot you my ideas via PM.

maybe a JV??

Interesting... been thinking about making it free for now in order to get people in the door. Then, once people start using it more, I can either monetize in a different way, add back in the monthly subscription option, or both.

PM sent, BTW.

[kurtyordy]

Here is my 2 cents. Be careful, some people think it is only worth 1.

If I am the consumer and end up on your site, I think it is targeted to something other than myself and I will click away immediately.

As a provider, I end up on your site and think, why do I need this? how will this actually help my business? Since I cannot figure that in less than 10 seconds, I will click away.

From my perspective, I love the idea, I hate the execution so far.

If I were going to do this, here is what I would do-

on the home page, make it driven to the consumer. I would allow them to narrow down the services by monthly price: less than $50, $50-$100, etc.

Then once the pick a price slot, lay out the services in a table:

xyz company 30 high pr backlinks, 1000 forum profiles, 2,000,0000 blog comments
abc company 300 high pr backlinks 0 form profiles, 10 blog comments.

and have them be able to sort the table by each column as well.

To start out, I would put up as many of the services as you can for free, or the ones that offer an affiliate program, to start doing some monetization there, but that would not be my initial focus.

My initial focus would be getting consumers and making the site one that they want to come back to because noone else is laying out this info in this way, and they know if they are looking for seo services that your site will be the easiest way to compare services in the price category.

Once you get the consumers, then i would start looking at monetization. either a monthly fee, which can be dangerous because if the number of services drops too low, the consumers experience will drop with it. Or you could monetize by setting up the payment processing and just taking a small piece of each transaction. The service can't complain because they are only paying you when they make money.

Not trying to be mean or anything, I just find your current site a little confusing.

[easymoney99]

In my humble opinion, omit the monthly subscription aspect; because really who would pay monthly fees for access to a marketplace. They will just say, fuck it I'm gonna keep it simple and use the major forums instead.

Only if the marketplace turned out to be really busy and had lots of traffic would the monthly fee work, but even then there are places like flippa.com who have tons of traffic but they make still it free.

What I'm going to do with my marketplace ShopIM.biz is make it free to buy and free to sell. And the way I'm gonna profit from the site is by charging a small tax on each purchase (paid by the buyer not the seller). Something like 6-8% or some other number that I determine.

I have an idea of how to basically fill the site up with sellers in 2-3 weeks of hard work but I've gotta keep that to myself unless you want to partner up. But either way, we both have yet to really enter the market, you are closer however and who ever gets to market first gets an advantage.

[bernieshawn]

Quick update:

-Made the site free for now. I might regret this later when it comes to introduce payments later, but I hope it will pay off in the long run by bringing in more people.

-Brainstormed and came up with 6 or 7 ways to monetize the site once it becomes more popular.

-Moved my site over to a VPS, which seemed like a big mistake at first. It was ENORMOUSLY aggravating because EVERYTHING broke when I made the switch - email, databases, plugins, if it was a part of the site, it didn't work after the switch.

-If you have a website and you're thinking of moving to a VPS, get someone who knows what they're doing to help you. The only thing you will miss out on is a lot of headaches, frantic Google searching, and general frustration.

-Installed a SSL certificate - figured that was pretty much a definite need to have.

-Added a way to sort services by view count, rating, and number of comments.

-Inquired about advertising on a major forum.

-I'm waiting to have a sales thread approved on the forum mentioned above.

-I have also been working on a bunch of fixes, improvements, and other general changes (most relating to the VPS switch). Some were suggestions made by one of the beta testers.

Right now, I'm still trying to figure out how to grow the marketplace, get more service providers, and get this thing off the ground.

[bernieshawn]

Another update:

Just finished my first draft of what the new home page will look like.

The current home page targets service providers only and I think that's one of the reasons that people tended to think that my site only offers order management for service providers. Actually, it's a marketplace for both buyers and sellers.

So, this new home page should reflect the finished concept. Please, if you have any input, rip it apart:

The SEO Marketplace | Testing Home Page

[kurtyordy]

Another update:

Just finished my first draft of what the new home page will look like.

The current home page targets service providers only and I think that's one of the reasons that people tended to think that my site only offers order management for service providers. Actually, it's a marketplace for both buyers and sellers.

So, this new home page should reflect the finished concept. Please, if you have any input, rip it apart:

The SEO Marketplace | Testing Home Page

much better. i would change the "view services or learn more" to "view services or list a services"

[bernieshawn]

Made a new service that my site can offer today:

The SEO Marketplace | Long Term SEO & Competitive Keyword Ranking

Actually, all I did was design the page. I still have to design the backend part of it, but I put the front end up to see if it happens to generate any interest.

What do you think about the page? Would you be likely to submit your website if you were seeking SEO work?

[snowbank]

bernie,

Go find a mentor now. Work for them for free for a year. Add massive value to their life. What will happen is you'll learn a ton about how to be successful, and you'll learn how to execute. I've talked about this same idea with a couple fastlane members before, and I agree if you know how to implement this you could have a good business, but you don't know how to execute which is going to have you spinning in circles for a long time. If I could go back and grab a mentor at 23 I would insta do it- it's such a huge ROI.

Why am I thinking you should get a mentor?- because you're actually doing things, and you're at the stage in your life when you could go do something like that. You may not quite know how to do certain things yet, but you're doing them, which is a really good sign. The skills you'd learn in 1 year with someone would allow you to scale those skills for the rest of your life, and I think you are going to end up spinning your wheels for a while here because you are basically missing all elements of what could make this type of business successful right now.

Go find an entrepreneur in your area who knows his stuff. Make their life easier for them and just ask if you can be involved/help in what they're doing. If you do a good job, not only will you learn a ton, but you'll probably be able to increase your network substantially which will also be very important with the stage in your life.

[bernieshawn]

bernie,

Go find a mentor now. Work for them for free for a year. Add massive value to their life. What will happen is you'll learn a ton about how to be successful, and you'll learn how to execute. I've talked about this same idea with a couple fastlane members before, and I agree if you know how to implement this you could have a good business, but you don't know how to execute which is going to have you spinning in circles for a long time. If I could go back and grab a mentor at 23 I would insta do it- it's such a huge ROI.

Why am I thinking you should get a mentor?- because you're actually doing things, and you're at the stage in your life when you could go do something like that. You may not quite know how to do certain things yet, but you're doing them, which is a really good sign. The skills you'd learn in 1 year with someone would allow you to scale those skills for the rest of your life, and I think you are going to end up spinning your wheels for a while here because you are basically missing all elements of what could make this type of business successful right now.

Go find an entrepreneur in your area who knows his stuff. Make their life easier for them and just ask if you can be involved/help in what they're doing. If you do a good job, not only will you learn a ton, but you'll probably be able to increase your network substantially which will also be very important with the stage in your life.

It's funny that you say "Go find a mentor!" - That's EXACTLY what I want right now.

My girlfriend used to work for a small business that was owned by a great entrepreneur - he's a self-made millionaire and owns at least 2 businesses that I know of. About a week ago, a family member of hers that still works there said he was interested in doing some mentoring and that I might be also able to go one of his seminars for free (the seminars are about a different topic, but apparently there's still some business/entrepreneurial elements involved).

So we sent him an email saying that I was very interested - still no reply yet but hopefully that will possibly give me a lead there. He's not in my location, but if there was a real opportunity I would 100% jump for it and move to where he is, just for the learning.

Other than that, though, how exactly do you find a mentor?

Go to the nearest country club and kiss ass? LOL just kidding (I hope...). But seriously, I have no idea how to get in contact with someone who (#1) is an entrepreneur worth learning from and (#2) would be willing to let me hang along.

1 more thing - the part in the quote that I bolded: Any hint at the elements that I'm missing?

My best guess would be that it's an execution thing - since I'm new to this, it comes as no surprise that I don't know exactly how to execute. That's still broad though - to narrow it down, would marketing be the problem?

Anyway, thanks for the response. Want to find a mentor!