intellectual property rights help

**GamerGripz** · Apr 12th, 2012, 11:36 PM

okay so we ran into a little trouble after we have had our 3d CAD files created. so basically here is a bit of the shortened story:

we have a contact in india (who we will call V) who is bestfriends with a man that owns his own manufacturing company and is also an mechanical aided engineer (who we will call J). Since we were so young V said he would get the files created for free for us, because he knows what it is like to be young and an entrepreneur as he was. So J laser scanned a few things for us and then created our files. J gave the files to V because we had been doing all the contacting with V, but J would not let V release the files without us first paying $600 for them. We originally planned on tooling and manufacturing with J's company, who quoted us at $4000. So he said we will have to pay the $600 to get the files but that will be deducted from the tooling quote so we will only pay $3400 for the tooling when the time comes around.

We had found way cheaper prices in china so we decided to take our tooling and manufacturing over there. So we needed to get the files without paying the $600. We spoke with him about the matter because he originally said it would be free without us having to commit to using his company for tooling. So i told him that those werent the original plans and we didnt want to have to pay the $600 because initially he said we didnt have to and it would also cause us to have to draw a bank loan out way earlier than we were planning to do. So after some talk and some convincing he turned the files over to me and said this quote on quote: (which i have printed out)

"I wish you the best in your entrepreneurship...
Once upon I started just like you...
So I am enclosing the .step files with this series of mail...
If you tool elsewhere, I will compensate [J] for his laser scanning."

So a few weeks had passed as we were trying to build up money to go into our next round of prototyping. But V had vigorously emailed me demanding I send him the $600 I owe him for the laser scanning. I told him I was not going to pay this because he stated it was free originally and when he gave the files he stated that he would pay if we go elsewhere. He told me that if I do not pay he will take me down in lawsuits and costs me thousands of dollars. So I spoke to our lawyer and he said just to ignore him because there is nothing he can do over $600, plus he would not be successful anyways. So I took his advice and just blocked his email so I would no longer receive his emails.

V also told us that if we use the files for anything he will also take us down for intellectual property theft because the files are not our work.

We are now going into our second round of prototyping and need to know if it is legal for us to use the files since he provided them for us and gave them up freely? Would this be intellectual property theft?

Thanks for the help!

**Amail** · Apr 13th, 2012, 10:01 AM

First, it sounds like V was trying to help, overcommited and got bit. It wouldn't be an issue if you went with J, but you're not going to.

From a legal standpoint, I can't help. I suspect there's no way anyone can know if you used his .step files or not, because you could easily claim to have gotten your prototype rescanned elsewhere, but I can't say for sure.

From an ethical standpoint, you need to make V whole. Whether he agreed to free, or to compensate J, it's clear he's taken a bullet for you.

If you really need to use that .step file, negotiate a deal with V in writing. Pay him his $600, agree to installments, or agree to a reduced settlement. Don't let $600 stop you from doing the right thing. Nobody should get burned trying to help.

**GamerGripz** · Apr 13th, 2012, 03:14 PM

thanks for the feedback. He has been a great help to us but now after he first jumped the gun and has been threatening us the last thing im going to do is pay. I would have the files redone before I paid him. thanks though

Anyone have any answers from a legal standpoint?

**Vigilante** · Apr 13th, 2012, 03:19 PM

Nobody can give you legal advice over an internet forum. If the information they provided you turned out to be bad, you could sue them. So, you're not going to get a legal opinion from anyone on this forum. I personally would pay the $600 and then use the existing files, but that's just my own personal opinion.

**GamerGripz** · Apr 13th, 2012, 03:39 PM

what would I have to do to get legal advice from a lawyer? I have spoke with one regarding what I should do about his threats to sue and he said to just ignore him, so thats what I did. He did not ever respond to my question about the property rights.

**Amail** · Apr 13th, 2012, 05:41 PM

You got your free law advice. Anything more you'll pay for. If you're too strapped to pay V or pay a lawyer, the safe bet is to assume you don't have property rights to the file.

Check out DAVID 3D Scanner for a way to build your own laser scanner. This will output a number of file formats which can be imported into SolidWorks, among other programs. There's ways to get this done.

**Likwid24** · Apr 13th, 2012, 06:35 PM

Originally Posted by GamerGripz

what would I have to do to get legal advice from a lawyer? I have spoke with one regarding what I should do about his threats to sue and he said to just ignore him, so thats what I did. He did not ever respond to my question about the property rights.

To get an answer from a lawyer your going to have to pay one. Probably a lot more than $600. I would pay the guy. Not only is it the right thing to do, but it will put the whole situation to rest real quick. I'm sure your pretty stressed out about it and you probably will feel guilt if you beat the guy. Paying the $600 will resolve both problems. Not paying him will only cause more headache for you and for him.

**hedgehog757** · Apr 13th, 2012, 06:52 PM

For $600 since he helped you out originally, I would just pay him off the original price of $600 and then you never have to worry about him again. it will take a lot of stress out of your life and unless you have a really good friend who is a lawyer and you really need legal advice, it will cost you a lot more money. Just my opinion as I am not a lawyer.

**GamerGripz** · Apr 14th, 2012, 09:53 AM

not sure if you are allowed to answer this but. Do intellectual property rights protect CAD files?

I assume it would be an industrial design and this is what I read about them:

Owners of protected designs must be able to prevent the manufacture, sale or importation of articles bearing or embodying a design which is a copy of the protected design.

im only 16 so im not sure if im interpreting it correctly but does that mean that because he gave me the design he no longer has property rights to it because he cannot prevent the manufacture or sale of it. Especially since he gave the files to me and they were not stolen.

**GamerGripz** · Apr 14th, 2012, 09:56 AM

Patents, industrial designs, integrated circuit designs, geographical indications and trademarks have to be registered in order to receive protection.

You probably cant help out much with the above post I assume. So could you atleast be able to answer if 3D CAD files would be categorized as an industrial design?

**Vigilante** · Apr 14th, 2012, 10:09 AM

CAD Design Drawings and Renderings part of Industrial Design process | WhiteLight Design - Lawrenceville, Georgia

"Computer-Aided Design (CAD) drawings and Renderings are an important part of the Industrial Design process."

**GamerGripz** · Apr 14th, 2012, 10:22 AM

haha thank you for answering my question without technically answering it

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