Bicycle hustling for fun and profit

[Geeko]

When they say firm, I usually find they won't move on price in advance, but maybe in person. The Norco is probably about a 2002 model, so when you get there you can say "well, it's a nice bike, but it's like ten years old and needs work. I can give you $160 cash right now and take it away, but that's the best I can do". I'd avoid asking for his best price or if he can do better on the price - since he's already stated " firm", asking for a better price will probably just get him to dig in his heels. Instead I'd recommend just offering something close to what he's asking. Avoid insulting him when you point out defects, you have to be gentle like "man it's a sweet bike, just more of a project than I was expecting".

Thanks for the advice. And happy buying

 

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[adamhenry]

Going to approach both the cruiser and Norco hopefully today. Unfortunately they both only have an email listed. Do you have experience when people say price is firm (like on the Norco?) I was going to ask him whats his lowest price and (hopefully he doesn't say the listed price) then take of like $20 or $15.
ie; for sale 200
ask lowest = 180
offer= 160-165
Haggle from there

Here's what I'd do. Spend some time looking over the bike. Even if you don't know what you're looking for. Ask him some questions designed to get him to point out what's wrong with it, eg. "You said it needs a tune up?", "You said something was broken?" (You know it's the brake lever but get him to point it out).

Don't comment on his answers necessarily, I just usually add a "huh" or whatever. Then after kind of scratching my head and humming over it for a little while I'd say something like "yeah it's a sweet bike, but definitely getting older now" then I'd say something like you know all about it "it's a VPS, probably like a 2002 model", then "look it's more of a project than I was expecting, and it's not like I need a project right now, so I can give you $160 cash for it right now".

 

[Geeko]

Here's what I'd do. Spend some time looking over the bike. Even if you don't know what you're looking for. Ask him some questions designed to get him to point out what's wrong with it, eg. "You said it needs a tune up?", "You said something was broken?" (You know it's the brake lever but get him to point it out).

Don't comment on his answers necessarily, I just usually add a "huh" or whatever. Then after kind of scratching my head and humming over it for a little while I'd say something like "yeah it's a sweet bike, but definitely getting older now" then I'd say something like you know all about it "it's a VPS, probably like a 2002 model", then "look it's more of a project than I was expecting, and it's not like I need a project right now, so I can give you $160 cash for it right now".

Thanks, that is the path i will go when i go to check it out!

 

[adamhenry]

Going to approach both the cruiser and Norco hopefully today. Unfortunately they both only have an email listed. Do you have experience when people say price is firm (like on the Norco?) I was going to ask him whats his lowest price and (hopefully he doesn't say the listed price) then take of like $20 or $15.
ie; for sale 200
ask lowest = 180
offer= 160-165
Haggle from there

Overall I'd say maybe avoid bikes that need work, especially if you're just starting out. In which case that beach cruiser is a better starting point. Even if you got the cruiser for $75 and sold for $100, getting momentum and cash is a better way to get started. You could get the Norco and then be stalled while you get in to repairs and parts. That's what would happen to me anyhow.

Probably overkill on the advice, but I can't help myself.

 

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[adamhenry]

Sold bike basket for $15, so July = +$600.

 

[adamhenry]

I think someone just offered me Dracula's watch as a trade for a bike:

"I have a 24k gold watch that came from NW part of Romania, from the Dragu family same area as Vlad."

???

 

[adamhenry]

Amazon paid out $20, so July = +$620

 

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[adamhenry]

Paid bike shop tab -$90
Amazon paid out $60
So July = +$570

Also found a free bike on my walk this morning that should get a quick $40-$50.

 

[adamhenry]

So as of the end of July, I was up $570 as compared to the beginning of the month.

This seems to be a plateau - for the last few months I seem to be getting to around +$600 by the end of the month.

To push beyond this plateau I have a couple of ideas. I used to track net profit for the month, rather than cash flow. I switched to cash flow, because it was important if I want to quit my day job - I need to know how much cash I have that hasn't been invested back into inventory. However, by not tracking net profit, I think I've been making too many low value deals.

For August I think I'll track both net profit and cash flow. I'll try to increase net profit per transaction, and keep track of net profit for the month as well as cash flow.

Looking back, I think I need to move on to some other items to flip besides bicycles for a couple of reasons. Since I know how to fix bicycles, I tend to buy bikes that need work, but then I procrastinate about fixing them - since what I really enjoy is buying and selling.

Also, with the bikes I've been buying, net profit per transaction is typically $20-$50, with $100 net profit on the really good deals. So I'd like to either start buying higher value bicycles, or another product that will earn more net profit per flip.

 

[Geeko]

If you have a truck there is a surplus of free furniture here. Did my first flip on a lazy boy the other day.
Purchase = $0 (free)
Rehab = needed new lever for reclining. Used a lathe to make a new one out of wood. $0-1
Sold = $150
Profit =$150
Total time working = 20min

Sent from my SGH-S730M using Tapatalk

 

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[adamhenry]

Yes, it's amazing what people give away. The top searches on usedvictoria each month are often "IKEA", "dresser" and "desk" so while there's lots given away for free, it is also paradoxically in high demand.

My mother in law has started doing quite well by repainting free furniture. Might look into this too.

 

[adamhenry]

Haven't got around to updating my figures for August, but mostly I took a hiatus from bicycle flipping to reevaluate, and also spent some time accumulating, packing and shipping some books for Amazon, as I hadn't done so since May - I'll update my costs for the books sometime soon.

Wanted to get some feedback on an idea - I'm thinking of creating an online video course on bicycle flipping that I'd sell. To get feedback on the course, what I'd do is write up the info in sort of an ebook format, and post a chapter at a time here as I complete it for free in exchange for feedback. Maybe post a link to a pdf of a chapter that Fastlane forum viewers could follow. I'd look to get comments either on the forum or by pm or email or something, that I could then incorporate into the course. The pdfs would essentially be all of the content of the course and you'd get it for free instead of paying for it, the difference from the course would simply be format.

If you'd be interested in getting this kind of content, maybe like this post or comment below or something. Thanks!

 

[adamhenry]

Back in the game, sold a bike for $100. Will try to put together progress numbers soon.

 

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[adamhenry]

Still been flipping, just haven't got around to updating this thread, so maybe I'll get back on track in September.

I don't think I'll do the ebook/course thing at the moment - I realized what I need to do is focus on flipping at the moment without getting carried away with too many side projects.

Here's the formula I'm experimenting with now, and while I'm using it with bicycles, I'll give an example using iphones to make it simpler:

1. Take your available cash, and divide by .6
This will give you a figure that you can negotiate down from.

So let's say I've got $180 cash. Divide by .6 and I get $300.

2. Search craigslist in a particular category for items for sale up to $300. Look for items that are priced as either a good deal or at market value.

Let's say I search the cellphone section and see ads for the iPhone 7 with amounts of $300, $275, $325 etc. Therefore $300 is about market value for this phone.

3. Contact all the reasonably priced ads, and offer 60%.

In my example, skip the ad for $325, but the $300 ad gets an offer of $180, the $275 ad gets an offer of $165, etc.

4. Buy one for close to 60%.

So someone might write you back and say they'll take your offer of $180 on the $300 iphone, or they might say they'll take $200 or something.

5. Relist for either market value or under market value.

So let's say you pick up the iphone for $200 - you could relist it at $250 for a quick sale and a nice profit, or, depending on how fast they sell, you might decide to list at $275 or $300.

I'm not sure how much success you'll have with iPhones, but I'm having a lot of success with this with bikes, like maybe 1 in 6 people writing back to either accept my offer or counter offer close to it. The beauty is that you can relist at less than they had listed the item for, and still make a profit.

For example, there was a bike listed at $180 - I offered $110, and he counter offered at $120. Picked it up for
$120.

Market price is around $200, so I've got it relisted at $200. If it doesn't sell through the week, I might relist for the weekend at $175. The bike is in mint condition, so there's no work involved for repair or even cleaning.

It's a very safe risk, because I know that if I needed my money back people would be falling over themselves to give me $120.

I also just sold a comparable bike in worse condition for $160 that I'd listed at $175, and at $175 I had probably a dozen inquiries.

 

[jon.a]

Still been flipping, just haven't got around to updating this thread, so maybe I'll get back on track in September.

I don't think I'll do the ebook/course thing at the moment - I realized what I need to do is focus on flipping at the moment without getting carried away with too many side projects.

Here's the formula I'm experimenting with now, and while I'm using it with bicycles, I'll give an example using iphones to make it simpler:

1. Take your available cash, and divide by .6
This will give you a figure that you can negotiate down from.

So let's say I've got $180 cash. Divide by .6 and I get $300.

2. Search craigslist in a particular category for items for sale up to $300. Look for items that are priced as either a good deal or at market value.

Let's say I search the cellphone section and see ads for the iPhone 7 with amounts of $300, $275, $325 etc. Therefore $300 is about market value for this phone.

3. Contact all the reasonably priced ads, and offer 60%.

In my example, skip the ad for $325, but the $300 ad gets an offer of $180, the $275 ad gets an offer of $165, etc.

4. Buy one for close to 60%.

So someone might write you back and say they'll take your offer of $180 on the $300 iphone, or they might say they'll take $200 or something.

5. Relist for either market value or under market value.

So let's say you pick up the iphone for $200 - you could relist it at $250 for a quick sale and a nice profit, or, depending on how fast they sell, you might decide to list at $275 or $300.

I'm not sure how much success you'll have with iPhones, but I'm having a lot of success with this with bikes, like maybe 1 in 6 people writing back to either accept my offer or counter offer close to it. The beauty is that you can relist at less than they had listed the item for, and still make a profit.

For example, there was a bike listed at $180 - I offered $110, and he counter offered at $120. Picked it up for
$120.

Market price is around $200, so I've got it relisted at $200. If it doesn't sell through the week, I might relist for the weekend at $175. The bike is in mint condition, so there's no work involved for repair or even cleaning.

It's a very safe risk, because I know that if I needed my money back people would be falling over themselves to give me $120.

I also just sold a comparable bike in worse condition for $160 that I'd listed at $175, and at $175 I had probably a dozen inquiries.

Do you know that you just described part of the basics of a house flip?

 

[adamhenry]

Do you know that you just described part of the basics of a house flip?

No, didn't know! Figured it could sort of be applied to varied products. Goal is to build up to larger ticket items, so maybe I'll get to real estate.

 

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[adamhenry]

Sold!

Less than 24 hour turnaround.

Previous owner had originally listed it for $225, then later had dropped it to $180. I offered $110, and we settled on $120. I listed and resold it within 24 hours for $200, no dicker. $80 net profit.

 

[ZCP]

Write the ebook. It will take you one weekend. It will make you money while you sleep. Fastlane.

Quit making excuses and do it. You have perfected a process. Now sell / scale the process.

 

[hotshot]

Love this thread man, keep up the good work. Fellow Canadian here.

Are you using Amazon.ca for the book sales?

 

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[adamhenry]

Love this thread man, keep up the good work. Fellow Canadian here.

Are you using Amazon.ca for the book sales?

Yep. Amazon.ca.

I use my smartphone to scan book barcodes in thrift shops, buy anything under 500k in rank and over $25 in lowest used price. Textbooks are often low rank and worth $50-$100 a piece.

 

[adamhenry]

Write the ebook. It will take you one weekend. It will make you money while you sleep. Fastlane.

Quit making excuses and do it. You have perfected a process. Now sell / scale the process.

Thanks ZCP.

I'll have another go at it.

 

[adamhenry]

Was listed at $70, I bought at $50. Needed work so I relisted "as is" at $100. Sold for $100 and doubled my money.

 

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[adamhenry]

Paid $125, Sold $365. Net profit $240.

 

[adamhenry]

How to make $50 with a cellphone photo:

His ad:

My ad:

His was listed at $200. No buyers, so I convinced him to deliver it to me for $150. I wiped off one side of the bike, took the shot with my cellphone, relisted the bike for $200 and sold it within 12 hours.

So my time involvement was a few emails, meeting him, wiping down bike, meeting buyer.

I wiped down the rest of the bike before the buyer arrived

 

[KarlR]

Love this thread Adam!

Do you think you would ever try applying your formulas to buying and selling cars?

 

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[adamhenry]

Love this thread Adam!

Do you think you would ever try applying your formulas to buying and selling cars?

Yes, I think I'll definitely get to cars, once my bankroll is big enough.

I used to buy and sell cheap cars quite frequently, though not for profit - I'd buy a $500 car, drive it for six months, then sell it for $500 and buy another.

Cars are a bit of a pain, because of taxes, fees, etc., as well as risks due to hidden problems. Was thinking recently that off road vehicles - ATVs, dirt bikes, etc. could be good, since I'd avoid the taxes and fees.

I definitely see a lot of "MUST SELL NOW" and "ANY REASONABLE OFFER" ads for cars where people are moving or something and trying to dump them quick, just got to figure out how to calculate the fees & taxes in advance.

 

[adamhenry]

OK so I said I'd get back on track with reporting my progress for September.

Also going to report net income and inventory I think, rather than cash flow.

September 1:

Sold a bicycle helmet for $10. Came with a bike I bought, so I'm counting my cost as $0.

In inventory, I've got a 2007 Kona Zing roads bike that I paid $500 for, came with that helmet as well as shoes. I've also got a Gary Fisher mountain bike that I paid $60 for, and only needs a couple of cables replaced before resale.

When I count inventory, I'm going to count it at my cost, rather than count my chickens before that hatch and count projected resale value.

Therefore, on September 1st we have:

Net profit month to date (mtd): $10
Inventory:
Kona Zing $500
Gary Fisher Marlin $60
Total Inventory $560

Net worth mtd: $570

I'm sure "net worth mtd" is the wrong term here, but basically trying to demonstrate the overall change through the month, net income + inventory. Maybe someone has a better idea.

Have some cash too but I'm not going to list that since I have to dip into it all the time for gas, groceries etc.

Some things brewing for September 2nd. Basically I'm spending every spare waking moment on this, so September should be good. More to come!

 

[Kyle Tully]

What's your end goal with this?

I've seen the thread pop up a couple of times and assumed you were looking to bankroll another idea... but just read the first post where you said you've been doing it for 18 months already.

Seems like a long time you could have been building up something with a LOT more potential.

 

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[adamhenry]

What's your end goal with this?

I've seen the thread pop up a couple of times and assumed you were looking to bankroll another idea... but just read the first post where you said you've been doing it for 18 months already.

Seems like a long time you could have been building up something with a LOT more potential.

Goal is extraction from my 9-5, in order to be able to work on something else. Basically being able to resell items on craigslist is the fastest way for me to sever the hour/$ link.

While the thread is titled "bicycle hustling", there are of course limits to $/hour - bicycles only go up to a certain $, and I can only hustle so many / hour.

However, this could fork in a number of different ways - can lead to blog, ebook, course, or other informational products - could lead to flipping products with higher ROI eg. vehicles, real estate, businesses.

Also, the 18 months part may be deceiving. It started as a 'beer money fund', and then I realized I could make more than beer money.

Then it turned into a second income project. I was able to leave my $60k high stress 9-5 for a $30k low stress 9-5, thanks to the supplemental income.

Now it's moving towards a part time 9-5, where I could work a regular 9-5 three days a week and this would supplement it enough.

It's also ramping up fast, where the plateaus are shorter. The first year was along the beer money lines, then this winter/spring I was able to drop the $60k, then by July I'd hit another plateau, and now I'm quickly moving towards part-time 9-5.

While it can be an easy way to bankroll another venture, I also feel it's a good First Aid Survival Training Course. What I mean is that I know now that I can experiment with any fastlane project, and if it goes belly up I can use craigslist flipping to generate cash out of nothing.

So step one is the surgical removal of 9-5.
Step two will be fastlane - may be related to step one (info product etc.) or may be unrelated.

 

[adamhenry]

Summary for September 2nd:

Wasn't as exciting as I thought - had hoped to sell the Zing @ $600. One guy showed, said he was putting it at the top of his list but wasn't ready to commit. Second person changed their mind before coming, due to the size of the bike, have a third potential party viewing it today. If they don't take it I'm going to take some new photos and drop the price to $575.

Did sell a bike lock for $5, cost $0 (came with a bike). Then sold a Brodie for $60. Granted, I'd spent $75 on the Brodie during my previous plateau (where I thought repairing bicycles should be part of the plan), so this was to just get cash back to reinvest.

Bought a Specialized Hardrock for $250 that I'll hope to sell for $300, and bought a Kona Lana'i for $90 that I'll try for $125.

I'm actually looking for less profit per flip than previously, in the hopes of faster flips. 20% profit on amount invested, but 10-20% acceptable. Therefore, for the Lana'i I've listed it at $125, but even if I got $100 that would be acceptable. Avoiding bikes that need any repair.

So unfortunately that Brodie ate into my net profit figure, but did allow me to buy more inventory.

Net profit mtd: $0
Inventory:
Kona Zing $500
Gary Fisher Marlin $60
Specialized Hardrock $250
Kona Lana'i $90
Total Inventory $900

Net worth mtd: $900