Thread: Any advice? Thinking of opening up a B&M food business.

I make my money doing online marketing and offline consulting. But thinking about opening up a B & M business with a buddy of mine. The business would be a food business. Not a restaurant. More like a pizza/sandwich shop. Although not like a typical pizza/sandwich shop. The world doesn't need another one of those.

I want to call it "Weird Eats and Treats". I actually bought the domain the other day. Mobile website mock-up is up now. "Weird" as in different variety, not weird as in off the wall food that hardly anyone eats.

How do I plan for it to be different? Well we'd be serving the normal foods like sandwich's, fries, and pizza. But also serving other foods like homemade baked ziti, homemade chilli, different kinds of salads, Irish potatoes, beef stew, pasta salad, grilled cheese, homemade iced tea, cup cakes, pound cake, pies, other baked goods, candy, etc.

*I realize some of the listed items above are sold in some food places. I'm not claiming everything will be different. Just that I have yet to see a place that sells pizza and Irish potatoes, for example.

My buddy has been a cook for over 20 years. He worked under Walter Staib (I had no clue who he was, so I had to google him). Between him and his dad, they have a bunch of recipes for all kinds of stuff.


I believe we will be successful becausee...

My friends experience in cooking combined with my marketing and sales experience. I've studied Dan Kennedy (I've read, listened to, watched 95% of his courses), Jay Abraham, Michael Masterson, MJ Demarco , Brian Tracy, Chet Holmes, Craig Garber, and tons of other people. I know what it takes to market a business.

I would do some pre-launch marketing. Have a website, mobile website, Facebook page, etc. I would do some Faceboook marketing along with SMS marketing to build interest before the doors even open. This way we get off to a great start from day 1.


Customer Involvement...

I also plan to ask customers what they like about our place and what they don't like. From that, make changes if needed.

I plan to run contests from time to time to get customers engaged with our business. Have a contest where customers can submit their own "weird" recipes and then we pick a day where we make all of the food and have judges to select which food wins. Make it an event and get a ton of people to the business. Get it all on video, place it on our website, YouTube, Facebook, etc. The winner gets their dish added to our menu and they get to name it. Probably also do something for 2nd and 3rd place winners. Like a gift certificate.

I'll think of other contest ideas or just other ideas in general where we can involve our customers. A client of mine owns a pizza place and he has a pizza making competition every year. A ton of people show up and it's a good time.


Simple way to increase profits...

Nothing too advanced here, but I hardly ever see any business doing it, and that is having items next to the cash register and on every order ask if they would like "X". Basically, an up sell. So simple and yet barely anyone does it. I'd also place various items on the counter for more "point of sale" conversions. Like how supermarkets have candy, gum, magazines, at the checkout lines.

Doesn't add too much to each sale, but added up over the course of the month, should be good for a some extra income.


Marketing...

I would do weekly SMS marketing and/or email marketing. So if I find we have a slow day every week, I can do a blast out to subscribers to let them know about a special we are running that day only.

I'd work on building my most valuable asset (customer list) every day. This way I can contact my customers whenever I want/need a surge of business.

EVERY order that goes out gets a flyer that has info about joining our email/SMS list and why they should, specials, etc.

Facebook marketing - Fanpage, updates, specials, videos, testimonials, etc.

Website - Testimonials, specials, online ordering, etc.

Mobile Website - Mobile version of desktop site.

The contests I mentioned above. Probably have one every few months.


Financials...

My soon to be mother-in-law said she is interested in providing the start up costs/rent. But I need to give her a business plan. Which I am working on.

My friends dad (the friend who would be doing this with me) is willing to help with our first month of inventory. I may be able to get another $5,000-$10,000 from another friend, but I'm not relying on that money at all. 99% of the funds would be from my soon to be in-laws.

Ideally we are looking to rent a building that already has most/all of the equipment in it already. That would be the ideal scenario. If not, then we of course have to buy equipment which will add up fast.

Rent wise, around here $2,500-$3,000 a month will get you a really nice place. There is a place that already has all of the equipment in it and is ready to "move in". Problem is it's too far from me. Without equipment, you can rent a place for under $2,000 around here. Depending on the [exact] location, of course.


Guidance...

A close friend's brother used to own a pizza shop. When he bought it, it was doing around $4,000 a month gross. When he sold it he had it up to about $13,000 gross a month. I can speak with him if we need help or need some pointers with anything.

Another friend used to own a B&M store selling fitness equipment. He is very successful and is the smartest guy I personally know when it comes to marketing. I thought I knew a lot, he probably forgets more than I know. So I can call on him if I were to need help with some marketing ideas or business questions in general.


Future Plans...

After I get a working system going and we are successful, I would look into either franchising or open other locations. Ultimately, the goal would be to one day sell the business for a few million. Like most of you, I don't want to be working my ass off when I'm older. I want to build a successful business that I can sell for millions down the road.

If needed, I could probably get other investors to help grow the business with franchising or opening other locations. The friend I mentioned above, the smart marketer, he is always looking to invest in a successful business and he has some wealthy friends that have "play money".


Miscellaneous...

Look, no one is sitting in bed at night thinking "Man, I sure wish another place would open up that sells food." The last thing this world needs is another pizza/sandwich shop. I get that. This is not one of those "find a need and fill it" type of businesses.

However, there is no denying the fact that a properly run food business can't be successful.

I would inject some personality into the business. I enjoy interacting with people, so being friendly and engaging customers isn't an issue for me. And I believe people will like the fact that the owners are so friendly and easy to talk to. I would make it fun and enjoyable for people to do business with us.

I would always be open to new ideas and to trying new things. I would constantly be interacting with customers to get their feedback.


Why am I posting here?

I have no doubts that we can make this a successful business. However, I do have one concern and it's a big one. And I am pretty sure you have already thought of it as you read this thread. My concern is this business creating a JOB for me. I have no problems busting my ass to get this business up and running. But I have ZERO desire to be working 8,12,16 hour days a few years down the road. My friend/partner, he has no problem working long hours. But I don't want to do it after I get the business up and running and making money.

The goal is to run a successful business that spits out money. Not one that sucks up my time.

So my reason for posting here is to ask for help in coming up with ideas on how to make this a FASTLANE business. Can it be done?

My fear is that without me there every day, doing what NEEDS to be done, it will be nowhere near as successful as it could be. The obvious thing to help take the hours off of me is to hire people. But we all know how that goes. No one will care enough about the business as much as I do.

Trying to get someone else to ask an up sell question with EVERY ORDER will be like pulling teeth. They'll think it isn't a big deal. Making sure someone else asks EVERY customer if they are a member of our "Weird Eater" (or whatever I call it) program, again, will be like pulling teeth. They just won't get it.

Is there a way around this problem? Again, I don't mind working hard in the beginning and putting in long hours if needed. But, down the road I do not want to create a job for myself that relies on me being there all day for it to be successful.

Are systems, checklists, and flow charts the answer? Seems to be working for McDonald's.

Any ideas?

Any feedback?

Any advice?

Thank you.

Was just talking with my future mother in-law, she thinks we should start this doing catering first. See if it has legs and if so, then open up a store.

Thoughts on this idea?

Would certainly be cheaper. Just need to figure out how to get in front of people that need catering or are hosting a party.

I agree with your mother. Do anything you can to test out your business before you invest large sums of money. That seems like a great way to test out your competitive advantage(which would be your food I assume)

I think this is exactly the scenario MJ was referring to in TMF when he was asked by a friend if he should open up a coffee (is that right?) shop and he said no, based on the fact that he only wanted to open up one of them. If you were to expand to multiple locations with the intent of franchising it, that would make it fastlane. So, based on MJ's advice, I would say do it if your intentions are to expand to many dozens or hundreds or thousands of stores through franchising.

You seem to have a pretty good plan, Hate the catering idea first.. It is two different businesses.

Is it fast lane? Are you buying yourself a job?

With this type of business you are buying yourself a job at first. To make it fast lane you need to be able to take yourself out of the equation quickly. Work, learn, prove the biz, then you start expanding in any way possible. If you stay cleaning dishes, you got yourself a job.. If you can sell franchises, you got your self a million bucks.

Good luck.

Originally Posted by wade1mil

I think this is exactly the scenario MJ was referring to in TMF when he was asked by a friend if he should open up a coffee (is that right?) shop and he said no, based on the fact that he only wanted to open up one of them. If you were to expand to multiple locations with the intent of franchising it, that would make it fastlane. So, based on MJ's advice, I would say do it if your intentions are to expand to many dozens or hundreds or thousands of stores through franchising.

Yeah, I read that thread about the coffee shop.

My intention is for it to make us a lot of money. I'm not passionate about food. I have weird eating habits and I can barely cook anything. Which is why I need my friend to handle that aspect. I am, however, passionate about marketing. Which is good being that is the highest leverage point in any business.

So yes, my intentions would be to expand it by either franchising or a few more locations. Not sure which one as I haven't researched that part yet. I'm thinking franchise is the way to go for money [potential] reasons. Then again, I'm sure there is more work involved going the franchise route instead of just opening another place. So I need to research it more.

Originally Posted by JackEdwards

You seem to have a pretty good plan, Hate the catering idea first.. It is two different businesses.

To be honest, I'm not all for the catering idea either. As you said, it's two different businesses.

However, I was thinking that maybe there is a niche we could target where we could cater for them. Example, I used to work for a car dealership and we had sales meetings every Saturday before the day started. Wondering if maybe we could set up a breakfast package and sell it to local car dealerships. The company I worked for has 23 locations. All are within an hour of each other.

However, I just thought of this idea not too long ago. So the numbers might not even work when I dive deeper into it. The idea sounds good (to me), but I need to give it more thought because I am thinking, as I just mentioned, that the numbers just won't work. Not to mention trying to deliver X amount of food to X amount of places all within a tight time frame every weekend.

Originally Posted by JackEdwards

Is it fast lane? Are you buying yourself a job?

With this type of business you are buying yourself a job at first. To make it fast lane you need to be able to take yourself out of the equation quickly. Work, learn, prove the biz, then you start expanding in any way possible. If you stay cleaning dishes, you got yourself a job.. If you can sell franchises, you got your self a million bucks.

Good luck.

Yeah, it will definitely be a job at first.

Which has me thinking, if my future in-laws have money to invest, then maybe this isn't the best business to go after. I'm going to think of other things I can do that wouldn't require all of the start up costs, finding a location, and long hours.

I looked into (to be fair, I possibly didn't give it enough time) the thing MJ posted about in another thread about the thread on the Lambo forums about buying and reselling items from craigslist. Just doesn't seem to be all of the great deals near me that the OP seemed to be finding in his area.

I may look into just expanding my offline biz (consulting/mobile websites). The work isn't as hard (as a B&M biz would be) and very little additional money would be needed.


Thanks to those who posted so far. I appreciate your time and input.

Originally Posted by biophase

What is alot of money?

Good question.

Within the first year, I would like for it to be netting me at least $10,000 a month. I know that is not that much, which is why I would look to open up more or franchise.

Long term, as in within 10 years or so, I would look into selling if I could get several million.

Which has me thinking, maybe the numbers don't work (for me) with this business? I'll obviously never know for sure how much it would make unless I actually went through and did it, but I should start researching to see if I can calculate a fairly accurate number beforehand.

Not to mention we still would have to work out who gets what. As in does my partner get a fixed % or do we pay him a salary. And I have to find out what my future mother in-law wants out of the deal. She may want a % of ownership or just repayment plus interest on the loan.

The more I think about all of this the more I'm thinking this may not be the best route to take. Seems like a TON of work (not saying I'm looking to make millions while sitting on my ass, just saying it as in there may be other ways more suited for me that would make the same amount of money without all of these steps). Then again, if done right, it could lead to millions down the road.

Originally Posted by Jonleehacker

I recommend getting a copy of The E-Myth Revisited: Why Most Small Businesses Don't Work and What to Do About It and reading it cover to cover.

If you want it to be fastlane, then the business itself has to be the product, not the food.

That is one of the few "classics" I actually haven't read. I'll have to give it a read, thanks.

I think the bigger question is whether or not people want a "weird food" menu. Do they really? Is this really such a unique concept? I'm skeptical.

Originally Posted by DeskSnacker

I think the bigger question is whether or not people want a "weird food" menu. Do they really? Is this really such a unique concept? I'm skeptical.

Yeah, I've thought about that as well. Trying to think of ways to test if they do. Could just post something on Facebook and ask my friends. Not the best method, but free and fast. Although I don't see it proving much either way.

Regardless, this is why we'd have "normal" foods on the menu as well.

Btw, spoke to my future mother in-law last night. She would want to franchise as well with the ultimate goal to one day sell it. So we're both on the same page.

But the more I think about this whole business the more I think it's not the greatest way to go about making millions. The paradox is that I won't know for sure unless I actually start it but part of me doesn't want to start it because I fear it will be buying myself a job.

It's just that part of me feels that there is a better way to build a highly profitable business than this idea. Always thought buying an established website would be a great fit and money maker for me. Usually a few things to improve upon on just about any website that will increase the traffic and conversions.

If you can't tell already, one of my big problems is I have a ton of business ideas but don't focus on just one and forge ahead with that until it either fails or succeeds. I jump around too much. Which is something I have to correct if I want my income to skyrocket.

I know from first hand experience that owning a Deli/Pizza/Sandwich Shop isn't all it's made out to be. It's way overrated. Long Long hours and lots of work. Not the type of money that's worth all the time and effort. If your looking to just "make a living" and don't care about working long hours then I'd say go for it. If your looking for Fastlane then your looking in the wrong place.

And your definition of "weird foods" is very weird. I did not see one thing on that list that would be considered weird. If I walked into a place named "Weird Eats and Treats", I would be looking for chocolate covered crickets or rattlesnake. Not Beef Stew or Baked Ziti. I don't get what's so weird about that. I would probably walk in, get pissed that there's nothing weird on the menu then leave.

If you can think of something that's not like every other sandwich shop out there, then go for it. Come up with some sort of new idea. Something original. Something that makes your place unique. You gotta come up with something way better than a weird grilled cheese sandwich that's really not so weird.

Originally Posted by biophase

Personally I think it's a horrible idea.

But the reason I asked is because if you want to make $10,000 a month, what do you need to gross? Is that $10k a month for you? Back calculate.....

Thanks for your post. Yeah, the numbers aren't great.

I don't think $80k per month gross is feasible. Hell, half of that would be tough, imo.

Originally Posted by yveskleinsky

I don't care for the idea either. For starters the name is offensive at best and horrible at worst. The reason I say the name is offensive is because I don't find foreign food "weird" and if an establishment thought it was weird, their sentiments would strike me as either ignorant or borderline racist...

You find it offensive and borderline racist? Seriously?

Did you even read my entire first post? I said "Weird as in different variety, not weird as in off the wall food that hardly anyone eats."

In case that isn't 100% clear, the keywords in that sentence are "different variety". Like the example I gave in the first post, "serving pizza and Irish potatoes." To me, that's weird.

Originally Posted by Likwid24

And your definition of "weird foods" is very weird. I did not see one thing on that list that would be considered weird. If I walked into a place named "Weird Eats and Treats", I would be looking for chocolate covered crickets or rattlesnake. Not Beef Stew or Baked Ziti. I don't get what's so weird about that. I would probably walk in, get pissed that there's nothing weird on the menu then leave.

You gotta come up with something way better than a weird grilled cheese sandwich that's really not so weird.

See my response above.


ANYWAY, I have no plans to move forward with this business. After seeing the numbers biophase posted and running my own numbers, doesn't make sense for me to pursue this idea.

Especially when I've made decent money before with nowhere near the man hours that would be required for this food business. For now I'm just going to stick to consulting and mobile websites. If anything, I may look to increase that biz which would only cost a few hundred bucks and be less work.

It's too hard(read: takes lots of money) to invent some new food/dining category. Want to get into food and succeed?

Do the best pizza. Do the best burger.

Originally Posted by yveskleinsky

...Yes I did read your whole post, and yes I seriously do find it to be offensive that you call ethnic food "weird", and I find it weird that you think think you can randomly redefine words like "weird" and expect people to somehow just be on the same page with you.

You're still reading it wrong. I don't know, maybe it's my fault for not clarifying it enough??

I'm not calling them weird as in "Italian people have weird food." AGAIN, weird as in the variety aspect of it.

Either way, at least this disagreement brings up the point that if one person misinterprets it than surely others will. Especially since they would just be going off of a sign, and not a thread of me trying to explain it.

Regardless, I'm not pursuing this business idea anymore. And even if I did, I could easily just change the name before moving forward if I found the name to be an issue.

Originally Posted by Vagabond 007

If you can't tell already, one of my big problems is I have a ton of business ideas but don't focus on just one and forge ahead with that until it either fails or succeeds. I jump around too much. Which is something I have to correct if I want my income to skyrocket.

I think everyone here can relate with that, ha!

I watch the "Restaurant Impossible" show a lot as I'm really into learning about the food business (but no desire to start a restaurant due to the impossible hours) and one of the most common mistakes restaurants make is not creating an identity aka branding. It is common for the restaurant to have too many things on the menu, so the patron is confused as to what exactly the restaurant is selling and what kind of identity they have. With just "weird food", you may be entering that realm. That show has a lot of great advice for people entering the business, so recommend watching it. I think they even run it online.

I can locate you to about 10 restaurants within a few blocks of where I live that do the exact same thing that you are planning to do.

It sounds like a good idea for a family restaurant, but since I don't know the technicals of the restaurant biz I can't help you much. But, to me, a guy who loves restaurants, it doesn't seem like anything special.