I need your Advice..

**JamesF** · Jul 2nd, 2011, 08:27 PM

Hey fastlaners,
I am working on Freelanceful.com, a place to go find/hire/pay freelance web designers and developers. Much like Elance/oDesk... and I need your advice on a major part.

Right now, on Elance and oDesk, the process is:
1) Submit project
2) Get bids from workers
3) Pick winning bid, start project

I want to make it different for Freelanceful by:
1) Submit project
2) Workers enter a discussion board on the project page, and put in their input, answer questions, how they'll tackle jobs, give advice, etc.
3) Discussion board will close after a few days, project poster then invites the best contributing workers from the discussion to submit their proposal/price.
4) Pick winning bid, start project.

What do you think? I'm leaving out my thoughts on pros/cons for my idea of the process because I want to hear yours.

Thank you in advance,
James F.

**NerdSmasher** · Jul 2nd, 2011, 11:32 PM

Depending on how the discussion board works, it could be quite useful or may drive away workers.
I say this because, I would guess that being able to have some discussion between the two parties before spending any money would be great, but if it is an open discussion like this board, then workers may just copy what other workers say that sounds good. This might cause some people who do legitimately good work to want to leave, because someone just says the same thing they said with a few different words, and underbid them.

If, however, you make the system like a personal message between the person who wants work done and the workers, then that may be a very good system, as no one can steal other peoples pitches and ideas of how to get things done.

You may also consider, rather than just having an open discussion, have the person looking for work to be done create a questionnaire about his project, such as:
What languages are you capable of programming in?
How would you code this type of website or widget?
What experience do you have in SEO?
etc.

**zendolphin** · Jul 3rd, 2011, 12:00 AM

I use Odesk, Elance, as well as scriptlance.com rentacoder.com and solvate.com

I always talk to the people bidding, way before i buy. putting them all in a room where they could discuss your project, might work 1 or 2 times

but as soon as you get that assH*le who takes the forum discussion, and runs away with the bid, at low prices, you will drive away workers FAST

BUT

I do agree the process on these sites are a little thin on major projects.
For simple projects. yes. very quick easy, love it. no discussion, just go install this widget.....

for major projects, I would love a check box that says this is a Tier 1 project, (BIG HAIRY PROJECT)
or a tier 2 project (quick N dirty) or maybe a tier 3 (multi person team project)
( I am making up tiers here btw) where if i check the BHP box, i go through a diff project. but pls dont take away my ability to do a quick and dirty one.

give me the option, to have the discusion, to invite others, to cloud source or crowd source PARTS OF IT. let me put in multiple parts, so i can assign graphics/coding/layout/UI? testing to multiple people, who win the bid for each, AND let me have a board THEY can work with, and interface with each other, on this 1 project, so i dont need to forward an email from the coder, to the graphics person, 113 times.

do the collaborative space for when the bid is won. save me having to go get a 37signals, basecamp account (or activecollab) for these guys, and make it a project management space BEYOND the bid process.

i still want my tiers tho, so i can do a quick project, or get bids, and discussion on huge projects, or an ongoing running project.

and as a way of reference, I have probably put close to 30K into projects like that over the last 3 yrs, above and beyond my own personal team who work for me.

Hope That Helps

**JamesF** · Jul 3rd, 2011, 01:10 AM

Yeah, definitely depends on the way it's set up. I want the public discussion board almost like in a social question/answers format type (Quora, Q&A platform); so all the non-helpful comments go to the bottom along with copy and pasted "pitches". There will be a Report Violation button by each, and the public discussion board will strictly prohibit "pitches" and "pick me proposals", I'm envisioning talk to be strictly about the project. For the Workers to ask questions about the specs, clarify things, answer Buyer's questions, etc.

This would help both parties I think:
Buyers - learn more about the workers and can easily distinguish the good ones from all the "noise" of 40-50 bids like in Elance/oDesk, get a preview of their communication skills, and also get answers to any

Workers - less "copy and paste" proposals like in Elance/oDesk so the good ones can actually stand out among the noise, can clarify better specs/descriptions, showcase their skills/knowledge, and overall see if they're good fit for Buyer and project.

@NerdSmasher - Yes, I totally agree with your mandatory questionaire, and have even got that in the wireframe so far. So the Buyer lists a few questions, and any bids that come must have answers to them, otherwise the worker can't submit a bid. This will prevent "noise" and a sea of 40 copy and pasted proposals.

@Zendolphin - Nice and thorough advice!!! Thanks man.. I do agree the project management needs a lot more work on Elance/oDesk, and that def something I was targeting (although for this 1st version, gonna have to keep it lean, but will def implement your suggestions for versions right after). Accountability is a major one too, I am thinking of having various required checkin's, uploads, etc. things of that sort for the worker to pressure them to stay on task and deadlines.

**domular** · Jul 5th, 2011, 08:23 PM

James I like the way you're thinking. You're ideas sound really interest. I predominately use oDesk and when you find the right person it works really well. I can see pros and cons to the system but it certainly is a balancing act trying to keep service providers and customers happy.

Let me ask you this, do you think elance and oDesk work harder to make the service provider or the buyer happy?

**RichKid** · Jul 5th, 2011, 08:40 PM

This is unrelated, but just to let you know in case you aren't aware... The sign up counter on your homepage is really just a pageview counter. Every time I click 'refresh' it goes up by 1.. regardless of if I wait a few minutes between refreshes, or a few seconds.

So the count isn't entirely accurate if you're hoping to reach 10,000 it might be a little less.. or even a lot less.

**JamesF** · Jul 23rd, 2011, 04:47 PM

Late reply; I lost this thread somehow..

Originally Posted by domular

Let me ask you this, do you think elance and oDesk work harder to make the service provider or the buyer happy?

They do a good job at both; I think a little more lean on the buyer side as that's the more important side of the chicken/egg equation.

Originally Posted by RyanDrake

So the count isn't entirely accurate if you're hoping to reach 10,000 it might be a little less.. or even a lot less.

Yup, you caught me! Lol.. it was just a page view counter.. I took it down; cause it was at like 9,000 something somehow? prob a spider bot.. I put the 10K sign up statement just for giggles; prob won't reach near that by launch.

**wallstreet** · Jul 23rd, 2011, 05:17 PM

I like the idea of 1 on 1conversions. I would limit how much back and forth would be allowed though, maybe give people 3 maximum replies.

**AcquireCurrency** · Jul 23rd, 2011, 06:02 PM

Discussion idea is great, but what you can do is allow the worker to fill out the skills/talents questionnaire within 2 mins - I used to hate having to sit there for 40 mins writing why I think I am capable of doing the job and what skills/experience I have. Solve this by having drop down menus, gives the employer a clear indication of what he's looking at and allows the worker to just get on with the task.

**Strewth&Dodgy** · Jul 23rd, 2011, 11:36 PM

Cool, I don't have to pay! Just signed up and will tweet and FB shortly as every bit counts.

I like the idea of Big hairy project, quick n' dirty, collabrative sorting out at the start. I'd also like
to know whereabouts geographically the worker is from - the bias I have is due in part to me
being a girl. In some countries this makes it very difficult just to communicate effectively as the
men in those parts of the world have a very derogatory view of women, and thus have issues
following instructions from one. Sad but true.

**JamesF** · Jul 24th, 2011, 04:01 AM

@Strewth - Thanks!

@Acquire - to clarify, you are talking about the setting up of a freelancer's profile?

@wallstreet - yeah, will keep in mind.. will see how the unlimited convo goes first to see how it goes in the 'wild'..