about Email Marketing & Optimization

[Mark Santiago]

Hey guys,

I'm here to answer your questions about email marketing...from copy to conversions.

Ask away!

 

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[Phones]

Hi @Mark Santiago , you should introduce yourself first

Cheers

 

[Boo Blizzi]

What niches do you operate in? (MMO, diet, finance, etc)
What kinds of products? (info, physical, services, etc)
How do you generate the leads? (PPC, Social, buying lists, co-reg, etc)

 

[VegasMan]

What is your background? Experience? What value can you add to this community? What are you looking to get from this community?

 

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[Mark Santiago]

Sorry for the "lack" of intro guys . I'm a slow laner looking to get back into the fast lane once again.

My background is primarily digital products, etc. however, for the last year I have been working for a large nonprofit overseeing and executing all of the email marketing.

It's been fun combining for profit and non profit ways of communicating to lists, etc...

 

[Mark Santiago]

As far as value adding I enjoy critiquing emails from subject line to call to action. I like getting particular with the psychology behind why people click and why they buy. It's amazing how much money is left on the table when we send emails that don't tap into the psychology of the buyer.

So as to experience, it doesn't matter if it's products or services, I like working with them all.

Hopefully I can give you guys some ideas on how to get results from your email campaigns

 

[jason91]

Erm, not to sound rude or anything - I'm sure we all appreciate people helping in AMA's- but, exactly what makes you qualified to give advice/ideas?

Can you tell us what you've achieved through marketing via email?

Click Through Rates and Conversions? How many people click through your emails and make a purchase? You know.. the good stuff .
Any recent discoveries you've made like putting a specific type of picture leads to more click throughs? I'm not sure what to ask because I don't know exactly where your expertise is :X.

 

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[Boo Blizzi]

What niches do you operate in? (MMO, diet, finance, etc)
What kinds of products? (info, physical, services, etc)
How do you generate the leads? (PPC, Social, buying lists, co-reg, etc)

It's nice to know your background, but I could have figured out what kind of value you could add to the community if you would have answered these questions.

 

[Mark Santiago]

Well over the last year of managing a list of about 160,000 people I've increased revenue 40% on track to do about. $700k in revenue this year. Again that is in the nonprofit industry, however we are "selling" physical products through donation.

Before that I primarily ran a membership site where I built up a small list that passively brought in several thousand per month.

Industries I prefer are anything but MMO . I started there and got burned with the hype.

What can be easily misunderstood is that most people think email marketing is easy, but it's a science, especially when you manage a decent sized list...

Value: it's hard to answer specifics without getting specific questions about real marketing campaigns.

Open rates and CTR don't mean anything without context. My open rates and CTR generally exceed industry benchmarks for the size of list I manage.

Does that help?

 

[Boo Blizzi]

I am really interested in your non-profit experience. I'm helping a friend with his now. They conduct workshops at inner city schools to prevent bullying, gangs, and gun violence.
I told him he has to provide some kind of value in exchange for the donation, but he doesn't know what to offer.
It would be cool if you could let me know what kind of things donors consider valuable?
Also, how did you build that 160k list?

 

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[Silverhawk851]

but it's a science, especially when you manage a decent sized list...

Thanks for doing this.

Absolutely agree, email is a beast on it's own that's not very easy to tame.
But gives you awesome power once you get it down.

Some things I've been testing and I'm sure have crossed your mind...

1. What initial sequence do you send them? Meaning do you build up 'Goodwill' for an extensive period of time before making the offer?
Or do you focus on making the offer sooner than later?

2.What is your segmentation process? What triggers do you use..i.e a auto-segment tool or get them to take action/opt-in again?

3. What is your ratio for content to offers? How long is your retention rate on average and how does manipulating your ratio affect that?

 

[Mark Santiago]

Story is everything in email. Stories with hooks that take people to landing page with a video that goes into more detail about the injustices some kids face and then how the nonprofit is the savior.

Surprisingly, we've found that many times our best revenue emails have no product offer, just a really good story.

It's all about finding the right people to connect with, probing them and giving them the opportunity to be a part of the solution.

List building has been done over several years. We have a TV show that brings in a good bit, but we've doubled our list using facebook ads, and niche media buys.

 

[jason91]

Well over the last year of managing a list of about 160,000 people I've increased revenue 40% on track to do about. $700k in revenue this year. Again that is in the nonprofit industry, however we are "selling" physical products through donation.

Before that I primarily ran a membership site where I built up a small list that passively brought in several thousand per month.

Industries I prefer are anything but MMO . I started there and got burned with the hype.

What can be easily misunderstood is that most people think email marketing is easy, but it's a science, especially when you manage a decent sized list...

Value: it's hard to answer specifics without getting specific questions about real marketing campaigns.

Open rates and CTR don't mean anything without context. My open rates and CTR generally exceed industry benchmarks for the size of list I manage.

Does that help?

Awesome! So I understand that your expertise is primarily for the process after an email is already on the list? Not creating landing pages to build an email list and etc? Or did you do a lot of the landing page stuff in your membership site?

I have a few questions:
1. What do you think is the most effective first email to the people who just signed up on your list? Say you gave them a free eBook with valuable info in your niche, and they signed their email for it. As an E-Commerce website selling products in the niche. Should you send promotions to see if they buy? or send more content?

2. What do you use for email marketing? MailCheat(Chimp)? Aweber? Another custom solution? Could you please give the benefits / things you dislike of whatever you've used?

3. How often do you send out emails to the list? Does it depend on the niche?

Thanks

 

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[Mark Santiago]

That's some meaty questions there

1. We have a welcome series, similar to a life cycle (saas) or autoresponder sequence (IM). Were actually about to test whether to ask them for money right away vs wait. Thus far, we wait four weeks before we ask for money. It has worked, but we do lose people in the process. My theory is when they sign up its a good time to ask because they have already taken that initial step of trust.

(test everything!!)

2. We have auto segmentation, but give them the opportunity to opt out. Since we are rather large I sometimes send up to 30 blasts per month so it's good to have segments. We now have a weekly email that goes to people who have been on the list for 90 days and asks them to let us know what they're interested in. That's working well.

3. I like to ask for money on just about every email (even when I ran my for profit list I always give people some opportunity to give). I haven't paid attention to our churn rate as much because of the rapid build up, but we lose about 120 subs per email (unsubs). We haven't found that it has changed much regardless of content/offer. In fact when we increased email volume our unsubs hardly changed. I think people can get away with emailing their list more often. As long as they provide value they won't lose as many people as they think. You have to compete for their inbox space. I have people that email me every day. I read their emails because they provide value. Others don't and I unsubs.

Thanks for doing this.

Absolutely agree, email is a beast on it's own that's not very easy to tame.
But gives you awesome power once you get it down.

Some things I've been testing and I'm sure have crossed your mind...

1. What initial sequence do you send them? Meaning do you build up 'Goodwill' for an extensive period of time before making the offer?
Or do you focus on making the offer sooner than later?

2.What is your segmentation process? What triggers do you use..i.e a auto-segment tool or get them to take action/opt-in again?

3. What is your ratio for content to offers? How long is your retention rate on average and how does manipulating your ratio affect that?

 

[Boo Blizzi]

Thanks for replying. My dude has a very compelling story and has been getting news coverage the past few months. I will tell him he needs to think about building a list of potential donors. I can help him get the leads with FB.

 

[Mark Santiago]

Phew...last one for now

Yes, I specialize in the marketing to the list. I don't do much on the UX side because we have a developer for that. I strictly focus in strategy and execution of each email. I do, however do landing pages for donations, engagement, etc.

1. Give them what they signed up. But then give them an opportunity to move further into your funnel. We even have an upsell for a DVD that sells like crazy because it's what our list wants. I don't see any reason you couldn't test an intro email with what I call a "soft product" offer in the PS. Test it and see what happens. Do you lose a ton more people of you didn't offer it?

One of our advocacy emails was being sent and I asked why we didn't have a donate form. Te marketing manager said because we've never done it that way. I said, let me test it. Sure enough, next time we sent one of those emails, I stuck a "Donate Now" button at the bottom and it brought in almost $10,000.

3. Depends on the niche and the value your list is looking for. I prefer to send a few times per week to have top of mind awareness. Are you going to lose people? Yes, but it always comes down to the value you are giving in exchange for their attention

Awesome! So I understand that your expertise is primarily for the process after an email is already on the list? Not creating landing pages to build an email list and etc? Or did you do a lot of the landing page stuff in your membership site?

I have a few questions:
1. What do you think is the most effective first email to the people who just signed up on your list? Say you gave them a free eBook with valuable info in your niche, and they signed their email for it. As an E-Commerce website selling products in the niche. Should you send promotions to see if they buy? or send more content?

2. What do you use for email marketing? MailCheat(Chimp)? Aweber? Another custom solution? Could you please give the benefits / things you dislike of whatever you've used?

3. How often do you send out emails to the list? Does it depend on the niche?

Thanks

 

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[Mark Santiago]

Do it...tell him to check out sites like Charity Water. Pay attention to how they frame the stories. It's all in matching the frame of your donor with the story you are trying to tell. Do it ethically and it will bless everyone

Thanks for replying. My dude has a very compelling story and has been getting news coverage the past few months. I will tell him he needs to think about building a list of potential donors. I can help him get the leads with FB.

 

[Kevin Peter]

Mark, I'd want to know how to satisfy a client (a start-up) with Mail Chimp where is really needs to take up a marketing automation tool - Marketo, without a budget.
Can I tell him to do the email campaigns through mail chimp (which is free) and then login the interested leads to marketo - so, that he spends really less (as these automation softwre does really charge you based on the in-house database size)

 

[Mark Santiago]

Hi Kevin,

I do use MailCheat(Chimp) with one of my clients, but we're not using any automation so I don't know that I can answer this. I will say that MailCheat(Chimp) and Marketo are a world of difference.

Is this an ecommerce company? I'm curious why they need so much power as Marketo is geared towards corporations not small business.

I don't think there is a way to link the two and use Marketo for automation after bringing in the leads through MailCheat(Chimp). MailCheat(Chimp), does have a lot of automation features that you can probably use with some creativity.

Mark, I'd want to know how to satisfy a client (a start-up) with Mail Chimp where is really needs to take up a marketing automation tool - Marketo, without a budget.
Can I tell him to do the email campaigns through mail chimp (which is free) and then login the interested leads to marketo - so, that he spends really less (as these automation softwre does really charge you based on the in-house database size)

 

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[Kevin Peter]

It is a technology startup. Product syncs with Gmail to give you a taste of task management through inbox. Very vast market and the growth rate is enormous. In last 1 year, we have had about 1000 clients.

Could you give me more details on the technical aspects of email marketing?
DNS setup
IP buying and more of theose jargons used every now and then.

 

[Mark Santiago]

What you're talking asking about is outside the realm of email marketing. We don't deal with IT functions like DNS and IP's. I deal strictly with the management of email lists and marketing to those lists through our email service provider.

So, not sure how I can better answer your questions. Thanks

It is a technology startup. Product syncs with Gmail to give you a taste of task management through inbox. Very vast market and the growth rate is enormous. In last 1 year, we have had about 1000 clients.

Could you give me more details on the technical aspects of email marketing?
DNS setup
IP buying and more of theose jargons used every now and then.

 

[Kevin Peter]

What you're talking asking about is outside the realm of email marketing. We don't deal with IT functions like DNS and IP's. I deal strictly with the management of email lists and marketing to those lists through our email service provider.

So, not sure how I can better answer your questions. Thanks

Mark, these are part of email marketing that one needs to know.
Well, I'd want to know about developing email lists from a scratch. We currently do not have people filling up a form or subscribing to the blog on the website. As the website itself is in beta stage, we want to target our market as soon as the collaterals are up.

How can I source in a email list for this?

You're ideas and suggestion will help me showcase something good here

 

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[Mark Santiago]

Hi Kevin, I'm still not sure how I can answer your question about IP's and DNS servers. The best thing to do is go with a reputable email service provider such as MailCheat(Chimp) or Aweber. You can send your emails through their service using their IP and DNS. Their setup process makes it easy to use your @domain.com to send emails from.

If you're new and don't know anyone, find some groups, places online or offline where your ideal prospects hang out. Don't overcomplicate it. Just go where they are and strike up conversations about their problems. Learn about them and then ask them if you can send them valuable content that will help them solve those problems.

If you have a budget, then test paid ads on places like FB and Google Adwords. From there, get content flowing on your blog and share it, share it, share it. Connect with other influencers in your industry on Twitter, FB, and LinkedIN. Get involved with their content (trust me, they'll notice). Like, share, and tweet their stuff. Have conversations with them. Once you've built rapport, then you can bring them your solution.

That's the Giving Economy 101...

Mark, these are part of email marketing that one needs to know.
Well, I'd want to know about developing email lists from a scratch. We currently do not have people filling up a form or subscribing to the blog on the website. As the website itself is in beta stage, we want to target our market as soon as the collaterals are up.

How can I source in a email list for this?

You're ideas and suggestion will help me showcase something good here

 

[Kevin Peter]

Hi Kevin, I'm still not sure how I can answer your question about IP's and DNS servers. The best thing to do is go with a reputable email service provider such as MailCheat(Chimp) or Aweber. You can send your emails through their service using their IP and DNS. Their setup process makes it easy to use your @domain.com to send emails from.

If you're new and don't know anyone, find some groups, places online or offline where your ideal prospects hang out. Don't overcomplicate it. Just go where they are and strike up conversations about their problems. Learn about them and then ask them if you can send them valuable content that will help them solve those problems.

If you have a budget, then test paid ads on places like FB and Google Adwords. From there, get content flowing on your blog and share it, share it, share it. Connect with other influencers in your industry on Twitter, FB, and LinkedIN. Get involved with their content (trust me, they'll notice). Like, share, and tweet their stuff. Have conversations with them. Once you've built rapport, then you can bring them your solution.

That's the Giving Economy 101...

We'll I do understand that technically you just utilize the platform support of the ESP

By following the method you have described, it would take ages for me to individually collect email addresses, keep them opt-in and then develop content to market and re-market until they are satisfied or they unsubscribe.

A few more,...

What if I want to initially do a blast for the paid email list someone is trying to selling me? How does spam filter work now?
What would be the besy day or time to send?
How often should I send email to the subscribers?
And yeah! the metrics to track?

 

[Mark Santiago]

I don't usually recommend buying lists. There's just too much liability to get fined. Plus, you're conversion rates would be drastically low. A slow build is always the way to go. If you have cash, you can easily grow your list fast by targeted ads online.

Best day depends on too much. Who are they, what are they doing, what interest do they have with what you're offering?

I always recommend at least once per week, but we mail upwards of 2x day to some of our lists. It just depends.

A few Metrics that we track: Open rates, CTR, action/response rate, email engagement, revenue/sub, revenue/click,

We'll I do understand that technically you just utilize the platform support of the ESP

By following the method you have described, it would take ages for me to individually collect email addresses, keep them opt-in and then develop content to market and re-market until they are satisfied or they unsubscribe.

A few more,...

What if I want to initially do a blast for the paid email list someone is trying to selling me? How does spam filter work now?
What would be the besy day or time to send?
How often should I send email to the subscribers?
And yeah! the metrics to track?

 

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[The Grind]

Thanks for the thread Mark.

There is a big debate online about "Is email marketing still King?"

The amount of emails being sent to consumers dramatically increased over the past few years.

Is email marketing still king? Still massively effective?

What would you say is the biggest different between a consumer getting a sales email in 2005 and one getting one now in 2015? Tougher fight for the open rate?

Also, what would you recommend for someone just beginning in email marketing to start learning? A specific course? Any Books/Resources you recommend to make the learning curve shorter?

Thank you.

 

[Mark Santiago]

Hey,

Great questions. The only people I hear saying email doesn't work are people who either don't know how to do it or burn their list out with crappy offers.

In the real world it works. In fact study after study shows that email is still the NUMBER 1 channel for driving revenue online.

Are consumer open rates down? Maybe, but it depends on too many factors to generalize. How they came on your list, what you're offering, what they're buying, your position in their mind, etc.

The only difference I see from 2005 to 2015 is marketers have to put out more quality stuff and list building has gotten ridiculously easy and cheap. All good stuff in my mind

Thanks for the thread Mark.

There is a big debate online about "Is email marketing still King?"

The amount of emails being sent to consumers dramatically increased over the past few years.

Is email marketing still king? Still massively effective?

What would you say is the biggest different between a consumer getting a sales email in 2005 and one getting one now in 2015? Tougher fight for the open rate?

Also, what would you recommend for someone just beginning in email marketing to start learning? A specific course? Any Books/Resources you recommend to make the learning curve shorter?

Thank you.

 

[Mark Santiago]

Sorry didn't see the last question:

What kind of email marketer do you want to be? The guys in the MMO niches, who prob teach the majority of "email courses you see online will give you a skewed view of reality.

I got my training through just doing it for years, then got certified through MECLabs which exponentially increased my understanding of the science behind email marketing.

Thanks for the thread Mark.

There is a big debate online about "Is email marketing still King?"

The amount of emails being sent to consumers dramatically increased over the past few years.

Is email marketing still king? Still massively effective?

What would you say is the biggest different between a consumer getting a sales email in 2005 and one getting one now in 2015? Tougher fight for the open rate?

Also, what would you recommend for someone just beginning in email marketing to start learning? A specific course? Any Books/Resources you recommend to make the learning curve shorter?

Thank you.

 

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[tafy]

Marc,

I have a b2b software startup and looking to get some early customers/beta testers via email

Currently I am going for the chat/sale on the first email

Im thinking a better way would be a 3 part email strategy

Email 1: Introduce myself and the company, what we do and what we are about
Email 2: Introduce our product and why its a good fit for their business
Email 3: Go for the chat/demo/meeting

Whats your take on this

 

[Mark Santiago]

I like the three part strategy, but the emails you described are too much about you and don't focus on what's in it for them...

1. Look for buying signals. Why are they a good candidate for buying your services? What can you find out about them before you contact them? This will make your personalization a tighter and make you send fewer emails.

In your first email you just want to get them to respond. So maybe it's something short like
"Hey, I noticed you guys are using infusionsoft. How's that working for you?"

Personally, I like to end in a question to get them to answer. I've tested no question vs question and if the rest of the email is personalized, they should respond.

2. Second email: take a different angle and add something you noticed about them: "Hey, I was reading your blog post about...(question)

3. Third email: add to the first two.

The idea is to be highly personal, especially if you're not selling anything and you don't have street cred. Speak their language: THEM.

If you spam or send a "template" email expect to be trashed or ignored. Email is too easy to ignore when done incorrectly.

Marc,

I have a b2b software startup and looking to get some early customers/beta testers via email

Currently I am going for the chat/sale on the first email

Im thinking a better way would be a 3 part email strategy

Email 1: Introduce myself and the company, what we do and what we are about
Email 2: Introduce our product and why its a good fit for their business
Email 3: Go for the chat/demo/meeting

Whats your take on this